Dispute with a car transporter - damaged car and missing key
Discussion
Looking for a bit of advice as to what to do.
I had car transported from London to Edinburgh. I used shiply to find best quote, selected provider that had 1400+ reviews, only few negative, and seemed in general like a decent business - states 4 vehicles, 8 drivers. Seemed very professional.
How wrong was I..... seemed professional only until you have an issue. Its a bit of a long story but bear with me.
Initial contact okay but took couple of days to arrange collection. Car arrived on the back of a flat bed lorry and driver (still smiley and nice at this point) proceeded to drive my car down and when parking the car he kerbed one of alloys badly, right in front of me!!! 1. I have seen it as I was standing right beside the car 2. all 4 wheels have been spotless and driver has actually sent me photo of minor scratches on the bumper when he collected the car which I was aware of.
When he got out and I quizzed him about it he got stroppy and said it must have been there!!! Starts rushing at this point, giving me paperwork to sign and packs up a trailer. In the meantime I am asking questions what are we doing about the alloy wheel, what is the procedure etc in case of accidental damage. Surely professional outfit would have one. He rudely insisted again that it wasn't him that damaged the car and demanded £250 balance in cash!
By this time he already sits in his lorry and speaks to me through an open window. I said I am not happy to pay until I know how I can claim for the alloy wheel. He kept asking if I am paying him or not, completely ignoring my questions about the damage to my car (talking over me). At this point, unsure we will get anywhere I asked him for a spare key to my car which I wasn't handed over yet. He tells me its in the boot and when I go to check he simply drove off. Of course spare key was no where to be found.
What followed is a sorry story of utter lack of professionalism and any customer care. I proceeded phoning both numbers I have for the driver and owner of the company, neither picking up. I have sent texts asking for a key back to which I received response they will send it only after I pay them remaining £250, giving me bank details. Needless to say I wasn't willing to risk it and requested them to send the key first. I even said look forget about alloy wheel damage which is only £75 to fix, just send me my spare key!
They basically stopped responding to my messages for the rest of the day until I said I am taking this to the police as they have my key and if car goes missing I want authorities to have their details and know about the situation.
At this point I got a phone call from a driver who started yelling at me to listen to him and to pay him his money and when I tried to reason with him I got a tirade of abuse with Fxxx off being shouted at me (customer!!!) repeatedly. In amidst this tirade he even told me I am just one unhappy customer and he has hundreds happy so he doesn't care about me!!! I was also threatened with court multiple times. Needless to say I hang up. He called again and situation pretty much repeated itself so I hung up again when he started swearing.
Since then, other than couple of messages, where I asked for a photo of the key to be sent to me as a proof they still have it (never received photo), there has been no communication back from the owner or the driver despite my messages asking to return back the key and I will settle the balance as I have said before. I have left them negative feedback on Shiply and assumed they do not want to resolve the matter. I'm still out of the pocket - approx £150 difference for a key (quote from dealer approx £400) and £75 for alloy wheel refurb but I'm not willing to be chasing these clowns only to be sworn at again.
Fast forward to today (5 days after car has been delivered with 1 key only when dealer has given them two keys) they send me an email with an invoice for £250. I replied to this I do not consider service completed as I only received one key for the car and I will pay when they deliver second key. I also asked for his insurance details so I can claim for the missing key and alloy wheel repair.
Not received response today but I'm expecting there isn't going to be one.
What are my options? I do not want to pay them as they have stole my key and damaged the car. I also do not want anything to do with them anymore, even at the expense of ordering new key, recoding existing one and refurbishing the alloy.
But I do not want these clowns to cause me further hassle by taking me to court where I will have to prove my side of the story. I have their text messages stating they will send the key after I pay them and I have photos of the damaged alloy wheel and text message stating that damaged alloy is between me and their insurance(!!!). Not sure if that would be enough in the eye of the law? I work in financial services so really do not want any court action against me in the odd chance that court would side with them. I'm tempted just to pay them £250 and scratch it up to experience but on the other hand why should I let them get away with it?
Any serious advice appreciated....
I had car transported from London to Edinburgh. I used shiply to find best quote, selected provider that had 1400+ reviews, only few negative, and seemed in general like a decent business - states 4 vehicles, 8 drivers. Seemed very professional.
How wrong was I..... seemed professional only until you have an issue. Its a bit of a long story but bear with me.
Initial contact okay but took couple of days to arrange collection. Car arrived on the back of a flat bed lorry and driver (still smiley and nice at this point) proceeded to drive my car down and when parking the car he kerbed one of alloys badly, right in front of me!!! 1. I have seen it as I was standing right beside the car 2. all 4 wheels have been spotless and driver has actually sent me photo of minor scratches on the bumper when he collected the car which I was aware of.
When he got out and I quizzed him about it he got stroppy and said it must have been there!!! Starts rushing at this point, giving me paperwork to sign and packs up a trailer. In the meantime I am asking questions what are we doing about the alloy wheel, what is the procedure etc in case of accidental damage. Surely professional outfit would have one. He rudely insisted again that it wasn't him that damaged the car and demanded £250 balance in cash!
By this time he already sits in his lorry and speaks to me through an open window. I said I am not happy to pay until I know how I can claim for the alloy wheel. He kept asking if I am paying him or not, completely ignoring my questions about the damage to my car (talking over me). At this point, unsure we will get anywhere I asked him for a spare key to my car which I wasn't handed over yet. He tells me its in the boot and when I go to check he simply drove off. Of course spare key was no where to be found.
What followed is a sorry story of utter lack of professionalism and any customer care. I proceeded phoning both numbers I have for the driver and owner of the company, neither picking up. I have sent texts asking for a key back to which I received response they will send it only after I pay them remaining £250, giving me bank details. Needless to say I wasn't willing to risk it and requested them to send the key first. I even said look forget about alloy wheel damage which is only £75 to fix, just send me my spare key!
They basically stopped responding to my messages for the rest of the day until I said I am taking this to the police as they have my key and if car goes missing I want authorities to have their details and know about the situation.
At this point I got a phone call from a driver who started yelling at me to listen to him and to pay him his money and when I tried to reason with him I got a tirade of abuse with Fxxx off being shouted at me (customer!!!) repeatedly. In amidst this tirade he even told me I am just one unhappy customer and he has hundreds happy so he doesn't care about me!!! I was also threatened with court multiple times. Needless to say I hang up. He called again and situation pretty much repeated itself so I hung up again when he started swearing.
Since then, other than couple of messages, where I asked for a photo of the key to be sent to me as a proof they still have it (never received photo), there has been no communication back from the owner or the driver despite my messages asking to return back the key and I will settle the balance as I have said before. I have left them negative feedback on Shiply and assumed they do not want to resolve the matter. I'm still out of the pocket - approx £150 difference for a key (quote from dealer approx £400) and £75 for alloy wheel refurb but I'm not willing to be chasing these clowns only to be sworn at again.
Fast forward to today (5 days after car has been delivered with 1 key only when dealer has given them two keys) they send me an email with an invoice for £250. I replied to this I do not consider service completed as I only received one key for the car and I will pay when they deliver second key. I also asked for his insurance details so I can claim for the missing key and alloy wheel repair.
Not received response today but I'm expecting there isn't going to be one.
What are my options? I do not want to pay them as they have stole my key and damaged the car. I also do not want anything to do with them anymore, even at the expense of ordering new key, recoding existing one and refurbishing the alloy.
But I do not want these clowns to cause me further hassle by taking me to court where I will have to prove my side of the story. I have their text messages stating they will send the key after I pay them and I have photos of the damaged alloy wheel and text message stating that damaged alloy is between me and their insurance(!!!). Not sure if that would be enough in the eye of the law? I work in financial services so really do not want any court action against me in the odd chance that court would side with them. I'm tempted just to pay them £250 and scratch it up to experience but on the other hand why should I let them get away with it?
Any serious advice appreciated....
The Spruce goose said:
if it was i would have paid under protest then claimed against them, the courts if needs be for the damage. You agreed a contract and have in effect broken it, so they could sue you for it.
But going by this logic they could deliver car with no wheels or stereo removed etc and are you suggesting they still met their end of the contract? Surely key, as much as anything else constitutes the part of the car in that respect and is covered by the scope of contract meaning they haven't completed the job?Bristol spark said:
A lot of posters on PH seem to think its a piece of cake to get your money back with this.
It certainly is not, its stressful, time consuming and certainly not guaranteed to get your money back, and also be worse off with the court costs to pay yourself.
A dodgy company will not care about CCJ's and will resprawn before the bailifs.
For the OP's loss its not worth it IMO.
Just dont pay the £250 and write the rest off if it was me.
It certainly is not, its stressful, time consuming and certainly not guaranteed to get your money back, and also be worse off with the court costs to pay yourself.
A dodgy company will not care about CCJ's and will resprawn before the bailifs.
For the OP's loss its not worth it IMO.
Just dont pay the £250 and write the rest off if it was me.
paintman said:
Providing someone from the dealership is prepared to attend court - I'd suggest you speak to them now to find that out - you are able to prove that the wheels were undamaged when collected.
Subject to the above proviso you are also able to prove that 2 keys were sent with the car.
Whilst you are understandably upset by the damage & the attitude of the company I can't see further discussion with them is going to achieve anything constructive.
I would suggest you pay the £250, get the spare key & then send an invoice for the cost of the wheel refurb. When they ignore that you can send a letter before action.
Bear in mind that if you do finish up going to court they will insist that the matter is heard at their local court & you will need to consider whether it's worth your time & travel costs plus those of the dealer - as your witness - who will be looking to you to pay their expenses.
It seems from what I read on the goverment website that SCC is simple enough to use and cost of making the claim is £35 for that amount. Its not apparently obvious that there would be any other costs.Subject to the above proviso you are also able to prove that 2 keys were sent with the car.
Whilst you are understandably upset by the damage & the attitude of the company I can't see further discussion with them is going to achieve anything constructive.
I would suggest you pay the £250, get the spare key & then send an invoice for the cost of the wheel refurb. When they ignore that you can send a letter before action.
Bear in mind that if you do finish up going to court they will insist that the matter is heard at their local court & you will need to consider whether it's worth your time & travel costs plus those of the dealer - as your witness - who will be looking to you to pay their expenses.
Edited by paintman on Tuesday 10th October 09:32
With regards to the payment of £250 I'm inclined just to pay it with a note that its paid under protest and send them an invoice for a replacement key cost and wheel refurb as its suggested. If they do not respond within 14 days I would then submit the SCC case and guidelines say that if I'm suing the company (which I am in this case) then hearing should it come to it takes place at my local court.
I'm not sure dealer would be prepared to travel to the hearing but even if he doesn't - its always going to be my word against the one of the car transported with me backing up my claims with txt messages they have sent me which state
"they will send the key when when I pay £250"
"wheel damage is between myself and their insurer"
both of which to me are admission of guilt but then again I am impartial.
Other thing I just reminded myself about is that I haven't signed the paperwork presented to me upon delivery of the car so they have nothing to show that I have signed the delivery over as complete. Not that it changes my view but I think perhaps they would have trouble proving delivery was considered complete if I didn't pay £250.....
Oh what a mess....
assuming they do sue me to small claims court, if the court finds in their favour then do I simply pay and counter sue for at this point? How does this appear then in my financial history? i.e. has to be declared etc?
Can they offload the debt to any debt collection agencies without court order?
My worry is if I decide to leave it and they pursue through court
a) I'll have to pay more than £250 and will have to then prove my case against them
b) it causes me hassle with work as I work in financial services and need to have clear history.
Can they offload the debt to any debt collection agencies without court order?
My worry is if I decide to leave it and they pursue through court
a) I'll have to pay more than £250 and will have to then prove my case against them
b) it causes me hassle with work as I work in financial services and need to have clear history.
_dobbo_ said:
If I've missed this then apologies - but have you had absolute confirmation that the dealer sent both keys?
If so, then your priority has to be getting the key back.
I'd pay the £250 in order to get the key back, then give them the opportunity to pay for the wheel refurb. If they refuse, then small claims is an option if the cost merits the effort, and you feel you can prove that they did the damage (i.e. some evidence other than you saw it happen).
Do you have it in writing that they will return the key if you pay the bill? Because you probably also need to be thinking about the possibility they have lost the key...
Dealer told me he has handed both keys over (he's a reputable person and I have no reason not to believe him) and they confirmed in txt message they will send the key after I pay them however I have asked for a photo of the key to be send to me first and haven't received it which makes me suspicious whether they still have it or they lost it or chucked to the bin in anger (I would expect it going by the reaction I got from the driver when he called me and started swearing at me).If so, then your priority has to be getting the key back.
I'd pay the £250 in order to get the key back, then give them the opportunity to pay for the wheel refurb. If they refuse, then small claims is an option if the cost merits the effort, and you feel you can prove that they did the damage (i.e. some evidence other than you saw it happen).
Do you have it in writing that they will return the key if you pay the bill? Because you probably also need to be thinking about the possibility they have lost the key...
Basically I haven't paid them yet as based on their conduct to date I do not trust them to send me back the key.
There is no paper work. Contract was agreed through Shiply. Thats the whole blurb on the terms and conditions.
By accepting our quote you are agreeing to the following
(Please do not add other items after quote)
2- At the moment quote is given, there are not fixed dates or times for loading and unloading
(Please do not try arrange on our behalf)
3- This quote is for vehicle to be transported as EMPTY BACK LOAD at our availability. WE will arrange collection and delivery with both parties after booking. All jobs will be completed within 5 working days after quote acceptance . We will ignore any fixed dates on listing.
4- Payments must be done before or by the time vehicle is delivered. Bank transference's must be cleared before the vehicle is delivered.
______________________________
We should be able to collect your vehicle most days of the week as we always have trucks collecting and delivering around the country everyday. Get in touch with us with your intentions before accepting quote if you have a deadline for the vehicle to be picked up and delivered, so we're sure we will be able to meet your requirements. We normally deliver next day but you will be advised when to expect the vehicle before it is picked up. Your vehicle will be TRANSPORTED by professional drivers (2 drivers per truck).We operate two 3.5T trucks so we can deliver to your door even if access is not the best, we also operate a 5.5T for all those 4x4 and vans that need to be moved, and also a 12T truck to move machinery and tractors etc, all our trucks are under under 3 years of age and are equipped with pneumatic suspension for lower vehicles, jump starter for those vehicles that have a flat battery..so your vehicle will be safely and legally carried. For your peace of mind, we have 100k motor trader insurance cover ( only insurance that covers a vehicle being transported for hire&reward). We also have operators license how the law requires. The sooner you accept quote the sooner we will be in touch with you to arrange collection and delivery and the sooner your vehicle will be transported. If you choose us, you will not be disappointed. Many thanks
There was a delivery note on which I made a note that alloy wheel was damaged during parking but I didn't sign it and driver didn't give it back to me.
Upon collection I just had txt from the driver that he collected the car and photo of minor scratches on the bottom of the bumper. No report of any other damage (as there was none!)
- ***************************************
By accepting our quote you are agreeing to the following
- TERMS&CONDITIONS*
(Please do not add other items after quote)
2- At the moment quote is given, there are not fixed dates or times for loading and unloading
(Please do not try arrange on our behalf)
3- This quote is for vehicle to be transported as EMPTY BACK LOAD at our availability. WE will arrange collection and delivery with both parties after booking. All jobs will be completed within 5 working days after quote acceptance . We will ignore any fixed dates on listing.
4- Payments must be done before or by the time vehicle is delivered. Bank transference's must be cleared before the vehicle is delivered.
______________________________
We should be able to collect your vehicle most days of the week as we always have trucks collecting and delivering around the country everyday. Get in touch with us with your intentions before accepting quote if you have a deadline for the vehicle to be picked up and delivered, so we're sure we will be able to meet your requirements. We normally deliver next day but you will be advised when to expect the vehicle before it is picked up. Your vehicle will be TRANSPORTED by professional drivers (2 drivers per truck).We operate two 3.5T trucks so we can deliver to your door even if access is not the best, we also operate a 5.5T for all those 4x4 and vans that need to be moved, and also a 12T truck to move machinery and tractors etc, all our trucks are under under 3 years of age and are equipped with pneumatic suspension for lower vehicles, jump starter for those vehicles that have a flat battery..so your vehicle will be safely and legally carried. For your peace of mind, we have 100k motor trader insurance cover ( only insurance that covers a vehicle being transported for hire&reward). We also have operators license how the law requires. The sooner you accept quote the sooner we will be in touch with you to arrange collection and delivery and the sooner your vehicle will be transported. If you choose us, you will not be disappointed. Many thanks
- ***************************************
There was a delivery note on which I made a note that alloy wheel was damaged during parking but I didn't sign it and driver didn't give it back to me.
Upon collection I just had txt from the driver that he collected the car and photo of minor scratches on the bottom of the bumper. No report of any other damage (as there was none!)
they deliver cars up and down all the time I was led to believe (before things went sour) so I did offer as well that one of the drivers drops off the key at my house at some point in future when they're up in Edinburgh next and I can pay cash - no acknowledgement whatsoever from the owner.
rallycross said:
You used Shipley - exactly what sort of service do you really expect to get from a guy loading your car on the back of a truck for a bargain price?
£250 from London to Edinburgh is cheap as chips so you can't realistically expect a gold standard service when you pay low prices on Shipley - does this not occur to you?
Use the money you saved on your cheap delivery to get your wheel refurbished at your local alloy wheel specialist (£40 to £90).
The truck driver kept the spare key when he realised you were likely to be a problem customer - pay them the money and you will get your key back ( or you might not but that's the problem using someone like this).
250 was a balance to pay over what I have already paid as a deposit. I didn't really have any way of telling this isn't professional outfit. They have 1400+ positive opinions and only handful of negative ones. I guess you can really tell how good a company is not by how well job goes if there's no issues but how they deal with it when issues arise. Clearly in this case its completely shambolic.£250 from London to Edinburgh is cheap as chips so you can't realistically expect a gold standard service when you pay low prices on Shipley - does this not occur to you?
Use the money you saved on your cheap delivery to get your wheel refurbished at your local alloy wheel specialist (£40 to £90).
The truck driver kept the spare key when he realised you were likely to be a problem customer - pay them the money and you will get your key back ( or you might not but that's the problem using someone like this).
Calling me a problem customer is a bit unfair, don't you think? I'm a "problem customer" because the driver damaged my car and was a complete t*t about it?
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