Separated Parents Question
Discussion
I'm hoping this is ok to post in here and would appreciate advice from anyone with experience of this situation.
So, my ex and I have a 4 year old daughter. Everything has been civil in the main part, I pay child support arranged between us which goes out by direct debit without fail. Unfortunately my ex chose to move back to her home town with our daughter so moved 130 miles away from where we lived as a couple.
Everything has gone surprisingly well, with me picking up my daughter every other weekend and her mum collecting from me, I paid her fuel cost in addition to child support. Then I'm asked if we can change that arrangement and meet halfway on both days and I agree. It's not ideal but I'm not going to be difficult for the sake of it.
In the mean time my ex has moved into her partners place with my daughter (albeit not admitting as such) and my partner and I have recently had a baby.
Cue things becoming more and more tricky and something I strongly suspect is that my ex aiming for me to start picking up and dropping off each time. Just noticing that she has me doing longer and longer runs, where I've picked up the whole way, then met midway the following day etc.
So here's my question, finally! Is there any obligation on my ex's part to do the driving she does to enable my daughter to spend time with me? If it went to court (not my intention at all) would there ever be a ruling that would say she had to do half the driving as well? Would our home circumstances be considered at all, such as my other child, work etc. along with hers?
So, my ex and I have a 4 year old daughter. Everything has been civil in the main part, I pay child support arranged between us which goes out by direct debit without fail. Unfortunately my ex chose to move back to her home town with our daughter so moved 130 miles away from where we lived as a couple.
Everything has gone surprisingly well, with me picking up my daughter every other weekend and her mum collecting from me, I paid her fuel cost in addition to child support. Then I'm asked if we can change that arrangement and meet halfway on both days and I agree. It's not ideal but I'm not going to be difficult for the sake of it.
In the mean time my ex has moved into her partners place with my daughter (albeit not admitting as such) and my partner and I have recently had a baby.
Cue things becoming more and more tricky and something I strongly suspect is that my ex aiming for me to start picking up and dropping off each time. Just noticing that she has me doing longer and longer runs, where I've picked up the whole way, then met midway the following day etc.
So here's my question, finally! Is there any obligation on my ex's part to do the driving she does to enable my daughter to spend time with me? If it went to court (not my intention at all) would there ever be a ruling that would say she had to do half the driving as well? Would our home circumstances be considered at all, such as my other child, work etc. along with hers?
To be fair I'm not looking to reduce any money that her mother receives, I'm used to paying that out and it's piece of mind for me knowing that my daughter has a roof over her head (it pays my ex's monthly mortgage payments). I don't know what the situation would be with her effectively moving in with her partner but she has another house that's partly in her name and I assume bills as well. From what I understand due to that she'd not be considered as living with her partner as she's got another house she's running.
She is extremely cagey about telling me that they live with him though so I don't know if she has a worry it could upset either what I give her or what benefits she may claim. Either way, I'm not out to change that as that's her prerogative. I'm also aware I can reduce payments due the birth of my second child but again, I don't need to do that so I won't do it for the sake of it.
I was just intrigued as to whether where was any obligation on her part with regards to travel and it sounds like there isn't. Although as stated in one respect I have had that fairly easy, there are other sides to the situation which haven't been such as any additional time, holidays and keeping me in the dark about important things.
From my side I don't understand where the difficulty has come from as it was fine for a long time but that's not relevant here.
Thanks for the advice so far.
She is extremely cagey about telling me that they live with him though so I don't know if she has a worry it could upset either what I give her or what benefits she may claim. Either way, I'm not out to change that as that's her prerogative. I'm also aware I can reduce payments due the birth of my second child but again, I don't need to do that so I won't do it for the sake of it.
I was just intrigued as to whether where was any obligation on her part with regards to travel and it sounds like there isn't. Although as stated in one respect I have had that fairly easy, there are other sides to the situation which haven't been such as any additional time, holidays and keeping me in the dark about important things.
From my side I don't understand where the difficulty has come from as it was fine for a long time but that's not relevant here.
Thanks for the advice so far.
theguvernor15 said:
OP i've done the whole court thing, i strongly advise against it (it's expensive & stressful)
However, my childs mum wouldn't play ball, so every penny was worth it!
As has been said, the court can order anything.
If you can afford to pay her the extra then by all means do it, court will cost more (probably).
You may find she's being cagey as she's claiming some form of benefits or something along those lines, or (i don't want to put ideas in your head), but there maybe another reason, (her new partner may have a criminal history or something along those lines).
OR there is the entirely innocent reason of she just doesn't want you knowing that much about them and cant be arsed to meet you half way!
I must admit court would be the absolutely last thing I would want to go for. As you say expensive and a huge cause of stress, I'm sorry to hear that was your only route. However, my childs mum wouldn't play ball, so every penny was worth it!
As has been said, the court can order anything.
If you can afford to pay her the extra then by all means do it, court will cost more (probably).
You may find she's being cagey as she's claiming some form of benefits or something along those lines, or (i don't want to put ideas in your head), but there maybe another reason, (her new partner may have a criminal history or something along those lines).
OR there is the entirely innocent reason of she just doesn't want you knowing that much about them and cant be arsed to meet you half way!
I don't have an issue with regards to paying my ex for the support for my little girl. In a strange way it makes me feel that tiny bit better that I can at least make sure she has the things she needs considering I can't see her as much as I'd like.
I had thought the exact same thing about the whole benefits situation. I don't know what she claims, it's entirely up to her and if she's doing it fraudulently I'm not out to grass her up. Thing is she's got my daughter into a school that's five minutes walk from his house, I never pick up from her actual house (when I used to) and any suggestion of me picking up from his even though it's ten miles further on gets refused quite quickly. Take Christmas for example, she made it difficult so I said I'd do both journeys, the moment I mentioned collecting from her partners place it was meeting half way.
Bizarrely he was actually always alright. Conversations were once sided with me asking how he was etc, but normal enough that it didn't phase me. Now the guy pretty much ignores me and has been just plain rude when I took my daughter to her first day of school, went to her nativity play etc.
Mrr T said:
I have a couple of friends who have been though this recently.
One of them saw his ex and children move a 4 hour car journey (8 hours round trip) away. He ended up doing this for every visit.
Courts can order anything. The other friend had to go to court because his ex (partner not wife) was being very difficult. He got the access he needed and she has to pick up from his (its only 20 minutes) but the bill was £15k plus.
That is an absolute killer for your friend. I'm slightly staggered that, that can be seen as fair at all but I suppose I'm seeing it from a fathers perspective. I suppose I just see it as important for the child that they see both sides of their family and that there's an obligation for both parents to enable that. I admire your friend for managing an 8 hour round trip as that's double the distance I would have to go. One of them saw his ex and children move a 4 hour car journey (8 hours round trip) away. He ended up doing this for every visit.
Courts can order anything. The other friend had to go to court because his ex (partner not wife) was being very difficult. He got the access he needed and she has to pick up from his (its only 20 minutes) but the bill was £15k plus.
The one thing my ex doesn't factor in when she's being difficult is that I rarely push for more time. It's not that I don't want it but she makes it so awkward, like I have to justify why I want my daughter to come and stay. Also there are things I try my best to accommodate for example keeping my daughter awake in the car. Sounds daft but if she nods off on the way home, she's up until midnight which is no good for anyone. So my mum usually comes along to keep her awake. The times we pick up and drop off are all detemined by her mum etc. I don't feel the need or see the point in arguing these things.
I just don't understand the need to make things difficult when originally we got on as parents just fine. Does make me wonder what outside influences get put on here to make her change significantly.
ScoobyChris said:
Can sympathise OP - my daughter lives 130 miles away and over the years I’ve asked several times for the travelling to be shared but each time it falls on deaf ears so I just suck it up. Still, she’s almost at the age where she can travel in the train on her own which will be an adventure for her and mean I don’t have to get up at 6am on a weekend 
Chris
Thanks Chris, sounds like a very similar to my situation albeit you've been doing a lot more driving. Fair play to you mate as there's so many dads that don't bother when their kids are 20 minutes away let alone that. Chris
I used to do the early start. On the M25 at 5.30am on a Saturday then home by 10.30am! Worked quite well for the first few years.
Well today I received the message I'd been dreading.
After stating that the 7k a year that my ex does in picking up and dropping off (actually less than that in reality) has added significant/unaffordable wear and tear on her vehicle she will no long be meeting me half way for the weekends I have my daughter. She also told me that there had been a number of weeks where I had failed to give her the additional fuel costs although this was genuinely a mistake on my part. One I would have rectified if I'd been told.
This leaves me in a real tricky situation. I cannot bring myself to see my daughter less, two weeks between visits is awful as it is. I'm just worried about the driving which may sound stupid on a car forum.
I'm just wary of managing a 65 hours week (including commuting), having a new born child so sleep is reduced to then throw in a 5.30am drive on the Saturday, followed by the same round trip Sunday evening. A total of ten hours driving does is not something I'm envying nor am I feeling confident about doing safely. Not that I suspect that is a contributing factor in terms of legal considerations.
Pretty gutted.
After stating that the 7k a year that my ex does in picking up and dropping off (actually less than that in reality) has added significant/unaffordable wear and tear on her vehicle she will no long be meeting me half way for the weekends I have my daughter. She also told me that there had been a number of weeks where I had failed to give her the additional fuel costs although this was genuinely a mistake on my part. One I would have rectified if I'd been told.
This leaves me in a real tricky situation. I cannot bring myself to see my daughter less, two weeks between visits is awful as it is. I'm just worried about the driving which may sound stupid on a car forum.
I'm just wary of managing a 65 hours week (including commuting), having a new born child so sleep is reduced to then throw in a 5.30am drive on the Saturday, followed by the same round trip Sunday evening. A total of ten hours driving does is not something I'm envying nor am I feeling confident about doing safely. Not that I suspect that is a contributing factor in terms of legal considerations.
Pretty gutted.
Thanks again for all the constructive replies.
In terms of work, unfortunately I don't have a lot of choice. I commute into central London for work and locally (Surrey) I would probably take a £10k pay drop. My other half is on maternity leave at the moment and I pay the mortgage, child maintenance to my ex and half of our other living costs along with other bills so I'm not in a position to lose that amount.
I will speak to my manager at work, both of us are able to work from home to an extent and he has mentioned this before. If so then I will aim to pick up my daughter on a Friday evening to take her back on the Sunday.
I have a feeling that this will not play out well with my ex and she will start to dig her heels in over it. One, I think this will just be because it's not how she'll want it and two, it could affect the amount she receives monthly. It's worked out by days per week which would go from two nights a month to equivalent of one a week.
Also, I have been in touch with a friend who's wife is having real issues with her ex. She posed the question to her solicitor about moving and what the travel arrangements would likely be. She said that "the norm" is that travel is considered a joint responsibility. Of course that's not definitive but as I strongly suspect I will start having difficulty with access I have to collate as much info as I can in case things hit the fan.
In terms of work, unfortunately I don't have a lot of choice. I commute into central London for work and locally (Surrey) I would probably take a £10k pay drop. My other half is on maternity leave at the moment and I pay the mortgage, child maintenance to my ex and half of our other living costs along with other bills so I'm not in a position to lose that amount.
I will speak to my manager at work, both of us are able to work from home to an extent and he has mentioned this before. If so then I will aim to pick up my daughter on a Friday evening to take her back on the Sunday.
I have a feeling that this will not play out well with my ex and she will start to dig her heels in over it. One, I think this will just be because it's not how she'll want it and two, it could affect the amount she receives monthly. It's worked out by days per week which would go from two nights a month to equivalent of one a week.
Also, I have been in touch with a friend who's wife is having real issues with her ex. She posed the question to her solicitor about moving and what the travel arrangements would likely be. She said that "the norm" is that travel is considered a joint responsibility. Of course that's not definitive but as I strongly suspect I will start having difficulty with access I have to collate as much info as I can in case things hit the fan.
Thanks mate, another helpful post and thank you. It's good to hear from people that have been through similar.
I've managed to work out a good set up. Spoken to my boss who's a family man and very understanding. I work in Central London so the commute is 90 minutes. We have an office 20 minutes from me and 10 minutes from the motorway so one Friday a month I can work from there and head off at 4pm. The other Friday I can work from home and again head off at 4pm.
So from this Friday I'll be picking up my little girl on a Friday evening. This works fairly well as she can sleep on the way home in the car and I can put her to bed. She then gets two nights and a proper day with me on the Saturday, plus I'm not up at 5am.
I did get in touch with the CSA as well, just to see what the situation was regarding travel and costs etc. This is something they take into account. I also spoke with a family solicitor as having worked in the legal industry I have some close friends who can put me in touch. Received some very good advice on that.
Essentially there's no clear cut answer to the question about sharing driving. There are many factors that contribute. For example my ex's car being reasonable condition, who moved away etc.
That said, if it went down that legal route I would by default be entitled to more holiday access as in they would be shared. Something she has always argued, the same would go for holidays as well. In terms of the drive, by emphasising how tiring it is it could go a different way and be judged that actually every other weekend is too much for my daughter and be extended to three weeks.
Either way a very very tricky one and unless the ex become more and more difficult with other things, I'm not sure I can justify a legal situation for the sake of driving but for other things it may be necessary.
Watch this space. In the mean time, I've downloaded a new audio book for the drive so watch this space.
I've managed to work out a good set up. Spoken to my boss who's a family man and very understanding. I work in Central London so the commute is 90 minutes. We have an office 20 minutes from me and 10 minutes from the motorway so one Friday a month I can work from there and head off at 4pm. The other Friday I can work from home and again head off at 4pm.
So from this Friday I'll be picking up my little girl on a Friday evening. This works fairly well as she can sleep on the way home in the car and I can put her to bed. She then gets two nights and a proper day with me on the Saturday, plus I'm not up at 5am.
I did get in touch with the CSA as well, just to see what the situation was regarding travel and costs etc. This is something they take into account. I also spoke with a family solicitor as having worked in the legal industry I have some close friends who can put me in touch. Received some very good advice on that.
Essentially there's no clear cut answer to the question about sharing driving. There are many factors that contribute. For example my ex's car being reasonable condition, who moved away etc.
That said, if it went down that legal route I would by default be entitled to more holiday access as in they would be shared. Something she has always argued, the same would go for holidays as well. In terms of the drive, by emphasising how tiring it is it could go a different way and be judged that actually every other weekend is too much for my daughter and be extended to three weeks.
Either way a very very tricky one and unless the ex become more and more difficult with other things, I'm not sure I can justify a legal situation for the sake of driving but for other things it may be necessary.
Watch this space. In the mean time, I've downloaded a new audio book for the drive so watch this space.
I keep saying thank you but this thread has genuinely been a help.
I have my head around the fact that I will be doing a lot of driving, to be fair the mileage and costs is not the concern but the time. Fortunately with work being decent I can actually have more time with my eldest daughter and she gets a bit more quality time at my place, with her own bedroom etc.
I have informed my ex that there will be a variation in maintenance due to the mileage and my 2nd child being born. It's actually fairly minimal and usually I'm not as pedantic but when I get moaned at that the money I gave for fuel wasn't enough as it cost her another £9 on that given weekend, it brings out my inner pedant. How someone only gets 40mpg from a 1.5dci when I manage 47mpg from a 3.2 diesel I don't know either.............aaaanyway! haha
Lets see how things pan out though, iPad will be loaded with Disney movies, new audio book downloaded and ready to go (World War Z fyi) so we'll be ok.
Also, I think a dad is so important to a daughter and as much as she has a father figure in the form of my ex's partner, knowing her real dad wants to see her and spend time with her I hope will make a positive impact.
I have my head around the fact that I will be doing a lot of driving, to be fair the mileage and costs is not the concern but the time. Fortunately with work being decent I can actually have more time with my eldest daughter and she gets a bit more quality time at my place, with her own bedroom etc.
I have informed my ex that there will be a variation in maintenance due to the mileage and my 2nd child being born. It's actually fairly minimal and usually I'm not as pedantic but when I get moaned at that the money I gave for fuel wasn't enough as it cost her another £9 on that given weekend, it brings out my inner pedant. How someone only gets 40mpg from a 1.5dci when I manage 47mpg from a 3.2 diesel I don't know either.............aaaanyway! haha
Lets see how things pan out though, iPad will be loaded with Disney movies, new audio book downloaded and ready to go (World War Z fyi) so we'll be ok.
solo2 said:
It's great to see Dad's wanting to be part of their kids lives. My kids have not seen their Dad for years despite trying to instigate contact in the past, they have given up now. He is simply not interested in his first family.
I just can not imagine feeling that way and not wanting to make the effort. It kills me not seeing my little girl and even after 4 years I'm saddened every time I say goodbye. How dads can be round the corner from their children and not be fussed staggers me. All the more frustrating for me as a father who can't see one of his children as much as he would want to. Also, I think a dad is so important to a daughter and as much as she has a father figure in the form of my ex's partner, knowing her real dad wants to see her and spend time with her I hope will make a positive impact.
Well, did my first weekend of driving albeit Friday I was met part of the way due to not leaving work earlier. As it happens it wasn't such a bad drive and in a way it's quite nice not having to rely on another person who may make things awkward.
Also, sat at 65mph the entire way mostly on cruise control, indicated 50mpg and cost me £32 which for 260 miles really isn't bad at all. Even more so for an old 3.2 diesel.
Having my little girl for two nights was good too, she managed to stay awake for the journey home and we had a nice day out on the Saturday as we had a whole day together.
Also, sat at 65mph the entire way mostly on cruise control, indicated 50mpg and cost me £32 which for 260 miles really isn't bad at all. Even more so for an old 3.2 diesel.
Having my little girl for two nights was good too, she managed to stay awake for the journey home and we had a nice day out on the Saturday as we had a whole day together.
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