330i or Legacy 3.0R Spec B
Discussion
I'm currently debating between these two cars as my next car for family duties as well as the occasional weekend blast. I'm very familiar with the 3 series on both E46 and E9X platforms having owned both but in diesel form.
I've only recently come across the Legacy as I was looking for an N/A alternative to the 330i and it seems like it would certainly be worth a look. Similar sort of power and weight to a 330i but with AWD instead of RWD.
Has anyone owned or driven both of these, how do they compare? I'm not going to expect German levels of build quality from the Subaru but I'm more concerned with driving dynamics. Which of the two is more fun to drive? MPG isn't really a concern either, I know the 330i would probably be better but I'm not doing enough miles to worry about that.
P.s both would be manual only if that sways it for either car.
I've only recently come across the Legacy as I was looking for an N/A alternative to the 330i and it seems like it would certainly be worth a look. Similar sort of power and weight to a 330i but with AWD instead of RWD.
Has anyone owned or driven both of these, how do they compare? I'm not going to expect German levels of build quality from the Subaru but I'm more concerned with driving dynamics. Which of the two is more fun to drive? MPG isn't really a concern either, I know the 330i would probably be better but I'm not doing enough miles to worry about that.
P.s both would be manual only if that sways it for either car.
I'll be looking out to see how anyone who has had both thinks they compare as I currently have an early manual E90 330i.
If it matters I think all the Spec B Legacy models are in Band M for Road Fund Licence, so £570 a year. But early 330is with the N52 engine are Band K, and the later ones with the N53 are in a lower band.
If it matters I think all the Spec B Legacy models are in Band M for Road Fund Licence, so £570 a year. But early 330is with the N52 engine are Band K, and the later ones with the N53 are in a lower band.
I have a Legacy spec B and mine is the high tax, but one earlier than early 2006 would be lower. The 3.0 H6 is a peach of an engine and if you want a sporty drive the manual is the way to go. I have not had mine long but it has been totally reliable so far. Never had the BMW so cannot compare the two.
Mr Tidy said:
I'll be looking out to see how anyone who has had both thinks they compare as I currently have an early manual E90 330i.
If it matters I think all the Spec B Legacy models are in Band M for Road Fund Licence, so £570 a year. But early 330is with the N52 engine are Band K, and the later ones with the N53 are in a lower band.
Yep post 06 Legacy is stung with the higher tax band so might try to find one slightly older. Only interested in the N52, heard too many bad things about the N53.If it matters I think all the Spec B Legacy models are in Band M for Road Fund Licence, so £570 a year. But early 330is with the N52 engine are Band K, and the later ones with the N53 are in a lower band.
asimmalik said:
Yep post 06 Legacy is stung with the higher tax band so might try to find one slightly older. Only interested in the N52, heard too many bad things about the N53.
Good plan, the tax change came into force for cars registered on or later than 23 March 2006. While I can live with £570 a year (I think) for my Z4M Coupe I couldn't justify that for a daily. I'm on my 4th N52 because I just didn't want an N53 either.
I ran a 325i with the N53 for three years. The benefits over the N52 were lower tax and greater efficiency, it averaged 35mpg and I used to use all the performance regularly.
The problem with the N53 is the piezo fuel injectors which fail and leak causing rough running and misfires. Unfortunately the only real solution seems to be to replace all 6 as doing them individually puts more pressure on the others causing them to fail soon after. Cost me £2k after just a year of ownership and I have to say I was gutted and felt like giving up on the car. But nothing else ever went wrong and from what I read it rarely does. It was a good car.
If you're looking at older ones it'd be N52 anyway which is probably the safer bet. But if you find an N53 with the injectors replaced by the latest index then it should be fine.
The problem with the N53 is the piezo fuel injectors which fail and leak causing rough running and misfires. Unfortunately the only real solution seems to be to replace all 6 as doing them individually puts more pressure on the others causing them to fail soon after. Cost me £2k after just a year of ownership and I have to say I was gutted and felt like giving up on the car. But nothing else ever went wrong and from what I read it rarely does. It was a good car.
If you're looking at older ones it'd be N52 anyway which is probably the safer bet. But if you find an N53 with the injectors replaced by the latest index then it should be fine.
Just bought a 2006 E92 335i. 60K miles, full BMW history, very good nick.
Some people would see it as poverty spec - manual, no sunroof, no iDrive/NAV. But I see it as 'driver spec'. Only downside - needs new boots all round, and it's the expensive road tax band.
Still - a lot of car for 6K I reckon.
I do like the Subaru too. No bad choice here I reckon.
Some people would see it as poverty spec - manual, no sunroof, no iDrive/NAV. But I see it as 'driver spec'. Only downside - needs new boots all round, and it's the expensive road tax band.
Still - a lot of car for 6K I reckon.
I do like the Subaru too. No bad choice here I reckon.
JohnBRG said:
Just bought a 2006 E92 335i. 60K miles, full BMW history, very good nick.
Some people would see it as poverty spec - manual, no sunroof, no iDrive/NAV. But I see it as 'driver spec'. Only downside - needs new boots all round, and it's the expensive road tax band.
Still - a lot of car for 6K I reckon.
I do like the Subaru too. No bad choice here I reckon.
My current daily is a 2006 330d touring, also without i-drive. The CCC i-drive from this generation is prehistoric so no real loss there. And manual is what I'd choose too with the 335i, certainly the drivers choice. Some people would see it as poverty spec - manual, no sunroof, no iDrive/NAV. But I see it as 'driver spec'. Only downside - needs new boots all round, and it's the expensive road tax band.
Still - a lot of car for 6K I reckon.
I do like the Subaru too. No bad choice here I reckon.
Owned an N55 and S55 before so I know the 330i or Legacy won't feel 'that fast'. Just fancied something N/A whilst they still exist!
I've had both.
The subaru first.
The legacy is good. Very good. It has a nice noise to it. It does handle very well, but then its awd handling, so its planted and sure footed and not being as lairy as its cousin the impreza. It's the more "grown up" of the Subaru saloon/wagon family. It didn't have so much power that it was beyond the limits of the chassis but by god did it like to drink fuel. I would see low 18mpg probably and remember thinking "its doing quite well on fuel". It really did like to drink when i was driving round town or hard. So all the time.
That said, i wouldn't say it was a car that "egged" me on to drive it in a fun way. Very planted and good to drive, smooth and not overtly always on the ragged edge, it flew under the radar but it was never all that engaging. So i am not sure you'd find it "fun". There is an "amusement" factor when you first get it. You don't feel it should be as quick or as fun as it is for such a big understated car. But frequent trips to the petrol station and not that many smiles between each trip. That amusement soons begin to wear off.
Then comes reliability. If anything went wrong it was expensive. Parts are expensive and they are not easy to work on at home. If you have normal sized hands you are going to struggle. So servicing was a pain in the rear as was replacing anything that had issues. And while some say Subaru may be good with reliability - trust me - i've had 6 and they are not. Things can and do go wrong and they are often expensive to fix.
Now the BMW - Whilst memory serves, the e9* 3.0 straight six 330i has a heavier kerb weight, you don't feel it. I would say the legacy looked and felt bigger despite winning on kg's. The BMW was lighter to steer and when pushing on, felt more alive and fun. That is why i like them over the Subaru. The subaru ticks the box of size and flying under the radar. But not by much. The wagon/saloon m-sport 330i is not a flashy thing. It's not as loud as the 335i and not as shouty but it does like a nice spirited b-road drive as you can really feel that coming into play if you drive them back to back.
Servicing wise - the parts from BMW are expensive, but get oem good enough from a motor factors i found it easier to work on and cheaper to maintain than any of my subarus and frankly more reliable. I also felt that compared to my friends 335i, i could use more of my power more of the time without getting into trouble. But i guess its horses for courses, the 335i definitely is a different animal to the n/a. But the n/a just has that appeal of heritage - German. RWD. Straight six. Not something that is available anymore. It's a lovely revvy engine and sounds really nice out the factory. The subaru is muted and without stainless exhausts in play, I would tip the BMW for liking the "noise" element.
Fuel wise, the BMW did drink that bit more when pushing on, but only comparing it to itself. Round town would see 20's and on longer journeys well into the high 30mpg marks - the subaru could get nowhere near. I'd fill up the subaru twice for every once time i did the BMW and i remember that those drives gave more smiles in the BMW than they did the subaru.
So i rate both cars. Both very good. I would get the Subaru for the under the radar, not many about reason. But that reason alone. For comfort and smiles and doing nearly everything the legacy can do for less money over the term of ownership, i would get the BMW.
The subaru first.
The legacy is good. Very good. It has a nice noise to it. It does handle very well, but then its awd handling, so its planted and sure footed and not being as lairy as its cousin the impreza. It's the more "grown up" of the Subaru saloon/wagon family. It didn't have so much power that it was beyond the limits of the chassis but by god did it like to drink fuel. I would see low 18mpg probably and remember thinking "its doing quite well on fuel". It really did like to drink when i was driving round town or hard. So all the time.
That said, i wouldn't say it was a car that "egged" me on to drive it in a fun way. Very planted and good to drive, smooth and not overtly always on the ragged edge, it flew under the radar but it was never all that engaging. So i am not sure you'd find it "fun". There is an "amusement" factor when you first get it. You don't feel it should be as quick or as fun as it is for such a big understated car. But frequent trips to the petrol station and not that many smiles between each trip. That amusement soons begin to wear off.
Then comes reliability. If anything went wrong it was expensive. Parts are expensive and they are not easy to work on at home. If you have normal sized hands you are going to struggle. So servicing was a pain in the rear as was replacing anything that had issues. And while some say Subaru may be good with reliability - trust me - i've had 6 and they are not. Things can and do go wrong and they are often expensive to fix.
Now the BMW - Whilst memory serves, the e9* 3.0 straight six 330i has a heavier kerb weight, you don't feel it. I would say the legacy looked and felt bigger despite winning on kg's. The BMW was lighter to steer and when pushing on, felt more alive and fun. That is why i like them over the Subaru. The subaru ticks the box of size and flying under the radar. But not by much. The wagon/saloon m-sport 330i is not a flashy thing. It's not as loud as the 335i and not as shouty but it does like a nice spirited b-road drive as you can really feel that coming into play if you drive them back to back.
Servicing wise - the parts from BMW are expensive, but get oem good enough from a motor factors i found it easier to work on and cheaper to maintain than any of my subarus and frankly more reliable. I also felt that compared to my friends 335i, i could use more of my power more of the time without getting into trouble. But i guess its horses for courses, the 335i definitely is a different animal to the n/a. But the n/a just has that appeal of heritage - German. RWD. Straight six. Not something that is available anymore. It's a lovely revvy engine and sounds really nice out the factory. The subaru is muted and without stainless exhausts in play, I would tip the BMW for liking the "noise" element.
Fuel wise, the BMW did drink that bit more when pushing on, but only comparing it to itself. Round town would see 20's and on longer journeys well into the high 30mpg marks - the subaru could get nowhere near. I'd fill up the subaru twice for every once time i did the BMW and i remember that those drives gave more smiles in the BMW than they did the subaru.
So i rate both cars. Both very good. I would get the Subaru for the under the radar, not many about reason. But that reason alone. For comfort and smiles and doing nearly everything the legacy can do for less money over the term of ownership, i would get the BMW.
stevekoz said:
I've had both.
The subaru first.
The legacy is good. Very good. It has a nice noise to it. It does handle very well, but then its awd handling, so its planted and sure footed and not being as lairy as its cousin the impreza. It's the more "grown up" of the Subaru saloon/wagon family. It didn't have so much power that it was beyond the limits of the chassis but by god did it like to drink fuel. I would see low 18mpg probably and remember thinking "its doing quite well on fuel". It really did like to drink when i was driving round town or hard. So all the time.
That said, i wouldn't say it was a car that "egged" me on to drive it in a fun way. Very planted and good to drive, smooth and not overtly always on the ragged edge, it flew under the radar but it was never all that engaging. So i am not sure you'd find it "fun". There is an "amusement" factor when you first get it. You don't feel it should be as quick or as fun as it is for such a big understated car. But frequent trips to the petrol station and not that many smiles between each trip. That amusement soons begin to wear off.
Then comes reliability. If anything went wrong it was expensive. Parts are expensive and they are not easy to work on at home. If you have normal sized hands you are going to struggle. So servicing was a pain in the rear as was replacing anything that had issues. And while some say Subaru may be good with reliability - trust me - i've had 6 and they are not. Things can and do go wrong and they are often expensive to fix.
Now the BMW - Whilst memory serves, the e9* 3.0 straight six 330i has a heavier kerb weight, you don't feel it. I would say the legacy looked and felt bigger despite winning on kg's. The BMW was lighter to steer and when pushing on, felt more alive and fun. That is why i like them over the Subaru. The subaru ticks the box of size and flying under the radar. But not by much. The wagon/saloon m-sport 330i is not a flashy thing. It's not as loud as the 335i and not as shouty but it does like a nice spirited b-road drive as you can really feel that coming into play if you drive them back to back.
Servicing wise - the parts from BMW are expensive, but get oem good enough from a motor factors i found it easier to work on and cheaper to maintain than any of my subarus and frankly more reliable. I also felt that compared to my friends 335i, i could use more of my power more of the time without getting into trouble. But i guess its horses for courses, the 335i definitely is a different animal to the n/a. But the n/a just has that appeal of heritage - German. RWD. Straight six. Not something that is available anymore. It's a lovely revvy engine and sounds really nice out the factory. The subaru is muted and without stainless exhausts in play, I would tip the BMW for liking the "noise" element.
Fuel wise, the BMW did drink that bit more when pushing on, but only comparing it to itself. Round town would see 20's and on longer journeys well into the high 30mpg marks - the subaru could get nowhere near. I'd fill up the subaru twice for every once time i did the BMW and i remember that those drives gave more smiles in the BMW than they did the subaru.
So i rate both cars. Both very good. I would get the Subaru for the under the radar, not many about reason. But that reason alone. For comfort and smiles and doing nearly everything the legacy can do for less money over the term of ownership, i would get the BMW.
That's just the kind of response I was looking for, much appreciated! The subaru first.
The legacy is good. Very good. It has a nice noise to it. It does handle very well, but then its awd handling, so its planted and sure footed and not being as lairy as its cousin the impreza. It's the more "grown up" of the Subaru saloon/wagon family. It didn't have so much power that it was beyond the limits of the chassis but by god did it like to drink fuel. I would see low 18mpg probably and remember thinking "its doing quite well on fuel". It really did like to drink when i was driving round town or hard. So all the time.
That said, i wouldn't say it was a car that "egged" me on to drive it in a fun way. Very planted and good to drive, smooth and not overtly always on the ragged edge, it flew under the radar but it was never all that engaging. So i am not sure you'd find it "fun". There is an "amusement" factor when you first get it. You don't feel it should be as quick or as fun as it is for such a big understated car. But frequent trips to the petrol station and not that many smiles between each trip. That amusement soons begin to wear off.
Then comes reliability. If anything went wrong it was expensive. Parts are expensive and they are not easy to work on at home. If you have normal sized hands you are going to struggle. So servicing was a pain in the rear as was replacing anything that had issues. And while some say Subaru may be good with reliability - trust me - i've had 6 and they are not. Things can and do go wrong and they are often expensive to fix.
Now the BMW - Whilst memory serves, the e9* 3.0 straight six 330i has a heavier kerb weight, you don't feel it. I would say the legacy looked and felt bigger despite winning on kg's. The BMW was lighter to steer and when pushing on, felt more alive and fun. That is why i like them over the Subaru. The subaru ticks the box of size and flying under the radar. But not by much. The wagon/saloon m-sport 330i is not a flashy thing. It's not as loud as the 335i and not as shouty but it does like a nice spirited b-road drive as you can really feel that coming into play if you drive them back to back.
Servicing wise - the parts from BMW are expensive, but get oem good enough from a motor factors i found it easier to work on and cheaper to maintain than any of my subarus and frankly more reliable. I also felt that compared to my friends 335i, i could use more of my power more of the time without getting into trouble. But i guess its horses for courses, the 335i definitely is a different animal to the n/a. But the n/a just has that appeal of heritage - German. RWD. Straight six. Not something that is available anymore. It's a lovely revvy engine and sounds really nice out the factory. The subaru is muted and without stainless exhausts in play, I would tip the BMW for liking the "noise" element.
Fuel wise, the BMW did drink that bit more when pushing on, but only comparing it to itself. Round town would see 20's and on longer journeys well into the high 30mpg marks - the subaru could get nowhere near. I'd fill up the subaru twice for every once time i did the BMW and i remember that those drives gave more smiles in the BMW than they did the subaru.
So i rate both cars. Both very good. I would get the Subaru for the under the radar, not many about reason. But that reason alone. For comfort and smiles and doing nearly everything the legacy can do for less money over the term of ownership, i would get the BMW.
I did have the feeling the BMW would be the better car to drive but hoped to be swayed into the Subaru because it's something different. And although MPG isn't a massive concern, 18mpg isn't really worth it for a 240bhp car.
With that being said, I'd still love to try the Subaru, maybe with a few suspension tweaks they can be a bit more engaging? BMWs just seem to get it right out the box.
The reliability is the really surprising thing that you've mentioned there, would expect a lot better from the Scooby!
asimmalik said:
stevekoz said:
I've had both.
The subaru first.
The legacy is good. Very good. It has a nice noise to it. It does handle very well, but then its awd handling, so its planted and sure footed and not being as lairy as its cousin the impreza. It's the more "grown up" of the Subaru saloon/wagon family. It didn't have so much power that it was beyond the limits of the chassis but by god did it like to drink fuel. I would see low 18mpg probably and remember thinking "its doing quite well on fuel". It really did like to drink when i was driving round town or hard. So all the time.
That said, i wouldn't say it was a car that "egged" me on to drive it in a fun way. Very planted and good to drive, smooth and not overtly always on the ragged edge, it flew under the radar but it was never all that engaging. So i am not sure you'd find it "fun". There is an "amusement" factor when you first get it. You don't feel it should be as quick or as fun as it is for such a big understated car. But frequent trips to the petrol station and not that many smiles between each trip. That amusement soons begin to wear off.
Then comes reliability. If anything went wrong it was expensive. Parts are expensive and they are not easy to work on at home. If you have normal sized hands you are going to struggle. So servicing was a pain in the rear as was replacing anything that had issues. And while some say Subaru may be good with reliability - trust me - i've had 6 and they are not. Things can and do go wrong and they are often expensive to fix.
Now the BMW - Whilst memory serves, the e9* 3.0 straight six 330i has a heavier kerb weight, you don't feel it. I would say the legacy looked and felt bigger despite winning on kg's. The BMW was lighter to steer and when pushing on, felt more alive and fun. That is why i like them over the Subaru. The subaru ticks the box of size and flying under the radar. But not by much. The wagon/saloon m-sport 330i is not a flashy thing. It's not as loud as the 335i and not as shouty but it does like a nice spirited b-road drive as you can really feel that coming into play if you drive them back to back.
Servicing wise - the parts from BMW are expensive, but get oem good enough from a motor factors i found it easier to work on and cheaper to maintain than any of my subarus and frankly more reliable. I also felt that compared to my friends 335i, i could use more of my power more of the time without getting into trouble. But i guess its horses for courses, the 335i definitely is a different animal to the n/a. But the n/a just has that appeal of heritage - German. RWD. Straight six. Not something that is available anymore. It's a lovely revvy engine and sounds really nice out the factory. The subaru is muted and without stainless exhausts in play, I would tip the BMW for liking the "noise" element.
Fuel wise, the BMW did drink that bit more when pushing on, but only comparing it to itself. Round town would see 20's and on longer journeys well into the high 30mpg marks - the subaru could get nowhere near. I'd fill up the subaru twice for every once time i did the BMW and i remember that those drives gave more smiles in the BMW than they did the subaru.
So i rate both cars. Both very good. I would get the Subaru for the under the radar, not many about reason. But that reason alone. For comfort and smiles and doing nearly everything the legacy can do for less money over the term of ownership, i would get the BMW.
That's just the kind of response I was looking for, much appreciated! The subaru first.
The legacy is good. Very good. It has a nice noise to it. It does handle very well, but then its awd handling, so its planted and sure footed and not being as lairy as its cousin the impreza. It's the more "grown up" of the Subaru saloon/wagon family. It didn't have so much power that it was beyond the limits of the chassis but by god did it like to drink fuel. I would see low 18mpg probably and remember thinking "its doing quite well on fuel". It really did like to drink when i was driving round town or hard. So all the time.
That said, i wouldn't say it was a car that "egged" me on to drive it in a fun way. Very planted and good to drive, smooth and not overtly always on the ragged edge, it flew under the radar but it was never all that engaging. So i am not sure you'd find it "fun". There is an "amusement" factor when you first get it. You don't feel it should be as quick or as fun as it is for such a big understated car. But frequent trips to the petrol station and not that many smiles between each trip. That amusement soons begin to wear off.
Then comes reliability. If anything went wrong it was expensive. Parts are expensive and they are not easy to work on at home. If you have normal sized hands you are going to struggle. So servicing was a pain in the rear as was replacing anything that had issues. And while some say Subaru may be good with reliability - trust me - i've had 6 and they are not. Things can and do go wrong and they are often expensive to fix.
Now the BMW - Whilst memory serves, the e9* 3.0 straight six 330i has a heavier kerb weight, you don't feel it. I would say the legacy looked and felt bigger despite winning on kg's. The BMW was lighter to steer and when pushing on, felt more alive and fun. That is why i like them over the Subaru. The subaru ticks the box of size and flying under the radar. But not by much. The wagon/saloon m-sport 330i is not a flashy thing. It's not as loud as the 335i and not as shouty but it does like a nice spirited b-road drive as you can really feel that coming into play if you drive them back to back.
Servicing wise - the parts from BMW are expensive, but get oem good enough from a motor factors i found it easier to work on and cheaper to maintain than any of my subarus and frankly more reliable. I also felt that compared to my friends 335i, i could use more of my power more of the time without getting into trouble. But i guess its horses for courses, the 335i definitely is a different animal to the n/a. But the n/a just has that appeal of heritage - German. RWD. Straight six. Not something that is available anymore. It's a lovely revvy engine and sounds really nice out the factory. The subaru is muted and without stainless exhausts in play, I would tip the BMW for liking the "noise" element.
Fuel wise, the BMW did drink that bit more when pushing on, but only comparing it to itself. Round town would see 20's and on longer journeys well into the high 30mpg marks - the subaru could get nowhere near. I'd fill up the subaru twice for every once time i did the BMW and i remember that those drives gave more smiles in the BMW than they did the subaru.
So i rate both cars. Both very good. I would get the Subaru for the under the radar, not many about reason. But that reason alone. For comfort and smiles and doing nearly everything the legacy can do for less money over the term of ownership, i would get the BMW.
I did have the feeling the BMW would be the better car to drive but hoped to be swayed into the Subaru because it's something different. And although MPG isn't a massive concern, 18mpg isn't really worth it for a 240bhp car.
With that being said, I'd still love to try the Subaru, maybe with a few suspension tweaks they can be a bit more engaging? BMWs just seem to get it right out the box.
The reliability is the really surprising thing that you've mentioned there, would expect a lot better from the Scooby!
If you go for the Legacy, get the facelift version (if auto). Comes with SI drive and paddle shift.
Edited by MDMA . on Monday 5th October 21:27
MDMA . said:
I've run a Legacy as a daily for the last 7 years or so and nothing had failed on it really. Needed a new battery, lamba sensor, replaced all 4 wheel bearings at 125k miles, the rest has just been yearly basic servicing. I've got another Legacy on the way from Japan at the moment, lands in the new year.
If you go for the Legacy, get the facelift version (if auto). Comes with SI drive and paddle shift.
What year did the facelift come in and are there any cosmetic differences or other changes? Or is it just the addition of the things you've mentioned. Only after a manual so not sure if that added SI drive in the faceliftIf you go for the Legacy, get the facelift version (if auto). Comes with SI drive and paddle shift.
asimmalik said:
MDMA . said:
I've run a Legacy as a daily for the last 7 years or so and nothing had failed on it really. Needed a new battery, lamba sensor, replaced all 4 wheel bearings at 125k miles, the rest has just been yearly basic servicing. I've got another Legacy on the way from Japan at the moment, lands in the new year.
If you go for the Legacy, get the facelift version (if auto). Comes with SI drive and paddle shift.
What year did the facelift come in and are there any cosmetic differences or other changes? Or is it just the addition of the things you've mentioned. Only after a manual so not sure if that added SI drive in the faceliftIf you go for the Legacy, get the facelift version (if auto). Comes with SI drive and paddle shift.
Edited by MDMA . on Monday 5th October 21:59
I'm a bit one-sided, but...
My Spec.B has been trouble-free from 39k miles to 126k ish. Battery yes, and both rear wheel bearings, and now another has gone - dunno which yet. A new clutch soon after we bought it, but I knew about that (the car was cheap) and it was a car that had done all of its initial 39k miles in London traffic. Front bushes needed doing in 2017, so I uprated these slightly - new front Bilsteins in 2018 on 115k miles though they passed the MOT at the time, I wasn't as happy with the front anymore.
I've found it easy to work on - changing the rear bearings myself, brake-pads, doing all the oil changes and flushed the coolant a couple of years back.
The STI gearbox is bombproof, but apparently the centre-diff can go from 120k onwards.
We get av 27 MPG and that's with many short journeys. Maybe I don't thrash it enough.
Driving - I think this is the biggest difference I have had compared with the poster above. It's such a good chassis, the Subaru design concept being 'engineering' and fewer compromises with shared platforms, it just communicates so well and rewards driver input... yes all cliches but they must come from somewhere. Build quality is excellent.
The AWD doesn't detract from the experience - it's just part of the package.
It's also a 'small' car - not wide and not heavy - it is long (in estate form), but you forget any of this, and just enjoy driving. The whole car revolves around the gearlever, and you just become part of the machine.
Really. I had the same experience with the Impreza.
It's a car that is greater than the sum of it's parts.
Parts include alloy bonnet (weighs nothing), inverted Bilsteins that are not ruinous to replace, six-speed gearbox and rear LSD.... proper full-time symmetrical AWD. It has enough power, and good-enough brakes.
I have swopped the OE 18" wheels for Impreza lightweight STI 17s, as I can feel a difference, but then I'm a wheel w
e.
As you can tell, I love it, and cannot find anything to replace it. More modern cars may have more power, but they don't have that chassis, and they are bigger and heavier.....
My Spec.B has been trouble-free from 39k miles to 126k ish. Battery yes, and both rear wheel bearings, and now another has gone - dunno which yet. A new clutch soon after we bought it, but I knew about that (the car was cheap) and it was a car that had done all of its initial 39k miles in London traffic. Front bushes needed doing in 2017, so I uprated these slightly - new front Bilsteins in 2018 on 115k miles though they passed the MOT at the time, I wasn't as happy with the front anymore.
I've found it easy to work on - changing the rear bearings myself, brake-pads, doing all the oil changes and flushed the coolant a couple of years back.
The STI gearbox is bombproof, but apparently the centre-diff can go from 120k onwards.
We get av 27 MPG and that's with many short journeys. Maybe I don't thrash it enough.
Driving - I think this is the biggest difference I have had compared with the poster above. It's such a good chassis, the Subaru design concept being 'engineering' and fewer compromises with shared platforms, it just communicates so well and rewards driver input... yes all cliches but they must come from somewhere. Build quality is excellent.
The AWD doesn't detract from the experience - it's just part of the package.
It's also a 'small' car - not wide and not heavy - it is long (in estate form), but you forget any of this, and just enjoy driving. The whole car revolves around the gearlever, and you just become part of the machine.
Really. I had the same experience with the Impreza.
It's a car that is greater than the sum of it's parts.
Parts include alloy bonnet (weighs nothing), inverted Bilsteins that are not ruinous to replace, six-speed gearbox and rear LSD.... proper full-time symmetrical AWD. It has enough power, and good-enough brakes.
I have swopped the OE 18" wheels for Impreza lightweight STI 17s, as I can feel a difference, but then I'm a wheel w
e.As you can tell, I love it, and cannot find anything to replace it. More modern cars may have more power, but they don't have that chassis, and they are bigger and heavier.....
Edited by Orangecurry on Monday 5th October 21:25
Joelonghair said:
Not much to add to the excellent review above, but when I was looking at the Subaru I found that the exhaust headers really strangled the engine. A set of aftermarket headers (Raptor circa £400) give you another 25hp.
Does the car need a remap to get the best out of those manifolds? If so, is there a reputable tuner for these cars?Orangecurry said:
I'm a bit one-sided, but...
My Spec.B has been trouble-free from 39k miles to 126k ish. Battery yes, and both rear wheel bearings, and now another has gone - dunno which yet. A new clutch soon after we bought it, but I knew about that (the car was cheap) and it was a car that had done all of its initial 39k miles in London traffic. Front bushes needed doing in 2017, so I uprated these slightly - new front Bilsteins in 2018 on 115k miles though they passed the MOT at the time, I wasn't as happy with the front anymore.
I've found it easy to work on - changing the rear bearings myself, brake-pads, doing all the oil changes and flushed the coolant a couple of years back.
The STI gearbox is bombproof, but apparently the centre-diff can go from 120k onwards.
We get av 27 MPG and that's with many short journeys. Maybe I don't thrash it enough.
Driving - I think this is the biggest difference I have had compared with the poster above. It's such a good chassis, the Subaru design concept being 'engineering' and fewer compromises with shared platforms, it just communicates so well and rewards driver input... yes all cliches but they must come from somewhere. Build quality is excellent.
The AWD doesn't detract from the experience - it's just part of the package.
It's also a 'small' car - not wide and not heavy - it is long (in estate form), but you forget any of this, and just enjoy driving. The whole car revolves around the gearlever, and you just become part of the machine.
Really. I had the same experience with the Impreza.
It's a car that is greater than the sum of it's parts.
Parts include alloy bonnet (weighs nothing), inverted Bilsteins that are not ruinous to replace, six-speed gearbox and rear LSD.... proper full-time symmetrical AWD. It has enough power, and good-enough brakes.
I have swopped the OE 18" wheels for Impreza lightweight STI 17s, as I can feel a difference, but then I'm a wheel we.
As you can tell, I love it, and cannot find anything to replace it. More modern cars may have more power, but they don't have that chassis, and they are bigger and heavier.....
Definitely a mixture of opinions on these! There's a few manuals for sale atm, need to arrange a time to go and see one. My Spec.B has been trouble-free from 39k miles to 126k ish. Battery yes, and both rear wheel bearings, and now another has gone - dunno which yet. A new clutch soon after we bought it, but I knew about that (the car was cheap) and it was a car that had done all of its initial 39k miles in London traffic. Front bushes needed doing in 2017, so I uprated these slightly - new front Bilsteins in 2018 on 115k miles though they passed the MOT at the time, I wasn't as happy with the front anymore.
I've found it easy to work on - changing the rear bearings myself, brake-pads, doing all the oil changes and flushed the coolant a couple of years back.
The STI gearbox is bombproof, but apparently the centre-diff can go from 120k onwards.
We get av 27 MPG and that's with many short journeys. Maybe I don't thrash it enough.
Driving - I think this is the biggest difference I have had compared with the poster above. It's such a good chassis, the Subaru design concept being 'engineering' and fewer compromises with shared platforms, it just communicates so well and rewards driver input... yes all cliches but they must come from somewhere. Build quality is excellent.
The AWD doesn't detract from the experience - it's just part of the package.
It's also a 'small' car - not wide and not heavy - it is long (in estate form), but you forget any of this, and just enjoy driving. The whole car revolves around the gearlever, and you just become part of the machine.
Really. I had the same experience with the Impreza.
It's a car that is greater than the sum of it's parts.
Parts include alloy bonnet (weighs nothing), inverted Bilsteins that are not ruinous to replace, six-speed gearbox and rear LSD.... proper full-time symmetrical AWD. It has enough power, and good-enough brakes.
I have swopped the OE 18" wheels for Impreza lightweight STI 17s, as I can feel a difference, but then I'm a wheel w
e.As you can tell, I love it, and cannot find anything to replace it. More modern cars may have more power, but they don't have that chassis, and they are bigger and heavier.....
Edited by Orangecurry on Monday 5th October 21:25
I'm trying not to sound funny, but different people either 'get' proper AWD or they don't. And I doubt you'll get anything from a test drive. Hopefully you'll decide if you hate it or not.
I suppose as they are so rare, if you find a manual Spec.B you'll not lose money if you don't get along.
And I'm not a Subaru fanboy. I have a variety of cars, and by that I mean FWD, AWD, RWD engine front and RWD engine rear.
I suppose as they are so rare, if you find a manual Spec.B you'll not lose money if you don't get along.
And I'm not a Subaru fanboy. I have a variety of cars, and by that I mean FWD, AWD, RWD engine front and RWD engine rear.
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