Private Road - Access Rights
Discussion
We are about to complete on a house purchase and one outstanding matter is that the property is accessed via a private (unadopted) road. The house that we are buying is on a cul-de-sac with 70 other houses and the cul-de-sac is adopted by the local council. However the road that the cul-de-sac leads off of is a private road. There are 2 other non-private cul-de-sacs that lead off of the same private road so in total there are 100+ houses using the private road for access.
The current owners have stated that there is a right of way but there's nothing documented to prove this. The cul-de-sac was built in the 50's and from what I know of the area there have been no disputes over access.
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Is there something somewhere that says if the access has been used for x many years then it is 'a given', or is that just for ramblers on farmers land??
Would be good to get some thoughts from folks in similar situations or anyone that knows about these things...
The current owners have stated that there is a right of way but there's nothing documented to prove this. The cul-de-sac was built in the 50's and from what I know of the area there have been no disputes over access.
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Is there something somewhere that says if the access has been used for x many years then it is 'a given', or is that just for ramblers on farmers land??
Would be good to get some thoughts from folks in similar situations or anyone that knows about these things...
Your solicitor has presumably seen all the detail regarding this, you need to be asking them this question. What have they told you?
There are too many variables for anything that anyone on here can say to be of much use.
As a starter though, yes, long usage of an accessway *may* lead to an established right but it's not as simple as that.
There are too many variables for anything that anyone on here can say to be of much use.
As a starter though, yes, long usage of an accessway *may* lead to an established right but it's not as simple as that.
Good luck!
We just bought a 5 year old house at the end of a 4 house cul-de-sac. Each house owns the land in front of it that the cul-de-sac is built on, so we have to cross 3 other properties to get out. Luckily for us it's all in the deeds that each house must allow access and must park in a considerate manner
We just bought a 5 year old house at the end of a 4 house cul-de-sac. Each house owns the land in front of it that the cul-de-sac is built on, so we have to cross 3 other properties to get out. Luckily for us it's all in the deeds that each house must allow access and must park in a considerate manner
Sounds ok to me, but a statutory declaration (stat dec) from previous owners saying how long they have used it for will help protect you. You would probably also be able to insure any title risk (First Title are good, I use them alot), your solicitor should know how to contact them. Premiums are usually between 0.1% and 0.25% of the value depending in the degree of risk
Ultimately your solicitor should be answering this question and it should be detailed in your report on title. As others have said there are lots of variables and its rarely cut and dried.
Despite my thoughts above, please ask your solicitor, rather than trust replies from an Internet Forum as you have no idea of people's qualifications, and the wrong advice could leave you with a problem re-selling.
Ultimately your solicitor should be answering this question and it should be detailed in your report on title. As others have said there are lots of variables and its rarely cut and dried.
Despite my thoughts above, please ask your solicitor, rather than trust replies from an Internet Forum as you have no idea of people's qualifications, and the wrong advice could leave you with a problem re-selling.
blueg33 said:
Sounds ok to me, but a statutory declaration (stat dec) from previous owners saying how long they have used it for will help protect you. You would probably also be able to insure any title risk (First Title are good, I use them alot), your solicitor should know how to contact them. Premiums are usually between 0.1% and 0.25% of the value depending in the degree of risk
Ultimately your solicitor should be answering this question and it should be detailed in your report on title. As others have said there are lots of variables and its rarely cut and dried.
Despite my thoughts above, please ask your solicitor, rather than trust replies from an Internet Forum as you have no idea of people's qualifications, and the wrong advice could leave you with a problem re-selling.
Agree, plus other long term present owners of other properties. I once had to make such a statement, in a similar situation, for a person buying a neighbouring property, and when selling a commercial, retail premises.Ultimately your solicitor should be answering this question and it should be detailed in your report on title. As others have said there are lots of variables and its rarely cut and dried.
Despite my thoughts above, please ask your solicitor, rather than trust replies from an Internet Forum as you have no idea of people's qualifications, and the wrong advice could leave you with a problem re-selling.
Leebo77 said:
We are about to complete on a house purchase and one outstanding matter is that the property is accessed via a private (unadopted) road. The house that we are buying is on a cul-de-sac with 70 other houses and the cul-de-sac is adopted by the local council. However the road that the cul-de-sac leads off of is a private road. There are 2 other non-private cul-de-sacs that lead off of the same private road so in total there are 100+ houses using the private road for access.
The current owners have stated that there is a right of way but there's nothing documented to prove this. The cul-de-sac was built in the 50's and from what I know of the area there have been no disputes over access.
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Is there something somewhere that says if the access has been used for x many years then it is 'a given', or is that just for ramblers on farmers land??
Would be good to get some thoughts from folks in similar situations or anyone that knows about these things...
An unadopted road usually (99% of the time) means it's actually owned by the council - although establishing this can be painful.The current owners have stated that there is a right of way but there's nothing documented to prove this. The cul-de-sac was built in the 50's and from what I know of the area there have been no disputes over access.
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Is there something somewhere that says if the access has been used for x many years then it is 'a given', or is that just for ramblers on farmers land??
Would be good to get some thoughts from folks in similar situations or anyone that knows about these things...
As mentioned above, your previous owners should provide you with a statutory declaration which will give you a prescriptive right to pass and re-pass etc. The declaration will be a sworn statement from them (and possibly their predecessors in title) and they should provide this at their cost.
A prescriptive right can be read about here:
http://www.landreg.gov.uk/assets/library/documents...
Edited by NDA on Sunday 21st November 14:28
NDA said:
Leebo77 said:
We are about to complete on a house purchase and one outstanding matter is that the property is accessed via a private (unadopted) road. The house that we are buying is on a cul-de-sac with 70 other houses and the cul-de-sac is adopted by the local council. However the road that the cul-de-sac leads off of is a private road. There are 2 other non-private cul-de-sacs that lead off of the same private road so in total there are 100+ houses using the private road for access.
The current owners have stated that there is a right of way but there's nothing documented to prove this. The cul-de-sac was built in the 50's and from what I know of the area there have been no disputes over access.
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Is there something somewhere that says if the access has been used for x many years then it is 'a given', or is that just for ramblers on farmers land??
Would be good to get some thoughts from folks in similar situations or anyone that knows about these things...
An unadopted road usually (99% of the time) means it's actually owned by the council - although establishing this can be painful.The current owners have stated that there is a right of way but there's nothing documented to prove this. The cul-de-sac was built in the 50's and from what I know of the area there have been no disputes over access.
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Is there something somewhere that says if the access has been used for x many years then it is 'a given', or is that just for ramblers on farmers land??
Would be good to get some thoughts from folks in similar situations or anyone that knows about these things...
As mentioned above, your previous owners should provide you with a statutory declaration which will give you a prescriptive right to pass and re-pass etc. The declaration will be a sworn statement from them (and possibly their predecessors in title) and they should provide this at their cost.
A prescriptive right can be read about here:
http://www.landreg.gov.uk/assets/library/documents...
Edited by NDA on Sunday 21st November 14:28
NDA said:
An unadopted road usually (99% of the time) means it's actually owned by the council
And yet the residents have to pay again (having already paid Council Tax) to fix it. My mother lived on an unadopted road - council refused to do anything with it even though the name board had their initials on it.So it seems the council can own something but not be responsible for it? I'm sure if started digging it up they'd be round PDQ.
Edited by Simpo Two on Sunday 21st November 15:12
Leebo, I had this problem when buying a few years ago.
You absolutely MUST get the sellers to provide Absence of Easement insurance (they should pay for it, not you, as it's part of the property's requirements). This will cover you if the rightful owner suddenly appears and decides to charge everyone a ridiculous fee for access - or worse still, blocks it off with a JCB.
Our mortgage company wouldn't have released the funds without the insurance in place.
You absolutely MUST get the sellers to provide Absence of Easement insurance (they should pay for it, not you, as it's part of the property's requirements). This will cover you if the rightful owner suddenly appears and decides to charge everyone a ridiculous fee for access - or worse still, blocks it off with a JCB.
Our mortgage company wouldn't have released the funds without the insurance in place.
Muzzlehatch said:
Leebo, I had this problem when buying a few years ago.
You absolutely MUST get the sellers to provide Absence of Easement insurance (they should pay for it, not you, as it's part of the property's requirements). This will cover you if the rightful owner suddenly appears and decides to charge everyone a ridiculous fee for access - or worse still, blocks it off with a JCB.
Our mortgage company wouldn't have released the funds without the insurance in place.
The mortage companies almost always want this type of cover in these circumstances. We used to self insure this as a £1bn t/o company but mortgage companies for our buyers still wanted a policy. Its actually called Defective Title Insurance. Who pays for it is a negotiation, but you are negotiating from a point of strength unless the sellers have a cash buyer lined up.You absolutely MUST get the sellers to provide Absence of Easement insurance (they should pay for it, not you, as it's part of the property's requirements). This will cover you if the rightful owner suddenly appears and decides to charge everyone a ridiculous fee for access - or worse still, blocks it off with a JCB.
Our mortgage company wouldn't have released the funds without the insurance in place.
Just to comment on something else said above - Your seller cannot grant you a prescriptive right. You can earn a prescriptive right over time, but it cannot be granted. You also need to be aware that if the right is prescriptive for access to for example a four bedroom house with a single garage, that doesnt mean that there is a right to access a granny flat that may be added to the house later. Rights of way cannot usually be intensified (used for more things) without either a new right being granted by the owner or another period passes for prescription as with the original prescriptive right.
I am glad your solicitor is looking at it. I have been dealing with title issues almost weekly for 20 years and no two are identical. Lawyers still make mistakes as well. I got caught out on one development and it cost me/the company £50k. Both the lawyers and I thought we had it sorted.
In my experience, applying for the insurance will flush out all of the right questions to ask. But note, do not disclose the address etc in a public forum or even discuss with neighbours as you could invalidate the insurance.
Simpo Two said:
Leebo77 said:
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Only if all 150 want to chip in...I would be happy to look at 1/20th of the cost, if I could only persuade 19 other households that it is an urgent problem.
Of course, being the last garage in the block and having to drive the furthest across it, my view of the situation is not the same as some other garage owners - some of whom do not even put a car in theirs...
Deva Link said:
Isn't it a bit unusual to have an adopted road "isolated" from the rest of the road network by access via an unadopted road?
Yes, very unusual. To the extent that it sounds fairly unlikely but as everyone has said the solicitor should come up with the specifics for this location. Silver Smudger said:
Simpo Two said:
Leebo77 said:
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Only if all 150 want to chip in...otherman said:
Silver Smudger said:
Simpo Two said:
Leebo77 said:
I am not too worried about costs to maintain the road as any costs would be split between probably 150+ houses.
Only if all 150 want to chip in...blueg33 said:
Our private access is shared by 3 houses. It needed resurfacing but one of the neighbours wouldn't pay, so 2 of us paid for it. It would have cost more to pursue through lawyers than it cost to surface.
I doubt there's any legal case. But if nobody else is prepared to adopt the road perhaps you can, and set up a toll-gate for him?!ETA: And then the Council will suddenly turn up waving clipboards and shouting, and saying they own the road, and you can say OK, here's the bill for the tarmac...
A few years ago on my mother's road one resident took it upon himself to build a speed hump outside his house. It didn't last long.
Edited by Simpo Two on Sunday 21st November 17:59
Gassing Station | Homes, Gardens and DIY | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff