Douglas Carswell: UKIP needs a 'fresh face' as leader

[jjlynn27]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35121684

DC said:

no party is defined by any one person.

NF said:

We have one person who disagrees with my leadership - Douglas Carswell is out on a limb.

Only one person, eh. Almost like a statistic from North Korean "satisfaction with leadership" questionnaire. Isn't that same DC the one and only elected representative (HoC)?

[jjlynn27]

Digga said:

DC is the perpetual voice of dissent. Even a stopped clock and all that....

I'll disagree. I very much doubt that he's the only person that doesn't agree with Farage. I'll accept that my view might be very much influenced by instinctive dislike for Farage, and his phony bloke down the pub act. If it wasn't for DC, who, if reports are correct would walk any election in his constituency, UKIP would have 0 MoPs. I also agree with Farage, and although I'm leaning towards staying inside EU, people that I know that want out, dislike Farage as much.

The problem, if you can call it that, for UKIP is that UKIP is one man band, and I can't see anybody who would be able to fill Farage's shoes.
Status quo, will not result in more MoPs at the next elections. Probably one less.

[jjlynn27]

My previous post made very little sense; 'I agree with Farage' is wrong on so many levels. I knew what I meant at the time. The point v Europe, is that people that I know dislike Farage, regardless of their stance on EU. Nobody was suggesting that they would vote based on that.

I don't believe that he is sincere at all. The 'resign/unresign' fiasco, for me, was a final proof, as if I needed one. I do think that he's good at handling media. But sincere? No.

[jjlynn27]

Scuffers said:

and your being very clearly a Muppet spouting something you know is simply not that happened.

And this type of response is why any discussion on NF gets shutdown by devotees. Some people see it like a cult. Any criticism of Farage is anathema. The 'we are not going to employ family members, cause we don't stand for nepotism' but 'well my wife is the only person in UK that can do the job', together with 'resign/unresign' fiasco is why he is not honest. Things that he says count for nothing.
Just imagine what would same people say if Miliband did the same thing.
Farage said about that he would resign, as it seemed impossible to him that he would not win. Compared to other candidates he had immense media coverage. Yet he failed. So then goes the famous; 'I'm the man of my word !'.

Back to DC spat; I don't know what to make of 'put up or shut up'. What does that even mean? DC clearly doesn't want to contest the leadership, not sure if he stated the reasons, but that shouldn't prevent him from voicing his opinion. To claim that he's the only one not happy with Farage's leadership is disingenuous attempt to prevent any debate.

[jjlynn27]

alfie2244 said:

Politicians - sincerity? If the resign / not resign saga is the best example people can find to demonstrate NF's insincerity then perhaps someone could draw up a list showing all politicians' insincerity.

I'll start - "Cast iron guarantee", "Increased student fees" or hows about "WMD"??

So because Clegg lied that somehow makes Farage more honest? What an odd thing to say.

[jjlynn27]

alfie2244 said:

jjlynn27 said:

alfie2244 said:

Politicians - sincerity? If the resign / not resign saga is the best example people can find to demonstrate NF's insincerity then perhaps someone could draw up a list showing all politicians' insincerity.

I'll start - "Cast iron guarantee", "Increased student fees" or hows about "WMD"??

So because Clegg lied that somehow makes Farage more honest? What an odd thing to say.

Did I say that?

What did you say? As don4l would say 'clarify your position.'

I'll try to help you here; Do you, alfie2244, think that Nigel Farage is 'man of his word'?

[jjlynn27]

alfie2244 said:

After 9 months gestation and you are still popping out strawmen, I expected better from a pro troll like yourself. I did enjoy your earlier posts, but after a while they get very repetitive. Never mind, with a bit of luck, it will snow soon and you will be able to build snowmen instead.

Very true, but is the Farage liar or honest man?

[jjlynn27]

alfie2244 said:

jjlynn27 said:

alfie2244 said:

After 9 months gestation and you are still popping out strawmen, I expected better from a pro troll like yourself. I did enjoy your earlier posts, but after a while they get very repetitive. Never mind, with a bit of luck, it will snow soon and you will be able to build snowmen instead.

Very true, but is the Farage liar or honest man?

Are you?

Irrelevant in a thread about UKIP. Are you so afraid to answer the simple question, do you think that other kippers will think less of you?

Quality entertainment.

[jjlynn27]

alfie2244 said:

jjlynn27 said:

alfie2244 said:

jjlynn27 said:

alfie2244 said:

After 9 months gestation and you are still popping out strawmen, I expected better from a pro troll like yourself. I did enjoy your earlier posts, but after a while they get very repetitive. Never mind, with a bit of luck, it will snow soon and you will be able to build snowmen instead.

Very true, but is the Farage liar or honest man?

Are you?

Irrelevant in a thread about UKIP. Are you so afraid to answer the simple question, do you think that other kippers will think less of you?

Quality entertainment.

And that sums you up to a tee. If you want quality entertainment, i.e. someone dancing to your tune in reality, then why not google utube for Dance of the Trolls...right up your street I would think.

All good. But what about Farage, is he 'a man of his word'?

[jjlynn27]

steveT350C said:

Scuffers said:

Countdown said:

What about the statement that there were 7000 HIV cases, of which 60% were not British citizens? is that sufficient for you?

And how was he wrong?

Only this week there was something about this, basically saying the real numbers were much higher.

http://order-order.com/2015/04/03/nigel-farage-is-right-about-health-tourism/

Where does it say that 60% are not British citizens? As for the quality of the article itself I'll leave you with this pearl of wisdom; 'Hepatitis B is equally devastating as HIV'.

[jjlynn27]

Scuffers said:

jjlynn27 said:

Where does it say that 60% are not British citizens? As for the quality of the article itself I'll leave you with this pearl of wisdom; 'Hepatitis B is equally devastating as HIV'.

It doesn't, it does say:

link said:

Of the 107,800 people estimated by Public Health England to be HIV positive an astonishing 59,300 are originally from Africa.

That's 55% are from Africa, so unless your suggesting that no others arrived from any other continent, i would suggest 60% is probably a little low.

So, want to pick another so called lie?

Edited by Scuffers on Saturday 19th December 18:32

Sure. But first I'd like you to show me workings to get to 59300. 'Originally from Africa' refers to 'Black-African ethnicity' in the study. Nothing to do with 'arrived'. The whole article is written by a moron for consumption by morons.

[jjlynn27]

steveT350C said:

jjlynn27 said:

'Hepatitis B is equally devastating as HIV'.

That is wrong... Hepatitis B is a much bigger global concern than HIV.

Is it? I'd like to know more, HPB and HPC and resulting illnesses were resulting in 1mil deaths per year. HIV 1.5mil from quick google. I'd still say that devastating effects of HPB and HIV are not comparable, regardless of global concerns. You work in medical field, IIRC, for you to link that article is somewhat baffling.

[jjlynn27]

steveT350C said:

jjlynn27 said:

steveT350C said:

jjlynn27 said:

'Hepatitis B is equally devastating as HIV'.

That is wrong... Hepatitis B is a much bigger global concern than HIV.

Is it? I'd like to know more, HPB and HPC and resulting illnesses were resulting in 1mil deaths per year. HIV 1.5mil from quick google. I'd still say that devastating effects of HPB and HIV are not comparable, regardless of global concerns. You work in medical field, IIRC, for you to link that article is somewhat baffling.

I linked the article because Scuffers referred to it.

I assume you are equating the use of the word 'devastating' with 'death'? An easy mistake to make if one works in the trolling field.

2 billion people have been infected with HepB virus compared with 37million with HIV.

According to the WHO, of those 2bn, an estimated 350million have chronic hepatitis and about 1million die annually compared with 1.5million from HIV.

No, I'm equating word 'devastating' with effect on people infected with a certain disease. You assume very many things, most of them wrong. The article, once again, is idiotic. Unsurprisingly, troglodytes would see that as a proof 'our Nigel was right, look at the number of foreigners coming over with diseases!!!'. The fact that the paper that article was 'based on' doesn't mention immigration at all, is, quite obviously, irrelevant. Using your figures, even if you chose to disregard effects on people infected with HepB vs HIV, 1.5mil out of 37mil die from HIV, while 1mil out of 2bn or 350mil (whichever number you wish to choose) would die from induced illnesses. Do you think that they are equally devastating?

I'm still waiting on maths showing how did they come up with figure of 59,300.

[jjlynn27]

Zod said:

Yeah but what about.....?

That's the standard Kipper response.

So much so, that you'd think that they give out leaflet, with pictures and instructions how to 'defend' The Leader.

Still fun.

[jjlynn27]

Not new, but quite telling, Farage's ex-right hand man;

hufpo said:

...
Kassam's appearance on Newsnight came shortly after an interview he gave to The Guardian was published. In the article he described Ukip's central-London HQ as "like a fking playground". It was a place, he said, that when journalists visited, he often had to "lock certain doors because the people behind those doors were too embarrassing to be seen".

Despite Ukip predictions that the party would be sending a sizeable number of MPs to Westminster at the election, Carswell ended up being the only one elected.

But Kassam questioned whether the former Tory MP belonged in Ukip. "There's no doubt Douglas is a very intelligent man," he said. "I just don't think he fits into a political party.

“I think he sees Ukip as being an independent. Whereas actually the way to be independent is to sit as as an independent MP.

He added: "I don't think he is willing to play the sort of push and pull you have to in a political party. I don't think he's really managed to fit in anywhere in Ukip."

The former Ukip aide told The Guardian that he and Farage would enjoy "PFLs" or “proper fking lunches" during the campaign. He told Maitlis it was a "Faragism" for a "three or four bottle lunch".
...

My bold.

Reading some posts here, bold part is not surprising at all.

Edited by jjlynn27 on Thursday 24th December 15:52