Bypassing a recruitment consultant
Discussion
I would apply direct, with a clear concience. In my experience:
1) the consultant refused do divulge what job it was, so you cannot be 100% sure that this is the exact same job.
2) you have no guarantee that you have been put forward for any jobs by this consultant.
3) if they did put you forward, you don't know if they sent your CV as is, or whether it was rewritten, perhaps badly
4) the consultant may be using you for a speculative enquiry, having already seen the job advert, rather than actually having any prior relationship with the employer
1) the consultant refused do divulge what job it was, so you cannot be 100% sure that this is the exact same job.
2) you have no guarantee that you have been put forward for any jobs by this consultant.
3) if they did put you forward, you don't know if they sent your CV as is, or whether it was rewritten, perhaps badly
4) the consultant may be using you for a speculative enquiry, having already seen the job advert, rather than actually having any prior relationship with the employer
I had similar to this two years ago, had an agency 'cold call' me about a job and I said yes sure (they refused to tell me who it was), turns out i'd already sent an application to said company off my own back.
Best I ever had was two recruiters had taken my CV off Monster and both sent it to the same company. They had both approached me but had given me different job spec and salary!! bizarre...
Go for it I say.
Best I ever had was two recruiters had taken my CV off Monster and both sent it to the same company. They had both approached me but had given me different job spec and salary!! bizarre...
Go for it I say.
Not quite the same situation for me, but similar:
I had an interview last year with company A, which went well, but was offered a contract role with company B. I had to take this, as I'd been out of work for 6 months. Company A still wanted me to do a 2nd interview (and software test). Both went well.
Now the contract is coming to an end, so I get back to the first agency, and they tell me company B have found someone for the role. Not surprising, as it's been 6 months, but in the last week I've been contacted by 2 other agencies about company A.
Should I go direct? Has the first agency lost the business of company A? Any opinions? Thanks.
I had an interview last year with company A, which went well, but was offered a contract role with company B. I had to take this, as I'd been out of work for 6 months. Company A still wanted me to do a 2nd interview (and software test). Both went well.
Now the contract is coming to an end, so I get back to the first agency, and they tell me company B have found someone for the role. Not surprising, as it's been 6 months, but in the last week I've been contacted by 2 other agencies about company A.
Should I go direct? Has the first agency lost the business of company A? Any opinions? Thanks.
apply direct for definate. I once had a consultant tell me he was putting me forward for a job, i was interested and he also told me the company were also advertising but as they were putting me forward i didnt need to apply. I heard nothing, then heard from another source the agency never got the chance to put cv's forward. Look after number one.
Yep go for it.
It is likely that the recruitment consultant has seen the same add that you have. The consultant will then go out to collect CVs as he has done with yours, often suggesting that they are the gateway to landing this job and have been exclusively appointed by the employer.. Key indicators are that they will push you for your CV and be extremely vague about the job and never provide you with a job description. Once they have collected a batch of CVs they will then approach the employer stating "look how many suitable people I have on my books that I can make available to you", and so it goes on.
99.9% work in this way. If they are genuinely appointed by the employer they will have all the details of the job and the employer available to them and will not be reticent in providing it.
pp
It is likely that the recruitment consultant has seen the same add that you have. The consultant will then go out to collect CVs as he has done with yours, often suggesting that they are the gateway to landing this job and have been exclusively appointed by the employer.. Key indicators are that they will push you for your CV and be extremely vague about the job and never provide you with a job description. Once they have collected a batch of CVs they will then approach the employer stating "look how many suitable people I have on my books that I can make available to you", and so it goes on.
99.9% work in this way. If they are genuinely appointed by the employer they will have all the details of the job and the employer available to them and will not be reticent in providing it.
pp
as a recruitment consultant - I'd recommend that you DO apply direct for it.
Agency should have told you which client is was for (if they disclose client name then you need/should not apply) however how are you to know for certain it's the same role (probably is, but how can you know if they won't tell you the clients name)
go for it & good luck
p.s. there are some recruiters that spec candidates into companies, but this is a very sharkey way to work and thankfully not many major companies allow this anymore - it's totally not needed/wanted. Shame there are some shisters out there who spoil it for the rest of us.
Agency should have told you which client is was for (if they disclose client name then you need/should not apply) however how are you to know for certain it's the same role (probably is, but how can you know if they won't tell you the clients name)
go for it & good luck
p.s. there are some recruiters that spec candidates into companies, but this is a very sharkey way to work and thankfully not many major companies allow this anymore - it's totally not needed/wanted. Shame there are some shisters out there who spoil it for the rest of us.
Soir said:
as a recruitment consultant - I'd recommend that you DO apply direct for it.
Agency should have told you which client is was for (if they disclose client name then you need/should not apply) however how are you to know for certain it's the same role (probably is, but how can you know if they won't tell you the clients name)
go for it & good luck
p.s. there are some recruiters that spec candidates into companies, but this is a very sharkey way to work and thankfully not many major companies allow this anymore - it's totally not needed/wanted. Shame there are some shisters out there who spoil it for the rest of us.
Quite surprised at this if I'm honest,Agency should have told you which client is was for (if they disclose client name then you need/should not apply) however how are you to know for certain it's the same role (probably is, but how can you know if they won't tell you the clients name)
go for it & good luck
p.s. there are some recruiters that spec candidates into companies, but this is a very sharkey way to work and thankfully not many major companies allow this anymore - it's totally not needed/wanted. Shame there are some shisters out there who spoil it for the rest of us.
The problem (as you will know Andy) is the agency will have a clause in their T's & C's that state along the lines of "any candidate submitted by us cannot be employed directly for 3/6/9/12 months without incurring the fee" therefore if the agency finds out they will invoice at full rate with no discount because "their" candidate has been placed at a company that they introduced to them.
In theory I would say apply direct however it may well cause problems with the employer getting a large invoice from the agency.
Also, any agent that says they cannot tell you the company name is total bulls
t, it sounds like you are dealing with a right idiot. Edited by Chris_OCR on Tuesday 16th March 10:27
For sure apply for it, happens all the time.
My previous job I had a similar situation.
Tell them at interview. Should gives you more ground for salary negotiation if they don't have to pay the agents fee.
Its only "wrong" if an agent puts you forward and then you suggest circumventing the agent. However it would all be very difficult to prove anything anyway.
My previous job I had a similar situation.
Tell them at interview. Should gives you more ground for salary negotiation if they don't have to pay the agents fee.
Its only "wrong" if an agent puts you forward and then you suggest circumventing the agent. However it would all be very difficult to prove anything anyway.
was8v said:
For sure apply for it, happens all the time.
My previous job I had a similar situation.
Tell them at interview. Should gives you more ground for salary negotiation if they don't have to pay the agents fee.
Its only "wrong" if an agent puts you forward and then you suggest circumventing the agent. [/b]However it would all be very difficult to prove anything anyway.[/b]
Biggest load of rubbish I have heard in a long time!My previous job I had a similar situation.
Tell them at interview. Should gives you more ground for salary negotiation if they don't have to pay the agents fee.
Its only "wrong" if an agent puts you forward and then you suggest circumventing the agent. [/b]However it would all be very difficult to prove anything anyway.[/b]
A very simple email trail will prove whether the Agency introduced the candidate or the candidate applied direct.
Chris_OCR said:
Biggest load of rubbish I have heard in a long time!
A very simple email trail will prove whether the Agency introduced the candidate or the candidate applied direct.
But the agent hasn't told this guy the name of the company.A very simple email trail will prove whether the Agency introduced the candidate or the candidate applied direct.
Why should the agent get a fee when this guy has seen a job ad and applied for it?
What if it turns out in the end it was a different job - the OP doesn't want to miss out on an opportunity.
In my case I registered with a recruitment agency, they told me they were putting me forward for a job.
A mate said there was an opening at his place, so I got invited for interview.
The agent rang me and said come for interview for this job.
Turns out the address was the same. Agent cancelled interview.
To OP: I'd say just apply for it. Let the company sort it out with the agent if they have to, not your problem you havent done anything "wrong" - the agent should have told you the name of the company.
Edited by was8v on Tuesday 16th March 14:33
was8v said:
Chris_OCR said:
Biggest load of rubbish I have heard in a long time!
A very simple email trail will prove whether the Agency introduced the candidate or the candidate applied direct.
But the agent hasn't told this guy the name of the company.A very simple email trail will prove whether the Agency introduced the candidate or the candidate applied direct.
Why should the agent get a fee when this guy has seen a job ad and applied for it?
What if it turns out in the end it was a different job - the OP doesn't want to miss out on an opportunity.
There is no excuse whatsoever for the agent not telling the OP the name of the company, very poor but he has still made the introduction therefore will get the fee if the OP is successful.
Chris_OCR said:
Because the agent has introduced the candidate to the client before the candidate introduced himself directly, legally standing the client would not have a leg to stand on regarding paying the fee IF the candidate was successful.
There is no excuse whatsoever for the agent not telling the OP the name of the company, very poor but he has still made the introduction therefore will get the fee if the OP is successful.
But the candidate doesn't have any liability surely? Hence our OP can merrily apply for this job.There is no excuse whatsoever for the agent not telling the OP the name of the company, very poor but he has still made the introduction therefore will get the fee if the OP is successful.
My experience of recruitment agents (FT IT jobs £20-25k pa) is that its normal for them not to tell you the name of the company until they have secured you an interview. I don't have experience at professional levels of the market so perhaps my agents have been less "professional".
Edited by was8v on Tuesday 16th March 17:22
Edited by was8v on Tuesday 16th March 17:24
was8v said:
Chris_OCR said:
Because the agent has introduced the candidate to the client before the candidate introduced himself directly, legally standing the client would not have a leg to stand on regarding paying the fee IF the candidate was successful.
There is no excuse whatsoever for the agent not telling the OP the name of the company, very poor but he has still made the introduction therefore will get the fee if the OP is successful.
But the candidate doesn't have any liability surely? Hence our OP can merrily apply for this job.There is no excuse whatsoever for the agent not telling the OP the name of the company, very poor but he has still made the introduction therefore will get the fee if the OP is successful.
My experience of recruitment agents (FT IT jobs £20-25k pa) is that its normal for them not to tell you the name of the company until they have secured you an interview. I don't have experience at professional levels of the market so perhaps my agents have been less "professional".
Edited by was8v on Tuesday 16th March 17:22
Edited by was8v on Tuesday 16th March 17:24
Definitely go direct if he hasn't told you the company.
You never know, it might just be different.
If not, and the select you direct, then it's his own fault.
As a recruitment consultant, I would never have sent someone's CV to a company without telling them who it was first. Sure I would want to see their CV before telling them, to know that A) you are interested, and B) you are not another recruitment consultant fishing for sales leads, but once you have sent your CV and spken with him about what you want etc, telling you the companies he will represent you to should be no problem at all.
You never know, it might just be different.
If not, and the select you direct, then it's his own fault.
As a recruitment consultant, I would never have sent someone's CV to a company without telling them who it was first. Sure I would want to see their CV before telling them, to know that A) you are interested, and B) you are not another recruitment consultant fishing for sales leads, but once you have sent your CV and spken with him about what you want etc, telling you the companies he will represent you to should be no problem at all.
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