Buying modern classics (ish)
Discussion
I was thinking about this today whilst browsing AT. Following some discussion on TRDs thread about losing interest in cars I started to look back on cars I always liked and admired but never tried. Nothing fancy, and mainly hot hatches as they have practicality and can easily be used year round without compromise.
Here are some cars I came up with..
R53 Cooper s
EP3 type r
Golf ed30
Meg rs250 cup
MX5 of some sort
GT86
I've been focused on newer cars for a bit and as we all know prices are crazy. Looking at an F56 Mini JCW for example takes things to 20k by the time I've found one with everything I'd want. I'm fortunate that I can afford it but really I struggle to see the value over my mk7 ST3. And last night when I found someone had left me a lovely piece of car park damage (mostly polished out now) I did feel relief that it wasn't a car I'd just forked out 20k for.
So back to older cars. Most of that list is available for under 10k, even for mint examples. I love the idea of buying one with good history and long MOT, running it for a year then moving on to the next one. I'd be interested to know if anyone does this?
If buying something like an r53 cooper s for example, where is the sweet spot in pricing?
3-4k A usable car, maybe a bit rough in places.
5-6k Nice examples with good history and hopefully trouble free for a year.
7-8k The best low milers. Are they worth it given the chance of appreciation and to cherish?
I'm kind of thinking the middle ground myself but would welcome opinions.
My usage is about 4k miles in a year. 3 days a week and usually no more than 10 miles at a time. Lives out on the drive. I'm not concerned with making or losing money and am happy to pay for proper maintenance. But I'd quite like some reliability if possible!
Here are some cars I came up with..
R53 Cooper s
EP3 type r
Golf ed30
Meg rs250 cup
MX5 of some sort
GT86
I've been focused on newer cars for a bit and as we all know prices are crazy. Looking at an F56 Mini JCW for example takes things to 20k by the time I've found one with everything I'd want. I'm fortunate that I can afford it but really I struggle to see the value over my mk7 ST3. And last night when I found someone had left me a lovely piece of car park damage (mostly polished out now) I did feel relief that it wasn't a car I'd just forked out 20k for.
So back to older cars. Most of that list is available for under 10k, even for mint examples. I love the idea of buying one with good history and long MOT, running it for a year then moving on to the next one. I'd be interested to know if anyone does this?
If buying something like an r53 cooper s for example, where is the sweet spot in pricing?
3-4k A usable car, maybe a bit rough in places.
5-6k Nice examples with good history and hopefully trouble free for a year.
7-8k The best low milers. Are they worth it given the chance of appreciation and to cherish?
I'm kind of thinking the middle ground myself but would welcome opinions.
My usage is about 4k miles in a year. 3 days a week and usually no more than 10 miles at a time. Lives out on the drive. I'm not concerned with making or losing money and am happy to pay for proper maintenance. But I'd quite like some reliability if possible!
I had a mk1 Focus 1.6 Zetec.
Loved that car and kept it around 5 years which is the most I've ever done. The other car I really loved was my Celica T sport, it was fantastic.
I know the cars I'd want (list in OP). More a question of whether to go for a cheaper usable one or pay out for a minter. Also if many people go for this kind of quick turn over. Run for a year and keep changing. Any pitfalls to be aware of?
Loved that car and kept it around 5 years which is the most I've ever done. The other car I really loved was my Celica T sport, it was fantastic.
I know the cars I'd want (list in OP). More a question of whether to go for a cheaper usable one or pay out for a minter. Also if many people go for this kind of quick turn over. Run for a year and keep changing. Any pitfalls to be aware of?
I've been doing it for the last couple of years, but convertibles more than "sports cars" and a lower budget. My primary aim to is try a load of different cars and not lose any money in the process.
A year is a long term commitment for me - usually between 3-6months before i get bored, shortest ownership recently was about 4 weeks - but thats because i saw a very cheap Z4 i wanted at the time
Look for cars with some recent history, bonus if it has more, long MOT is preferable as it gives you the option to move it on again if something else catches your eye with the expense/risk of putting it through another.
I will say, from experience - stay away from MX5's - I've had a couple of Mk1s and a Mk3 - I love the Mk1's but they all rust - Mk2's seem to be even worse - so unless you can find one with evidence of rust repairs, or are handy with a welder - look elsewhere.
A year is a long term commitment for me - usually between 3-6months before i get bored, shortest ownership recently was about 4 weeks - but thats because i saw a very cheap Z4 i wanted at the time
Look for cars with some recent history, bonus if it has more, long MOT is preferable as it gives you the option to move it on again if something else catches your eye with the expense/risk of putting it through another.
I will say, from experience - stay away from MX5's - I've had a couple of Mk1s and a Mk3 - I love the Mk1's but they all rust - Mk2's seem to be even worse - so unless you can find one with evidence of rust repairs, or are handy with a welder - look elsewhere.
Thanks for reply Matt.
Budget doesn't matter too much other than the more you spend the more you're likely to lose. I'd be aiming at 10k max with a little flex. And nothing on my wish list is particularly exotic so hopefully issues would be cheap to sort.
My preferred MX5 is the ND so that would probably be a few cars down the line as its newer. Also I can see a time when 2 seats will be easier to manage than it is now.
I'm not really looking to go for bottom of the market cars. I do like my cars to look smart and try to keep them that way. And I like them to work too. I know anything older can throw problems but I'm sure the risk can be lessened with a more well sorted example. Happy to pay more for a good car and I think it could pay off come resale time.
The r53 Cooper S is a good contender to get started. I really like them and there still seems to be decent ones around. If I could pick up a nice one for 5k it surely can't cost me too much over a year and 4k miles. Or am I missing something?
Budget doesn't matter too much other than the more you spend the more you're likely to lose. I'd be aiming at 10k max with a little flex. And nothing on my wish list is particularly exotic so hopefully issues would be cheap to sort.
My preferred MX5 is the ND so that would probably be a few cars down the line as its newer. Also I can see a time when 2 seats will be easier to manage than it is now.
I'm not really looking to go for bottom of the market cars. I do like my cars to look smart and try to keep them that way. And I like them to work too. I know anything older can throw problems but I'm sure the risk can be lessened with a more well sorted example. Happy to pay more for a good car and I think it could pay off come resale time.
The r53 Cooper S is a good contender to get started. I really like them and there still seems to be decent ones around. If I could pick up a nice one for 5k it surely can't cost me too much over a year and 4k miles. Or am I missing something?
Can’t see you losing fortunes doing it unless you buy the wrong car. MX5’s are great but can be money pits if rotten or repaired badly. Finding a really good rust free one should be pretty depreciation proof provided you keep it rust free.
I think you just need to judge the market. Buying anything less than 2k is going to need work. 5k should buy you a really good cooper S but an average ep3.
I think you just need to judge the market. Buying anything less than 2k is going to need work. 5k should buy you a really good cooper S but an average ep3.
SAS Tom said:
Can’t see you losing fortunes doing it unless you buy the wrong car. MX5’s are great but can be money pits if rotten or repaired badly. Finding a really good rust free one should be pretty depreciation proof provided you keep it rust free.
I think you just need to judge the market. Buying anything less than 2k is going to need work. 5k should buy you a really good cooper S but an average ep3.
And an early MX5 is 33 years old, not sure i would class that as a modern classic, it is very much a classic, but then we could argue about that all day long I think you just need to judge the market. Buying anything less than 2k is going to need work. 5k should buy you a really good cooper S but an average ep3.
I would be buying something about 15 years old and planning to keep for 5 years or so, that will probably only cost maintenance cost over that time. And as for older cars having problems, i really don't think you will end up with more issues than a 5 year old car, unless you find rust. Probably a lot less issues than some new cars.
I've done a bit of this in recent years, with examples such as an Audi TT Mk1 and Porsche 968.
I recommend going for something mid priced with good bodywork. Read buyers guides and check if car you are looking at has had weak points addressed in recent years.
Improve and get your money back or profit after a year. Bottom end will be money pits. Top end super low miles likely to be troublesome from lack of use and you'll worry about putting on the miles. Also slower to sell unless it's a fast Ford.
I recommend going for something mid priced with good bodywork. Read buyers guides and check if car you are looking at has had weak points addressed in recent years.
Improve and get your money back or profit after a year. Bottom end will be money pits. Top end super low miles likely to be troublesome from lack of use and you'll worry about putting on the miles. Also slower to sell unless it's a fast Ford.
ChrisH72 said:
They are fun little cars - had one for 8 years from new For £10K I would buy the best Renault Megane Mk3 RS 250 I could, preferably one with the cup pack and Recaros.
For £5K I would be looking at getting the best Renault Clio 182/197 I could get
Under £5K the best Audi TT I could get.
I think the Megane is going to be a classic one day, the last of the old school manual hot hatches.
For £5K I would be looking at getting the best Renault Clio 182/197 I could get
Under £5K the best Audi TT I could get.
I think the Megane is going to be a classic one day, the last of the old school manual hot hatches.
Ive been doing something similar, actually got on the JDM wagon earlier than the ridiculous price hikes we are seeing at the moment...in the last 11 years I have had
350z
VX220 NA
R33 Skyline
Celica ST205 GT4
VX220 Turbo
Z4 Coupe
I think I sold every car for more than I paid for it whilst chucking some miles on them. It is definitely getting harder to find something a bit different now.
350z
VX220 NA
R33 Skyline
Celica ST205 GT4
VX220 Turbo
Z4 Coupe
I think I sold every car for more than I paid for it whilst chucking some miles on them. It is definitely getting harder to find something a bit different now.
coldel said:
Ive been doing something similar, actually got on the JDM wagon earlier than the ridiculous price hikes we are seeing at the moment...in the last 11 years I have had
350z
VX220 NA
R33 Skyline
Celica ST205 GT4
VX220 Turbo
Z4 Coupe
I think I sold every car for more than I paid for it whilst chucking some miles on them. It is definitely getting harder to find something a bit different now.
Nice list. I do like Jap stuff but it is pricey.350z
VX220 NA
R33 Skyline
Celica ST205 GT4
VX220 Turbo
Z4 Coupe
I think I sold every car for more than I paid for it whilst chucking some miles on them. It is definitely getting harder to find something a bit different now.
A really tidy EP3 looks to be closer to 10k at the moment.
Mk 5 Golf Gtis are getting harder to find clean and looked after.
They can be a bit maintenance heavy if not cared for, rust sets in too around the front wings/sills in particular.
If enthusuast owned owned they can be a good buy though, the Edition 30 commands a big premium which isn't really worth it in my opinion. (I've owned both)
They can be a bit maintenance heavy if not cared for, rust sets in too around the front wings/sills in particular.
If enthusuast owned owned they can be a good buy though, the Edition 30 commands a big premium which isn't really worth it in my opinion. (I've owned both)
I think the Mk1 TT has probably hit rock bottom and will start to increase in value.
Sub £2k cars are all money pits? Don’t think so - last spring I picked up this 225 roadster with full service history for £1400 - completely standard even down to the original radio cassette with a long mot. Should have kept hold of it in hindsight.
Do like the R53 though, brilliant fun and parts not too bad. Had to replace the gearbox on my sons as the synchro failed on 2nd. My nephew has a 2015 JCW he’s about to sell and tempted to take it off his hands as it’s stupidly fast for its size.
How about a mk2 Golf GTI? Prices rising fast, but must be a decent investment if you can find a good one
Sub £2k cars are all money pits? Don’t think so - last spring I picked up this 225 roadster with full service history for £1400 - completely standard even down to the original radio cassette with a long mot. Should have kept hold of it in hindsight.
Do like the R53 though, brilliant fun and parts not too bad. Had to replace the gearbox on my sons as the synchro failed on 2nd. My nephew has a 2015 JCW he’s about to sell and tempted to take it off his hands as it’s stupidly fast for its size.
How about a mk2 Golf GTI? Prices rising fast, but must be a decent investment if you can find a good one
Edited by mattman on Friday 26th May 19:24
Edited by mattman on Friday 26th May 19:25
Following this thread with interest. Interesting thread. 
Assuming I'm unable to give up on cars, I fancy something a bit more modern than the 15 - 25 year old cars I've been running.
I've been looking at Abarth 595 Comp's, hovering just over £10K. I'm 44 so it's probably a fairly silly, immature car for someone like me, but who cares? There's something about them for me, not conventionally good cars. A Fiesta ST would probably hump it, but there's just something about it for me.
I'm quite attracted to the Megane 250 / 265, but having had two Clio RS's, Renault build quality and reliability was pretty poor in my experience, and one of them was a new car! A friend of mine also had the Turbo blow on his Megane 225.
F56 Mini's are also coming into budget, but I wonder if they might feel too grown up. Supposed to be quite reliable as far as I know. Quite tuneable. I know Lee aka Cerb4.5 liked his a lot. I've had an R53 with a smaller pulley, it was pretty good fun, thirsty though and don't come across as a car that laps up abuse.
I'm also an ex owner of the FN2 and think these are criminally cheap for what they are. Very decent for a £5k car. Not at all fast, but you can make them feel much livelier with a Hondata. Super reliable, decent handling when driven hard, and I think they still look good even now. For 10k you can get a Championship White with an LSD, and they look the b
ks.
Another option for 10k that caught my eye is the Pug 208 GTI PS. I have a feeling these are probably quite underrated. Not sure on reliability though.
Up to you but I'd avoid a 10k GT86. I think they need mods to be good too, but I do hear about the occasional engine failure (and did you see the 19k GR86 that died on the track recently?).
Though I sometimes wonder if it's silly to pay £10k+ for a car that only gets occasional use, but I can afford it and you only live once, right?
Then again, as per my thread that you refer in the OP, I sometimes wonder if I can be bothered with any of it anymore, as long as I have occasional access to a car, i.e. Mrs getting a Mini Cooper. In my situation having no car wouldn't really impact my life much so... who knows?
Obviously I already have an MX5 so know that is an option at 10k if you don't want a hatch, obviously watch out for rust, and keep an eye on oil. Personally though I've done them to death and I'd rather pay 5k for a decent MR2 with a few very light mods. All old cars though and fancy moving on from it now whatever I decide.
Assuming I'm unable to give up on cars, I fancy something a bit more modern than the 15 - 25 year old cars I've been running.I've been looking at Abarth 595 Comp's, hovering just over £10K. I'm 44 so it's probably a fairly silly, immature car for someone like me, but who cares? There's something about them for me, not conventionally good cars. A Fiesta ST would probably hump it, but there's just something about it for me.
I'm quite attracted to the Megane 250 / 265, but having had two Clio RS's, Renault build quality and reliability was pretty poor in my experience, and one of them was a new car! A friend of mine also had the Turbo blow on his Megane 225.
F56 Mini's are also coming into budget, but I wonder if they might feel too grown up. Supposed to be quite reliable as far as I know. Quite tuneable. I know Lee aka Cerb4.5 liked his a lot. I've had an R53 with a smaller pulley, it was pretty good fun, thirsty though and don't come across as a car that laps up abuse.
I'm also an ex owner of the FN2 and think these are criminally cheap for what they are. Very decent for a £5k car. Not at all fast, but you can make them feel much livelier with a Hondata. Super reliable, decent handling when driven hard, and I think they still look good even now. For 10k you can get a Championship White with an LSD, and they look the b
ks.Another option for 10k that caught my eye is the Pug 208 GTI PS. I have a feeling these are probably quite underrated. Not sure on reliability though.
Up to you but I'd avoid a 10k GT86. I think they need mods to be good too, but I do hear about the occasional engine failure (and did you see the 19k GR86 that died on the track recently?).
Though I sometimes wonder if it's silly to pay £10k+ for a car that only gets occasional use, but I can afford it and you only live once, right?
Then again, as per my thread that you refer in the OP, I sometimes wonder if I can be bothered with any of it anymore, as long as I have occasional access to a car, i.e. Mrs getting a Mini Cooper. In my situation having no car wouldn't really impact my life much so... who knows?
Obviously I already have an MX5 so know that is an option at 10k if you don't want a hatch, obviously watch out for rust, and keep an eye on oil. Personally though I've done them to death and I'd rather pay 5k for a decent MR2 with a few very light mods. All old cars though and fancy moving on from it now whatever I decide.
coldel said:
Ive been doing something similar, actually got on the JDM wagon earlier than the ridiculous price hikes we are seeing at the moment...in the last 11 years I have had
350z
VX220 NA
R33 Skyline
Celica ST205 GT4
VX220 Turbo
Z4 Coupe
I think I sold every car for more than I paid for it whilst chucking some miles on them. It is definitely getting harder to find something a bit different now.
I seem to be the opposite, I buy nice cars, but always end up losing money. Clearly I am either useless at buying, or selling cars. Most likely both 350z
VX220 NA
R33 Skyline
Celica ST205 GT4
VX220 Turbo
Z4 Coupe
I think I sold every car for more than I paid for it whilst chucking some miles on them. It is definitely getting harder to find something a bit different now.
Edited by TameRacingDriver on Friday 26th May 20:26
Gassing Station | Car Buying | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff