Citroen C4 Grand Picasso
Discussion
I'm considering one of these, probably the 2.0 diesel EGS in Exclusive trim. It would be great to hear any opinions and/or real-world ownership stories. Particularly any info on what starts to wrong as the age and mileage build up, ownership costs, common faults etc.
I'm looking for something that can transport large amounts of stuff long distances, but which has a bit of style and panache. I've looked at lots of MPVs and estate cars, and keep coming back to the Citroen because it looks so good.
The Peugeot 5008 is substantially the same car, but it's pricier and the design lacks IMHO the Gallic flair of the Citroen. The Renault Grand Scenic is more expensive and now only available with weedy engines, plus I don't like the looks of the facelifted version. The Grand Espace is no longer available. The Ford S-Max is nice, but too expensive when you factor in the options. The Vauxhall Zafira Tourer is a possibility but I didn't like the interior design much.
I had a good poke around at my local Citroen dealer and was generally impressed. It does seem well thought out and generally fit for purpose. The dashboard is digital and centrally mounted like my old Grand Espace. The general quality does not feel up to that of the Espace but it will probably do. The panoramic sunroof is pretty cool. There is ample boot space with rear seats down. Parts prices seem reasonable. The EGS takes a bit of getting used to (it seems that it's an automated manual rather than an auto, so no creep on idle) but I can live with it.
I'm generally not a fan of diesel, but it seems that very few petrol Picassos get sold, and so I figure there is probably more expertise out there with the diesels. Also, I've heard bad things about the 1.6 turbo petrol engine with cars requiring new engines under warranty.
Normally I would never buy new, but there are not many Exclusives in the used market, and it seems that a new one can be had with a massive discount off RRP, which puts it into "nearly new" territory price wise anyway.
I keep being told there is an all-new one out this year but I don't know if that's true. I think it just got facelifted for 2012 anyway.
Any thoughts welcomed
I'm looking for something that can transport large amounts of stuff long distances, but which has a bit of style and panache. I've looked at lots of MPVs and estate cars, and keep coming back to the Citroen because it looks so good.
The Peugeot 5008 is substantially the same car, but it's pricier and the design lacks IMHO the Gallic flair of the Citroen. The Renault Grand Scenic is more expensive and now only available with weedy engines, plus I don't like the looks of the facelifted version. The Grand Espace is no longer available. The Ford S-Max is nice, but too expensive when you factor in the options. The Vauxhall Zafira Tourer is a possibility but I didn't like the interior design much.
I had a good poke around at my local Citroen dealer and was generally impressed. It does seem well thought out and generally fit for purpose. The dashboard is digital and centrally mounted like my old Grand Espace. The general quality does not feel up to that of the Espace but it will probably do. The panoramic sunroof is pretty cool. There is ample boot space with rear seats down. Parts prices seem reasonable. The EGS takes a bit of getting used to (it seems that it's an automated manual rather than an auto, so no creep on idle) but I can live with it.
I'm generally not a fan of diesel, but it seems that very few petrol Picassos get sold, and so I figure there is probably more expertise out there with the diesels. Also, I've heard bad things about the 1.6 turbo petrol engine with cars requiring new engines under warranty.
Normally I would never buy new, but there are not many Exclusives in the used market, and it seems that a new one can be had with a massive discount off RRP, which puts it into "nearly new" territory price wise anyway.
I keep being told there is an all-new one out this year but I don't know if that's true. I think it just got facelifted for 2012 anyway.
Any thoughts welcomed
I went out for a drive in a C4GP a couple of weeks ago and was generally impressed. The 2.0 litre diesel engine has IMHO enough power for everything you are likely to do on UK public roads. It's roomy, quiet and has masses of space. It seems generally well made although I thought the interior quality could be a little bit better for what (in Exclusive form, and at full RRP) is a £25K car.
I felt that it was a bit harder to judge the position of the car compared to my old Espace, probably due to the curvy shape. But I don't see C4GPs with parking scuffs everywhere so I am sure it just takes getting used to.
The Espace-style centre digital dash is nice, but again takes a bit of getting used to. The audio system is a bit tinny, but OK for a car in this segment. The EGS gearbox was not as smooth as it could be, but I'm really nit picking now. That is pretty much the sum total of my negative feedback. No deal breakers.
The people who buy them seem to like them, and a high percentage of sales seem to be repeat purchases.
I am going to take a look at the Vauxhall Zafira Tourer when it comes out. This looks similar to the C4GP size and price wise once you factor in discounts and a few options.
I will then make a final decision. If I go for either of these, it will be new with the expectation of a sizable discount.
The wild card possibility is a used Chrysler Grand Voyager (08 onwards model) which a local used car dealer is prepared to source for me. This is a lovely car - leather everywhere, better sound system etc. - but I've heard of reliability issues, and it's bloody huge.
If your one had pneumatic rear suspension it must have been an Exclusive.
Will let everyone know what I do and why.
I felt that it was a bit harder to judge the position of the car compared to my old Espace, probably due to the curvy shape. But I don't see C4GPs with parking scuffs everywhere so I am sure it just takes getting used to.
The Espace-style centre digital dash is nice, but again takes a bit of getting used to. The audio system is a bit tinny, but OK for a car in this segment. The EGS gearbox was not as smooth as it could be, but I'm really nit picking now. That is pretty much the sum total of my negative feedback. No deal breakers.
The people who buy them seem to like them, and a high percentage of sales seem to be repeat purchases.
I am going to take a look at the Vauxhall Zafira Tourer when it comes out. This looks similar to the C4GP size and price wise once you factor in discounts and a few options.
I will then make a final decision. If I go for either of these, it will be new with the expectation of a sizable discount.
The wild card possibility is a used Chrysler Grand Voyager (08 onwards model) which a local used car dealer is prepared to source for me. This is a lovely car - leather everywhere, better sound system etc. - but I've heard of reliability issues, and it's bloody huge.
If your one had pneumatic rear suspension it must have been an Exclusive.
Will let everyone know what I do and why.
With all the issues with diesels generally I'm now considering the 1.6 turbo petrol. Performance on paper looks similar to the 2.0 diesel, and it's a lot cheaper. I would much prefer a petrol. Anticipated mileage is no more than 20K per year.
I hear stories of major failures with this engine, but AFAIK it's the same engine that's used in the Mini, and BMW have sold vast quantities of those, so it can't be that bad surely? With any engine sold in these quantities there are bound to be some tales of woe.
Thanks wiliferus for the comment about the Grand Voyager. This and the C4GP are the only MPVs on sale today that IMHO are even remotely interesting. On the one hand, getting leather everywhere, 3-zone air con, electric everything (even doors), Bose audio etc. on a 3-year old car for the same price as a new C4GP (assuming reasonable discount) is tempting. On the other hand, wiliferus's horror story isn't the first one I've heard.
I hear stories of major failures with this engine, but AFAIK it's the same engine that's used in the Mini, and BMW have sold vast quantities of those, so it can't be that bad surely? With any engine sold in these quantities there are bound to be some tales of woe.
Thanks wiliferus for the comment about the Grand Voyager. This and the C4GP are the only MPVs on sale today that IMHO are even remotely interesting. On the one hand, getting leather everywhere, 3-zone air con, electric everything (even doors), Bose audio etc. on a 3-year old car for the same price as a new C4GP (assuming reasonable discount) is tempting. On the other hand, wiliferus's horror story isn't the first one I've heard.
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