Network rail logic
Discussion
Our nearest neighbour on one side is network rail with a signal box and level crossing. A certain amount of disruption was envisaged.
Last night between 9:30pm and 7:30am they were doing stuff to the level crossing noisily. More is planned on Monday and Wednesday night.
Now I get this must be done when the network is closed. However this line appears to be closed every Sunday, and certainly is this week. So why would they choose to work overnight? And if they do why stop, rather than just get ok with it and finish the job?
Oh and a special place in hell for Machines that beep in reverse!
Last night between 9:30pm and 7:30am they were doing stuff to the level crossing noisily. More is planned on Monday and Wednesday night.
Now I get this must be done when the network is closed. However this line appears to be closed every Sunday, and certainly is this week. So why would they choose to work overnight? And if they do why stop, rather than just get ok with it and finish the job?
Oh and a special place in hell for Machines that beep in reverse!
AJB88 said:
Not sure what level crossing your at but there was a possession in the area last night 2200-0840, works need to be completed when a possession of the line is granted. last night there was a number of jobs being done, some track inspections, ballast drops (involving maintenance trains), some rail repairs and some resignalling work.
a lot of these jobs cant be done when the line is live.
Blaxton. I’m guessing is the case. But the lines not live today as the signal box is unstaffed. a lot of these jobs cant be done when the line is live.
As long as they keep off the bloody grass when parking! To be fair as far as I can tell it is open 24 x 6.
The house was built with sound insulation in my mind so they don’t disturb me at all. Always pleased when the crossing siren gets switched off though.
We are planning air conditioning for at least our bedroom which faces the road by summer as I have reservations about sleep with the level crossing racket.
The house was built with sound insulation in my mind so they don’t disturb me at all. Always pleased when the crossing siren gets switched off though.
We are planning air conditioning for at least our bedroom which faces the road by summer as I have reservations about sleep with the level crossing racket.
andy97 said:
surveyor said:
Our nearest neighbour on one side is network rail with a signal box and level crossing. A certain amount of disruption was envisaged.
Last night between 9:30pm and 7:30am they were doing stuff to the level crossing noisily. More is planned on Monday and Wednesday night.
Now I get this must be done when the network is closed. However this line appears to be closed every Sunday, and certainly is this week. So why would they choose to work overnight? And if they do why stop, rather than just get ok with it and finish the job?
Oh and a special place in hell for Machines that beep in reverse!
The train and freight operating companies (TOCs and FOCs) need to railway lines to be open as much as possible to move the people and goods about that we all depend on, and there is a great seal of pressure to do as much maintenance as possible whilst the railways are still operating. However, there are some maintenance operations that require the railway to be shut to enable them to be carried out, this is known as a “possession”. Last night between 9:30pm and 7:30am they were doing stuff to the level crossing noisily. More is planned on Monday and Wednesday night.
Now I get this must be done when the network is closed. However this line appears to be closed every Sunday, and certainly is this week. So why would they choose to work overnight? And if they do why stop, rather than just get ok with it and finish the job?
Oh and a special place in hell for Machines that beep in reverse!
Possessions are often at night because the railways need to run during the day. Simple as that. And the TOCs and FOCs (and their customers) won’t tolerate the interruptions to their business for days at a time, hence railway maintenance is often mobilised and demobilised every night for relatively short durations of work over a period of several nights rather than just carrying on until the work is finished. It is just not feasible to stop the trains running and diversions are not as easy as on the road network. This is also why the cost of maintaining a railway is very high.
TOCs and FOCs pay for access to the rail network and there are commercial contracts in place with Network Rail for that access. If NR take a possession and then fail to hand the railway back to the operators at the agreed times for the days activities they have to pay compensation to the operators.
andy97 said:
surveyor said:
andy97 said:
surveyor said:
Our nearest neighbour on one side is network rail with a signal box and level crossing. A certain amount of disruption was envisaged.
Last night between 9:30pm and 7:30am they were doing stuff to the level crossing noisily. More is planned on Monday and Wednesday night.
Now I get this must be done when the network is closed. However this line appears to be closed every Sunday, and certainly is this week. So why would they choose to work overnight? And if they do why stop, rather than just get ok with it and finish the job?
Oh and a special place in hell for Machines that beep in reverse!
The train and freight operating companies (TOCs and FOCs) need to railway lines to be open as much as possible to move the people and goods about that we all depend on, and there is a great seal of pressure to do as much maintenance as possible whilst the railways are still operating. However, there are some maintenance operations that require the railway to be shut to enable them to be carried out, this is known as a “possession”. Last night between 9:30pm and 7:30am they were doing stuff to the level crossing noisily. More is planned on Monday and Wednesday night.
Now I get this must be done when the network is closed. However this line appears to be closed every Sunday, and certainly is this week. So why would they choose to work overnight? And if they do why stop, rather than just get ok with it and finish the job?
Oh and a special place in hell for Machines that beep in reverse!
Possessions are often at night because the railways need to run during the day. Simple as that. And the TOCs and FOCs (and their customers) won’t tolerate the interruptions to their business for days at a time, hence railway maintenance is often mobilised and demobilised every night for relatively short durations of work over a period of several nights rather than just carrying on until the work is finished. It is just not feasible to stop the trains running and diversions are not as easy as on the road network. This is also why the cost of maintaining a railway is very high.
TOCs and FOCs pay for access to the rail network and there are commercial contracts in place with Network Rail for that access. If NR take a possession and then fail to hand the railway back to the operators at the agreed times for the days activities they have to pay compensation to the operators.
You live near a railway line, it’s a fact of life that most maintenance takes place at night or on bank holidays. The teams will do their best to use quieter machines and to warn residents in advance but many activities are just not possible to be totally quiet. You have to accept it and get used to it.
I live near an airport, it’s the same principle. No point me moaning about aircraft noise.
Edited by andy97 on Monday 29th March 13:44
My theory on this, given the line has been closed every Sunday for weeks is that the contractor makes more money on overnight works...
Pothole said:
surveyor said:
Near an airport too, but they are better neighbours.
My theory on this, given the line has been closed every Sunday for weeks is that the contractor makes more money on overnight works...
A theory based on a suspicion of greed, posted despite being given plenty of other reasons by posters who appear to actually know the score, tells us plenty about you.My theory on this, given the line has been closed every Sunday for weeks is that the contractor makes more money on overnight works...
andy97 said:
P5BNij said:
Another point worth noting - just because a signalbox is closed or appears be, it doesn't follow that the line itself is closed, some intermediate boxes are 'switched out', with the route cleared to allow the passage of trains.
And most lines are now controlled remotely from just a small number of regional control centres. The days of manned signal boxes being needed all over the network are very very long gone.andy97 said:
surveyor said:
They have not really provided any good reasons (with the exception of one actually) why the works had to be done overnight rather than on the closed line the next day. And yes I am a tad grumpy. Another closure tonight. I will probably be grumpier tomorrow!
We have tried to provide the probable answers. We don’t have the specifics for this project but No railway line is left closed during the day for the hell of it, it is just too expensive. Massively expensive. There will be good engineering and safety reasons; unfortunately you just don’t seem to want to accept that.I'm sure there are reasons why they did not do the work during daytime. Good or not probably depends on your point of view, and I accept that.
jaybarts said:
Not 100% sure but it may well be that the line needed to remain open during the day as it could well be a diversion route if things were going tits up on the ECML.
Also 90% of possession’s are held overnight to minimise disruption, it could be a case of the staff working at your crossing on Sunday night and then will be needing to work in busier areas like Lincoln Mon, Tues, Weds and then Doncaster Thurs so therefore need to maintain a shift pattern.
The actual reason will most likely be that they were only granted a road closure during the night if the barriers were required to be down for extended periods.
I don’t sign the route but if I did I’d be sure to give you a friendly PH horn in the early hours
Good reasoning. Best yet... Can live without the toot Also 90% of possession’s are held overnight to minimise disruption, it could be a case of the staff working at your crossing on Sunday night and then will be needing to work in busier areas like Lincoln Mon, Tues, Weds and then Doncaster Thurs so therefore need to maintain a shift pattern.
The actual reason will most likely be that they were only granted a road closure during the night if the barriers were required to be down for extended periods.
I don’t sign the route but if I did I’d be sure to give you a friendly PH horn in the early hours
Rick101 said:
Are my posts invisible? 
No sorry.... I was reading those too... Interesting history on the wiki page. Our house is very nearly photographed.Am I right in thinking that the local crossings are still controlled from the finningley box? I have a clear idea of their shift patterns from when they used the grass in front of our home as parking space.. That at least has stopped. Mostly.
N Dentressangle said:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3-X-Hush-Plugz-Foam-Ear...
Seriously, try some earplugs. It sounds like there'll sometimes be inevitable works and noise, so these are the best I've found for a quiet night's sleep. Disco next door, babies, snoring etc - they stop everything.
Think we are lucky. Although the road closure notification sign is Uk no sign of any workers. I think they may be at the next crossing down tonight.Seriously, try some earplugs. It sounds like there'll sometimes be inevitable works and noise, so these are the best I've found for a quiet night's sleep. Disco next door, babies, snoring etc - they stop everything.
Jezzerh said:
I don’t know how long you’ve lived there Surveyor but that crossing seems be closed fairly often. I do wonder why they can’t seem to do a job that lasts but then I am assuming that every time they close it they are doing the same work.
There usually seems to be a decent number of people in hi-vis standing around when I walk or drive past so I do wonder if it’s just all a big grift tbh and they do just enough to ensure it will need looking at again a few months later.
I once had to turn back from the pedestrian crossing round the back of Harvey Close as there was a crew ‘repairing’ said crossing. There were 8 guys. On a Sunday. And only 2 of them looked to be completing any sort of activity.
I know I’m a cynical sod!
Early days for us.There usually seems to be a decent number of people in hi-vis standing around when I walk or drive past so I do wonder if it’s just all a big grift tbh and they do just enough to ensure it will need looking at again a few months later.
I once had to turn back from the pedestrian crossing round the back of Harvey Close as there was a crew ‘repairing’ said crossing. There were 8 guys. On a Sunday. And only 2 of them looked to be completing any sort of activity.
I know I’m a cynical sod!
Edited by Jezzerh on Tuesday 30th March 23:17
They did close the road last Tuesday, but there was little noise. Another one tonight. Hopefully a quiet one again! I think they are probably working on the crossing up the line, and using ours as a staging post. Probably be wrong again though!
More fun and games this week.
Road closure signs Monday Tuesday and Wednesday but no noisy works warning.
Monday night we were woken up By a jack hammer at 1am then went for hours.
Somewhat pissed of i spoke to the head engineer for the area the next day to find that we should have been notified. I make a point that consecutive noisy working actually creates safety issues for neighbours who have to work in the day and are kept awake at night.
And they pull the works. I’m astonished.
I believe they are coming back tonight to compete them. The notification failed again, but an engineer knocked on the door and is going to report back that I’m not the ogre
That they expect.
He also confirmed that the neighbouring signallers are a bit odd!
I look forward to some heavy tamping later..
Road closure signs Monday Tuesday and Wednesday but no noisy works warning.
Monday night we were woken up By a jack hammer at 1am then went for hours.
Somewhat pissed of i spoke to the head engineer for the area the next day to find that we should have been notified. I make a point that consecutive noisy working actually creates safety issues for neighbours who have to work in the day and are kept awake at night.
And they pull the works. I’m astonished.
I believe they are coming back tonight to compete them. The notification failed again, but an engineer knocked on the door and is going to report back that I’m not the ogre
That they expect.
He also confirmed that the neighbouring signallers are a bit odd!
I look forward to some heavy tamping later..
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