I've created a petition with regards to the riots

[Puffing Devil]

As a Croydon resident I like many other was shocked and appalled by the events that have taken place. I believe they are the actions of a people at an utter disconnect with the area around them. For one thing, I had no idea Reeves was such a historic and meaningful part of the town, until after it burnt down, and some of the stories I've heard talking to older residents after the riots shock me - I've lived in Croydon all my life and actually didn't know a single thing about the town! I have very little doubt it's the same situation for a lot of the rioters.

Local history, local myths and legends have been passed down for generations, it is only at this moment in time that they are no longer taught; and maybe that's a problem with the education system. Kids often speak about none of the knowledge they gain from education being of practical use, although that is clearly not the case it maybe because they can't see a connection between anything they're learning and the world they know.

I propose that the education system is decoupled from the National Curriculum in terms of case studies, and in subjects where there is scope, Geography, History, Business Studies, etc. we give the school or the local government greater control over which case studies are used within the subject. I think it would re-humanize and re-energize the teaching process in this country and possibly get kids to engage more, surely there is nothing better than a bit of local legend to engage a child.

Anyway sorry for the long spiel, the petition is below. If you agree with any of this please sign the petition and don't hesitate to share, and we'll see how far this thing goes. Thanks.

http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/10714

[V8mate]

I think kids should learn about their local area long before they hit the subject areas you describe. It's for the under 9s to learn about (and respect!) their local area, to maximise the upside of the African proverb you used.

For senior school/GCSE kids, I think it's tragic that none of them can point out the basics of the major rivers of the world and every capital city. Most couldn't point out their home town let alone the top ten cities in the UK on a blank map.

It may be learning by rote, but it's the start of having them realise that there's a whole lot more out there than just the local High St.

[Puffing Devil]

Possibly, but how much more would they feel the human impact of the Wars if History lesson told them about the immediate impact on the surrounding area during the war. How much more effectively would they see the rules of business in action if applied to a local business. Why does it matter if they can't point to all the world's major rivers? I could, and I literally can't think of any situations when I am going to need that rather useless bit of information. That's surely what they're talking about when they say the teaching isn't relevant. It seems like there's a focus on globalism in education merely for the sake of it.

[V8mate]

I think that if you tell kids that a row of terraced houses were bombed where B&Q is now, it may as well be a thousand miles away as next door.

[dandarez]

All too late I fear. Nobody is born a rioter. You have to get 'em young and teach 'em properly.

Right and wrong? That went out of the window with the liberalisers.

Boys were always said to 'listen and learn' respect from male teachers. Look at where it is in this country now. I know an old male primary head who would stop and talk to youngsters outside of school, now he fears doing so. What a tragedy.

In 2005, women made up 93%, yes 93%, of primary school teachers and women also were the majority (81%) of primary school head teachers that year. It's not much different now. This is not to denegrate women teachers but you 'need' an equal mix at the very least.

We've lost the plot.

[Eric Mc]

Lack of knowledge of your locality, lack of knowledge of what's going on in your community and lack of knowledge of local and national history all serve to ensure that people feel no connection whatsoever between themselves, other residents and those people and events that have gone before them.

This is one of the many strands of national collapse which helped fuel the fire of the riots.

Obviously, the education system has had a massive influence on what people know (or don't know, in this case).The infiltration of a strong "guilt" aspect to the teaching of British history has ensured that many young people grow up thinking that Britain should be despised for its role in world history. No wonder they hold everybody and everything in contempt. They've been told to think like this.

[Puffing Devil]

I agree on the primary school thing. Scientists predict that the Y chromosome is deteriorating and men will eventually become obsolete, with men no longer needed in the classroom or in the home what use do we have to the continued development and survival of the human race. They don't even need men for sperm anymore...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/fertilit...

Never has a man been made to feel more utterly useless than in 21st century Britain.

[SeeFive]

When I was first at Junior school (what's that, about 8?) we had to do a project on the history of our town as part of our history lessons. There would be a load of research at libraries, checking out the local rags etc, and producing a scrapbook size project on the area from earliest days to more recent. My wife did the same for her (different) town as did a lot of my mates from different areas.

Do kids not do this any more?

[southendpier]

yes, schools teach local history.

it is not the schools fault people behave like scum.

[V8mate]

southendpier said:

yes, schools teach local history.

it is not the schools fault people behave like scum.

Very true. It's those folk what spawned 'em.

[Puffing Devil]

Tbh when I was 8 we did a project on the history of Benin, and it wasn't a black majority school - if we did a local history project I can't remember it for the life of me. But this isn't so much about local history as a separate subject, but giving the school control over what case studies are given for related GCSE's rather than having the rather rigid case study system we have at the moment.

Case studies, are supposed to make the teaching material relevant to the real world, the world students know. The national curriculum is not really best equipped to know that world, the school is. The school should be able to react to the needs of the students rather than being rigidly confined by reams and reams of curriculum pages.

[Puffing Devil]

V8mate said:

Very true. It's those folk what spawned 'em.

Bit simplistic, I saw one guy on facebook ranting and raving about the rioters, and the next day his little sister bragging about how much fun she had during the riots. One of them was ashamed that his local community was getting smashed, and another taking pride in it getting smashed up. I know some whose parents condoned their actions, and every single one of them are career criminals. For the ones who parents don't condone their actions, and I know that girl got a beating, you have to ask why.

Those kids primarily went there for a sense of belonging, just so they could feel part of something. You have to ask why they don't feel part enough of the local community, that they had to partake in the riots, and that quote sums it up really. I'm part of that generation too, and I feel exactly as alienated as they do.

I have the association of nostalgia for my old hunting grounds, but for places like Reeves - nothing, it might as well have been a giant abandoned warehouse for all the feeling it ever elicited in me. The park where I played football used to be a huge boating lake - did not know that until after the riots, now when I go there I feel an odd vertigo and am annoyed I didn't experience that every time I played there. Jubilee Bridge is a simple flyover I thought was simply built as a tribute to the queen, I didn't know there used to be far bigger with shops adorning the sides, did't know there is a river here that was diverted underground, didn't know about the Croydon canal... I'm literally fuming at how little I know about the place I have lived in my whole life. It is flat-out disgraceful that the next generation should not be privy to the peculiarities and associations that make you feel part of a community, that knowledge is supposed to be what sets you apart from outsiders as part of the local community.

That African proverb "If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth." garnered support from a huge amount of people in the wake of the riots, because people could identify with it straight away.

[BMWBen]

Puffing Devil said:

I agree on the primary school thing. Scientists predict that the Y chromosome is deteriorating and men will eventually become obsolete, with men no longer needed in the classroom or in the home what use do we have to the continued development and survival of the human race. They don't even need men for sperm anymore...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/fertilit...

Never has a man been made to feel more utterly useless than in 21st century Britain.

"Scientists" have predicted have they? Like they predict the weather... And the home servant robot... Some women just love cock you know, we'll be fine

[perdu]

For what its worth (nothing) when I went to Primary School there was ONE male teacher, Mr McCann (who rode his bike to school every day with his son on a child seat behind him) to half a dozen or so lady (YES LADIES) teachers.

The only other male member of teaching staff was Mr Barr the headmaster.

To be honest it didn't hurt me at all.

(Making wrong decisions when passing the Eleven Plus did me far more harm)

This was in the nineteen fifties

But to go to the OPs point, it is sad that communities don't know much about "what went before" in their areas, but it was years before I discovered (for myself) that the odd coloured roof on one pair of semis in our road was because Hitler took against the local Lucas's factory in the forties...

You learn far more by talking to your neighbours than school is likly to give you

Still

The petition

I'll have a think

I'm not sure modern teaching does as much teaching as I got

So maybe