Welsh lockdown

[mac96]

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advi...

I really cannot make my mind up whether this is evidence of a nasty racist undercurrent, or an entirely justified reaction, Either way, seems odd to be getting steamed up about visitors now- the summer season is definitely over.

Any thoughts?

[mac96]

nordboy said:

I think the issue is, that due to local lockdowns and the differences between the law in England and Wales, is that English people can seemingly travel from wherever they want to visit/ holiday in Wales. Yet if you're living in Wales, depending on where you are, you can't even cross the county border, which may be a couple of miles away.

The whole thing makes a mockery of the current lockdown laws. And people are getting a bit pissed off with it.

That's a good point. Particularly in North Wales the county boundaries are not logical zones for this either- Conwy in particularly has larger rural areas whose inhabitants probably can see no reason for restrictions.

I definitely agree that it is ridiculous to allow people from locked down areas in England (or Wales) to travel to counties not in lockdown.

[mac96]

welshjon81 said:

I've booked a week in Cornwall over the half term for my family but we can't go due to local lockdown. I'm absolutely fine with this as we are in the middle of a pandemic and we all need to make sacrifices and pull together.

On the other hand:-

Why should I be OK with someone from Leicester (for example) coming to stay down the Gower where I live?

You shouldn't be OK with it. But that is a bit different from the 'no foreigners here' attitude' of some people. I am sure they are in a small minority. I am English and have been a regular visitor to North Wales as long as I can remember apart from the hard lockdown earlier this year; I have never been told to 'f off home'. Well, actually once, but that was when I was about 12 , and the other lad was about the same age, so I don't count that!

[mac96]

When I started this I was genuinely uncertain what to make of the article. PH have definitely helped me make my mind up; It seems that Welsh people are upset because:
1.A few are just ejits, just like everywhere else;
2.The Welsh Government is useless;
3.The UK Government is useless, but differently useless making for difficult to deal with inconstancies.
4.Ancient history, Edward 1st etc.;
5.More recent and relevant history- forced English language, reservoirs.
6.Local politicians stirring up dislike of the English for own selfish purposes.
7. Failure to provide affordable homes, which can then be conveniently blamed on the English (see 6.)



So my conclusion is that the anti English rhetoric around Covid whilst probably unfair, is understandable. Thank you!

[mac96]

foobies said:

wobert said:

You sound like you’re in Betsi Cadwaldr Health Authority too, like me.

I agree, it’s an absolute basket case.

I agree, Drakeford is using Covid for his own means, bearing in mind the Senedd elections next year. I’m hoping the public will see this incompetence and give the incumbent government a good hiding.

Where I am in Alyn & Deeside, the incumbent MP was close to losing his seat at the last election, so hopefully the groundswell of opinion continues and goes against Drakeford, we can live in Hope (and die in Caergwrle, as the saying goes!)

Correct.

Rank incompetence and mismanagement are the cause of Betsi's issues. It went into special measures when Drakeford was health minister, and not much has changed since.

I'm not sure if Drakeford will get mauled in the election because a lot of people around here are total Karens or public sector workers. From what I can gather, they are quite enjoying current events. But if enough people lose their jobs, which is looking very likely given the virtual shutdown and pending collapse of hospitality here (which is the main driver of the economy towards the Conwy area), maybe there'll be some kind of reckoning for him and Welsh Labour.

Either way, Drakeford and Welsh Labour's behaviour is nefarious in the extreme. The 'five mile rule' and now restriction of movement and travel - I cannot adequately articulate my absolute contempt for this idiot.

There'll be an explosion of mental health issues in Wales as a result of Drakeford's actions. But of course this bloke couldn't take responsbility for a fart. The fallout from his decisions will be everyone else's fault, like it always is. He cannot see any further than the end of his nose, and it's quite daming really that Wales should have such a short-sighted, wattle-faced simpleton in charge. If we get the politicians we deserve, Wales must have done something really really bad (apart from voting this clown and his party in). The lack of critical thinking is outrageous, and short-termism on display from this allegedly clever bloke, even more so.

It's utterly shameful how at a time when people and businesses are seriously struggling, he's spending more time trying to score cheap shots against 'THE ENGLISH!!!!!' and Boris, than he is actually looking at and understanding the devastation his policies are causing to entire communities here in Wales.

He has devolved powers. He could be leading the charge showing 'the English' how it's done. Instead, he's told Boris to hold his beer while he leaves a smouldering crater where the Welsh economy once stood.

Of course the state of health provision in Wales will be another factor making it easier for politicians to frighten the locals about the largely imaginary risk of holiday visitors. Not to mention second home owners and caravaners who must be the lowest risk of all as they do not have to gather in groups in hotels etc

[mac96]

ATG said:

Byker28i said:

Evanivitch said:

Byker28i said:

We're seriously starting to consider selling our welsh home now I can't see this getting any better next year and they are stoking the welsh nationalism, "it's all the english fault"

I've definitely not seen anyone blaming the English for it.

What people have done is pointed out the unfairness of Welsh high risk areas being in county-lockdown, whilst English high risk areas were free to go on holiday, including into parts of Wales.

Yeah there's quite a bit of 'we don't want the english' 'lock down to stop them bringing it here' type of stuff, echoing effectively what David Simpson the council leader was saying earlier in the year.

I was working from home last week, but left Wales to avoid restrictions of movement and also just to avoid any further nastiness. We're now be into around 5 months we've stayed away from our Welsh home this year, trying to be seen to do the right thing, so that's almost 5 months we've not used it.

I can't see it getting any better in the short term and that underlying bitterness will continue for a while longer

Ah, so it's a holiday home? In that case can't you see why some people might resent you travelling between it and your other home? We are all supposed to be avoiding unnecessary travel and mixing.

This is not the simple concept it used to be though. I know people able to afford two homes will be unpopular in some quarters, but with the ease of working from home the concept of second/holiday home has changed. You can live in two places and regard both as home. You might even regard Wales as your main home, even if you are English with another home in England. This thread has become very pessimistic- Wales is still a wonderful place,politics notwithstanding.

[mac96]

Rh14n said:

Red 4 said:

Earthdweller said:

Is it not dependent on where though ?

A friend transferred from the Met to North Wales Police he didn’t have to speak Welsh but could only be posted to the Merseyside/Cheshire border area unless/until he could speak Welsh

That would have been 15-20 years ago so things may have changed

My mate transferred to The North Wales Heddlu on promotion to Chief Superintendent in 2010.

He spoke as much Welsh as me, which is close to none. I understand Araf but that's only because they also write "Slow" above it.

The policy was to actively encourage Welsh speakers though. He learned. I'd have stuck with a phrase book.

North Wales Police have a pretty strong (but realistically reasonable) Welsh Language Policy with differing levels of fluency required for different roles. Strangely enough, it was very robustly championed and encouraged by the infamous (notorious even) Chief Constable, Richard Brunstrom during the first decade of this century. He led by example and became a fluent Welsh speaker very quickly.

Seems absolutely fair to me-not English, and want to work in England - learn English. Not Welsh and want to work in Wales, especially in the areas where most people normally speak Welsh- learn Welsh.

[mac96]

Rh14n said:

Badgerboy said:

I do wonder how many Welsh speakers cannot speak English however.

Happy for those who wish to speak it to speak it, but I don't like it being rammed down my throat. I wish there was an opt out system for not recieving official documents in Welsh, bloody waste of paper and resources.

You clearly can't see the irony in this post. We are in Wales. Welsh is one of the oldest languages in Europe and the main reason for its decrease is that English has been "rammed down our throats" for the past 150 odd years by such means as the Welsh Not punishing and stigmatising children for speaking Welsh. Today, Welsh speakers oblige non-Welsh speaking people by speaking English with them. Many people suggest that by doing this we are perpetuating the problem because it allows them not to make any effort to learn Welsh. What other nation has allowed this to happen? If you were to move to France would you make some effort to learn French?

I'm lucky in that in speaking Welsh and English my life is doubly-enriched with both cultures and languages and living in Wales. If we lose the language we'll lose our heritage, literature, poetry, music and so much more. We don't want to deny you your right to speak English. Surely, in Wales, is it not my basic human right to use Welsh in may day-to-day life? I'm just sick of having to justify this simple concept.

I am glad you have brought out the shear cultural richness of Welsh. Sometimes gets lost in arguments about practicalities. I don't speak Welsh and feel the poorer for it. If I had worked in Wales I would have had to learn and that would have a good thing. A retirement project perhaps.

[mac96]

Kent Border Kenny said:

saaby93 said:

Sounds like the Stores keepers back in BL.
The whole point of having a store room and a store keeper was to have something in store.
They couldnt let anything out of store until they knew something was coming in to replace it.

A room stocked high with vaccines is better than an empty one

How?

What is the advantage in delaying giving the vaccinations?

Could it be to avoid gap between first and second dose being too long for effectiveness? Use all up for dose 1 in first few days, no second doses available.

[mac96]

eccles said:

phil_cardiff said:

eccles said:

What's all this independence rubbish got to do with the Welsh lockdown?

Always fun when the forum police arrive

Happy now?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55758774

Yes, and lets have no more of it or you'll get banished to Rhyl for life!

As OP, I will just opine that some threads develop a life of their own and that's fine with me!