Which Turbo - Direct Drive

[jesusbuiltmycar]

I would like to upgrade my Turbo Trainer., budget £500, recommendations greatly appreciated...

I am considering a Tacx Flux (£449 at Decathlon) or a Tacx Flux S (£549 at Wiggle)

Curently I have a basic Tacx Flow, wheel on turbo trainer which I use with a bike that has a Quarq power meter. I would like improved ride feel and preferrably a direct drive turbo, wheel off turbo. The trubo will mainly be used with Zwift and I would like to continue using the Quarq for power measurment.


With a smart turbo trainer will ERG mode still work with Zwift if I use the Quarq powermeter instead of the Turbo trainers built in power meter?

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Thanks for the replys - I think that I will get the Elite Zumo recommended by JPJPJP - it has a "Power Meter link" feature whereby the trainer uses an on bike powermeter instead of using an algorithm to estimate the power, which suits my needs perfectly.

The Elite Zumo is currently £429 at Halfords - and I can get an extra 10% discount with British Cycling

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Well I took the plunge and bought the Elite Zumo today - first impressions are - "its a piece of st".

There appears to be no way to adjust the resistance manually (or via an app) and it is set to be huge - as in barely turn the pedals huge! I can only manage 400 watts for a short amount of time and on the Zumo that gives me a cadence of 45 rpm in my lowest gear... In 'bugger gears I can barely turn the pedals

I have tried it in "power meter link" mode (linked to my Quarq) and stand alone mode and with both configurations the trainer is unusable (although the Zumo's estimated power is very similar to the power reading from the Quarq).


The My-E-Training app from Elite is bad. Initially my Mac refused to run it as it is very out of date and "cannot be trusted" - after a work around I got it loaded but it is of very low quality - most options for configuring the trainer simply don't work....

There is also a phone based version of the app but it too is very buggy. If I can't get a solution tomorrow I will return it and try a Tacx Flux S...

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Thanks JP - I think it must have a fault ... I’ve emailed customer services - and created an account for the forum but it won’t be “activated” for 24 hours ,,,

I’ll update when they get in touch - physically it looks the business and feels very stable - hopefully Elite can help me get it sorted.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Usget said:

Mine has a quirk where, in ERG mode, it defaults to super-high resistance until you start spinning up to speed. Have you tried it with Zwift yet to see if it adjusts the magnets back once you get going?

Also - if you have a newer Garmin (x20 or x30) you can link that to the trainer and control resistance with that, I think?

Yes tried with Zwift but I can only "spin" at a cadence of 40-50 due to the ridiculously high resistance, I am not "powerfully built" and can only push 400watts (5.7 watts per kilo) for a couple minutes maximum. Thanks for the info about the Garmin - I will give that a try later.

No response yet from Elite and my forum account is still not "approved" so at present I can't even request any help.

Edited by jesusbuiltmycar on Monday 18th November 15:47

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Just spent an hour trying various things suggested on here and elsewhere - after a calibration using Zwift I can now spin at 100 RPM using my lowest gear for 220watts (just under FTP). This is not ideal though as I would like to be able to spina at a high cadence for lower wattage especially when warming up (e.g. 160 watts at 95rpm).

The cadence reported by the Turbo is woefully inaccurate (about 66% of the actual cadence) and the power reported by the turbo is close to the Quarq all though it is delayed by about 15 seconds....

I have put my bike back on my old Tacx Flow (wheel on dumb trainer) as I want to ride Zwift tomorrow.

This is the first direct drive trainer I have tried - is the pedalling through glue to be expected with magnetic direct drive turbos?
I thought the road feel from the basic Tacx Flow was very artificial (and sometimes the tyre slips) but it is way better than me experience of the Zumo so far.

Tomorrow I plan to ride on Zwift after work - for now I have put my bike back on the old turbo. If Elite reply I may give it one last try but if I have no luck tomorrow I will return it on Wednesday and stick with the dumb trainer + Quarq that I have been using for the last year.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Tonight I am going to pack the Zumo up and take it back for a refund. I can't see any point in exchanging it for another one as I have no confidence in Elite as a company - they clearly have no functioning QA/test department, haven't repsonded to my request for techincal support and I have read about other people's working Zumos suddenly developing this kind of fault.

As for my original question - "Which Turbo?" - for now the £99 Tacx one I bought 2 years ago coupled with a Quarq is the best bet - it simply works,
there is no chance for buggy firmware/software to ruin a ride,

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Elite have been in touch -

elite said:

Please make the following test:
From My E-Training go to Workouts -> Level Mode
Click on Start and while you are pedaling change the level from 1 to 16 and check if you feel the resistance variation.

In negative case:
With the help of the video of this link: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_4_odhFmqXdSi1j... please take a video of the internal moto while you power on the trainer (start the video with trainer powered off) and send me the video.

I tried the suggested test and can confirm that when the resistance does change slightly with the levels, but the lowest setting of 1 is still a huge amount of resistance.... Level 16 is slightly more.

I also performed the other "test" which involved taking the case off and videoing the motor at startup; I can confirm it does perform a range test at startup (wind the motor all the way in then back out)....

On the plus side I had a fantastic ride on Zwift tonight - "The Herd Gallops with Chris", using my dumb trainer ...

[jesusbuiltmycar]

WestyCarl said:

Don't wish to state the obvious, but what gear are you starting in?

I have an Elite and it's worked perfectly, however if I leave my bike in top gear it can take some effort to get the flywheel spinning.

My smallest gear - 34x28, requires about 200W + for a cadence of 85rpm; on a flat raod I would be in 50x17 for that wattage and cadence.

The price has dropped a further £30 at Halfords in the 2 days since I bought it, so with British Cycling discuont they are now £360 (I paid £386) time to return it for a refund.

From what I have read other direct drive turbos in this price range come with a bunch of issues (Tacx Flux, Tacx Flux S, Tacx Flux 2, Elite Suito etc) and I dont want to spend £800+ for a Kickr Core or a Tacx Neo....

Zwift / turbo training for me needs to be time efficient and I will not tolerate any tech-faff after work; I'll probably hang on a couple of weeks and possibly get a "wheel on" Wahoo Kickr Snap - my undestanding is that it is reliable and should have a better raod feel that my current budget wheel on trainer.

Edited by jesusbuiltmycar on Wednesday 20th November 09:14

[jesusbuiltmycar]

g7jhp said:

I've been eyeing a Taxc Flux S (£549) or Flux 2 (£699), Neo 2 (now BF £899) or Wahoo Kickr Core (£699) or Smart (£999).

Buy only the Neo 2 has a discount.

Wondering if Wahoo will discout later.

Any suggestions on the above?

You could always try an Elite Zumo, you may have more luck than me as I am sure most work straight out of the box. DRainmaker's reviwe is very detailed and he certainly recommends it, however it is worth bearing in mind that when any piece of kit is reviewed by an "influencer", the company (e.g Elite/Tacx/Garmin etc) will make sure that the unit sent for review is properly tested prior to shipping.

I took my Zumo back to Halfords yesterday for a refund; if Elite had been a little more pro-active in helping me rectify the issues I would have probably tried a sceond unit..

I am now going to hold off for a week and see what Black Friday deals there are - I will probably get a Wahoo Snap (£429) - from what I have read; they are ultra reliable and that Wahoo have good customer support. The positives about the Snap is that I could use any of my bikes on it, the downside is that my new bike would require a Thru Axel Adapter which is a further £45..

The Tacx Flux 1 is currently £449 at Decathlon: https://www.decathlon.co.uk/flux-smart-direct-driv...
I saw on the comments that DC Rainmaker woudl choose the Flux1 over the Wahoo Snap but I have read elswhere that all Taxc Flux models have mechanical issues (belt noise after 6 months use?). It also is my understanding that Taxc have good customer service.

Edited by jesusbuiltmycar on Thursday 21st November 07:50

[jesusbuiltmycar]

The Wahoo Snap (as recommended by JPJP)n is now £379 on most cycling websites. I purchased one yesterday and it arrived today.

Setup took less than 5 minutes - I plugged it in and it just worked I have just had a brief 10km test ride on tired legs, having already ridden 70Km round the forest earlier.

My initial impressions are that it is an excellent piece of kit, The ride feel compared to my dumb trainer is fantastic - the change is resistance when encountering a hill feels natural and if I stop pedalling it continues to spin for quite a while.

This was probably the first Zwift ride where I have used the little chainring. One thing I noticed is that when riding up hill it seamed a lot easier to put out more power (note: I am still using my Quarq for power readings). - not sure if this is because I was in the right gear for climbing, a bit of new toy excitement or a combination of both!

All in all I am very pleased with it, looking forward to giving it a proper ride tomorrow.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

g7jhp said:

So Wahoo are doing reconditioned 2018 Kickr for £599.99 down from £849.99 with a 3 year warranty.

Is that better than a Flux 2?

Thoughts?

Is that the Wahoo Kickr Smart (RRP £999) or Wahoo Kick Core (RRP £699) - from what I have read both are very good trainers (and better than the one I purchased). Not sure how they compare to the Flux 2 - but I have read that the Flux has issues with belt wear and noise and DC Rainmaker's 2019 trainer recommendations didt not include teh Flux 2 due to inaccuracy in ERG mode.

See also DC Rainmaker's 2019-2020 trainer recommendations:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2019/10/the-smart-trai...