Which way to go ?

[J4CKO]

Have an M135i, was fancying an M4 next but not sure if it will be massively more fun or faster which I dont really need, obviously a lot more expensive.

Part of me says F55 Cooper S, maybe with a few tweaks, dont do a great deal of miles and want something a bit more engaging/fun,

193 I dont think would cut it but thinking a remap and some other bits to get it nearer 300 than 200 bhp, maybe an LSD,

Anyone gone in a similar direction ?

Only driven a very old One and we had a previous Cooper S Clubman for a couple of days but it had issues and went back, found the ride very harsh, are the newer ones better in that respect ? was on 17s with the Sports suspensions and Run Flats.

my son has a Fiesta ST which I love but find it a bit hard work, is a Cooper S similar/better/worse in that respect ?

[J4CKO]

BeMo said:

Can't comment exactly as I'm waiting on mine being built/delivered but I'll be going from a M140i to a F56 Cooper S very shortly. I had intended the M140i to be a keeper, being a manual which you can no longer get but had a go in a couple Mini's recently and thought the short upright windscreen amongst other things made them feel quite unique.

I have always had a soft spot for the Mini's and having had one for a couple of weeks as a courtesy last year, thought it drove really well even if it was just a Cooper with an auto box. Had a extended test drive of a JCW back in March and decided to put an order in, gone for an S in "exclusive" spec with 17 inch non-run flats and passive suspension so can report back on the ride when it arrives.

The JCW I test drove was hard but probably rode better than my non-adaptive M140i. I will definitely miss the BMW's engine, but there aren't many opportunities to stretch it's legs even with some of the best roads in the country on my door step and other than the powerplant it's not a particularly exciting car.

I'm hoping the "fun" factor that I got from driving the Mini won't wear off too quickly and I won't regret my decision...

The B48 engine in the Cooper S seems to respond well to remaps with lots of them approaching 300bhp just on software.

Awesome info BeMo, thanks for that. Amazed it rides better than a non adaptive F20, really quite happy with the ride on my M135i so it it matches or betters it, i am happy with that.

Not sure I want the agro of rank hubs, wonky turbos and something quite that fast as an M4, completely agree that with my M135i, which has a tuning box, I am a bit nonplussed except for the engine, the rest, as a drivers car leaves me a bit cold.

Think might pop in to the local BMW/Mini agent where I got mine and see what they can do, might go new.

[J4CKO]

Cheers chaps sounds like I need to research the models and available options I may want need, am not a spec hound but worth knowing what is available, need to drive one as well, as stuff opens up that gets a bit more viable.

[J4CKO]

Drekly said:

twokcc said:

Owned a r56 cooper s ad now have a F56 cooper S .
Best option at time seemed to be to change shock absorbers so decided to go for Koni FSD's which are aimed solely at improving car ride. ( car already on non runflat tyres) . A large improvement and made car a far smoother ride but still not as good as the 325d also on non runflats) Changing 17" wheels for 16" improved it yet again.Just didn't look as good and decided to try Michelin PS4's on original 17" and changed front's from toyo TR1's that were on car when I bought it- original Continentals still on rear).
Michelins made an amazing difference- don't know how much Koni's contributed to this but combination worked well and made it how I thought it should have been produced as standard.

The standard F56 on runflats nearly as good . The 3 door cooper S has shortest wheelbase and suspect that this may be part of the reason for its ride and longer wheelbase Cooper S's may ride better. Avoided the JCW as believe this has upgraded suspension from Cooper S which results in a poorer ride. r

Edited by twokcc on Thursday 11th June 08:16

I think if I knew I was going to keep my R56 for years I would be tempted to buy Koni FSDs (already ditched the runflats) as it is annoying on bad pieces of tarmac, on the other hand it might be better to just put the money towards an F56 instead.
The trouble with the F56 Cooper S, even the 210 Works, is it still has virtually the same brakes as the R56 Cooper S, and they are certainly not up to use with near 300bhp if you get it remapped.

So maybe best to stump up for an F56 JCW which has the Brembos, but choose one with 17 inch wheels and non-runflats fitted. Thats what I'd do if I upgrade to another Mini.
Incidentally I found you can deselect the default Sports Suspension option on the JCW which would then give it the same suspension as a stock Cooper S, but I wonder how many people actually did that?

Or just buy an M2 Competition over an M4.

M2 Comps are beyond my budget, was thinking I could perhaps spend 30 on an M4 and stretch, but they are still over 40.

Just never really gelled with the M135i, might be partly as its an auto box, very good auto and its great in traffic but just missing a manual, plus the steering and suspension arent great, nice engine, decent base of the 1 series, but as a package I dont think it works. I think all the hype around them was perhaps based on it being a missile in 2012 compared to what had come before. Dont think I need 450 bhp either, am past willy waving about BHP, you end up looking at 600 bhp auto saloons and remap options.

The M4 issues of Crank Hubs and Turbo failures put me off as well, I dont want to get into spending 30 grand plus on a car then fretting about a potential three grand for turbos and the Russian roulette of it slipping the crank hub, plus its a bit bigger than I need.

I am re assessing what I get out of a car for the money spent. want something reasonably practical that I want to take out for a drive for the sake of it, not really got anywhee to keep a Caterham or classic so needs to be a modern car really.

[J4CKO]

Both cars pictured look great.

[J4CKO]

Toolslinger said:

Hi just thought I share my insight.
My last three cars.
Mk 7 fiesta st with mountune suspension,Collins performance remap.
F56 Mini Cooper s 17 inch wheels ps 4 tyres.
Current car mk8 Fiesta st performance pack.
I presume your sons car is a mk 7 st,you didn’t say whether it was modified.changing the suspension and tyres to PS4 s make a big difference,the Bridgestones it comes with are crap.its much easier to live with on a day to day basis.The Collins map also removes some of the torque restrictions in first and second gears.And as I don’t need to tell you it’s a wonderful drive.
The mini,much easier to live with on a daily basis, on 17’s and PS4’s rode lovely. spec wise just chilli pack,plus visual boost radio.only negative, but a big one is the brakes.Has to be your first upgrade if going for mini.
Mk8 st,much better as standard,ride comfort,exhaust note,lsd with the performance pack,PS4’s.Only downsides not as good looking as the mk7,particularly the rear end.feels much faster than 200bhp.
To summarise don’t discount the mk7st,with a few subtle mods it makes a great hot hatch even better
Good luck with your search.

Its got the Mountune springs and exhaust, not driven it since those were done, may nick it for a bit over the weekend. Thing is, he has that, my wife also has a red Fiesta, will look a bit strange having three Fiestas.

Much easier to live with sounds more me, the M135i is fairly easy when just doing normal stuff, doesn't set your teeth on edge.

[J4CKO]

cerb4.5lee said:

I've been really happy with my F56 Cooper S and I've had it 3 years in august. It has 17" wheels without runflats and I find the ride very compliant on country roads. It is fun to drive and it still puts a smile on my face.

Performance wise I'm happy enough with it as standard but it is great that they are so easy to tune if I did change my mind. The engine feels pretty strong, and its relative size and weight makes it a winner for me versus the bigger/heavier cars I've had.

The brakes are poor though when you are pushing on and I'd prefer it if it had the JCW front brakes on it. I rate the LED headlights and I find the heated seats/heated front screen nice options. The sport mode is also a nice to have for the little pops and bangs.

The standard fit Michelin Primacy tyres are pants though, and I reckon a set of Michelin PS4 would transform it(I have them on the 370Z).

Very smart !

I want something more interactive, went to the Mini place but nobody about and nothing really in stock.

[J4CKO]

Toolslinger said:

J4CKO said:

Toolslinger said:

Hi just thought I share my insight.
My last three cars.
Mk 7 fiesta st with mountune suspension,Collins performance remap.
F56 Mini Cooper s 17 inch wheels ps 4 tyres.
Current car mk8 Fiesta st performance pack.
I presume your sons car is a mk 7 st,you didn’t say whether it was modified.changing the suspension and tyres to PS4 s make a big difference,the Bridgestones it comes with are crap.its much easier to live with on a day to day basis.The Collins map also removes some of the torque restrictions in first and second gears.And as I don’t need to tell you it’s a wonderful drive.
The mini,much easier to live with on a daily basis, on 17’s and PS4’s rode lovely. spec wise just chilli pack,plus visual boost radio.only negative, but a big one is the brakes.Has to be your first upgrade if going for mini.
Mk8 st,much better as standard,ride comfort,exhaust note,lsd with the performance pack,PS4’s.Only downsides not as good looking as the mk7,particularly the rear end.feels much faster than 200bhp.
To summarise don’t discount the mk7st,with a few subtle mods it makes a great hot hatch even better
Good luck with your search.

Its got the Mountune springs and exhaust, not driven it since those were done, may nick it for a bit over the weekend. Thing is, he has that, my wife also has a red Fiesta, will look a bit strange having three Fiestas.

Much easier to live with sounds more me, the M135i is fairly easy when just doing normal stuff, doesn't set your teeth on edge.

You didn’t mention budget,if you want easy to live with,go mini at around 8k,budget not a problem definitely mk8 st.Dont worry about what other people think just buy the best car for you

Budget, recon mine is worth 15k, then depends on what I decide to do, could get a new one or one a couple of years old.

Need to have a go of one, pref a JCW but maybe a Cooper S, doing my research now.

[J4CKO]

paultownsend said:

Sorry going back to your original post. You said F55 MCS. So do you mean 5 door hatch? As the F56 is the 3 door hatch?

Ah, thats me getting my terminology wrong, F56 I would be after then, sure the 5 door is more practical, makes more sense but just prefer the look of the three door.

[J4CKO]

BOR said:

J4CKO said:

available options I may want need, am not a spec hound but worth knowing what is available,

One more thing, Jacko.

If you want to transport yer bike, there is an special option pack to allow bolting a bike carrier to the back of the car.

If you look at the photos Cerb4lee has helpfully posted, you can just make out two towing eye covers instead of the normal one off.

You can use these to bolt on the rack. There is a connecting plug for the light board behind the lower black grill.

This option not available on JCW or JCW bodykit.

Good to know, I do ride a bit but tend to set out from home but useful to be able to take a bike if I get the urge.



Been speaking to a mate who had a raft of Fiesta ST's then went Mini Cooper S, 18 plate auto.

He says if he was buying again he would go for a normal 1.5 Cooper as he had one as a courtesy car and preferred it, said it felt quicker and handled better, also said he tried a JCW and a normal Cooper S but couldn't tell much difference. He also said the Cooper S is typically under estimated power wise and tends to be nearer 210 bhp.

Suspect the Cooper is perhaps lower geared, revvier and a bit lighter at the front end.

[J4CKO]

paultownsend said:

Remember that if you get the F56 3 door then the JCW none valved exhaust just bolts on to the Cooper S. Evolve didn’t change the cat to get their 300hp (which seems too high for me. It’s a good increase whatever and they happily post their before and after RR figures).
The best thing is you can pick up a JCW exhaust for £75 on the Bay!

And yes. The 5 door is Fugly!

I really like the basic cloth seats in the MCS. I just think that coming from a M135i you’ll need something with a good top spec so it doesn’t feel like too much of a downgrade.

Would you not want to get into a manual M140i /M240i and do a few choice mods to get up to M2 performance?

I did ponder that, my mate has a manual m135i but not had a go, mine has a tuning box on it so about 370 bhp and I have sort of decided I dont want to go chasing power figures as even at that level of power, i.e. fast but there are a lot faster available it feels like laboring a point for the sake of numbers.

It is so easy to miss the point with cars and play top Trumps and before you know it you are in a tuned M5 and though its an amazing piece of kit the performance is so easy to extract it is, rather than just going a bit quick, its blatting through every limit in the country in a couple of seconds, speed for the sake of it as its a big luxurious saloon for crossing continents. These cars have their place but for the mileage I do, want a bit more interaction, some pace but dont need 400, 500 plus bhp,

Also, the M135i, the manual box may sort that aspect, though the manual isnt that well regarded in these, you still have the woolly steering, lack of an LSD and suspension that isnt really up to the job. So even with a manual one, would need to add an LSD, some suspension mods and the steering I dont think you can do much about. So not going to mod this as its an auto.

I need to try a few cars and get something that isnt too hardcore/hard to live with but also I want to just go for a drive, never feel like it with the BMW, its ok but would never take it out for the sake of it.

Not bothered about leather seats, but prefer Sat Nav, Bluetooth connectivity, air con and heated seats but not overly fussy, wouldnt be going for anything too old, been there done that.

So the Minis are top of the list, the Fiesta ST, The Hyundai I30N really impressed me, wouldnt mind trying a Megane RS. Not really thinking pure 2 seaters.

[J4CKO]

Yeah, watched the Evolve videos, interesting stuff.

i mentioned to my wife I fancied a Mini, she said its a bit of a "Spoilt teenage girls car"

My CLS was a "Town Councillors car"

BMW "Tossers Car"

She liked my 350Z, Porsche 944 S2 she liked but it was " A bit rattly".

TT didnt offend her from what I, was just the amount of time and parts it required that raised an eyebrow.

Trouble is, I am a nuisance for changing cars, had the BMW 2 and a bit years now, a long time for me, want something I gel with and couldnt imagine getting rid of, if the M135i went tomorrow, I wouldnt be all that bothered.

[J4CKO]

Been using the ST today, really enjoyed it, ride is a bit jiggly and the interior is ok, but the Mini one looks better, and what surprised me, and it may be because I havent been driving my M135i much is it felt plenty fast enough. Much more interactive, mainly for being a manual, the dampers work and it feels much more confidence inspiring.

Hoping to get a shot in a Mini fairly soon.

[J4CKO]

Dolf Stoppard said:

J4CKO said:

Have an M135i, was fancying an M4 next but not sure if it will be massively more fun or faster which I dont really need, obviously a lot more expensive.

Part of me says F55 Cooper S, maybe with a few tweaks, dont do a great deal of miles and want something a bit more engaging/fun,

193 I dont think would cut it but thinking a remap and some other bits to get it nearer 300 than 200 bhp, maybe an LSD,

Anyone gone in a similar direction ?

Only driven a very old One and we had a previous Cooper S Clubman for a couple of days but it had issues and went back, found the ride very harsh, are the newer ones better in that respect ? was on 17s with the Sports suspensions and Run Flats.

my son has a Fiesta ST which I love but find it a bit hard work, is a Cooper S similar/better/worse in that respect ?

I don't normally like people diving in to threads like this and trying to flog stuff. But...might be moving this on in the next couple of weeks if of any interest:



2018 Cooper S. 11500 miles. Nice spec. One previous owner. Immaculate condition. Likely to be traded in so anything over the dealer's offer would be a bonus (looking at c£13.5k)! Still in warranty and all paperwork is obviously available, with details matching my home address. No finance.

It's my fourth MINI, possibly making way for a fifth!

Seems a great price but after a 3 door.

[J4CKO]

12 grand discount ? How !

I nipped down to the local Mini dealer and had a sit in one, pretty impressed, very nice.

Need to book an appointment to have a go, got a brochure.

Missus is like "You dont really want a Mini do you", well, actually, think I do.

[J4CKO]

Am just biding my time, other option is a Fiesta ST.