Exige Cup 430 v Exige 410
Discussion
Looking over the past couple of months it appears that Cup 430’s are hanging around but 410’s and judging by dealers new Exige Car sales they are selling .
This could be expected as there is a significant price difference new but used the price difference is less, particularly as the Cup is fully covered in Carbon.
Having driven both on road on soft Nitron settings there is little to no difference in road noise, handling etc but on track a Cup should with the extra power, aero, potentially lower weight and with all the carbon , be quicker.
But why are 410’ s selling more than 430’s, as for anyone thinking of doing a few track days a year a Cup would be top and for just road use a Cup shouldn’t lose much to a 410
This could be expected as there is a significant price difference new but used the price difference is less, particularly as the Cup is fully covered in Carbon.
Having driven both on road on soft Nitron settings there is little to no difference in road noise, handling etc but on track a Cup should with the extra power, aero, potentially lower weight and with all the carbon , be quicker.
But why are 410’ s selling more than 430’s, as for anyone thinking of doing a few track days a year a Cup would be top and for just road use a Cup shouldn’t lose much to a 410
ecain63 said:
I've heard rumours that the 410 and 430 have the same power output, despite the badge. Same as the Evora did. Other than the extra few carbon bits, front arches with gills and a different wing I can't see what else justifies the price jump. Surely you could just adjust the 410 suspension settings to the same as the 430 to achieve the same handling characteristics??
The 410 is based on the 380 Cup chassis and I'd bet if someone here with a 430 was to check their rear subframe they'd see a 380 Cup stamp too.
Both amazing cars. I took my 410 to Thruxton on Monday and it's got so much potential
No doubt the 410 sport is the sweet spot in the range but :The 410 is based on the 380 Cup chassis and I'd bet if someone here with a 430 was to check their rear subframe they'd see a 380 Cup stamp too.
Both amazing cars. I took my 410 to Thruxton on Monday and it's got so much potential
Power outputs are certainly at least 20hp difference as the Cup feels torquier and will out drag a 410 comfortably although some of this could be down to the weight difference.
A Cup will be lighter than a 410 sport unless every Carbon option is included and has the optional titanium exhaust ( not many would have this ) in which case it would be closer. Would also add over £10k to the price
The Cup comes with a roll over hoop and has 50% more down force. The 430 Cup was also 1.5 secs quicker round Hethel .
I’m not sure though if the Cup has slightly stiffer Nitron springs also
ecain63 said:
Where's the Hethel laptimes for the 410 posted? So far I've not seen any and only heard a rumour that they won't post it because it wasn't slower than the 430.
Anyway, for the purposes of science it'd be great to get some 410 and 430 models at a dyno day to see them back to back..
I’ve not seen dyno of a 410 but back to back the 430 is quicker , no doubt about that and particularly more so on track Anyway, for the purposes of science it'd be great to get some 410 and 430 models at a dyno day to see them back to back..
With regards to the Hethel times the possible reason that they weren’t publicised wasn’t because the 410 was quicker than a 430 but because it was faster than a 380 Cup. Dealers hadn’t sold their 380 Cup stock and for marketing reasons it just did not help Lotus
[quote=Bispal]
new 50:50 finance deals on plentiful 410's which can be bought for £80k but very few (2 I think) 430's available new & therefore on 50:50 and £105k+. So £25k difference when new and available on 50:50 deal.
Used 430's start around £85k, same as as a high spec 410 but used 430's won't be available on 50:50. Also very little colour / spec choice with new 430 as only 2 available at the moment (new) in green and black. 22 x 430's made / registered in 2018 and only 3 in 2019. For the 410 it was 16 in 2018 and 23 in 2019 so almost 8 times more brand new 410's available on 50:50 deal.
Yep, I imagine this is one of the main reasons , financing and the price differential new
So only 25 430 Cup’s, out there which may make them more desireable in the future.
new 50:50 finance deals on plentiful 410's which can be bought for £80k but very few (2 I think) 430's available new & therefore on 50:50 and £105k+. So £25k difference when new and available on 50:50 deal.
Used 430's start around £85k, same as as a high spec 410 but used 430's won't be available on 50:50. Also very little colour / spec choice with new 430 as only 2 available at the moment (new) in green and black. 22 x 430's made / registered in 2018 and only 3 in 2019. For the 410 it was 16 in 2018 and 23 in 2019 so almost 8 times more brand new 410's available on 50:50 deal.
Yep, I imagine this is one of the main reasons , financing and the price differential new
So only 25 430 Cup’s, out there which may make them more desireable in the future.
Edited by Rocketreid on Friday 4th October 17:00
Baldchap said:
Whilst at Hethel we tracked both a Sport 410 and a Cup 350. Ignoring the power difference, dynamically they were very different indeed.
It almost felt like in the Cup you just jammed a middle finger up at the laws of physics and stopped and turned at speeds where the Sport would have struggled. It was racing car Vs road car.
If it were me buying the Exige for track use, I'd stretch for the Cup if at all possible.
Presumably you meant Cup 430 not 350.It almost felt like in the Cup you just jammed a middle finger up at the laws of physics and stopped and turned at speeds where the Sport would have struggled. It was racing car Vs road car.
If it were me buying the Exige for track use, I'd stretch for the Cup if at all possible.
In any event I fully agree, the Cup 430 is a properly sorted track car with fantastic road manners. All the additions over the 410 add up to a far better track set up with few disadvantages for road use
Munkeyfeet said:
The 410 is selling better as it’s the cheapest route to a chargecooled car with gearbox cooler etc that most want.
The dealers told me the balloon payments make financing cheap on the 410 so they are flying out the showrooms. Hofmanns have bought another two to sell on!
Not so great come resale as they are much more common.
430s are making more like 435/436bhp from what I understand. 410 whilst an amazing car isn’t near that and the same driver in both cars would be quicker in the cup.
I tend to agree , the scarcity of the Cup430 should lead to better residuals than the 410.The dealers told me the balloon payments make financing cheap on the 410 so they are flying out the showrooms. Hofmanns have bought another two to sell on!
Not so great come resale as they are much more common.
430s are making more like 435/436bhp from what I understand. 410 whilst an amazing car isn’t near that and the same driver in both cars would be quicker in the cup.
Interested to hear you think the Cup generates more than 430bhp. It was certainly my impression the 430 was noticeably quicker than a 410 and if it’s generating 25bhp more, and certainly is lighter then it would explain it a bit more
Quags said:
The 410 is such a weapon, I drove the 410 recently at Hethel and was blown away with the speed it can carry.
Beautiful car, very much on my lottery list.
I love the 430, I just can't see, like a lot of Lotus models, the value in the price difference.
As with everything it depends on how much you value the best.Beautiful car, very much on my lottery list.
I love the 430, I just can't see, like a lot of Lotus models, the value in the price difference.
No doubt the 410 is now well priced in comparison to a 350 and the Cup 430, but it lacks many things compared to the Cup in standard form ( carbon and Titanium )
You can of course spec up a 410 and then it becomes much closer price wise but you will still lack the aero, roll over, track springs etc . The Cup will always be more sort after in the future imo
Quags said:
When I was there for my driving day, that one had been smashed up by an instructor, it had started raining etc (insert racing driver excuse here) which is why they had a 410. But I was told that black one was a 350.
I agree about the 430, if I could afford it. But depends on the type of driving, if doing lots of track days then great, but I doubt very much you'd explore the extras on the roads.
Yes but who doesn’t love all of the Cups Carbon and the Titanium Exhaust I agree about the 430, if I could afford it. But depends on the type of driving, if doing lots of track days then great, but I doubt very much you'd explore the extras on the roads.
gareth h said:
These prices are a bit off, I paid £75k for my 410 (1 month old with 400 miles on the clock), you’d probably pick one up now for £70 ish, compared to a £50k 2nd hand 350 which would need £10-11k thrown at it, for the extra £10k I’d rather have the 3 year warranty safety net and I suspect stronger residuals.
Even better is you can get into a year old Cup 430 still with warranty.With all the bells and whistles as standard and now in the low - mid £80,000’s. Much better investment imo as a very rare car and not likely to lose so much money in the future
MarkM3Evoplus said:
Komotec 430 isn't chargecooled like the factory 430. Probably no difference on the road, but chargecooling preferable for track use
There would be a difference !!The Cup 430 is far closer to the Chargecooled Komotec 460 both on and off track . The 460 has greater torque but the Cup is likely to be far lighter and unless significant money has been spent on the 460 to upgrade the brakes , weight and handling it would not be as quick on track. Of course it will depend on the donor Car , Stock Sport 350 1,125kg Stock Cup 430 1,059, a woman’s weight difference !!
Cost for the Komotec 460 upgrade £8,500, Carbon £5,000+ , Titanium Exhaust £5,500, Nitrons £3,000 +, Brakes £2,500 +, Carbon Seats, Harnesses, Roll over hoop £3,500. Minimum £28,000 on top of doner Car .
You can’t just stick a 458 hp engine into a car designed to handle 345 without some of these measures.
Of course you can perhaps cut corners but will it be worth it and also you have to factor in resale values.
Lotus Cup Cars will always hold a premium imo
A V6S was 1,176kg , very lardy !!
Gassing Station | Elise/Exige/Europa/340R | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff