MET parking thieves

[Jamesgt]

I'll try and keep this short. I received one of these parking fines back in April. Short story is;

Entered the car park one evening and left 20 minutes later. Following day I entered the car park and left 20 minutes later. The camera picked me up entering the first time but not leaving. It then didn't pick me up entering the second time but it did leaving. I asked MET to check their cameras but now they want evidence of my story such as vehicle tracking! F-ing vehicle tracking!!?? They say a bird may have flown in front of the camera and they tell me the technology isn't perfect. Cheers!

This car park is near stansted airport. McDonald's and Starbucks are located here. I am partial to both but not enough to spend 24 hours at them.

Anyone have any ideas?

[Jamesgt]

I've already got their evidence. Photos of my car entering one day and leaving the next day.

[Jamesgt]

I did actually check into a local hotel not long after my first visit to that car park. I may see if they have any info. I'm there every week so it's no bother to ask reception.

[Jamesgt]

Ekona said:

I work at Stansted, and won a POPLA claim against MET at that exact same services last year, albeit under different circumstances.

They are a hateful bunch at this airport. I spoke to the guy in the parking enforce car one morning. He took great pleasure in booking anyone who stopped for a second on the roads around the airport.

[Jamesgt]

The problem with this particular car park and the petrol station next door is it is FULL of private hire drivers. It's frustrating when you want food from either of the three and you can't find anywhere to park due to cabs. The cameras don't combat this problem.

If it goes as far as court how does this work? I've been sent a final demand for £100 despite me contesting. If they just hound me with fines when do I get go to court?

[Jamesgt]

Red Devil said:

Jamesgt said:

If it goes as far as court how does this work?

You're clearly new to this game as you shouldn't have waited this long to ask for advice/help.
Don't get hung up about court yet. See below.

Jamesgt said:

I've been sent a final demand for £100 despite me contesting.

By whom? The PPC or a DCA (Debt Collection Agency). If the latter, ignore them: they are just bluff and bluster.

How did you contest it? I hope you didn't phone them. That's a rookie error.
Have you made a formal appeal in writing to the PPC and received a rejection letter?
If so they must provide you with a POPLA code so that you can challenge it there.
See the BPA CoP Section 22.12 - http://www.britishparking.co.uk/write/Documents/AO...

If they haven't done so, demand it.

Jamesgt said:

If they just hound me with fines when do I get go to court?

Firstly, get the word 'fine' out of your head. It is nothing of the sort, merely an invoice.
It will be dealt with in a civil court - either on the basis of a tort (trespass) or a breach of contract, - not a criminal one.
If/when will be up to the PPC, but you should be able to defeat it before then at POPLA provided you get your ducks in a row.

Read this and this. Check out all the links.

Jamesgt said:

I asked MET to check their cameras but now they want evidence of my story such as vehicle tracking! F-ing vehicle tracking!!??

They have no incentive to do so and would much rather try to put the burden of proof (of a negative: you weren't there) onto you.
However if you have anything* to show that you were elsewhere between the two parking events that will be excellent ammunition for a POPLA appeal.
A POPLA decision in your favour is binding on the PPC. The reverse is not the case. You can still opt to argue your case in front of a judge if the PPC issues court papers..

 * e.g. a time stamped till receipt from petrol station or a shop etc. etc.

Jamesgt said:

They say a bird may have flown in front of the camera

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekQ_Ja02gTY

Jamesgt said:

and they tell me the technology isn't perfect.

A damning admission. I assume this was verbal rather than in writing...

The actual order of events,

Received first letter along with photos in April. I rang them to say check your cameras. They say appeal it via their website. So i immediately appealed it via their website with "check your cameras". Then I receive a letter yesterday from PPC stating final demand of payment before it passes to legal team. So I rang them which is when they stated the technology isn't perfect so I need to provide further proof of my cars whereabouts during the period I say I wasn't at the car park. Vehicle tracking was used as an example.

I guess I'm just naive. I'm not sure wtf they think I was going overnight in McDonald's?! If I was a mini cab driver it would also make zero sense to stay there for that amount of time.

[Jamesgt]

Just an update on this. I thought I was in the clear. I went to McDonald's to see if they could revoke a parking charge (Aldi did it for my mum so worth a go). Mcdonalds manager was very helpful and seemed well versed on what to do next. She gave me her email address and told me to forward on the details. I did this the same day and heard nothing back for a few weeks. I then had another nasty letter from MET. I went straight to McD and complained again. I was told the other manager had not sent all the details required in the email for MET to cancel the charge. I was told "not to worry, she will sort it out now". A few weeks pass and now I've just got home to a letter from a debt collector (DRP) demanding payment by today!

Am I buggered? I've actually just contacted McDonald's and they've now told me I should have taken the issue with Starbucks next door as it isn't McDonald's car park. FFS!!

[Jamesgt]

I understand I wasn't advised to approach McDonald's. My mum's first hand expirience of something similar in Aldi was all rectified by simply approaching a manager in Aldi. I tried the same at McDonald's and was filled with hope (rubbish) so I decided to waste no more effort on it as McDonald's managers insisted it would go no further. So here I am, another nasty letter and it appears to have escalated.

[Jamesgt]

Do you know what time frame is on the popla appeal process? PCN was for 18th April

[Jamesgt]

Just read I have 28days from first correspondence to appeal. Way out!! I didn't even open the first letter until the day I started this thread so it was probably sat at home a good amount of time while I was on holiday and working abroad.

So my choices are, go to court or pay up. I still might be able to get cctv from work to prove I wasn't there for that alleged overnight stay they say I did. Regardless I understand I cannot claim expenses for the day, loss of wages etc.

[Jamesgt]

Sorry, I have no actual knowledge of this process. Let's say I'm going to gather all the evidence I possibly can for defence. Cctv maybe, signing in sheets for work, letter from manager, evidence I work just two miles away with a free car park. How will this process work? Do I get to submit my evidence prior to court, then MET will likely not proceed as I have a good wedge of evidence?

[Jamesgt]

OpulentBob said:

There are signs in the Starbucks car park specifically saying they will charge people who park there and use the Macdonalds. I was there about 3 hours ago. If you drive in to Starbucks, the spaces on the left hand side have the sign behind them. I read it from the car and thought of this thread.

Thanks for that. I've never bothered to read those signs. Reality is I didn't park over night in either car park. I've spoke to someone in work who says they have cctv for 6 months. This will show my car and me turning up to work at the time MET accuse me of settling in for the night at the car park.

[Jamesgt]

It's currently at £160. I think even if it was £20 I'd want to fight it on principle. The cheek of just send invoices out and threatening court action! I was naive to think they would even check their cameras to prove my innocence.

I will find out more about the work cctv tomorrow night hopefully.

[Jamesgt]

Thanks for that silverfoxcc. I did fight a PCN from another company about two years ago. I overstayed the free 10 minutes by a minute or two so I had actually done wrong. In that case I put the effort in finding out how to fight it. This time because I haven't stayed anything like the seven hours they suggest I just thought it would be simple for them to cancel the ticket once they look at the cameras. They are just a bunch of hateful cowboys.

At least I know now first hand they don't play fair. I'm fully expecting more tickets as the new hotel I stay in employs a PPC.

[Jamesgt]

MitchT said:

I recall something similar happening in my neck of the woods ... found the article:
http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/local/l...

The driver is right. They are patronising. Just admit the system is sh*t and leave people alone.

[Jamesgt]

OpulentBob said:

Sorry, I missed this earlier. You raise a good point, the document clearly says that up to 2 hours free parking in the service area is mandatory if signed from the trunk road, which it clearly is.

I think it depends on whether the Starbucks is classed as part of the "service area", or whether service just means the petrol station. Is coffee a service?!

B28 of that document also may be applicable here, at a push.

The Starbucks sign does not conflict with Starbucks policy of 2 hours for Starbucks customers, I guess is their get out. If you use their facility, then you comply.

But yeah you could probably (maybe) make a case if you dug right down in to the regs and definitions etc, and could convince whoever that Starbucks is part of the same overall facility as the petrol station or Macs. Which, to a road user, they are.

Difficult one!

I missed this also. Probably not relevant for my case but the petrol station at the services which includes M&S has recently installed PPC. They are giving you 30 minutes maximum. So this contravenes the 2 hours mandatory rest?

[Jamesgt]

silverfoxcc said:

James

sent you a PM

Cheers for that. I'm going to do my evidence collecting the next few days and write back over the weekend to both DRP and MET.

[Jamesgt]

SantaBarbara said:

It costs two pounds at Stanstead just to drop someone off in the express car park

John Lennon airport is much better and cheaper

I think it's all a con with these smaller airports. Gatwick and Heathrow are the main airports for the U.K. They manage to do a free drop off period.