New to Hill-Climbing/Sprints

[IggyS]

Myself and a friend have been toying with the idea of building a car to compete in hill-climb and sprint events across the UK for a while now, and have finally decided to start getting the wheels in motion.

However, our first obstacle appears to be wrapping our head around a few of the rules, and just what we can/cannot do. However we've read up and form what we can understand the clubs are fairly relaxed about following the MSA rule-books to the letter, although we'd like to obey the letter of the rules for now just whilst we get started.

So, I'll start off with what we want to build, and hopefully people can let us know whether its within the rules or not, as we can;t quite wrap our head around the legalese.



Small car with an RX8 Engine/Drivetrain swap

First main question is what class this would be under, form what we gather it would be C2 (as 1.3Lx1.5 for Rotary puts us at 1950cc), but we're not sure if engine swaps are actually permitted under this class. A lot of other Hill-climb cars have non-standard engines but we're unsure what class these fall under.

Second question, the C rules state "Induction is free" under engine regulations, we assume this means N/A induction kits and not forced induction, but would like some clarification on this.

And Thirdly, is this all doable on a Class B motorsport license? We can't find any rulings on what classes you can/cannot drive under each license so we assume there are no restrictions, but again, it would be nice to know for sure.



We're based on the Suffolk/Essex border so we're a little far away form a lot of events, but would be keen to meet up with any clubs nearby and run through the basics if possible.

[IggyS]

Drumroll said:

Firstly what do you want to do? have fun or be competitive or a mix of both? The reason for asking is depending on what you want to do will/should steer you to what car to build. The problem with some modified classes is that there will always be guys with bigger budgets (not necessarily more talent though)
For various reasons different championships/clubs run classes differently.

My suggestion is go to a few events speak to various people and decide from there.

Do not just build a car as you may find that A) it will not fit in a recognisable class or may not even be allowed to run. B) It will fit in a class but will be completely noncompetitive.

Do not take this as a don't do it post, far from it. just understand what you want and what you need to do to achieve it. Sprinting/hill climbing can be great fun and the social side can be fun too.


Me I'm off to Harewood this weekend, not competing though, marshalling.

Thanks for the tips, we're mostly interested in a little bit of fun with our first steps into some actual motorsport events more than anything else!

Its good to know that different championships and clubs run classes very differently form each other, as this does kind of shape what we will want to do with our car. The particular build is something I've wanted to do for a long time, so I'm more than happy to be a little non competitive in it just for the chance to see it built and have some fun.

As for events, We're in a little bit of a dead-zone in the country for sprints and hill-climbs and so there are a lot less clubs focused on speed events near us, any advice or is it just going to be that we have to travel to get to any clubs?

[IggyS]

Drumroll said:

Just in case you haven't seen this; https://www.msauk.org/assets/bb2018completelow-res... it's the book that governs MSA sport in this country.

Try this: https://aemc.org.uk/Sprint

or this: https://www.blytonpark.co.uk/ several clubs run sprints here as well as track days.

Another option is to look at this "club" http://www.javelinsprintdays.co.uk/sprint/ Not run under MSA rules though. So are car that is OK for this may not be for an MSA event.

Yeah we've read the big blue book (or at least the sprint section) and that's where our confusion comes from under MSA rules, we cant work out if modified cars allow engine swaps (Rules 12.6.1 and 12.6.2), mostly due to our inability to translate legaleese.

that aemc website is a fantastic find though so we may investigate that further, and we can definitely compete under javelin sprint days as they specifically allow engine swaps (provided they are of high quality)


Thanks so much for your help

[IggyS]

westwood35 said:

If you swap an engine you will immediately be put into Sports Libre. Road going classes are quite strict in what you can do. Mod Prod allow quite a bit, but again engine block has to remain the same.

Perfect, cheers for the quick concise info!

Guess the 13B Cappuccino is out the window as a sprinter then, but still on the table as a personal project somewhere down the line!

[IggyS]

Trev450 said:

As a 'dip your toe in the water' exercise, why not get hold of a fun type production car and do a few events with it before throwing a lot of money and effort into a bigger project. I've been doing sprints in the production class for a good few years and apart from being relatively inexpensive, you still keep a road legal car.

Hehe, this is what we were just discussing actually, and on reflection, curbing the ambition and entering in a production car is gonna be far more sensible (and quicker to get into).

There's a great deal of little cars we want to own between us, so we're gonna do some scouting and see if we can find something fun (and cheap) to build.

Also we're going to try and go spectate an event properly and get to know people at least once before we put down any cash.

[IggyS]

Vocal Minority said:

Yep - engine swapping as a beginner puts you into sports livre instantly - which is an odd class.

I have an RX8 and compete in roadgoing under 2 litre. Not as competitive as most french hot hatches due to heft.

But it has RWD and does fire things. So its better.

5th

But better.

NB: Induction is free means just that - you can go forced on naturally aspirated or change the method of the forced induction.

Howeevr you will be subject to the 1.4 multiplier - so for example my RX8 would become a 2.75 litre in effect

Edited by Vocal Minority on Tuesday 21st August 17:23

Spitting fire is what they're all about!

We were considering getting a blown seal rx-8 and send it off for a rebuild, and getting it bridge-ported in the process to put into the Cappuccino, but that may be alright as a standalone option. As far as we're aware internal modifications are all okay so porting should be good.

Also giving some thought to a Celica GT-S, or buying a second MR2 and kitting that out for sprints.

[IggyS]

GibsonSG said:

I’m in my first season and kept it as simple as possible - a seasoned competitor advised us to spend the money on suspension, brakes and safety and leave the engine alone for a couple of seasons. I think his rationale was good on reflection to date.

Adjustable suspension, a new set of race pads and discs, a cage and harnesses probably add up to a fair bit for a first timer still!

Hopefully we can find something cheap, get some good rubber on it and a cage in, then go from there.