How big is it? Farmers' question.
Discussion
Two questions;
1) Am I working this out right? 2) What farming subsidies are available on pasture and woodland?
With my trusty measuring stick on Google Earth I have measured a piece of land near my house which is about 65% woodland and 35% pasture, as 300m x 200m: 60,000 sq meters. I recall, a hectare is 100m x 100m, and there are 2.4 acres to the hectare? So there are about 6 Hectares, or 14.5 acres? So there is a field of about 5 acres and 10 acres of rough woodland.
Naive townie boy questions next. I have eyed up this land to buy for some years, and want at some point, to access the pasture via the woods making it a paddock for my house.
The farmer has done nothing with the woodland for the past 7 years except left it to overgrow (and it isn't yet accessible from the road due to a 6 foot stone wall) but does put his cattle on the pasture periodically, accessed from a lane on the far aide of the village the otherside of the woods. I wondered if he might like to sell the land but rent back most of the pasture if the rent was right, or sell me the woodland and a chunk of the pasture. Except price, what deal e.g. him keeping use of most of the pasture and any subsidies, would motivate him to sell it, or why wouldn't he?
From my experience the farmer will need to be very hard up or your offer would need to be considerablly more than its worth. Most farmers would be reluctant to sell off any substancial plots. 1/4 to 1/2 acre building plots with nice price tags maybe. How much were you thinking of offering? Average woodland would be around £3k-£5k an acre. Very much dependent on location, road access, value of wood and use restrictions.
richyb said:
From my experience the farmer will need to be very hard up or your offer would need to be considerablly more than its worth. Most farmers would be reluctant to sell off any substancial plots. 1/4 to 1/2 acre building plots with nice price tags maybe. How much were you thinking of offering? Average woodland would be around £3k-£5k an acre. Very much dependent on location, road access, value of wood and use restrictions.
He took the accessible timber out 7 years ago. He could still get at some of the timber from the field side but I suspect the local council may have something to say as some of the remaining the trees are spcimen trees from when the land was within the local stately home grounds. It is a very large family farm and they have been here years, but which he married into as his wife's family were the local landowners.I did get his accounts out of companies house and after a few bad years he had a better year 2007/8 ( I assume on the back of more + cereal prices).
The land is just outside of the village curtilage so he has no chance of development under the local plan.
Has the farmer any children.
If he sells to you there is a distinct possibility he will have to pay Capital Gains Tax on the profit,dependant on the last valuation.
He can pass this on to his children 100% free of Inheritance Tax.
So unless he his on his uppers or can roll the money over into something else of equal amount he has nothing much to gain from the sale.
If he sells to you there is a distinct possibility he will have to pay Capital Gains Tax on the profit,dependant on the last valuation.
He can pass this on to his children 100% free of Inheritance Tax.
So unless he his on his uppers or can roll the money over into something else of equal amount he has nothing much to gain from the sale.
Edited by netherfield on Monday 16th November 10:53
prand said:
Have you considered lease/rent?
No, because unless it was a long term jobbie it wouldn't add value to my house and I don't have an immediate need for the land. I can just see the potential of annexing this land but recognise that the grazing labnd is still in use and hwe might not want to lose that in the short term 9which was why I thought about buying and leading it/ren ting it to him for a price which he would find attractive (like him keeping any subsidies and maintaining the fences and a peppercorn rent).All farmers will sell, but it's my gut feeling that he is going to want an absolutely extortionate amount. He'll realise it will add a lot of value to your property having that large a paddock, and will price accordingly. To give you an indication, back in 2002, the people that owned our farm before us sold off three acres of one of the fields, to a house whose garden backed onto it, for £27,500. I would expect that would be considerably more now. So for 15 acres odd, I reckon you'd be looking at over £100k to tempt him. But, it may well add that sort of value to your home. Good luck, and let us know how it goes!
Four Cofffee said:
Two questions;
1) Am I working this out right? 2) What farming subsidies are available on pasture and woodland?
With my trusty measuring stick on Google Earth I have measured a piece of land near my house which is about 65% woodland and 35% pasture, as 300m x 200m: 60,000 sq meters. I recall, a hectare is 100m x 100m, and there are 2.4 acres to the hectare? So there are about 6 Hectares, or 14.5 acres? So there is a field of about 5 acres and 10 acres of rough woodland.
Naive townie boy questions next. I have eyed up this land to buy for some years, and want at some point, to access the pasture via the woods making it a paddock for my house.
The farmer has done nothing with the woodland for the past 7 years except left it to overgrow (and it isn't yet accessible from the road due to a 6 foot stone wall) but does put his cattle on the pasture periodically, accessed from a lane on the far aide of the village the otherside of the woods. I wondered if he might like to sell the land but rent back most of the pasture if the rent was right, or sell me the woodland and a chunk of the pasture. Except price, what deal e.g. him keeping use of most of the pasture and any subsidies, would motivate him to sell it, or why wouldn't he?
If the Farmer is signed up for the Environmental Stewardship Scheme (and I would expect he is), he'll be getting maybe £1000 a year for the land. As others have pointed out, he would be extremely loathe to sell it unless he was desperate, and even then I would expect to have to offer him in the region of 100k for it - and be prepared to go on up from there when the bargaining starts.1) Am I working this out right? 2) What farming subsidies are available on pasture and woodland?
With my trusty measuring stick on Google Earth I have measured a piece of land near my house which is about 65% woodland and 35% pasture, as 300m x 200m: 60,000 sq meters. I recall, a hectare is 100m x 100m, and there are 2.4 acres to the hectare? So there are about 6 Hectares, or 14.5 acres? So there is a field of about 5 acres and 10 acres of rough woodland.
Naive townie boy questions next. I have eyed up this land to buy for some years, and want at some point, to access the pasture via the woods making it a paddock for my house.
The farmer has done nothing with the woodland for the past 7 years except left it to overgrow (and it isn't yet accessible from the road due to a 6 foot stone wall) but does put his cattle on the pasture periodically, accessed from a lane on the far aide of the village the otherside of the woods. I wondered if he might like to sell the land but rent back most of the pasture if the rent was right, or sell me the woodland and a chunk of the pasture. Except price, what deal e.g. him keeping use of most of the pasture and any subsidies, would motivate him to sell it, or why wouldn't he?
For many farmers, their land is their only asset, and it's just not in their blood to give it up. One of the farmers I know is sitting on a farm worth maybe 3 or 4 million, and yet he's getting by on an income of maybe 20k a year. I asked him once why he didn't sell up and retire. "Don't be bloody silly, I wouldn't have a farm if I did that" he said.
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