FIA press release - F1 changes
Discussion
FIA Press release said:
The FIA has today provided the Formula One teams with details of a package of measures to reduce the performance of Formula One cars. These measures are likely to be imposed if satisfactory proposals have not been agreed by at least eight teams and presented to the FIA before 6 September 2004.
1. Aerodynamics (2005)
Diffuser height limited, front wing raised, rear wing element moved forward and changes to the bodywork immediately in front of the rear wheels. Together, these changes are estimated to reduce downforce on a current car by at least 25%, but reduce drag by less than 4%.
Explanation: lower downforce will reduce speeds, particularly in fast corners, and slightly increase braking distances, while the small reduction in drag will have a minimal effect on straight-line speeds.
2. Tyres (2005)
A driver may choose from two types of tyre, as in 2004. He will then have two sets of his chosen tyre, one for Friday and Saturday practice, the other for qualifying and the race. A damaged tyre can be replaced during the race (taken from the first set), but the car cannot be refuelled at the same time as the damaged tyre is changed.
Explanation: a tyre which must last 350 km rather than 80 km will have less grip, reducing cornering speeds, increasing braking distances and possibly producing less tyre debris or “marbles”.
3. Engine (2005)
One engine to last for two race weekends.
Explanation: both peak and average power will be less than for an engine with a shorter life.
4. Engine (2006)
2.4 litre V8 (90º) with maximum bore diameter, fixed cylinder spacing, minimum crankshaft centre line height, minimum weight and minimum height of centre of gravity. Direct fuel injection, variable geometry inlet systems, variable geometry exhaust systems, variable valve timing and variable valve lift systems all prohibited. Only one spark plug, one coil and one injector per cylinder. Exotic materials banned.
Explanation: a 20% reduction in capacity will produce a corresponding drop in power. Constraints on design and the use of materials will significantly slow the rate of power increase and reduce the scope for using engine design to improve chassis characteristics. Keeping existing cylinder sizes retains many current engine components while keeping engine revs close to current levels.
5. Other engines
During 2006 and 2007, teams which cannot obtain a 2.4 litre engine will be able to use a 3 litre V10 with power restricted by means of a rev limit fixed by the FIA.
Explanation: this will ensure that all teams (including new entrants) have access to a competitive engine, even if supplies of the new 2.4 are initially restricted.
So before sept. 6th they will have to agree to some less NASCAR-esque rules.
I thought the FIA and Bernie could only force new rules if safety was involved. Otherwise, an agreement must be reached between teams and if not, no changes?
I would stop watching if rules like these were implemented.
I thought the FIA and Bernie could only force new rules if safety was involved. Otherwise, an agreement must be reached between teams and if not, no changes?
I would stop watching if rules like these were implemented.
These changes look very good to me, I think this will improve the sport no end, more about driver skill and less about pit stop advantages.
I have long thought that whoever has the first or last pit in the lane has an advantage, no having to swerve around other teams, either a straight run in or out. I have also noticed that Ferrari always have an end pit, am I right in thinking the teams can choose the pit with the championship winners of the previous year having first choice? I think that they should rotate through each pit position during the season, therefore no advantage accrues to any team.
I have long thought that whoever has the first or last pit in the lane has an advantage, no having to swerve around other teams, either a straight run in or out. I have also noticed that Ferrari always have an end pit, am I right in thinking the teams can choose the pit with the championship winners of the previous year having first choice? I think that they should rotate through each pit position during the season, therefore no advantage accrues to any team.
FIA Press release said:
2. Tyres (2005)
A driver may choose from two types of tyre, as in 2004. He will then have two sets of his chosen tyre, one for Friday and Saturday practice, the other for qualifying and the race. A damaged tyre can be replaced during the race (taken from the first set), but the car cannot be refuelled at the same time as the damaged tyre is changed.
Explanation: a tyre which must last 350 km rather than 80 km will have less grip, reducing cornering speeds, increasing braking distances and possibly producing less tyre debris or “marbles”.
Haven't they got this the wrong way around? If they're going to reduce downforce, they need to keep mechanical grip the same otherwise the mechanical/downforce balance remains the same and therefore still not allow cars to closely follow each other around corners. Also, I thought that the sensible option was to keep tyre changes but get rid of those damn fuel stops.
foster3jd said:
I would stop watching if rules like these were implemented.
Why?.... unless I'm reading this wrong, the effect of these rule changes would be to increase the probability of on track overtaking and decrease the effectiveness of pit-stop stratergies.
I can tell you would love NASCAR then!
I like the war of technology between engineers. Yes changes would help passing but I don't like rules that penalise drivers positions when the engines blew.
The FIA bungled it up when (hindsight 20/20) they put grooves in the tires and then again when they temporarily had one tire manufacturer. They should have at that point had a HARD standard tire for all.
HIstorically, the FIA has had some stupid rule changes that are in themselves extremely expensive to implement.
Not all the proposed rules are bad. Limiting the aerodynamics for one. But I like technology and I like the idea of reducing aero and increasing mechanical grip. But V8's remind me too much of NASCAR. Toyota should have been allowed to make a V12!
forever_driving said:With less downforce and harder tyre compounds cornering speeds will be reduced due to lower levels of grip... and yes, this will affect all cars in roughly equal measures.
2. Tyres (2005)
A driver may choose from two types of tyre, as in 2004. He will then have two sets of his chosen tyre, one for Friday and Saturday practice, the other for qualifying and the race. A damaged tyre can be replaced during the race (taken from the first set), but the car cannot be refuelled at the same time as the damaged tyre is changed.
Explanation: a tyre which must last 350 km rather than 80 km will have less grip, reducing cornering speeds, increasing braking distances and possibly producing less tyre debris or “marbles”.
However, it should also mean less marbles, hence wider and more varied racing lines, e.g. more options to attempt to drive round the outside, which we haven't seen too often in the last few years!... plus there is more chance of the cars getting out of shape and giving the car behind a run at them.
FourWheelDrift said:
And anyone getting a puncture and having to pit will be taken out of any race challenge because they will not be able to refuel at the same time.
Which isn't very good if they want to increase the racing spectacle.
But might be good for some "slicing through the backmarkers" type action.
Senna's death was quite a fluke. Although the liklehood of an identical accident is reduced because of the higher cockpit sides, a heavy impact with a hard wall could still produce fatal results.
There are huge dilemmas involved in messing about with F1 from the technical side. The main thing the F1 people want to maintain is the technical "superiority" and higher speeds that F1 possesses over lower racing formulae. If F1 went down the "low downforce", "lower BHP" route (which I kind of agree with), the performance of the cars would fall back towards lower grade racing which might make it less attractive to a certain element of the audience - and indeed, to a certain element of the technical people who work in F1. Also, drivers moving up the ranks to F1 might suddenly find themselves in cars which exhibit totally different characteristics to what they have been driving in F3 or F3000/GP2. Where would that leave them?
It's a bit like "squaring the circle".
>> Edited by Eric Mc on Sunday 18th July 09:58
There are huge dilemmas involved in messing about with F1 from the technical side. The main thing the F1 people want to maintain is the technical "superiority" and higher speeds that F1 possesses over lower racing formulae. If F1 went down the "low downforce", "lower BHP" route (which I kind of agree with), the performance of the cars would fall back towards lower grade racing which might make it less attractive to a certain element of the audience - and indeed, to a certain element of the technical people who work in F1. Also, drivers moving up the ranks to F1 might suddenly find themselves in cars which exhibit totally different characteristics to what they have been driving in F3 or F3000/GP2. Where would that leave them?
It's a bit like "squaring the circle".
>> Edited by Eric Mc on Sunday 18th July 09:58
CART (Champ car) suffers more than anything due the American passion for oval track racing, hence on a domestic scale it competes against the Indy Racing League for attention and investment. Currently it runs a grid of just 18-20 cars but still includes some house hold names, including our own Justin Wilson.
IMHO, the racing is good and close, and more worthy of tv time than the current F1 set-up.
IMHO, the racing is good and close, and more worthy of tv time than the current F1 set-up.
Eric Mc said:The whole feeder system would need to be overhauled too, so that each formula was an incremental jump along the same path... this would be difficult to legislate and get right, but not impossible.
Also, drivers moving up the ranks to F1 might suddenly find themselves in cars which exhibit totally different characteristics to what they have been driving in F3 or F3000/GP2. Where would that leave them?
kevinday said:It's quite simple, the car numbers and pits are allocated according to the maunafactureres and drivers positions in last years drivers championship. Hence (these last 4 or 5 years) Schumacher/Barrachello/Ferrari are #1&2, and so on down the grid etc.
I have long thought that whoever has the first or last pit in the lane has an advantage.... am I right in thinking the teams can choose the pit with the championship winners of the previous year having first choice?
Remove the plank. Since this is all supposed to be for the benefit of TV, let the cars bottom out on straights again. Cars hitting the floor equals sparks, which look amazing and make people say things like "ooo" and "ahh".
Big, wide slicks, compounds controlled by the FIA, but not rock hard. The cars need lots of mechanical grip.
Wings the same, or maybe slightly bigger. Make the cars look better, and keep sponsors happy by giving them more space.
Total ban on diffusers, barge boards, turning vanes and those silly little winglets at the back of the sidepods and on airboxes. This will cut downforce by around 30-35%, giving the decrease in corner speeds the FIA want. This will also drastically reduce the turbulence experienced by following cars, making overtaking easier.
This 2.4 litre V8 proposal is crap. Even if all the exotic materials are banned, the engine manufacturers will probably be able to get 19,000-20,000rpm out of a smaller engince before long, so they're still going to produce well over 800bhp. Which is good, but its going to cost a fortune.
Now, I know I posted the other day saying I wanted a return to 1.5 litre turbo motors, but that was with my silly, money no object head on.
The rules should be: 3 litre engine, number of cylinders free. The block must be constructed of aluminium, and steel used for pistons, conrods and cranks. Titanium can be used for valves, valve springs and exhausts. No exotic alloys or precious metals allowed. The valves must be operated by a mechanical camshaft and valve spring arrangement. Pneumatic, magnetic and computer controlled valves will not be permitted. This will cap engine speeds to around 15,000-16,000rpm. Any faster than that and the valve springs start to melt in a big capacity engine.
Direct injection, variable valve timing etc banned
Refuelling banned, number of tyre stops free.
One hour qualifying session on Saturday with no lap limit. That means people will go out at the start of the session, so we won't be staring at nothing for half an hour, as sometimes used to happen.
A manual, H-pattern gearbox, maximum of 6 forward speeds, with the clutch fully under the drivers control, with the pedal mounted in the footwell. A ban on active differentials, traction control and all driver aids.
I could say go to a standard, FIA ECU, but this is F1 after all, so there needs to be a certain technological element.
Force the teams to use steel discs, and possibly ban carbon pads as well. This will increase braking distances probably by 10-20%, and make overtaking easier.
What does everyone think of that then?
Big, wide slicks, compounds controlled by the FIA, but not rock hard. The cars need lots of mechanical grip.
Wings the same, or maybe slightly bigger. Make the cars look better, and keep sponsors happy by giving them more space.
Total ban on diffusers, barge boards, turning vanes and those silly little winglets at the back of the sidepods and on airboxes. This will cut downforce by around 30-35%, giving the decrease in corner speeds the FIA want. This will also drastically reduce the turbulence experienced by following cars, making overtaking easier.
This 2.4 litre V8 proposal is crap. Even if all the exotic materials are banned, the engine manufacturers will probably be able to get 19,000-20,000rpm out of a smaller engince before long, so they're still going to produce well over 800bhp. Which is good, but its going to cost a fortune.
Now, I know I posted the other day saying I wanted a return to 1.5 litre turbo motors, but that was with my silly, money no object head on.
The rules should be: 3 litre engine, number of cylinders free. The block must be constructed of aluminium, and steel used for pistons, conrods and cranks. Titanium can be used for valves, valve springs and exhausts. No exotic alloys or precious metals allowed. The valves must be operated by a mechanical camshaft and valve spring arrangement. Pneumatic, magnetic and computer controlled valves will not be permitted. This will cap engine speeds to around 15,000-16,000rpm. Any faster than that and the valve springs start to melt in a big capacity engine.
Direct injection, variable valve timing etc banned
Refuelling banned, number of tyre stops free.
One hour qualifying session on Saturday with no lap limit. That means people will go out at the start of the session, so we won't be staring at nothing for half an hour, as sometimes used to happen.
A manual, H-pattern gearbox, maximum of 6 forward speeds, with the clutch fully under the drivers control, with the pedal mounted in the footwell. A ban on active differentials, traction control and all driver aids.
I could say go to a standard, FIA ECU, but this is F1 after all, so there needs to be a certain technological element.
Force the teams to use steel discs, and possibly ban carbon pads as well. This will increase braking distances probably by 10-20%, and make overtaking easier.
What does everyone think of that then?
foster3jd said:
I would stop watching if rules like these were implemented.
Why?.... unless I'm reading this wrong, the effect of these rule changes would be to increase the probability of on track overtaking and decrease the effectiveness of pit-stop stratergies.
When will somebody realise that it doesn't matter how much you change the engine, if everybody has the same then overtaking is virtually impossible!
In order for one car to pass another it has to be travelling FASTER at that moment in time. This is not possible if everything about them is manufactured to the same exacting standards to the same exacting rules!
Small, light cars stop quicker and corner faster. Big powerful cars accelerate quicker and have a higher top speed. A very simple equation for overtaking, DIFFERENT TYPES OF CAR.
Just imagine, Ferrari V12, BMW V10s, Renaut V6 turbos and some wacky brit slapping a 19litre V24 into one of the minnows. Fun, excitement, variation and all the top class technology F1 needs.... infact more than it has at the moment.
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