To DSG or not to DSG? Long term prospects?
Discussion
Good Morning,
I'm going to test drive a DSG Golf GTi later today, but I was wondering what DSG is like to live with long-term - does the novelty wear off and you end up pinning for a manual? That's the impression I get from EVO magazine.
I've driven a Seat Altea 2.0 TDi with DSG a couple of times, but they didn't have paddles and I wasn't too impressed, but I'm expecting the Golf Gti to be better.
Does the advantage of the DSG in queing traffic outweight the potential lack of driver involvement when on your favourite B road?
Cheers.
I'm going to test drive a DSG Golf GTi later today, but I was wondering what DSG is like to live with long-term - does the novelty wear off and you end up pinning for a manual? That's the impression I get from EVO magazine.
I've driven a Seat Altea 2.0 TDi with DSG a couple of times, but they didn't have paddles and I wasn't too impressed, but I'm expecting the Golf Gti to be better.
Does the advantage of the DSG in queing traffic outweight the potential lack of driver involvement when on your favourite B road?
Cheers.
Its not a brilliant example, but a friend of mine has an A3 TDI with DSG. Currently at nearly 30k miles and never had any issues at all. He did a track day in it and found the gearbox wanting - constant hunting and unable to hold the gear how he wanted. Also he managed to get stuck in a field once - no gear lock and ended up being a little embarrassed.
That said though, its seamless, fast and works well if you want to go quickly or slowly. In reality rarely use the sport mode and never got the wrong gear. I do wonder what the longer term issues are - two clutches? Probably wont be an issue, but worth getting some prices from VAG about how much when they hit 100k plus....
That said though, its seamless, fast and works well if you want to go quickly or slowly. In reality rarely use the sport mode and never got the wrong gear. I do wonder what the longer term issues are - two clutches? Probably wont be an issue, but worth getting some prices from VAG about how much when they hit 100k plus....
I've got a 2.0TDi DSG at the moment.
They are a brilliant gearbox and they are quite novel.
They take a short time to get used to but once you have dialled into it, they can still offer driving pleasure. Its like having turbo lag in a way, for kick down, you need to just pin the throttle a fraction before you normally would in a manual with the gear already selected. It's surprising how soon you adjust.
They do, of course have the manual 'sequential' style option which is another ball game - still trying to get my head round that.
Long long term ? Not sure.
I've had mine for 3 weeks and I still find it fun. I'm lucky that I get a new car every 6 months so I doubt I'll get bored because I'll be in a manual again in a few months time.
Driving in traffic is a doddle and its nice to not have to depress the clutch 700 times on the way into work !
Overall, pleased.
I'm afraid you'll have to be the decision maker of whether you can stay happy for a longer period. I think I'd cope. Just. Probably. Possibly.
They are a brilliant gearbox and they are quite novel.
They take a short time to get used to but once you have dialled into it, they can still offer driving pleasure. Its like having turbo lag in a way, for kick down, you need to just pin the throttle a fraction before you normally would in a manual with the gear already selected. It's surprising how soon you adjust.
They do, of course have the manual 'sequential' style option which is another ball game - still trying to get my head round that.
Long long term ? Not sure.
I've had mine for 3 weeks and I still find it fun. I'm lucky that I get a new car every 6 months so I doubt I'll get bored because I'll be in a manual again in a few months time.
Driving in traffic is a doddle and its nice to not have to depress the clutch 700 times on the way into work !
Overall, pleased.
I'm afraid you'll have to be the decision maker of whether you can stay happy for a longer period. I think I'd cope. Just. Probably. Possibly.
Well I love it. (The DSG box that is). Currently have an Audi A3 3.2 Q with it in. Find it great for city driving espically in Sheffield and once out and about shifting it to sequential manual means you are always in the correct gear cos you decide. Its not an "true" auto at the end of the day and some people have a problem with this, for example it won't "hill hold" on steep gradients. However I think the gear changes are far quicker and far smoother than most auto's. Some people have critised the fact that even in manual mode it will shift up on the rev limiter and change down before stall speed but then who wants to drive on the limiter anyway. Overall I've lived it for 2 years and would definately spec it again.
medicineman said:
Well I love it. (The DSG box that is). Currently have an Audi A3 3.2 Q with it in. Find it great for city driving espically in Sheffield and once out and about shifting it to sequential manual means you are always in the correct gear cos you decide. Its not an "true" auto at the end of the day and some people have a problem with this, for example it won't "hill hold" on steep gradients. However I think the gear changes are far quicker and far smoother than most auto's. Some people have critised the fact that even in manual mode it will shift up on the rev limiter and change down before stall speed but then who wants to drive on the limiter anyway. Overall I've lived it for 2 years and would definately spec it again.
Wot he said, I've had the same for over 3 years 
medicineman said:
Well I love it. (The DSG box that is). Currently have an Audi A3 3.2 Q with it in. Find it great for city driving espically in Sheffield and once out and about shifting it to sequential manual means you are always in the correct gear cos you decide. Its not an "true" auto at the end of the day and some people have a problem with this, for example it won't "hill hold" on steep gradients. However I think the gear changes are far quicker and far smoother than most auto's. Some people have critised the fact that even in manual mode it will shift up on the rev limiter and change down before stall speed but then who wants to drive on the limiter anyway. Overall I've lived it for 2 years and would definately spec it again.
So if it won't "hill hold" how do you find queing in traffic on a slight up-hill incline? Left foot brake?! 
I can't say anything about the longevity, but I did recently test drive one back-to-back with a manual GTI. I've ended up ordering the manual.
Why? I couldn't fault how it behaved in automatic or manual mode - changes were quick and smooth, and it had a certain gadget appeal. But I found those positives didn't outway how I felt about auto - perceived lack of control, hunting, delay kicking down - and the manual mode didn't make me feel involved enough (and I didn't particularly like the feeling of the 'paddles' - they are more like small buttons really).
I spent ages reading around this topic, but none of it helped - you're definitely doing the right thing by giving it a try.
Why? I couldn't fault how it behaved in automatic or manual mode - changes were quick and smooth, and it had a certain gadget appeal
. But I found those positives didn't outway how I felt about auto - perceived lack of control, hunting, delay kicking down - and the manual mode didn't make me feel involved enough (and I didn't particularly like the feeling of the 'paddles' - they are more like small buttons really).I spent ages reading around this topic, but none of it helped - you're definitely doing the right thing by giving it a try.
Volte said:
So if it won't "hill hold" how do you find queing in traffic on a slight up-hill incline? Left foot brake?!
I had a DSG 2.0TDi Golf for a few weeks and just used the handbrake in that kind of situation, much like doing a hill start in a manual car.By the way, I enjoyed the DSG however it wasn't the full flappy paddles version and it was only mated to 105bhp so any criticisms I have of it (hunting, not holding onto a gear long enough etc) are more likely due to the fact the engine didn't have enough to give rather than the gearbox as such.
I've had 3 DSG/s-tronic equipped 3.2 TT's since early 2004 and couldn't imagine wanting to go back to a manual. In traffic just keep it in D and the box does all the boring stuff for you (seamlessly and lightning fast). On the open road, you can keep it in Drive or if you fancy a bit fun, you can slip it into Sport or use the paddles.
Verdict: a fantastic piece of kit
Verdict: a fantastic piece of kit
Wiggo said:
Volte, what is your opinion now that you've had the test drive?
Unfortunately I couldn't get along with it. 
I didn't like the slipping noise during the changes, and it seemed to have a mind of its own, changing down too enthusiastically in auto mode. And I didn't know what to do with my left arm! 
Not for me - I got the same feeling I had when I bought an Apple Mac after working with Windows forever!
Maybe with more time I would have got used to it, but I think I enjoy the satisfaction changing gear!
baz1985 said:
DSG= left foot braking. You can balance the car using thottle and brake application through the corner and hence greater exit speed.
Are you sure this works? I thought most VW group cars wouldn't let you press the throttle and brake pedal at the same time! I found out the hard way the first time I tried to heal and toe my old shape Leon Cupra! There was no response from the throttle! 
Edited by Volte on Wednesday 14th November 08:06
Hi Guys,
I have a 3.2 TT with DSG and I think it is great, very responsive, quick to shift and great fun with the paddles. Maybe it is not so well suited to a diesel engine?
On the hill issue, I find mine holds very well on hills, even creeps a bit sometimes?
The only critiscm is that you have to be quite progressive with the throttle or it can change down a bit too quickly, but heh its an automatic, not a mind reader!
I have a 3.2 TT with DSG and I think it is great, very responsive, quick to shift and great fun with the paddles. Maybe it is not so well suited to a diesel engine?
On the hill issue, I find mine holds very well on hills, even creeps a bit sometimes?
The only critiscm is that you have to be quite progressive with the throttle or it can change down a bit too quickly, but heh its an automatic, not a mind reader!
see my post here for a technicians/Drivers view.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Regarding long term.
They are fairly reliable, but most of the ones we see are in TT's and they dont do big miles 40 - 60k max, so if your planning on 100k your in unknown. I know of 3 cars had to have new mechatronics units inside the box, and a few that had to have special adaption drives done when the pull aways got harsh, other than that they dont really break.
Hope this helps.
TT
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Regarding long term.
They are fairly reliable, but most of the ones we see are in TT's and they dont do big miles 40 - 60k max, so if your planning on 100k your in unknown. I know of 3 cars had to have new mechatronics units inside the box, and a few that had to have special adaption drives done when the pull aways got harsh, other than that they dont really break.
Hope this helps.
TT
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