Orange peel effect
Discussion
I took the rear wing (seac type) into a body shop to get colour matched and sprayed 2 weeks ago. £150 was the price so I said go ahead. Didn't seem a bad price for something this size, 5'x 2' and only sprayed one side.
The colour is quite a good match, no name for it though just a number on the swatch cards. I picked it up just as they were closing on Friday and agreed to go back in today to pay. I noticed when putting it in the boot of the car that it looked a bit orange peely, but thought maybe it was just the way the light caught it.
Fitted it on the car when I got home and I am so disappointed with it. Not only is it orange peel affect but it has quite a few dust flecks in the paint. You can also still see some marks that were on it before I took it in to them.
Also, when I went out for a drive in the sunshine yesterday to show my dad it, I noticed a small blister had raised up, about the size of a match head, that has now disappeared again.
This is not a 'back street shop' but a very reputable spray shop and I have seen some cracking jobs come out of there.
So going back this aft to ask the boss to have a look to see if he thinks it is a good job. Am I being too picky?? or is this to be expected nowadays
The colour is quite a good match, no name for it though just a number on the swatch cards. I picked it up just as they were closing on Friday and agreed to go back in today to pay. I noticed when putting it in the boot of the car that it looked a bit orange peely, but thought maybe it was just the way the light caught it.
Fitted it on the car when I got home and I am so disappointed with it. Not only is it orange peel affect but it has quite a few dust flecks in the paint. You can also still see some marks that were on it before I took it in to them.
Also, when I went out for a drive in the sunshine yesterday to show my dad it, I noticed a small blister had raised up, about the size of a match head, that has now disappeared again.
This is not a 'back street shop' but a very reputable spray shop and I have seen some cracking jobs come out of there.
So going back this aft to ask the boss to have a look to see if he thinks it is a good job. Am I being too picky?? or is this to be expected nowadays
Took the wing back to shop and explained my disappointment. The owner looked at it and then spitted out one whole chapter from the book of excuses.
1 > You can't get a good finish with paint and lacquer. Its all in the polishing and buffing afterwards.
2 > It's because it is fibreglass, there is so much shrinkage and swelling going on all the time.
3 > It's the paint we have to use nowadays.
4 > Leave it with us and we'll sort it out, it needs flattened off and polished back up again.
So I have left it with them until Thursday. I am not holding my breath for a good job but will have to wait and see.
From a distance it looked real good and I guess they hope that people don't notice these things or just accept that that's how they are.
I now know one person that won't be recommending this body particular shop, no matter how it turns out on Thursday
1 > You can't get a good finish with paint and lacquer. Its all in the polishing and buffing afterwards.
2 > It's because it is fibreglass, there is so much shrinkage and swelling going on all the time.
3 > It's the paint we have to use nowadays.
4 > Leave it with us and we'll sort it out, it needs flattened off and polished back up again.
So I have left it with them until Thursday. I am not holding my breath for a good job but will have to wait and see.
From a distance it looked real good and I guess they hope that people don't notice these things or just accept that that's how they are.
I now know one person that won't be recommending this body particular shop, no matter how it turns out on Thursday
TOPTON said:
4 > Leave it with us and we'll sort it out, it needs flattened off and polished back up again.
Orange Peel is easily fixed by giving is a going over with some rubbing compound, followed up with something like scratch X and then polish and wax. There will be a couple of hours work involved in a piece that size, even using an electric polisher. That should get you a good result though.you will see orange peel 'effect' on cars in a showroom!
recently in a main dealers and a brand new and unregistered black LR defender had dreadful orange peel - could not believe it
but a friends new BMW had minor orange peel in rear panels
yes, paint correction by an experienced 'detailer' can correct the problem but on brand new cars its unacceptable - but when i pointed out the problem on my friends BMW she just shrugged her shoulders as she did not see it as a problem!
so whilst the public accept it nothing will be done by manufacturers to improve the quality of the paint finish
recently in a main dealers and a brand new and unregistered black LR defender had dreadful orange peel - could not believe it
but a friends new BMW had minor orange peel in rear panels
yes, paint correction by an experienced 'detailer' can correct the problem but on brand new cars its unacceptable - but when i pointed out the problem on my friends BMW she just shrugged her shoulders as she did not see it as a problem!
so whilst the public accept it nothing will be done by manufacturers to improve the quality of the paint finish
Orange peel is a well known problem on new Beemers these days istr its to do with the process used- more akin to powder coating than traditional painting.
Easily remdied,sure, but thats hardly the point.
As far as paying £150 to paint an rbs off the car - I'd regard that a beng on the high side,especially in view of the apparent quality of the finished product.
There are a good many decent quality painters that charge around £75 a panel these days, even less if you want a poor finish with s
t in it!
Easily remdied,sure, but thats hardly the point.
As far as paying £150 to paint an rbs off the car - I'd regard that a beng on the high side,especially in view of the apparent quality of the finished product.
There are a good many decent quality painters that charge around £75 a panel these days, even less if you want a poor finish with s
t in it!Well an update from Thursday when I went to collect it at 3pm.
The wing was now in total rubbed down state, not primed yet and with patches of filler here and there. The body shop owner says---
The marks in it were too deep to polish out so he's rubbed it all down to do it again. It will be ready on Tuesday.
So the marks that were on it before I gave it to them 1st time around were just sprayed over in the hope that maybe I didn't notice.
Maybe, just maybe I am going to get a proper job this time.
Now bearing in mind it is 3pm and they close at 4pm, closed all weekend and the bank holiday I don't see this happening. So I said not to rush it and I will give them a call on Wednesday.
I'm not going to hold my breath
The wing was now in total rubbed down state, not primed yet and with patches of filler here and there. The body shop owner says---
The marks in it were too deep to polish out so he's rubbed it all down to do it again. It will be ready on Tuesday.
So the marks that were on it before I gave it to them 1st time around were just sprayed over in the hope that maybe I didn't notice.
Maybe, just maybe I am going to get a proper job this time.
Now bearing in mind it is 3pm and they close at 4pm, closed all weekend and the bank holiday I don't see this happening. So I said not to rush it and I will give them a call on Wednesday.
I'm not going to hold my breath
Y282 said:
all i can say is give them a chance. at least they're trying to remedy it. try to forget it's in there for now and see what they can do with it.
good luck and maybe post some pics up when it's done?
should NEVER have been given to the customer in that state - no excuses!good luck and maybe post some pics up when it's done?
and yes, quite a few body shops say its not their fault its the 'new' water based paints - just an excuse for poor workmanship!
grand cherokee said:
Y282 said:
all i can say is give them a chance. at least they're trying to remedy it. try to forget it's in there for now and see what they can do with it.
good luck and maybe post some pics up when it's done?
should NEVER have been given to the customer in that state - no excuses!good luck and maybe post some pics up when it's done?
and yes, quite a few body shops say its not their fault its the 'new' water based paints - just an excuse for poor workmanship!
A finish can be achieved at an extremely high level from the gun, even so it would still need a minor polish afterwards even if its just to take the newness off it but in most cases a painter is driven by time constraints...he may only have had an hour and a half to complete it but that is still no excuse for poor workmanship....
the orange peel was most likely caused by the paint(clearcoat) being too thick or the temperature too high but can be caused by many things....
To one reply...orange peel CANNOT be removed simply by polishing with a little scratch x...it needs wet sanding and then polishing back and then refining....
BMW are the worst case scenario for orange peel, almost every one you see is riddled with it....
thing is you have done the right thing by letting them put it right...if they then fail again go to a higher class of painter and have the other company pay.....
the orange peel was most likely caused by the paint(clearcoat) being too thick or the temperature too high but can be caused by many things....
To one reply...orange peel CANNOT be removed simply by polishing with a little scratch x...it needs wet sanding and then polishing back and then refining....
BMW are the worst case scenario for orange peel, almost every one you see is riddled with it....
thing is you have done the right thing by letting them put it right...if they then fail again go to a higher class of painter and have the other company pay.....
Reflectology said:
A finish can be achieved at an extremely high level from the gun, even so it would still need a minor polish afterwards even if its just to take the newness off it but in most cases a painter is driven by time constraints...he may only have had an hour and a half to complete it but that is still no excuse for poor workmanship....
the orange peel was most likely caused by the paint(clearcoat) being too thick or the temperature too high but can be caused by many things....
To one reply...orange peel CANNOT be removed simply by polishing with a little scratch x...it needs wet sanding and then polishing back and then refining....
BMW are the worst case scenario for orange peel, almost every one you see is riddled with it....
thing is you have done the right thing by letting them put it right...if they then fail again go to a higher class of painter and have the other company pay.....
very good reply - thanksthe orange peel was most likely caused by the paint(clearcoat) being too thick or the temperature too high but can be caused by many things....
To one reply...orange peel CANNOT be removed simply by polishing with a little scratch x...it needs wet sanding and then polishing back and then refining....
BMW are the worst case scenario for orange peel, almost every one you see is riddled with it....
thing is you have done the right thing by letting them put it right...if they then fail again go to a higher class of painter and have the other company pay.....
Now I am feeling disappointed with the body shop.
I rang them at 9 this morning to see if it was complete and Dave the owner says---
D>> "we have rubbed it down and primered it again but it keeps blistering in one small patch, so you can have it back as it is with no charge"
So I went to pick it up and said---
Me>> "So you are not going to spray it for me".
D>> "We can't, it keeps blistering because of what it's made of"
Me>> "But it's fibreglass like the rest of the car,"
D>> " YEP"
That was it, I picked it up and walked away. So here is a pic of the offending section of supposed blistering
Now the grey area is primer on top of filler. This is where when I first took it to them it had some scratches that needed filling before painting. Obviously been filled now but he says it keeps blistering there.
Why would it blister there only where there is filler and primer? Or is he basically saying sod off we don't want to do it.
When I took it back last week it had blister the size of a match head exactly where the scratches were, but these have now been filled
I rang them at 9 this morning to see if it was complete and Dave the owner says---
D>> "we have rubbed it down and primered it again but it keeps blistering in one small patch, so you can have it back as it is with no charge"
So I went to pick it up and said---
Me>> "So you are not going to spray it for me".
D>> "We can't, it keeps blistering because of what it's made of"
Me>> "But it's fibreglass like the rest of the car,"
D>> " YEP"
That was it, I picked it up and walked away. So here is a pic of the offending section of supposed blistering
Now the grey area is primer on top of filler. This is where when I first took it to them it had some scratches that needed filling before painting. Obviously been filled now but he says it keeps blistering there.
Why would it blister there only where there is filler and primer? Or is he basically saying sod off we don't want to do it.
When I took it back last week it had blister the size of a match head exactly where the scratches were, but these have now been filled
they are more than likely painting it and oven drying it which is a big no no where plastics and fibre glass are concerned, what happens is when heat hits is the pores open and release small pockets of air....it needs to be done by someone who knows what they are doing to be honest mate, someone who recognises that its a delicate material and should not be force dried....
Yep orange peel removal is far from easy to do correctly and can take alot of time , i have a new M3 with me now with dreaded orange peel and another sitting next to it with out orange peel as it came to use last year to rectify the problem .
nice to be able to see 2 sitting next to each other in same colour for ultimate comparison
kelly
nice to be able to see 2 sitting next to each other in same colour for ultimate comparison
kelly
TOPTON said:
Now I am feeling disappointed with the body shop.
I rang them at 9 this morning to see if it was complete and Dave the owner says---
D>> "we have rubbed it down and primered it again but it keeps blistering in one small patch, so you can have it back as it is with no charge"
So I went to pick it up and said---
Me>> "So you are not going to spray it for me".
D>> "We can't, it keeps blistering because of what it's made of"
Me>> "But it's fibreglass like the rest of the car,"
D>> " YEP"
That was it, I picked it up and walked away. So here is a pic of the offending section of supposed blistering
Now the grey area is primer on top of filler. This is where when I first took it to them it had some scratches that needed filling before painting. Obviously been filled now but he says it keeps blistering there.
Why would it blister there only where there is filler and primer? Or is he basically saying sod off we don't want to do it.
When I took it back last week it had blister the size of a match head exactly where the scratches were, but these have now been filled
quite honestly name and shame the 'paint shop' (i use the word loosely!) concerned so that no other forum members make the mistake of going to these cowboys!I rang them at 9 this morning to see if it was complete and Dave the owner says---
D>> "we have rubbed it down and primered it again but it keeps blistering in one small patch, so you can have it back as it is with no charge"
So I went to pick it up and said---
Me>> "So you are not going to spray it for me".
D>> "We can't, it keeps blistering because of what it's made of"
Me>> "But it's fibreglass like the rest of the car,"
D>> " YEP"
That was it, I picked it up and walked away. So here is a pic of the offending section of supposed blistering
Now the grey area is primer on top of filler. This is where when I first took it to them it had some scratches that needed filling before painting. Obviously been filled now but he says it keeps blistering there.
Why would it blister there only where there is filler and primer? Or is he basically saying sod off we don't want to do it.
When I took it back last week it had blister the size of a match head exactly where the scratches were, but these have now been filled
Reflectology said:
they are more than likely painting it and oven drying it which is a big no no where plastics and fibre glass are concerned, what happens is when heat hits is the pores open and release small pockets of air....it needs to be done by someone who knows what they are doing to be honest mate, someone who recognises that its a delicate material and should not be force dried....
your knowledge/expertise continues to impress me - think i'll soon be in touch for some work - thanks!Not trying to stick up for the bodyshop but,
if the part is cheap or badly made , with lots of air bubbles trapped under a gel coat that is too thin. then this could explain why the blister appeared when out in the full sun.
poor form from the shop for not contacting the customer after the part had been originaly prepared for paint though.
if the part is cheap or badly made , with lots of air bubbles trapped under a gel coat that is too thin. then this could explain why the blister appeared when out in the full sun.
poor form from the shop for not contacting the customer after the part had been originaly prepared for paint though.
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