Parking fine assistance (yay!)
Discussion
Hi Guys
Parking fine received - was at customer site in Birmingham (Harvester in Sutton Coldfield managed by EuroCarParks)
Paid for 2hr parking on machine
Was 2hr30 (my mistake)
Car is registered and owned by my Mrs so letter was written to her, but I was driver as I use it.
They are charging £50 rising to £85 if not paid
My mistake for slipping over by 30 minutes. Don't think it's fair to pay the £85 fine for the sake of an extra 30 minutes.
Any assistance? I am going through a lot of s
te at the moment and happily admit I would like some major assistance rather than being told to "go look on pepipoo" as I don't want to spend hours and hours trying to fight it.
Parking fine received - was at customer site in Birmingham (Harvester in Sutton Coldfield managed by EuroCarParks)
Paid for 2hr parking on machine
Was 2hr30 (my mistake)
Car is registered and owned by my Mrs so letter was written to her, but I was driver as I use it.
They are charging £50 rising to £85 if not paid
My mistake for slipping over by 30 minutes. Don't think it's fair to pay the £85 fine for the sake of an extra 30 minutes.
Any assistance? I am going through a lot of s
te at the moment and happily admit I would like some major assistance rather than being told to "go look on pepipoo" as I don't want to spend hours and hours trying to fight it. Edited by xjay1337 on Thursday 13th June 12:02
S11Steve said:
Harvester is part of the Mitchells & Butlers chain who appointed ECP last year to "manage" their parking across most of the 2000 ish sites.
The easiest route is to speak to the pub manager - they can, and frequently do cancel tickets for their customers.
Slight issue there - I wasn't a customer of the pub. I went to an office across the road. Simply paid for the parking!The easiest route is to speak to the pub manager - they can, and frequently do cancel tickets for their customers.
kowalski655 said:
If not then your missus can reply saying she was not the driver so not liable (exception-see below)
Don't name the driver, simply say "the driver did this", no need to say your name or "my husband"
Exception is if Notice to Keeper is POFA compliant, which would be unusual even now after 7 years practice
Even then there are arguments against the charge (NOT a fine)S11Steve us the expert here but try the manger first,after all, the longer you're in a place,the more money you spend
Can do that, is there a template letter about? Don't name the driver, simply say "the driver did this", no need to say your name or "my husband"
Exception is if Notice to Keeper is POFA compliant, which would be unusual even now after 7 years practice
Even then there are arguments against the charge (NOT a fine)S11Steve us the expert here but try the manger first,after all, the longer you're in a place,the more money you spend
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I was waiting for the sanctimonious post to come..Unfortunately this over ran, a mistake - genuinely didn't expect to go anywhere near the 2 hours let alone over stay by 30 minutes to configure a couple of phones - however there were some technical problems, In the heat of the moment trying to resolve time was lost track of.
I don't think £50 is fair fine for exceeding the permitted time fo 2 hours, especially from a PPC - I've had a couple of tickets before, one from a council, failure to pay and display (genuine mistake, didn't realise, £30, fair enough, I paid no questions).
The other, from an office in Liverpool. Obvious scam , typical PPC crap, my work just said don't waste time arguing it and we just billed it to the customer.
As was said above if the fine was more reasonable I would take it on the chin. Plus my general hatred towards PPCs in general means if I can avoid having to give the b
ds any money then I will. Butter Face said:
Honestly mate, if you're going through other stuff that should take priority, just pay the £50, get it fked off and get on with life.
It's honestly what I would do if I had other st to worry about, don't let your principles cause you more headaches than it's actually worth IMO.
I'm sure it's lost on the many company directors on this page, but one of those issues is an upcoming trip to SA that I've failed to budget for, so the £50 would be much better put in the fund for that rather than causing me even more stress and more arguments with the Mrs. ked off and get on with life.It's honestly what I would do if I had other s
t to worry about, don't let your principles cause you more headaches than it's actually worth IMO.If I have to, then I will just pay the £50 but if I can avoid it for the sake for a few hours and a couple of E-mails then job done.
Anyway a copy of the letter here is here if anyone is interested. Someone mentioned about a paragraph 9 (2) (e) not being present but I'm none the wiser.
Stay in Bed Instead said:
Yes you were the one that stole 30 mins parking without payment.
What's the view like from way up there? I'm asking for assistance , if you're just wanting to post to increase your post count without actually helping the situation then maybe just close the page and go to another thread.
Ticket was bought at 12:35 as I got a bit confused as to where I was walking and sent a couple of E-mails in the car.
As I said a genuine mistake to losing track of time. Didn't even realise I was more than 2 hours, wasn't on my mind until the letter came through the door.
£50 may not be a lot to you. It is to some others.
Stay in Bed Instead said:
What makes you think you deserve assistance?
Are alternative views not permitted in your world?
What steps did you take to pay the balance parking charge when you realised you had accidentally over stayed?
If you don't feel I am deserving of assistance then we have no further need to engage in discussion in this thread..Are alternative views not permitted in your world?
What steps did you take to pay the balance parking charge when you realised you had accidentally over stayed?
As I said a genuine mistake to losing track of time. Didn't even realise I was more than 2 hours, wasn't on my mind until the letter came through the door.
£50 may not be a lot to you. It is to some others.
Edited by xjay1337 on Friday 14th June 09:15
Thanks, I guess. I've been called worse :-)
Parking was paid for, and in the heat of the moment forget the time. Honest mistake.
If parking had not been paid for, then fair enough.
If car park was full, then fair enough, if was empty. If it was a reasonable charge then fair enough. (as I said I paid £30 before without question).
Knob or not if a fine can be avoided then I would much rather donate some money to the air ambulance than into the pockets of the PPC if can be avoided.
Parking was paid for, and in the heat of the moment forget the time. Honest mistake.
If parking had not been paid for, then fair enough.
If car park was full, then fair enough, if was empty. If it was a reasonable charge then fair enough. (as I said I paid £30 before without question).
Knob or not if a fine can be avoided then I would much rather donate some money to the air ambulance than into the pockets of the PPC if can be avoided.
silverfoxcc said:
OP
The letter fails POFA by not 'inviting' the RK to name the driver.
A small point BUT is is laid down in law what the letter can and cannot say. And that is one part
YOu wshould get a win at POPLA but if you don't want to have a quick check with pepipoo.com use this template
AND read POFA 2012 it is VERY particular on how the PPC should act. IF they don't then they are fair game to tell them to get stuffed!!
Send this to the PPC as the Registered keeper and DO NOT changed one word
Dear Sirs,
I have just received your Notice to Keeper xxxxx for vehicle VRM xxxx
You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely that you have failed to give the invitation prescribed by 9 (2) (e) of the Act. You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper.
There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.
I do not expect to hear from you again, or your debt collectors, except to confirm that no further action will be taken on this matter and my personal details have been removed from your records.
Yours etc
They will either cancelled or send you a POPLA code where you should win ( pepipoo will confirm). if they do not cancel it will cost them 27.00 to send you the code
Hi silverfox,The letter fails POFA by not 'inviting' the RK to name the driver.
A small point BUT is is laid down in law what the letter can and cannot say. And that is one part
YOu wshould get a win at POPLA but if you don't want to have a quick check with pepipoo.com use this template
AND read POFA 2012 it is VERY particular on how the PPC should act. IF they don't then they are fair game to tell them to get stuffed!!
Send this to the PPC as the Registered keeper and DO NOT changed one word
Dear Sirs,
I have just received your Notice to Keeper xxxxx for vehicle VRM xxxx
You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely that you have failed to give the invitation prescribed by 9 (2) (e) of the Act. You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper.
There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.
I do not expect to hear from you again, or your debt collectors, except to confirm that no further action will be taken on this matter and my personal details have been removed from your records.
Yours etc
They will either cancelled or send you a POPLA code where you should win ( pepipoo will confirm). if they do not cancel it will cost them 27.00 to send you the code
Edited by silverfoxcc on Friday 14th June 09:23
thank you very much for the information this is the sort of help I was looking for
cheers - i will verify on pepipoo as i have a thread on there
super7 said:
I guess the point here being that you were charged £50 for overstaying your ticket!
IF the car park was busy with people paying the parking charge and wandering off to do other things rather than frequenting the pub, you are reducing the amount of space that is available for bonafide customers of the drinking establishment, meaning you could be directly impacting the level of revenue that the pub can make. Bearing in mind the current cost of a visit to a pub/restaurant these days, do you still think it's an unreasonable FINE?
If I was the pub manager and I saw you turn up, park your car, and then naff off to work somewhere else for 2hrs, I'd stick you a ticket the minute it became obvious you were using the pubs car park for purposes other than going into the pub whether you paid for it or not.
You might find the pub has a problem with people like you, hence the charges and the fines......
I believe the parking is free if you use the restaurant, or you pay to park if you don't. The parking is not purely for the patrons of the restaurant. IF the car park was busy with people paying the parking charge and wandering off to do other things rather than frequenting the pub, you are reducing the amount of space that is available for bonafide customers of the drinking establishment, meaning you could be directly impacting the level of revenue that the pub can make. Bearing in mind the current cost of a visit to a pub/restaurant these days, do you still think it's an unreasonable FINE?
If I was the pub manager and I saw you turn up, park your car, and then naff off to work somewhere else for 2hrs, I'd stick you a ticket the minute it became obvious you were using the pubs car park for purposes other than going into the pub whether you paid for it or not.
You might find the pub has a problem with people like you, hence the charges and the fines......
Many people in the area pay to park and then use the shops opposite (so I am told by my site contact).
I honestly understand what you are saying, though.
silverfoxcc said:
OP
The letter fails POFA by not 'inviting' the RK to name the driver.
A small point BUT is is laid down in law what the letter can and cannot say. And that is one part
YOu wshould get a win at POPLA but if you don't want to have a quick check with pepipoo.com use this template
AND read POFA 2012 it is VERY particular on how the PPC should act. IF they don't then they are fair game to tell them to get stuffed!!
Send this to the PPC as the Registered keeper and DO NOT changed one word
Dear Sirs,
I have just received your Notice to Keeper xxxxx for vehicle VRM xxxx
You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely that you have failed to give the invitation prescribed by 9 (2) (e) of the Act. You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper.
There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.
I do not expect to hear from you again, or your debt collectors, except to confirm that no further action will be taken on this matter and my personal details have been removed from your records.
Yours etc
They will either cancelled or send you a POPLA code where you should win ( pepipoo will confirm). if they do not cancel it will cost them 27.00 to send you the code
Hi Silverfox, I checked on pepipoo and one of the helpful people over there said they have given the keeper liability so to be careful what I send.The letter fails POFA by not 'inviting' the RK to name the driver.
A small point BUT is is laid down in law what the letter can and cannot say. And that is one part
YOu wshould get a win at POPLA but if you don't want to have a quick check with pepipoo.com use this template
AND read POFA 2012 it is VERY particular on how the PPC should act. IF they don't then they are fair game to tell them to get stuffed!!
Send this to the PPC as the Registered keeper and DO NOT changed one word
Dear Sirs,
I have just received your Notice to Keeper xxxxx for vehicle VRM xxxx
You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely that you have failed to give the invitation prescribed by 9 (2) (e) of the Act. You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper.
There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.
I do not expect to hear from you again, or your debt collectors, except to confirm that no further action will be taken on this matter and my personal details have been removed from your records.
Yours etc
They will either cancelled or send you a POPLA code where you should win ( pepipoo will confirm). if they do not cancel it will cost them 27.00 to send you the code
Edited by silverfoxcc on Friday 14th June 09:23
I have cut that part out on my draft letter :
What do you think?
"Dear Sirs,
I have just received your Notice to Keeper xxxxx for vehicle VRM xxxx
You have failed to comply with The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, Section 9 (2) (e) of the Act. You have failed to give the invitation prescribed therefore within.
There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.
I do not expect to hear from you again, or your debt collectors, except to confirm that no further action will be taken on this matter and my personal details have been removed from your records.
Yours etc"
silverfoxcc said:
xjay
Just double check on pepipoo that it is all ok as written, poster called ostell is quite good on this.
We don't want to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory
Thanks dude.Just double check on pepipoo that it is all ok as written, poster called ostell is quite good on this.
We don't want to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory
Ostell was commenting on my post - indeed very helpful, he said the modified template should be OK - I sent off the appeal this afternoon
Thank you for your help, I will keep updated!
Chester draws said:
This is where I'm (still) confused, the letter does state that they don't know the drivers name and address, and it does invite the keeper to either pay themselves or to pass the name and address of the driver.
Obviously someone cleverer than me will tell me that it doesn't, but in the meantime I'll continue to make sure that I get back to my car within the time that I've paid for and hopefully I won't have to have all this hassle.
Aren't you perfect. Obviously someone cleverer than me will tell me that it doesn't, but in the meantime I'll continue to make sure that I get back to my car within the time that I've paid for and hopefully I won't have to have all this hassle.
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