Breaking the House Purchase Chain

[XJ75]

We are currently trying to move house, the chain is quite small as follows:

Investor -> Buyer of our place -> Us -> Place we are buying (which is probate)

The investor is a cash buyer, the buyer of our place is a cash buyer, we aren't cash buyers but our mortgage is fully approved and in place. All the searches and paperwork at each stage of the chain are complete and ready to go, with the exception of not having the probate granted yet.

Just been told that there's an issue with the probate of the place we are buying, something about having to amend the will. They have absolutely no idea how long it will take to sort (couldn't even say weeks or months). They are asking us if we would consider moving out so that we can complete on our sale. We have a BTL locally which we could have moved into, but I've recently renewed the tenancy on that so it's no longer an option. My mother lives fairly local but her house is small so it's far from ideal to move in with her. On top of that, we are facing paying for the removal costs twice, paying for putting our stuff in storage, plus my commute will be much longer and expensive (I use the train) if we stayed with my mother.

I'm tempted to suggest that our buyers temporarily move out instead, but I'm not sure if I'm being unreasonable. We don't want to lose our buyers as they paid a price that we are very happy with.

Any suggestions? Thanks.

[boyse7en]

Asking the occupiers of the house you are looking to buy to move out doesn't help. You won't be able to move in until you have bought it, which you can't do until probate has been completed.

You're stuck (and I can sympathize as similar happened to me with delayed probate) with either moving out into rented/relatives house and completing your sale, or trying to delay your sale to the cash buyers.

Both of these options have risks:
If you move out and probate takes several months to complete the price of the house may increase (they did this to us)
If you move out and rent you may have to pay 6 or 12 months rent even if probate comes through in a fortnight
If you stay put, your buyer may take their cash elsewhere and buy something else.

[LemonParty]

Can you ask the estate of the house you are buying if you can move in and rent that until the sale goes through?? Only one move, etc. plus the estate grows with the rental income.

[XJ75]

boyse7en said:

Asking the occupiers of the house you are looking to buy to move out doesn't help. You won't be able to move in until you have bought it, which you can't do until probate has been completed.

Sorry I meant ask the buyers of our house to move out so that the investor at their end of the chain can complete (I believe it's the investor that is getting impatient).

[kambites]

I think it's very unlikely that anyone is going to be willing to commit to moving before contracts have been signed (which I assume they haven't, if the probate isn't finalised yet?).

[KrazyIvan]

XJ75 said:

Sorry I meant ask the buyers of our house to move out so that the investor at their end of the chain can complete (I believe it's the investor that is getting impatient).

Why would you get involved in that end of the deal?

Imagine they move out into a rented property, the deal for the house your buying falls through, and you cant move now for some time while you search for a new house, your previous buyer is now stuck and losing money and your being blamed, the only winner would be the investor.

If the investor is getting impatient, other then pass the pressure on down the line hoping it can move it forward a little quicker, there really isn't much you can do.

[XJ75]

KrazyIvan said:

Why would you get involved in that end of the deal?

Imagine they move out into a rented property, the deal for the house your buying falls through, and you cant move now for some time while you search for a new house, your previous buyer is now stuck and losing money and your being blamed, the only winner would be the investor.

If the investor is getting impatient, other then pass the pressure on down the line hoping it can move it forward a little quicker, there really isn't much you can do.

Only because that's the end the pressure is coming from. We are in no hurry to move, so why should we take the risk of moving out? It's not really fair on them to expect them to move out, but equally I don't think it's fair on us to move out either.

[XJ75]

On a separate note, if we do move out, is it unreasonable to ask for some compensation to cover additional removal costs, storage costs and rent (possibly ~6 months of rent)?

[KrazyIvan]

XJ75 said:

KrazyIvan said:

Why would you get involved in that end of the deal?

Imagine they move out into a rented property, the deal for the house your buying falls through, and you cant move now for some time while you search for a new house, your previous buyer is now stuck and losing money and your being blamed, the only winner would be the investor.

If the investor is getting impatient, other then pass the pressure on down the line hoping it can move it forward a little quicker, there really isn't much you can do.

Only because that's the end the pressure is coming from. We are in no hurry to move, so why should we take the risk of moving out? It's not really fair on them to expect them to move out, but equally I don't think it's fair on us to move out either.

Your absolutely right, the investor needs to be told to show some understanding (they are they only one in the chain in it to make money by the sound of it) and the probate, well that will take as long as it takes and all anybody can do is ensure the solicitors are not sitting on it for no reason.


As said there really isn't much you can do.

Good luck and I hope it all works out fine in the end, even if it is a little delayed.

[kambites]

XJ75 said:

On a separate note, if we do move out, is it unreasonable to ask for some compensation to cover additional removal costs, storage costs and rent (possibly ~6 months of rent)?

Compensation from whom? It all depends on who's most desperate to close the deal.

I suppose another way to put it is to reverse the question, how much would you be willing to pay your buyers to move into rented accommodation?

[XJ75]

kambites said:

Compensation from whom? It all depends on who's most desperate to close the deal.

I suppose another way to put it is to reverse the question, how much would you be willing to pay your buyers to move into rented accommodation?

I guess from either the investor or the buyer of our place. Basically I don't want to end up out of pocket just because someone is in a hurry. But on the flip side I don't want the whole lot to collapse, it's a delicate balancing act!

[kambites]

You pays your money... if you're personally willing to make a financial contribution to hold the chain up you might be able to. I suspect the cheapest way for you to do so will be for you to be the one that moves, though. Anything else, and you still have the risk of the chain falling through and you losing your money.

If you're not willing to spend that sort of money, you're at the mercy of the commitment of the other people in the chain.

Edited by kambites on Thursday 15th June 14:00

[kambites]

Probably also worth noting that if you are willing to move into rented accommodation and sell, even if the property you're buying were to fall through, you'll end up with considerably more buying power with no chain behind you.

[PositronicRay]

LemonParty said:

Can you ask the estate of the house you are buying if you can move in and rent that until the sale goes through?? Only one move, etc. plus the estate grows with the rental income.

This was an option a relative took in a similar situation. They were going to be allowed to move in rent free, under licence. Didn't happen in the end before the licence was drawn up issues resolved nd everything moved quickly after months of delays.

[XJ75]

We've now had 2 suggestions from the estate agent:

1. Exchange contracts on the sale of our place but don't complete until the probate is granted on the house we are buying
2. Exchange and complete and on the sale of our place and rent the new place under some kind of license agreement until we can exchange/complete

I'm leaning towards option 1, but presumably that means exchanging contracts without a completion date, which isn't ideal.

[PositronicRay]

XJ75 said:

We've now had 2 suggestions from the estate agent:

1. Exchange contracts on the sale of our place but don't complete until the probate is granted on the house we are buying
2. Exchange and complete and on the sale of our place and rent the new place under some kind of license agreement until we can exchange/complete

I'm leaning towards option 1, but presumably that means exchanging contracts without a completion date, which isn't ideal.

Will the chain below you be okay with 1)

[XJ75]

It sounds like they would. I called the estate agent back to get clarity. Option 1 actually involves a "longstop completion", which is where we would agree a completion date quite far ahead (~3 months).

Worst case is that after 3 months, we could move into my mother's place.

[Bill]

XJ75 said:

We've now had 2 suggestions from the estate agent:

1. Exchange contracts on the sale of our place but don't complete until the probate is granted on the house we are buying
2. Exchange and complete and on the sale of our place and rent the new place under some kind of license agreement until we can exchange/complete

I'm leaning towards option 1, but presumably that means exchanging contracts without a completion date, which isn't ideal.

2 seems easiest, unless it's a state.

[kambites]

I'd be surprised if the investor is willing to commit to a completion in three month's time. They'd either need to keep the cash liquid enough to guarantee that they can complete on that date (which, depending on the size of the company, could severely limit their cash-flow) or risk being in breach of contract if they can't liquidate the money at the right time for some reason.

[Robertj21a]

My experience of disputed/problem probates is that they can take forever to get fully sorted. I would be looking to make plans that avoid the probate property.