Main dealer pulling down my pants
Discussion
Bit of advice please.
I took a 2011 RRS to the garage for a new crossover pipe last Tuesday.
Having used the same dealership for the last few years, i've got a pretty good relationship with them and everything is normally spot on.
When I took it in, I was told it will be 5 hours plus whatever the part costs. The gearbox has to come out to do the job (other option is lift the body off but more expensive).
Now the service advisor I deal with left on Thursday which has kind of screwed me over as they're saying she should never have told me the price etc.
It should have been done on Wednesday last week but she rang me to say the part they ordered was incorrect so had to order the right one so would be done Thursday last thing at the latest. She wanted to make sure it was done before she left so she 'had no loose ends'.
Again, she rang me on Thursday and said it's taking a bit longer to do so won't be ready until Tuesday due to the bank holidays but assured me the price she quoted is the price i'll be paying.
Fast forward to today and another service advisor rang me to say a bolt has seized and they need to take the gearbox out to do it properly and want an extra 5 hours(??)
Obviously I was pretty annoyed as I was told to do the job the gearbox had to come out anyway but apparently they tried to do it another way.
I told them i'm not paying for another 5 hours labour as that's what I was quoted for originally.
They're now refusing and telling me I either pay the extra 5 hours or pay for the 5 hours already 'used' or they won't release the car back to me.
I'm a bit pissed off and now the service advisor has left, they're saying it's my word against theirs.
Bit of a long post but just wanted to get the details in. Any advice on what to do would be great.
Thanks.
I took a 2011 RRS to the garage for a new crossover pipe last Tuesday.
Having used the same dealership for the last few years, i've got a pretty good relationship with them and everything is normally spot on.
When I took it in, I was told it will be 5 hours plus whatever the part costs. The gearbox has to come out to do the job (other option is lift the body off but more expensive).
Now the service advisor I deal with left on Thursday which has kind of screwed me over as they're saying she should never have told me the price etc.
It should have been done on Wednesday last week but she rang me to say the part they ordered was incorrect so had to order the right one so would be done Thursday last thing at the latest. She wanted to make sure it was done before she left so she 'had no loose ends'.
Again, she rang me on Thursday and said it's taking a bit longer to do so won't be ready until Tuesday due to the bank holidays but assured me the price she quoted is the price i'll be paying.
Fast forward to today and another service advisor rang me to say a bolt has seized and they need to take the gearbox out to do it properly and want an extra 5 hours(??)
Obviously I was pretty annoyed as I was told to do the job the gearbox had to come out anyway but apparently they tried to do it another way.
I told them i'm not paying for another 5 hours labour as that's what I was quoted for originally.
They're now refusing and telling me I either pay the extra 5 hours or pay for the 5 hours already 'used' or they won't release the car back to me.
I'm a bit pissed off and now the service advisor has left, they're saying it's my word against theirs.
Bit of a long post but just wanted to get the details in. Any advice on what to do would be great.
Thanks.
cmaguire said:
With the main dealers I've used in the last few years they quote labour based on a time given by the manufacturer. On that basis if they do it quicker they win, if they don't then tough luck on them. Independents tend to want to bill for extra if possible, which isn't unreasonable if the job takes longer through no fault of their own, and they are cheaper to begin with.
This has always been the case. I'll ring them up and get a price to do a job. I've not once had them come back to me and say it will now be more for whatever reason.The big thing for me is that the job I said yes to was to take the gearbox out to change the pipe. I was under the impression it was a body off job until she told me they can do it by removing the gearbox. Before she mentioned it, I had no clue it was possible.
Whether or not she has tried to screw them over by under quoting or not, I don't see how this falls on me.
She told me it was all down on the job card just incase it wasn't completed before she left but when I asked them, they said nothing was noted.. Yet they knew the hourly rate we agreed.
TooMany2cvs said:
I rather suspect the book time is body-off, and the gearbox-out route was offered as a shortcut. The third, shorter cut, was then tried to help save the OP more time - but failed, because of a pre-existing and unforeseeable problem with his car.
You honestly think they would've rung me up and said 'good news, we've managed to do it under the agreed time so we're not charging you as much as we agreed'???As I said, 2 options were given to me. When I originally rang up they quoted to take the body off, she then spoke to a tech and he said they can do it by taking the gearbox out.
I went for that option and was told 5 hours labour plus the cost of the part.
Its all very simple and this 'pre existing problem' you seem to keep saying would never have been an issue if they had just taken the gearbox out like they were supposed to.
TooMany2cvs said:
So there y'go. That's the book method and time. Everything else was an unofficial shortcut intended to save you money, and done on a time-and-materials basis.
I'm not sure if you're just being difficult or you work at that dealership but i'll say it one more time and then we can just agree to disagree.They gave me two options, I went with the gearbox out as would anyone else as it was cheaper and the result is the same.
They told me 5 hours to do this job, I said go ahead.
They then rang me and said the route they tried has failed due to a seized bolt so they will need to take the gearbox out to do the job.
I told them they were supposed to take the gearbox out to do the job as that's what I was told would be happening.
They now want an extra 5 hours so 10 in total whereas if they had removed the gearbox to start with, none of this would have happened.
papa3 said:
Do you have a written quote? Without it I suspect you are barking up the proverbial.
Did you sign a job card authorising the work? Normally this will be upto a certain limit over the quote. Without it the garage will be struggling.
I seem to recall (from a long ago course) that they are perfectly entitled to hold your vehicle in lieu of payment but that the Lien must be reasonable i.e. not holding a £20k car for a £200 bill. This may or may not be utter nonsense.
No written quote. It should be marked down on the job card but with out seeing it, I have no idea if this was done.Did you sign a job card authorising the work? Normally this will be upto a certain limit over the quote. Without it the garage will be struggling.
I seem to recall (from a long ago course) that they are perfectly entitled to hold your vehicle in lieu of payment but that the Lien must be reasonable i.e. not holding a £20k car for a £200 bill. This may or may not be utter nonsense.
I've tried to contact the service advisor that has left but she hasn't got back to me yet and not sure if she would want to get involved.
For what it's worth, the car is about £24k and the bill they want me to pay to release the car is £690 for the labour.
Edited by rich12 on Wednesday 19th April 10:44
I've been sent this. Not sure if it is 100% correct but seems like it would be right..
If the customer is not given a copy of the garage’s terms and conditions before the garage agrees to repair the vehicle, those terms and conditions are highly unlikely to apply. (A lack of a signature is not fatal to the garage’s claim if it can show that the customer was given the terms and conditions and agreed to them beforehand.)
What if there is no contract between the garage and the customer?
If there are no terms and conditions (or they were not otherwise agreed), the garage cannot rely on those terms. However, the garage can still rely on the law of “bailment”.
A bailment comes about when the garage voluntarily accepts possession of a customer’s car (or van or bike or any other type of vehicle) such as when a customer brings his car in for repair. English law does not require a contract between the garage and its customer for a bailment to arise.
If the garage carries out repairs and this results in an improvement to the car (as opposed to its current condition merely being maintained), the garage is entitled to retain possession of the car until the customer has paid for the repairs (this entitlement being known as a “lien”). Once the customer has paid, the lien is lost and the garage must return the car.
If the customer is not given a copy of the garage’s terms and conditions before the garage agrees to repair the vehicle, those terms and conditions are highly unlikely to apply. (A lack of a signature is not fatal to the garage’s claim if it can show that the customer was given the terms and conditions and agreed to them beforehand.)
What if there is no contract between the garage and the customer?
If there are no terms and conditions (or they were not otherwise agreed), the garage cannot rely on those terms. However, the garage can still rely on the law of “bailment”.
A bailment comes about when the garage voluntarily accepts possession of a customer’s car (or van or bike or any other type of vehicle) such as when a customer brings his car in for repair. English law does not require a contract between the garage and its customer for a bailment to arise.
If the garage carries out repairs and this results in an improvement to the car (as opposed to its current condition merely being maintained), the garage is entitled to retain possession of the car until the customer has paid for the repairs (this entitlement being known as a “lien”). Once the customer has paid, the lien is lost and the garage must return the car.
They don't charge £69/hour. I'm assuming you got that from when I said what they wanted it labour charges to release the car??
£115/hour plus VAT.
Yes, I believe them about the seized bolt so yeh they just didn't want the hassle which is fine by me. Just wish they hadn't taken a week to say it.
The garage who will be doing the repair are 100% removing the gearbox to do the repair as i've told them about the issue with LR.
Thanks for all the good advice on here. Shame one or two people are just idiots.
£115/hour plus VAT.
Yes, I believe them about the seized bolt so yeh they just didn't want the hassle which is fine by me. Just wish they hadn't taken a week to say it.
The garage who will be doing the repair are 100% removing the gearbox to do the repair as i've told them about the issue with LR.
Thanks for all the good advice on here. Shame one or two people are just idiots.
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