New twin turbo TDI from Audi revs convincingly past 5,000rpm

[Welshbeef]

http://www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/FirstDrives/Au...

Adother player to the field with high rpm for the TDI.

the old dagadagadaga comments will have to change as saying that out loud is just too slow vs the RPM.

[anonymous-user]

If peak power is at 4500rpm then why does it matter?

[Codswallop]

Sounds like crap mind you;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gy2ve24_viE.

[cerb4.5lee]

Its amazing what you can do with an oil burner nowadays,they didnt appeal to me once upon a time,but i respect the way they perform now loads.

If they could master a nice sounding tickover,then there would be no need to buy a petrol engine ever again.

[J4CKO]

I am so bored of the whole Diesel thing, started in the nineties for most with Turbo Diesel Peugeot's that did 50 mpg, then the rest cottoned on and everybody went diesel, then we got the common rail uber diesels (335D mapped, etc) and they keep coming out with more and more of them, people spending 46 grand on a diesel Audi then they still do the "ner ner ne ner ner" its fast for a diesel, faster than your petrol rubbish and it does 80 mpg, FFS IT WAS 46 GRAND !

Now we have it revs high (for a diesel) to go with it, sure its great and goes like stink but its time for a diesel backlash, a fast diesel, it just like a really jazzy Orathpedic shoe.

[TonyRPH]

Haven't diesels traditionally had a limited (upper) rev range because of the increased stresses on the big end / small end bearings and crank?

I wonder how long the bottom end will last with revving it beyond 5k RPM? (even with it being designed to do so).

[frosted]

J4CKO said:

FFS IT WAS 46 GRAND !

Is the petrol model half price ?

[DLovett]

doogz said:

Because you don't change gear at peak power.

When do you then change?

[bodhi]

Didn't BMW say years ago that a dismal could be made to rev like a petrol, but would drink like one as well? We're starting to see this manifest itself already in my book, with higher performance tractor engines drinking similar amounts to the petrol equivalent, so apart from low co2 for the company driver, what exactly is the point of a modern diesel?

For examples see x35i vs x35d, Golf GTI vs Golf Gtd, etc. Basing it on real world numbers there's less than 10 between them these days....

[y2blade]

doogz said:

DLovett said:

doogz said:

Because you don't change gear at peak power.

When do you then change?

Half past 2.

sorry but ...

[Ramses]

bodhi said:

Didn't BMW say years ago that a dismal could be made to rev like a petrol, but would drink like one as well? We're starting to see this manifest itself already in my book, with higher performance tractor engines drinking similar amounts to the petrol equivalent, so apart from low co2 for the company driver, what exactly is the point of a modern diesel?

For examples see x35i vs x35d, Golf GTI vs Golf Gtd, etc. Basing it on real world numbers there's less than 10 between them these days....

BMWs are a bad example to use to make that point, their oil burners are . 3.0 diesel kicking 250 bhp Vs 3.0 petrol with a likewise 250bhp - aside from the fact that the Oil burner will be quicker, with diesel version will give 50% better consumption. (real world figures - i've gone from 330i to a 530d and average 39/40mpg comapred to 23/24)

With non-BMW the difference is less noticable. Last time I looked the BMW lump gets c10mpg better than the VAG equivalent. The VAG units getting so that tehy are not demonstrably better than the petrol.

[A S P]

Have I missed the story??? What's the big deal about being able to rev to 5000rpm? Presumed diesels were already doing this.

Liking the accuracy of the headline, how far does it actually rev to?

[Welshbeef]

doogz said:

Seriously though, if you're wringing it's neck, would you change up at exactly peak power? I certainly wouldn't. There was a big discussion about this on here a couple of months back, it was quite a good read. If you're actually interested i'll see if i can find the thread?

The Focus ST and Fiat Coupe 20v Turbo both had red lines at 7k rpm but made peak power at 5,500rpm. I can tell you when pushing on I wouldnt be changing up at 5.5k I'd be keeping the throttle wide open up close to the limiter. Otherwise I'd never use 1,500rpm of the upper rev range.

[Synchromesh]

DLovett said:

doogz said:

Because you don't change gear at peak power.

When do you then change?

If you changed at peak power it may take you too far below the 'power band' in the next gear, so it can be best to change just after peak power, so that when you shift, you're still in the right rev range in the next gear. Not a great explanation but I'm sure someone will come along and make it clearer

[DLovett]

doogz said:

Seriously though, if you're wringing it's neck, would you change up at exactly peak power? I certainly wouldn't. There was a big discussion about this on here a couple of months back, it was quite a good read. If you're actually interested i'll see if i can find the thread?

I'm sincerely interested, I have always changed gear just around peak power RPM, but had a feeling you should perhaps go over by 500-1000 RPM due to gear ratios etc.

[TonyRPH]

doogz said:

TonyRPH said:

Haven't diesels traditionally had a limited (upper) rev range because of the increased stresses on the big end / small end bearings and crank?

I wonder how long the bottom end will last with revving it beyond 5k RPM? (even with it being designed to do so).

I always thought it was just down to the fact that diesel doesn't burn as fast as petrol?

I'm not sure - but I seem to recall reading somewhere that the higher compression ratios required by diesels put more stresses on bearings etc.

Perhaps that's all changed with forced induction anyway.

[greggy50]

DLovett said:

I'm sincerely interested, I have always changed gear just around peak power RPM, but had a feeling you should perhaps go over by 500-1000 RPM due to gear ratios etc.

I have always changed gear about 500 - 1k revs above depending on the car so when I change gear I am straight back in the power hand in my head I always presume they is more power a bit above the powerband rather than below it but whether this is true or not is another thing...
On the other hand I am sure I read the other day this audi got time at 0 - 60 in under 5 seconds bloody impressive for a diesel with a couple of tweeks this could be slotted into an Audi R8 I imagine and make a both extremely fast and economical everyday supercar

[RizzoTheRat]

Ramses said:

With non-BMW the difference is less noticable. Last time I looked the BMW lump gets c10mpg better than the VAG equivalent. The VAG units getting so that tehy are not demonstrably better than the petrol.

Difference seems pretty similar to me, I average around 45mpg from my Octavia CR170, with low 50's easily achievable on a longer run, while a mate used to reckon high 20's average from his 2.0 petrol version, and I think he said 37mph on a run.

[anonymous-user]

Let's see how it copes with 100K of stop/start ownership over 5 years. There is always a penalty for extracting more and more power from an oil burner.

[Welshbeef]

The surge in power delivery is great likewise the bigger rev range is great to have.

The only drawback is and I have this with my own car the noise. Sure when on a cruise etc you couldn't tell the difference as tyre and wins noise makes more noise than the engine.
But when giving it the max beans mine sounds far better than an I4 diesel and it's a reasonably nice growl but it's not a patch on the aural pleasure of a nice petrol. If they could engineer a nicer noise why would people drive a petrol?? Fewer petrol station visits to fill up