Club series for the beginner?

[jevans82]

hi all,

I've been doing some looking into some club racing.

I would like to buy a car that I can use solely for the track, trailered to events, that will be reasonable on consumables. I want to spend plenty of time doing track days and then move into a race series with tight controls on the technical side of things.

I need to bring the trailer and car in for under 10k (cheaper the better) and then can spend on consumables and race entry as and when.

I've limited track experience having done a few track days in my old imprezas. I have a c63 and am loving the rear wheel drive so ideally would like to look at something rwd. I would like the car to take me through more track days and perhaps into some open racing (track day trophy style) before entering into a series. The more series the car can enter, the better but im not keen to keep chasing performance through lots of money.

I spent an interesting day at Thruxton yesterday watching the bmw compact series, lots of caterhams and then the fun cup series. I think the caterhams and fun cup are too expensive for me, however, I did really like the look of the compact cup. I have tried to look for a race prepped bmw 1.8 compact but my initial internet searching hasn't turned up too many leads.

I will be attending most of this on my own so ease of getting car prepped at track would be useful.

Very happy to hear of other series and cars that people would recommend. The rwd is a preference but not an absolute deal breaker.

Many thanks,

John

[jevans82]

Some really useful insights, thank you.

I had a ride in a 69 plate 360 r today and it was absolutely intoxicating. Although the acceleration numbers are in the ball park of my merc, this felt absolutely brutal. Loved it.

Point taken about the initial hit on caterhams but not losing much over the course of a couple of years. I will certainly have a look at the other recommended series. I think I am slightly daunted by the closeness and high standard of racing that I saw at the weekend. I don't think i'm totally sh!te but it looked like a good standard.

The 750 locost was one of the top of my list. I'll have a nose around facebook and see if I can make a meet (if there are any left this year). Having had a blast in the caterham

Thank you for the input on the other series. Big saloons sound awesome, I will want to come and see that. I must admit that if I was thinking about a saloon track car my heart will always say impreza.

Very appreciative of the feedback, ideas and knowledge.

J

[jevans82]

andya7 said:

Bear in mind that the Caterham ‘Supersport’ (~2009-2014?) is the ‘Graduates Sigmax’ once you put Yokohama tyres on...

If you put Toyo R888R’s in then it is eligible for the 7 Race Series.

Their format of either mixed grids (420R & 1600’s) or separate grids (depending on circuit grid capacity) is proving very popular.

Opening round at Snetterton had a full grid (45 cars plus three reserves) and Silverstone had 57 on the grid... one short of full.

If you end up being a reserve then there is no entry fee (yes, free racing!!) on the basis that if you ‘fund’ getting yourself there and are prepared to wait and see if a space appears then you are not charged a an entry fee. All three reserves managed to get at least one race for £0 at Snetterton.

Snetterton had 30mins practice, 20mins qualifying, a 20mins race and 2 x 30mins races... entry fee of £650 (inc vat).

By comparison in the 420R class, Caterham Motorsport had 7 cars at Cadwell and 10 at Thruxton, compared to 7RS’s 31 at Silverstone... with the same spec car (save for tyres)

The 7RS usually has the ‘better’ circuits in the UK; Silverstone GP, Donington GP, Brands Hatch GP and then invitation races later in the year; Le Mans, Portimao and Estoril.

Same car is also eligible for Mag 7’s (also at Le Mans this year) on their mixed grid, be it the 1600 or 420R spec, although the 420R is going to set you back £25-35k.

7RS entry fees (£/min) are comparable across them all, but naturally the likes of Pembrey, Mallory, Croft, etc. are cheaper to rent by the minute than ‘premier’ circuits.

Last couple of years has seen the 7RS race at Imola (twice), Catalunya, Spa, Ascari (private event), Jarama, Jerez and Vila Real street circuit (not for the faint hearted..!!!)

Overseas events are located at easy to get to locations, so get a company to transport your car to Jerez/Portimao/Estoril (approx £1500 for all three in one trip) and fly in on budget airlines.

A Supersport/Sigmax is about £10-12k and you can use it in Graduates, CSCC Mag 7’s or 7 Race Series.

Bottom line is, choose the right spec of Caterham and you could be racing ‘anywhere’ in the UK or Europe, via several different choices in which Series/Championship you join.

You could pick and choose events as you wish and then, if the urge takes you, enter either Graduates or 7RS for a full Championship (Mag 7’s is non-champ.

As others have said, depreciation at this age is negligible and wear and tear on a 550kg car is far less than your average car.

(yes, I have a vested interest in the 7 Race Series, but have raced and been involved in the Graduates since 2002-2017... and both offer similar but different options for drivers)

Thanks for the details here. It helps me to think more clearly about the opportunities for a car that it is eligible for multiple series.

I will do some more looking around at specs etc. The 420 r is going to be beyond my reach.

Thanks

[jevans82]

Mr Tidy said:

I was at Thruxton on Sunday too and really enjoyed watching the Compact Cup series with such a full grid!

But the main attraction for us was that my mate knew someone running a BMW Z4 in the Project8Racing series, and he got 2nd in his class in the first race and 1st in his class in the second race.

And as I've had 3 Z4s in the last 6 years my mate knew I'd be up for going!

There were loads of Caterham races too, and while I'm sure Caterhams may be much better to drive we had lost interest and left before the last race as we didn't find them nearly as exciting to watch.

There is something exciting about watching bigger chunks of metal racing. That's why the jag saloons that were mentioned earlier sound like lots of fun and I really enjoyed the compact racing. I didn't see the project 8, sounds like fun

[jevans82]

PTP165 said:

Hi John

I wonder if you might have considered the 750 Formula? I think this might fit your requirements quite well, cars available sub £10K, controlled by championship regulations under the 750 Motor Club and also the added benefit of running on slicks and wings. There are currently 3 cars available which you can find on the website below. Please have a look and if you would like more info please let me know. I returned to 750 Formula this year after 20 years in hill climb single seaters.

https://750formulachampionship.com/cars-for-sale

More info can be found on the 750 Motor Club website too including the regulations etc.

https://www.750mc.co.uk/formulae/750-formula.htm

Hope this helps.

Steve

I have to admit i hadn't thought about this type of racing. I'll have a look at some videos and see if I can get along to some races (if there are any left in the season). Would you describe it as a good series for an introduction to racing?

Thanks,

John

[jevans82]

blaine54 said:

MSV and CSCC offer a good spectrum of classes which pretty much any car you choose will have a class and you also then have sprint and endurance races at their meetings. I started off in MSV trackday trophy, which was sold as a race series for people dipping their toes coming from trackdays. It might have lost it's ethos a bit with clio cup cars etc but there is a place for anything on their grids so worth a look. At the slower end, how about something like EnduroKA? 2-3 hours racing time per meeting, cheap car to build, racing and having fun with your mates and a competitive field with experience from novices to the odd pro driver. Cscc and the Jags are at Donnington on the 26-27th Sept if you want to have a look & a chat

Edited by blaine54 on Friday 28th August 15:19

Thanks,

I will come and have a look if I can get out the house. I think getting to see more of the meetings is a good idea.

[jevans82]

Nampahc Niloc said:

That’s the key. Get out there and see the car’s in the flesh. Unfortunately at the moment spectators can’t get into the paddocks. Ideally you need to chat to some of the competitors who’ll be able to give you lots of useful information and should help you decide what is for you.

Yes, can understand the paddock being closed to spectators. It's frustrating though as having a chat with people around the cars is likely to help me make decisions. That said, this has been a useful place too.

[jevans82]

Thanks Steve,

My inlaws are a couple of miles from snetterton so it might be a good shout. If I can make it I'll get in touch.

Many thanks

[jevans82]

PTP165 said:

jevans82 said:

Thanks Steve,

My inlaws are a couple of miles from snetterton so it might be a good shout. If I can make it I'll get in touch.

Many thanks

Hi John

The car I was talking about has now been put on the bay of e albeit at a buy now price. May be worth contacting the owner as I think this one will go quite quickly and it is a great car. It is based on a championship winning car and also derived form the Darvi marque design.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/750-formula-racing-car/...

I will point you at the Alpha Live videos from the Silverstone races once we have the edited versions.

Steve

Thanks for highlighting this Steve,

are 750 series cars welcome on regular track days or do they need to go on specific race prep days?

Thanks,

John

[jevans82]

Sadly the only update is.... there is no update.

I've been looking at the affordable end of caterhams, sigmax spec like these:

https://www.cgrc.uk/forsale.asp

However the initial cost of car and trailer is proving to be a little prohibitive. I'm hoping that as winter bites, there may be some bargains or a couple of months allows me to grow the pot a little.

Always happy to have a link or two thrown my way. One of my takeaways from this is how helpful this forum has been for someone who is using it from the first time.

I will definitely post if there's any movement!

[jevans82]

Hi, longtime since an update but I finally got a car. Caterham supersport that has been raced in the CGRC sigmax series and it arrived a couple of days ago.

I'm starting the process of getting it ready for an MOT and then out on the road when the weather allows. Hopefully spring will be just around the corner and I'm looking forward to some track days at Brands and other tracks before dipping my toe into some racing.

Long way to go before that but very happy with my new toy. Appreciate everyone's input on this.

[jevans82]

Thank you all for the input.

I'm very excited. Car is now (nearly) ready for MOT and I'm looking at Brands Hatch for my first track day.

I'm excited about the racing, just feel like I need to get used to the car a little bit more first. Also need to sort a trailer and my tow vehicle.

[jevans82]

andrewcliffe said:

You could enter a couple of sprints as well to get a taste of how the element of competition changes things, even though its just against the clock.

That's an interesting idea. I'll have a look. I've never really thought about that before.

[jevans82]

I've got some instruction lined up. I've seen a few ads say that that some instructors don't offer tuition in vehicles like caterhams. Is that quite wide spread?

[jevans82]

Nampahc Niloc said:

Also, before you invest in a specific camera/data logging system, talk to the instructors. They will have their own recommendations and might be able to sort you out a deal.

Makes sense, however, the car comes with the vbox lite and driver display so that part is taken care of. Looking forward to using it on track

[jevans82]

Nampahc Niloc said:

There are a few instructors well known and trusted in the Caterham world, to name a few:

Ben Clucas
Scott Gillam
Ryan Hooker

...are all worth checking out.

Ben also has some good videos on YouTube that are worth watching to learn lines and approximate breaking point. It’ll take you a while to realise and trust just how fast a caterham can corner, though it obviously depends on the car, the tyres and the conditions on the day.

When it comes to choosing an instructor, there is no one best option. If you have the time and money, try a couple of different ones. This will help you decide who has a style that beat works for you.

Thank you, I'll have a look and see if I can sort something out