Starlink Broadband

[vdn]

M1AGM said:

My nest works absolutely 100% when not at home, tested it today. I have never had any issues with using multiple different cloud based services for the house and starlink. I run a 7 camera cctv system, an ashp, nest, ufh, unifi network with 19 devices, dialup VPN to the office, starting to wonder if the experts talking down starlink here have any working knowledge of starlink or are basing their information on hearsay and/or reddit because I see no issues whatsoever.

I dont have philiips hue so if that doesn’t work then so be it, must be a bit rubbish tbh.

Thank you, I've some relief hearing this!

[M1AGM]

vdn said:

M1AGM said:

My nest works absolutely 100% when not at home, tested it today. I have never had any issues with using multiple different cloud based services for the house and starlink. I run a 7 camera cctv system, an ashp, nest, ufh, unifi network with 19 devices, dialup VPN to the office, starting to wonder if the experts talking down starlink here have any working knowledge of starlink or are basing their information on hearsay and/or reddit because I see no issues whatsoever.

I dont have philiips hue so if that doesn’t work then so be it, must be a bit rubbish tbh.

Thank you, I've some relief hearing this!

No problem. I’ve just had a look on my phone as to which apps I use for home stuff and to add to the list above:

Andersen EV charger (software is crap but thats down to Andersen)
Husqvarna for the mowers
Smart life for smart switches and some lights (have a dozen or so)

• ** alarm system (edited for security)

Tesla (for PWs)

All work 100% when away from home with home running through starlink for internet.

Plus we use netflix and sky etc all fine.

[theboss]

M1AGM said:

My nest works absolutely 100% when not at home, tested it today. I have never had any issues with using multiple different cloud based services for the house and starlink. I run a 7 camera cctv system, an ashp, nest, ufh, unifi network with 19 devices, dialup VPN to the office, starting to wonder if the experts talking down starlink here have any working knowledge of starlink or are basing their information on hearsay and/or reddit because I see no issues whatsoever.

I dont have philiips hue so if that doesn’t work then so be it, must be a bit rubbish tbh.

Talking it down? There's no emotive angle to it, people are just describing some technical limitations arising from use of CGNAT. I had it installed last year but walked away from it 6 months later because I moved house. These limitations aren't unique to Starlink, most cellular solutions are the same.

[M1AGM]

theboss said:

Talking it down? There's no emotive angle to it, people are just describing some technical limitations arising from use of CGNAT. I had it installed last year but walked away from it 6 months later because I moved house. These limitations aren't unique to Starlink, most cellular solutions are the same.

Not wishing to offend. I think the question should be which home automation services are not compatible with starlink. So far. Philips Hue. The point I have made is that a plethora of vendors tech works fine with starlink, whats the problem?

[BertB]

Out of home on Philips Hue works fine for me over starlink.

Our Starlink router is in bypass mode, but can't imagine this would make any difference.

[theboss]

M1AGM said:

theboss said:

Talking it down? There's no emotive angle to it, people are just describing some technical limitations arising from use of CGNAT. I had it installed last year but walked away from it 6 months later because I moved house. These limitations aren't unique to Starlink, most cellular solutions are the same.

Not wishing to offend. I think the question should be which home automation services are not compatible with starlink. So far. Philips Hue. The point I have made is that a plethora of vendors tech works fine with starlink, whats the problem?

Some stuff works with CG-NAT, some stuff doesn't. Hue is one and their discovery mechanism is pretty archaic based on my observations.

No problems with me, I have a leased line being delivered soon so I couldn't care less. Starlink was great when I needed it. It's game changing in isolated locations where no alternatives exist.

[Captain_Morgan]

M1AGM said:

My nest works absolutely 100% when not at home, tested it today. I have never had any issues with using multiple different cloud based services for the house and starlink. I run a 7 camera cctv system, an ashp, nest, ufh, unifi network with 19 devices, dialup VPN to the office, starting to wonder if the experts talking down starlink here have any working knowledge of starlink or are basing their information on hearsay and/or reddit because I see no issues whatsoever.

I dont have philiips hue so if that doesn’t work then so be it, must be a bit rubbish tbh.

Or you might not grasp the limitations of cgnat…

[M1AGM]

Captain_Morgan said:

Or you might not grasp the limitations of cgnat…

Go on then, what limitations are there with cgnat that creates a problem for your average user running IoT services?

[Captain_Morgan]

M1AGM said:

Captain_Morgan said:

Or you might not grasp the limitations of cgnat…

Go on then, what limitations are there with cgnat that creates a problem for your average user running IoT services?

I believe the issues with cgnat have already been explained, however with cgnat your modem/fw/router does not have a public IP address, it has a private IP address which sits behind one of your isp’s public ip, this impacts incoming traffic as many devices across many households will have the same IP address, the lack of a uniq public IP address is why some services do not work, for example inbound VPN’s do not work.

Hue does work, it is the presence feature that is impacted by this lack of a uniq ip identifier.

Should you wish to explore this limitation I suggest you google cgnat issues & limitations.

[M1AGM]

Captain_Morgan said:

M1AGM said:

Captain_Morgan said:

Or you might not grasp the limitations of cgnat…

Go on then, what limitations are there with cgnat that creates a problem for your average user running IoT services?

I believe the issues with cgnat have already been explained, however with cgnat your modem/fw/router does not have a public IP address, it has a private IP address which sits behind one of your isp’s public ip, this impacts incoming traffic as many devices across many households will have the same IP address, the lack of a uniq public IP address is why some services do not work, for example inbound VPN’s do not work.

Hue does work, it is the presence feature that is impacted by this lack of a uniq ip identifier.

Should you wish to explore this limitation I suggest you google cgnat issues & limitations.

I know what cgnat is, the limitations are not an issue for most home users, as per my post I run a load of stuff connected by Starlink, your examples of why it is a problem are 1) inbound VPN and 2) Hue presence feature. Is that it? Most IoT is developed around the user pulling data, which is via software authentication, the IP doesn’t matter.

[Captain_Morgan]

M1AGM said:

Captain_Morgan said:

M1AGM said:

Captain_Morgan said:

Or you might not grasp the limitations of cgnat…

Go on then, what limitations are there with cgnat that creates a problem for your average user running IoT services?

I believe the issues with cgnat have already been explained, however with cgnat your modem/fw/router does not have a public IP address, it has a private IP address which sits behind one of your isp’s public ip, this impacts incoming traffic as many devices across many households will have the same IP address, the lack of a uniq public IP address is why some services do not work, for example inbound VPN’s do not work.

Hue does work, it is the presence feature that is impacted by this lack of a uniq ip identifier.

Should you wish to explore this limitation I suggest you google cgnat issues & limitations.

I know what cgnat is, the limitations are not an issue for most home users, as per my post I run a load of stuff connected by Starlink, your examples of why it is a problem are 1) inbound VPN and 2) Hue presence feature. Is that it? Most IoT is developed around the user pulling data, which is via software authentication, the IP doesn’t matter.

Can you point out specifically where I have said it’s a problem?

I have pointed out that cgnat has some limitations a fact you admit yourself, these limitations may be a issue to some & not others, but obviously not for you.

[AndyC_123]

Hi

I live & work very rurally with no hardwire phone, so use a 4g router in the house and a 4g router in the office (150 meters from house).

Use VOIP phones in the office and the 4g router isn't stable/good enough for them. Download speed 10.9 and upload 1.06, which is OK for what we need (except the phones).

So thinking of getting Starlink.... with the cost of the hardware being so high, would it be possible to place the dish in-between the office and the house, and run both off the one dish?

Many thanks

[Leithen]

AndyC_123 said:

Hi

I live & work very rurally with no hardwire phone, so use a 4g router in the house and a 4g router in the office (150 meters from house).

Use VOIP phones in the office and the 4g router isn't stable/good enough for them. Download speed 10.9 and upload 1.06, which is OK for what we need (except the phones).

So thinking of getting Starlink.... with the cost of the hardware being so high, would it be possible to place the dish in-between the office and the house, and run both off the one dish?

Many thanks

In theory, yes. You would need a waterproof/weatherproof box or cabinet with a power supply coming in and ethernet going out to each separate building. Put a switch into the box alongside the Starlink Hub, with both preferably connected to a UPS and allow the Starlink Hub to do DHCP (dole out IP addresses). IIRC the maximum length of ethernet is 100m, so you will probably want to have switches in House and Office as well.

[Captain_Morgan]

AndyC_123 said:

Hi

I live & work very rurally with no hardwire phone, so use a 4g router in the house and a 4g router in the office (150 meters from house).

Use VOIP phones in the office and the 4g router isn't stable/good enough for them. Download speed 10.9 and upload 1.06, which is OK for what we need (except the phones).

So thinking of getting Starlink.... with the cost of the hardware being so high, would it be possible to place the dish in-between the office and the house, and run both off the one dish?

Many thanks

It’s a how long is a piece of string question.

How far apart are the two buildings?
What are the construction materials?

Did you mean using the native wifi between two buildings?
If so unless they are very close then it’s unlikely to work.

If you meant sharing your network between the two buildings then entirely possible, what kind of budget did you envisage for this?
Are you interested in running a ethernet cable between buildings?

[Captain_Morgan]

Captain_Morgan said:

AndyC_123 said:

Hi

I live & work very rurally with no hardwire phone, so use a 4g router in the house and a 4g router in the office (150 meters from house).

Use VOIP phones in the office and the 4g router isn't stable/good enough for them. Download speed 10.9 and upload 1.06, which is OK for what we need (except the phones).

So thinking of getting Starlink.... with the cost of the hardware being so high, would it be possible to place the dish in-between the office and the house, and run both off the one dish?

Many thanks

It’s a how long is a piece of string question.

How far apart are the two buildings?
What are the construction materials?

Did you mean using the native wifi between two buildings?
If so unless they are very close then it’s unlikely to work.

If you meant sharing your network between the two buildings then entirely possible, what kind of budget did you envisage for this?
Are you interested in running a ethernet cable between buildings?

Apologies I missed the 150m distance point.

You have a few options here, the one above where you mount the dish, router & switch equidistant between buildings & run an Ethernet cable to each building, where you’ll need a accesspoint & possibly a switch in each, this also has the issue of requiring power at the dish location for starlink & switch.

You could locate the starlink close to the location that will use the greater bandwidth & use a point to point wifi link between the buildings assuming you have clear line of sight. The cost of this link depends on the bandwidth requirement at the remote end ~£90-400. Devices are available from Ubiquiti & tp-link among others. Obviously you use the starlink fw/router/accesspoint at one end if it covers the area well & accesspoint & possibly a switch at the remote end.

Or

You could locate the starlink close to the location that will use the greater bandwidth & use ethernet to fibre converters & run a fibre cable between buildingst The cost of this 2x media converters @~£30 each, ~200m premade fibre cable ~£200-300 + ~150m conduit to run the fibre cable in. Obviously you use the starlink fw/router/accesspoint at one end if it covers the area well & accesspoint & possibly a switch at the remote end. This would give the greatest bandwidth between buildings but likely the greatest effort.

Or

As above but use gamechanger cat6 cable that will run ~200m but is very very expensive ~£2300 for 500m external grade.

Personally I’d use the first of my suggestions if it were me.

Edited by Captain_Morgan on Monday 22 August 12:33

[M1AGM]

Captain_Morgan said:

Apologies I missed the 150m distance point.

You have a few options here, the one above where you mount the dish, router & switch equidistant between buildings & run an Ethernet cable to each building, where you’ll need a accesspoint & possibly a switch in each, this also has the issue of requiring power at the dish location for starlink & switch.

You could locate the starlink close to the location that will use the greater bandwidth & use a point to point wifi link between the buildings assuming you have clear line of sight. The cost of this link depends on the bandwidth requirement at the remote end ~£90-400. Devices are available from Ubiquiti & tp-link among others. Obviously you use the starlink fw/router/accesspoint at one end if it covers the area well & accesspoint & possibly a switch at the remote end.

Or

You could locate the starlink close to the location that will use the greater bandwidth & use ethernet to fibre converters & run a fibre cable between buildingst The cost of this 2x media converters @~£30 each, ~200m premade fibre cable ~£200-300 + ~150m conduit to run the fibre cable in. Obviously you use the starlink fw/router/accesspoint at one end if it covers the area well & accesspoint & possibly a switch at the remote end. This would give the greatest bandwidth between buildings but likely the greatest effort.

Or

As above but use gamechanger cat6 cable that will run ~200m but is very very expensive ~£2300 for 500m external grade.

Personally I’d use the first of my suggestions if it were me.

Edited by Captain_Morgan on Monday 22 August 12:33

Where do you get £2300 for 500m of cat6?

[M1AGM]

Captain_Morgan said:

Can you point out specifically where I have said it’s a problem?

I have pointed out that cgnat has some limitations a fact you admit yourself, these limitations may be a issue to some & not others, but obviously not for you.

Apologies, you are correct, you said ‘limitations’.

BigTZ4M said:

somouk said:

It’s often dependant on how they run their network, if they are using a CGN based network with a single breakout to the internet things like this break as they use dynamic DNS style systems which don’t work on the WAN.

If you have your own IP per connection then they tend to work fine.

This is the reason. Like nearly all cellular connections, Starlink uses CGNAT and Hue doesn’t support away from home features behind CGNAT. Lots of home automation stuff doesn’t.

That statement would put me off considering starlink, and it’s wrong.

[Captain_Morgan]

M1AGM said:

Where do you get £2300 for 500m of cat6?

It’s crazy expensive isn’t it.

https://gprivate.com/60iiy

[M1AGM]

Captain_Morgan said:

M1AGM said:

Where do you get £2300 for 500m of cat6?

It’s crazy expensive isn’t it.

https://gprivate.com/60iiy

https://www.millsltd.com/default/fusion-cat-6-utp-external-cable-500m-drum-4934.html

£259?

[Captain_Morgan]

M1AGM said:

Captain_Morgan said:

M1AGM said:

Where do you get £2300 for 500m of cat6?

It’s crazy expensive isn’t it.

https://gprivate.com/60iiy

https://www.millsltd.com/default/fusion-cat-6-utp-external-cable-500m-drum-4934.html

£259?

https://www.cmwltd.co.uk/p/paige-datacom-258342304-gamechanger-cat-6-shielded-osp-external-cable-500m-drum?code=258342304

What distance does the cable you have posted support?
What distance does the poster I responded to need to cover?
What distance does the Gamechanger cable cover?