Mobile Email - Blackberry vs Symbian vs MS Mobile
Discussion
Vodafone have the Storm, Bold and Curve Blackberry phones - the Storm is unreliable and generally regarded as rubbish (though I am sure someone likes it - I know three people who have returned it as crap). The Bold is more consumer focused with a great screen but some instability. And the Curve is the boggo business phone - but the best of the three. Looks good, good battery and all of the features of the others but better (except the touch screen). They will do media player, music player and web browser too! The screens are VERY good and have an excellent DPI, so take a look at them and see what you think.
Worth figuring out what Exchange functions you use, and re-engineering those requirements into the right device, rather than the other way round.
Not all Activesyncs are equal, the missing stuff may not be vital to you, but if you do want to set email flags or leave an actual OOO message (rather than just set the Out Of Office Assistant) then you may be stuffed for a bit.
There are iPhone Apps that do the Task Syncing (TaskData) and OOS (OOFy) but if you are an Exchange "power user" you may find it doesn't do everything you are led to believe by people that see their email appear on the iPhone via Activestink and think "wahey, Exchange is all here"
Same with Symbian (folders....grrrr), and WinMo doesn't do some things the iPhone does.
Not all Activesyncs are equal, the missing stuff may not be vital to you, but if you do want to set email flags or leave an actual OOO message (rather than just set the Out Of Office Assistant) then you may be stuffed for a bit.
There are iPhone Apps that do the Task Syncing (TaskData) and OOS (OOFy) but if you are an Exchange "power user" you may find it doesn't do everything you are led to believe by people that see their email appear on the iPhone via Activestink and think "wahey, Exchange is all here"
Same with Symbian (folders....grrrr), and WinMo doesn't do some things the iPhone does.
Edited by Noger on Tuesday 19th May 20:15
off_again said:
The Ben said:
The nokia E71 doesn't have push, but the E65??? I think, the new one, does.
That alone should keep you with you bb!
Eh?That alone should keep you with you bb!
Got an E71 and it has push!
To answer the original post:
1) iPhone, Symbian (pretty much all recent phones) and Windows Mobile support ActiveSync natively - no additional software to install
2) For ActiveSync the sync covers tasks, calendar, email and contacts - if you want to obviously
3) ActiveSync supports remote management, PIN setting and if you want, remote wipe if you have the relevant software installed
4) ActiveSync for Symbian (Mail for Exchange) does NOT support folders - though you can use Good Email (at a cost) which does
5) Blackberry BES services cost additional money - typically £20 - £30 per phone, ActiveSync phones DO NOT HAVE THIS CHARGE
So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
off_again said:
Vodafone have the Storm, Bold and Curve Blackberry phones - the Storm is unreliable and generally regarded as rubbish (though I am sure someone likes it - I know three people who have returned it as crap). The Bold is more consumer focused with a great screen but some instability. And the Curve is the boggo business phone - but the best of the three. Looks good, good battery and all of the features of the others but better (except the touch screen). They will do media player, music player and web browser too! The screens are VERY good and have an excellent DPI, so take a look at them and see what you think.
Huh? The Storm is well loved with RIM selling over 500k of them but the early versions had a whole lot of OS issues. The later OS fixes most of the problems and the device is generally very well received by users not having issues with it.The Bold is probably the most stable of the devices.
Also the Curve certainly doesn't have all of the features of the Bold with the most significant being 3G and only some variants have WIFI. The curve also lacks the performance of the Bold.
The Curve is a fine device but is hardly comparable to the Bold.
As for compression between Winmob devices and Blackberry. The Blackberry wins hands down thanks to it being developed from the ground up with compression in mind. A windows mobile will use more than 50% more data over the same connections.
sadako said:
off_again said:
The Ben said:
The nokia E71 doesn't have push, but the E65??? I think, the new one, does.
That alone should keep you with you bb!
Eh?That alone should keep you with you bb!
Got an E71 and it has push!
To answer the original post:
1) iPhone, Symbian (pretty much all recent phones) and Windows Mobile support ActiveSync natively - no additional software to install
2) For ActiveSync the sync covers tasks, calendar, email and contacts - if you want to obviously
3) ActiveSync supports remote management, PIN setting and if you want, remote wipe if you have the relevant software installed
4) ActiveSync for Symbian (Mail for Exchange) does NOT support folders - though you can use Good Email (at a cost) which does
5) Blackberry BES services cost additional money - typically £20 - £30 per phone, ActiveSync phones DO NOT HAVE THIS CHARGE
So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
I use my WinMo phone to send and receive email and to syncronise my calendar and contacts and Activesync does the job perfectly well.
The Windows Mobile 6.1 OS is horribly inconvenient and fiddly to use; I used to have an HTC Tytn II, now have a BB Pearl and haven't looked back. With my fat fingers the use of the stylus with the WinMo phone was a must (meaning I'd need two hands to operate the thing) and then the on-screen dialler was particularly slow witted. For struggling through an airport with a laptop case and small trolley, there's nothing that compares with the BB for ease of use.
mouseymousey said:
sadako said:
off_again said:
The Ben said:
The nokia E71 doesn't have push, but the E65??? I think, the new one, does.
That alone should keep you with you bb!
Eh?That alone should keep you with you bb!
Got an E71 and it has push!
To answer the original post:
1) iPhone, Symbian (pretty much all recent phones) and Windows Mobile support ActiveSync natively - no additional software to install
2) For ActiveSync the sync covers tasks, calendar, email and contacts - if you want to obviously
3) ActiveSync supports remote management, PIN setting and if you want, remote wipe if you have the relevant software installed
4) ActiveSync for Symbian (Mail for Exchange) does NOT support folders - though you can use Good Email (at a cost) which does
5) Blackberry BES services cost additional money - typically £20 - £30 per phone, ActiveSync phones DO NOT HAVE THIS CHARGE
So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
I use my WinMo phone to send and receive email and to syncronise my calendar and contacts and Activesync does the job perfectly well.
off_again said:
5) Blackberry BES services cost additional money - typically £20 - £30 per phone, ActiveSync phones DO NOT HAVE THIS CHARGE
So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
The problem with Activesync/intellisync (No longer available but still widely used) or most of the other solutions is, it isn't a complete solution for a business, however it may do all that some small businesses require albeit with the understanding they have a massive security whole on their network. There is no point developing very effective security and then opening the doors to unsecured devices.So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
Ordinary_Chap said:
off_again said:
5) Blackberry BES services cost additional money - typically £20 - £30 per phone, ActiveSync phones DO NOT HAVE THIS CHARGE
So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
The problem with Activesync/intellisync (No longer available but still widely used) or most of the other solutions is, it isn't a complete solution for a business, however it may do all that some small businesses require albeit with the understanding they have a massive security whole on their network. There is no point developing very effective security and then opening the doors to unsecured devices.So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
Ordinary_Chap said:
The problem with Activesync/intellisync (No longer available but still widely used) or most of the other solutions is, it isn't a complete solution for a business, however it may do all that some small businesses require albeit with the understanding they have a massive security whole on their network. There is no point developing very effective security and then opening the doors to unsecured devices.
If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
Just like any other device in history there are ways to exploit Blackberry and they release security patches If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
jonnie5 said:
Thanks
Only reason for change is to reduce to one device, but needs to include a good music player (ideally with stereo bluetooth support). Not asking for much I know
Also need to stay on Voda (as they are also a client)
I'll have a look at the new blackberry models I think and take it from there.
Cheers
I use the media player on my blackberry - mine's got a limit of 2Gb SD cards, but newer ones support 4Gb or even 8Gb I think. I use the blackberry (wired) headphones for listening to music, and phoning. I guess a bluetooth headset would work just as well? I don't think it supports A2DP but again, newer models may do that for you.Only reason for change is to reduce to one device, but needs to include a good music player (ideally with stereo bluetooth support). Not asking for much I know
Also need to stay on Voda (as they are also a client)I'll have a look at the new blackberry models I think and take it from there.
Cheers
I think blackberry has the corporate market sewn up because of a (real or percieved, I'm not sure) focus on security. Other smartphones may allow users to install programs, this can be restricted on the blackberry.
I'm on the Pearl 8100, by the way.
Andy
buggalugs said:
Ordinary_Chap said:
off_again said:
5) Blackberry BES services cost additional money - typically £20 - £30 per phone, ActiveSync phones DO NOT HAVE THIS CHARGE
So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
The problem with Activesync/intellisync (No longer available but still widely used) or most of the other solutions is, it isn't a complete solution for a business, however it may do all that some small businesses require albeit with the understanding they have a massive security whole on their network. There is no point developing very effective security and then opening the doors to unsecured devices.So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
We have to look at how the devices are used rather than purely basing this around OWA and the like. Most users do things like store documents and the like on their devices and other business sensitive information and if or when the device gets stolen the thief gets access to these files plus often the Windows credentials the user uses.
The biggest issue is to spend a lot of time/effort and money securing the device then create a big gap in security, Blackberry's don't do this. As with AD group policies are applied so are Blackberry policies and there are many ways to protect the device like entering the wrong password more than 3 times will erase the device or remote kill commands to be sent to kill the device and this is even before we start to talk about how Blackberry's encrypt all communication and provide end to end security.
For those doubting just how secure a normal Blackberry can be read this;
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/03/25/making_bla...
There is a reason why our police forces and services use them, along with the American special services.
cuneus said:
Ordinary_Chap said:
The problem with Activesync/intellisync (No longer available but still widely used) or most of the other solutions is, it isn't a complete solution for a business, however it may do all that some small businesses require albeit with the understanding they have a massive security whole on their network. There is no point developing very effective security and then opening the doors to unsecured devices.
If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
Just like any other device in history there are ways to exploit Blackberry and they release security patches If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
I work in the industry and I'm not aware of one. The last successful exploit (Send Malformed PDF's) was actually a DDOS which simply caused the dispatcher to stall and as it was set to automatically restart on Windows box it didn't really cause too much of a problem.
I say this out of interest, not to challenge you.
Edited by Ordinary_Chap on Thursday 21st May 22:10
Ordinary_Chap said:
Can you show me a exploit that is currently successful on any of the Blackberry platforms?
I work in the industry and I'm not aware of one. The last successful exploit (Send Malformed PDF's) was actually a DDOS which simply caused the dispatcher to stall and as it was set to automatically restart on Windows box it didn't really cause too much of a problem.
I say this out of interest, not to challenge you.
No I can't - though as you will be aware there have been other exploits and I am sure there will be more in the future I work in the industry and I'm not aware of one. The last successful exploit (Send Malformed PDF's) was actually a DDOS which simply caused the dispatcher to stall and as it was set to automatically restart on Windows box it didn't really cause too much of a problem.
I say this out of interest, not to challenge you.
You are wrong about Obama - that is no ordinary Blackberry!
cuneus said:
Ordinary_Chap said:
Can you show me a exploit that is currently successful on any of the Blackberry platforms?
I work in the industry and I'm not aware of one. The last successful exploit (Send Malformed PDF's) was actually a DDOS which simply caused the dispatcher to stall and as it was set to automatically restart on Windows box it didn't really cause too much of a problem.
I say this out of interest, not to challenge you.
No I can't - though as you will be aware there have been other exploits and I am sure there will be more in the future I work in the industry and I'm not aware of one. The last successful exploit (Send Malformed PDF's) was actually a DDOS which simply caused the dispatcher to stall and as it was set to automatically restart on Windows box it didn't really cause too much of a problem.
I say this out of interest, not to challenge you.
You are wrong about Obama - that is no ordinary Blackberry!
There hasn't been a successful exploit for several years now.
I think you need to re-read the post before telling me I'm wrong, I simply mentioned he had a Blackberry and at the end of the day, whilst it's a hardened Blackberry, it's still a Blackberry.
Be careful before telling people they are wrong.
Ordinary_Chap said:
buggalugs said:
Ordinary_Chap said:
off_again said:
5) Blackberry BES services cost additional money - typically £20 - £30 per phone, ActiveSync phones DO NOT HAVE THIS CHARGE
So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
The problem with Activesync/intellisync (No longer available but still widely used) or most of the other solutions is, it isn't a complete solution for a business, however it may do all that some small businesses require albeit with the understanding they have a massive security whole on their network. There is no point developing very effective security and then opening the doors to unsecured devices.So its pretty much down to what you want. Blackberry phones have the monopoly in the corporate sector as they are well regarded. Though I understand that the recent 'consumer' focused ones are crap. iPhone has a great implementation of ActiveSync and works well, though it likes a constant data connection to work correctly. Symbian ActiveSync is also excellent and almost identical to that of the Windows Mobile version except for the folder support. At the end of the day its all down to what you want to do and use. All are very good and work well, though the battery life on a Symbian phone is excellent.
If you need to manage the devices and security, that's what you are paying for with BES and if that is not important you could use BIS.
The reason Blackberry is so far ahead in the corporate market is down to the security of the devices which is unmatched and also providing a complete and very effective solution out of the box.
Even President Obama gets to use a Blackberry.
We have to look at how the devices are used rather than purely basing this around OWA and the like. Most users do things like store documents and the like on their devices and other business sensitive information and if or when the device gets stolen the thief gets access to these files plus often the Windows credentials the user uses.
The biggest issue is to spend a lot of time/effort and money securing the device then create a big gap in security, Blackberry's don't do this. As with AD group policies are applied so are Blackberry policies and there are many ways to protect the device like entering the wrong password more than 3 times will erase the device or remote kill commands to be sent to kill the device and this is even before we start to talk about how Blackberry's encrypt all communication and provide end to end security.
For those doubting just how secure a normal Blackberry can be read this;
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/03/25/making_bla...
There is a reason why our police forces and services use them, along with the American special services.
Edited by buggalugs on Friday 22 May 00:10
buggalugs said:
I hear what you're saying about the Windows devices containing network access credentials, however I'm not aware of a way of extracting those at present. Also, the devices security options can be managed centraly - pin codes, remote wipe etc. Comms is via SSL. Maybe blackberry does have an advantage but to br honest I'm not convinced that the Windows devices have as big a disadvantage as you say.
That’s fine, no need to take my word for it. As for recovering credentials that’s often not required since most of them cache the credentials for various applications. A simple way at looking at Smartphones is to consider them as computers on your network. Edited by buggalugs on Friday 22 May 00:10
Just take one look at any company, government, Military body that requires security and take a look at what they run. In fact the UK's government bodies and police forces generally run BES environments however there are some Windows mobiles knocking around but under the management of a 3rd party security application but that’s entirely different to running the standard stuff. The American bodies also run Blackberries.
I am a Windows fan and a MCSE and all of the rest of it but there is clearly no comparison between Blackberry and Windows Mobile when it comes to mobiles.
If you have time, read up on it and you'll see how much danager unsecured devices can be.
There are many reasons why Blackberries are so prolific in the corporate environment but two of the biggest are security and being able to manage the devices.
Edited by Ordinary_Chap on Friday 22 May 09:27
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