Are coffee shops actually viable?
Discussion
Mandarin VX said:
citizensm1th said:
you need a usp, how about a kids play area outside in the summer and a kids drawing/art area inside for the winter?
other than that you need to do the best cakes in the area something to tempt the yummy mommies to go out of the way to get to you
Not really enough space for either of those, but yes, needs a USP, and I think that might be it's location/quietness (which kids will quickly destroy but hey..!)other than that you need to do the best cakes in the area something to tempt the yummy mommies to go out of the way to get to you
yes, cakes, scones, toasties, "cream teas" all that shebang...
Frimley111R said:
Thankyou4calling said:
I can assure you a Costa Coffee isn’t taking £5.2 million a year.
My thoughts too. I have a friend who works for Mcdonalds and their busiest drive through had a £6m T/O and that's 24 hour, selling more stuff per transaction.I have a coffee shop. Well for now I do as a sale is going through. We do all the usual drinks and a breakfast/lunch menu that is served all day until 3pm.
Staff are the biggest expense. A full timer inc employers tax and NI can be roughly £10 per hour. Owner operators will need at least one. But what about time off? We add in an apprentice at say £4 an hour dependant on age, but unless you have cover you will be working 6/7 days a week inc getting stock in etc.
That's not great when the novelty wears off I can assure you. In busy times we need 3 people on minimum and we are not a overly busy shop.
My advise would be to work out all the figures based on you NOT working within the business. If it still produces a modest profit then great, crack on with it. If not then don't bother as stacking shelves at asda will provide a better lifestyle in the long run.
Staff are the biggest expense. A full timer inc employers tax and NI can be roughly £10 per hour. Owner operators will need at least one. But what about time off? We add in an apprentice at say £4 an hour dependant on age, but unless you have cover you will be working 6/7 days a week inc getting stock in etc.
That's not great when the novelty wears off I can assure you. In busy times we need 3 people on minimum and we are not a overly busy shop.
My advise would be to work out all the figures based on you NOT working within the business. If it still produces a modest profit then great, crack on with it. If not then don't bother as stacking shelves at asda will provide a better lifestyle in the long run.
My Mrs was looking at something similar a few years ago. She worked for a small catering company (shop plus events) and she worked in an office canteen/kitchen proving sandwiches for meetings and coffee and sandwiches etc during the day as well.
The catering company did not want to do it any more so the missus wondered if she could take it over. So she kept a record of what was sold for a month and we then worked out the likely profit. It wasn't great and then we had to factor in fetching supplies, doing the books etc and it came out that it simply wasn't worth the effort.
The catering company did not want to do it any more so the missus wondered if she could take it over. So she kept a record of what was sold for a month and we then worked out the likely profit. It wasn't great and then we had to factor in fetching supplies, doing the books etc and it came out that it simply wasn't worth the effort.
Mandarin VX said:
Thanks for the input everyone.
So after much thinking, maths, camping out in other shops etc, she's decided not to go for it.
Its definitely been a surprise just how little a small coffee shop can expect to take on an average day.
It sounds to me like she lacks the necessary to start and run a business.So after much thinking, maths, camping out in other shops etc, she's decided not to go for it.
Its definitely been a surprise just how little a small coffee shop can expect to take on an average day.
Probably best not to attempt it.
WarnieV6GT said:
I have a coffee shop. Well for now I do as a sale is going through. We do all the usual drinks and a breakfast/lunch menu that is served all day until 3pm.
Staff are the biggest expense. A full timer inc employers tax and NI can be roughly £10 per hour. Owner operators will need at least one. But what about time off? We add in an apprentice at say £4 an hour dependant on age, but unless you have cover you will be working 6/7 days a week inc getting stock in etc.
That's not great when the novelty wears off I can assure you. In busy times we need 3 people on minimum and we are not a overly busy shop.
My advise would be to work out all the figures based on you NOT working within the business. If it still produces a modest profit then great, crack on with it. If not then don't bother as stacking shelves at asda will provide a better lifestyle in the long run.
Ah 'when the novelty wears off' . You could write a book about that re small sme's. I call it the two year honeymoon. Once the owners have finished telling everyone that they have a new business on face book etc, it slowly dawns on them what they have done and that they will have to live at work. This is about the time they start coming in late/ leaving early, and delegating thier own duties to thier staff, and then wonder why said staff leave. Staff are the biggest expense. A full timer inc employers tax and NI can be roughly £10 per hour. Owner operators will need at least one. But what about time off? We add in an apprentice at say £4 an hour dependant on age, but unless you have cover you will be working 6/7 days a week inc getting stock in etc.
That's not great when the novelty wears off I can assure you. In busy times we need 3 people on minimum and we are not a overly busy shop.
My advise would be to work out all the figures based on you NOT working within the business. If it still produces a modest profit then great, crack on with it. If not then don't bother as stacking shelves at asda will provide a better lifestyle in the long run.
technodup said:
sale every 15 seconds? Value of a fiver? So two coffees or so? Even to pour them from a jug would take longer, never mind ringing it up and giving change etc.
I've never drunk a cup of coffee but I've seen the performance that goes into making it in these places and it takes way longer than 15 seconds. And even if you had one person permanently on the till the others doing the making/serving would be bottlenecked.
The chain stores have someone taking the money, someone the making coffee, someone the wrapping cake etc....so it is possible....I've never drunk a cup of coffee but I've seen the performance that goes into making it in these places and it takes way longer than 15 seconds. And even if you had one person permanently on the till the others doing the making/serving would be bottlenecked.
Mandarin VX said:
Thankyou4calling said:
It sounds to me like she lacks the necessary to start and run a business.
Probably best not to attempt it.
What is that supposed to mean?Probably best not to attempt it.
Doing the numbers before starting a business is called Due Diligence. Which has led to the decision that it's not viable.
Shnozz said:
Mandarin VX said:
Thankyou4calling said:
It sounds to me like she lacks the necessary to start and run a business.
Probably best not to attempt it.
What is that supposed to mean?Probably best not to attempt it.
Doing the numbers before starting a business is called Due Diligence. Which has led to the decision that it's not viable.
JonnyJustice said:
Having recently returned from Amsterdam, I’m hopeful that one day our UK coffee shops will resemble those found in the Dutch capital.
Much more enjoyable experience than a Starbucks...
Christ I hope not. There's nothing more council than the Amsterdam coffee shops and the grey marl tracksuit clad UK tourists who frequent them.Much more enjoyable experience than a Starbucks...
JonnyJustice said:
Mandarin VX said:
JonnyJustice said:
Having recently returned from Amsterdam, I’m hopeful that one day our UK coffee shops will resemble those found in the Dutch capital.
Much more enjoyable experience than a Starbucks...
StarBuds?Much more enjoyable experience than a Starbucks...
p4cks said:
JonnyJustice said:
Having recently returned from Amsterdam, I’m hopeful that one day our UK coffee shops will resemble those found in the Dutch capital.
Much more enjoyable experience than a Starbucks...
Christ I hope not. There's nothing more council than the Amsterdam coffee shops and the grey marl tracksuit clad UK tourists who frequent them.Much more enjoyable experience than a Starbucks...
Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 28th December 13:30
For what it's worth a new coffee shop opened in my (small) town around a year or so ago. The owner is an excellent baker, so sells sourdough, sausage rolls and lots of other fantastic in-house snacks. He's up to 6 or 7 staff already, I would guess a mixture of part time and full time.
So if you have both the skills and location this can still be a worthwhile line of business.
So if you have both the skills and location this can still be a worthwhile line of business.
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