Door Hanging - Which tools?
Discussion
I want to change a dozen doors in my house and I'm being quoted £80 per door.
I have hung a few doors before using basic hand tools but they took me a looong time and I thought the finish could have been better.
I have plenty of time on my hands right now so would sooner spend some cash on tools and hang the doors and fit the furniture myself.
I have a set of reasonably good, sharp, chisels, I've already bought a pair of air wedges and a set of self centering drill bits.
Can anyone recommend a suitable router and are the corner chisels worth the money?
Which, if any, of the available hinge jigs would you recommend?
Any other tools that are helpful and would be worth investing in to fit a dozen or so doors?
Any tutorials that you thing are worth watching?
Many thanks in advance for advice.
I have hung a few doors before using basic hand tools but they took me a looong time and I thought the finish could have been better.
I have plenty of time on my hands right now so would sooner spend some cash on tools and hang the doors and fit the furniture myself.
I have a set of reasonably good, sharp, chisels, I've already bought a pair of air wedges and a set of self centering drill bits.
Can anyone recommend a suitable router and are the corner chisels worth the money?
Which, if any, of the available hinge jigs would you recommend?
Any other tools that are helpful and would be worth investing in to fit a dozen or so doors?
Any tutorials that you thing are worth watching?
Many thanks in advance for advice.
Promised Land said:
No disrespect to you but if you’re needing to ask what tools you need to hang doors you really shouldn’t be attempting it.
£80 a door isn’t a bad price depending on your location, I charge £45 for cheap egg box style doors and £65 for any oak veneered style door.
Yes you could hang them I have no doubt but it’s like me coding a programme, I’m not in that profession so wouldn’t do as good a job as someone who is.
Internals on 3 inch butts don’t require a router, a very sharp 3/4 or 1” bevel chisel is all you need plus a marking gauge.
Electric planer, a hand plane to take the arisses off and a 1/2” chisel for the latch, plus an inch And a half inch auger bit for the latch, bath locks, don’t use flat/ speed bits.
If you’re cutting the bottom to go over carpet, tiles etc re use the timber inside by cleaning the face off and glueing it back in if egg box doors, if a veneer door they’re usually chipboard inside so no need for that.
Chisels need honing too, not just straight out the box as they’re only sharpened. So an India sharpening stone or diamond stone if you prefer.
With all due respect, did you read my post. I've done it before and just want to do a better job hence the request for advice. Sorry if I'm stepping on your professional toes but I think £80 to hang a door where I live isn't good value. If I lived in the south beast I might feel differently.£80 a door isn’t a bad price depending on your location, I charge £45 for cheap egg box style doors and £65 for any oak veneered style door.
Yes you could hang them I have no doubt but it’s like me coding a programme, I’m not in that profession so wouldn’t do as good a job as someone who is.
Internals on 3 inch butts don’t require a router, a very sharp 3/4 or 1” bevel chisel is all you need plus a marking gauge.
Electric planer, a hand plane to take the arisses off and a 1/2” chisel for the latch, plus an inch And a half inch auger bit for the latch, bath locks, don’t use flat/ speed bits.
If you’re cutting the bottom to go over carpet, tiles etc re use the timber inside by cleaning the face off and glueing it back in if egg box doors, if a veneer door they’re usually chipboard inside so no need for that.
Chisels need honing too, not just straight out the box as they’re only sharpened. So an India sharpening stone or diamond stone if you prefer.
Last time I used flat/speed bits. Why do you suggest it's preferable to use an auger?
WishIWasAJoiner said:
Air wedges are good for getting your spaces around the door before transferring the hinge positions.
When you come to hang the doors, I’ve found the air wedge can be a bit frustrating for me as well as door lifters. Using a good magnetic drill bit which holds the screw, place the bottom edge of the door (hinge side) through the threshold and the top hinge will line up - one screw into the bottom hole of the top hinge and then pull the door back through and place all three in the lower and check your fit.
I’ve only ever fitted doors with - Hammer, chisel, electric or hand planer, auger bits, 3mm drill bit, marking gauge, drill, pencil and a door holder I made out of 4x2.
Sorry forgot to add - I personally wouldn’t use a router, unless you would like to set up a jig for the hinges or free hand the majority and then clean them up with your chisels. If you do want to use a router a 1/4” palm router would be my choice. A Katsu mains powered off Amazon which as far as I can tell is a Makita router will suit your needs. I have the Katsu and I use it all the time for work and diy at home. Cheaper options may be available but I cannot recommend anything else unless your want to go Festool, majors or dewalt, all of which I have personal experience with - https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00LVVJB7A/ref=cm_sw_r...
I prefer auger bits over spade bits because I’ve found them easier to handle when cutting out for mortise lock - when stepping down for each cut, I’ve found the spade bits slip, it could be user error though - I’m only 6 years into the trade.
Thank you, that's very helpful.When you come to hang the doors, I’ve found the air wedge can be a bit frustrating for me as well as door lifters. Using a good magnetic drill bit which holds the screw, place the bottom edge of the door (hinge side) through the threshold and the top hinge will line up - one screw into the bottom hole of the top hinge and then pull the door back through and place all three in the lower and check your fit.
I’ve only ever fitted doors with - Hammer, chisel, electric or hand planer, auger bits, 3mm drill bit, marking gauge, drill, pencil and a door holder I made out of 4x2.
Sorry forgot to add - I personally wouldn’t use a router, unless you would like to set up a jig for the hinges or free hand the majority and then clean them up with your chisels. If you do want to use a router a 1/4” palm router would be my choice. A Katsu mains powered off Amazon which as far as I can tell is a Makita router will suit your needs. I have the Katsu and I use it all the time for work and diy at home. Cheaper options may be available but I cannot recommend anything else unless your want to go Festool, majors or dewalt, all of which I have personal experience with - https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00LVVJB7A/ref=cm_sw_r...
I prefer auger bits over spade bits because I’ve found them easier to handle when cutting out for mortise lock - when stepping down for each cut, I’ve found the spade bits slip, it could be user error though - I’m only 6 years into the trade.
Edited by WishIWasAJoiner on Wednesday 29th December 13:52
I'm not sure I grasp your process shown in bold. How do you lift the door into place?
WishIWasAJoiner said:
I’m very poor when describing things, sorry.
When the door is ready to be hung, so hinges cut and it can be place into the frame. When it comes to attaching the door to the frame my process is -
Stand the door perpendicular to the frame so the hinges are in line with the cut outs on the door frame. I then lift the door slightly and put the bottom edge of the door (the hinge side) slightly through the door opening and tilt the top of the door back towards you and it will make it easy to line up the top hinge with the door frame cut out and attach one screw in the bottom hole of the top hinge. I then hold the bottom of the door and gently bring it back through the opening and attach the bottom hinge to the door frame. The door will then be safe to open and close to check fit (providing correct screws etc are used haha), if you’re happy with the fit, then add the rest of the screws. If the door binds a little bit - adding all the screws usually corrects this by pulling the door over.
Sorry if that still doesn’t explain it, in person, demonstrating it would be 2 minutes and I’ve found it a lot faster than lifters and air bags. I hang fire doors the same way, it’s how I was shown to do them on site.
I get it now. Thank you When the door is ready to be hung, so hinges cut and it can be place into the frame. When it comes to attaching the door to the frame my process is -
Stand the door perpendicular to the frame so the hinges are in line with the cut outs on the door frame. I then lift the door slightly and put the bottom edge of the door (the hinge side) slightly through the door opening and tilt the top of the door back towards you and it will make it easy to line up the top hinge with the door frame cut out and attach one screw in the bottom hole of the top hinge. I then hold the bottom of the door and gently bring it back through the opening and attach the bottom hinge to the door frame. The door will then be safe to open and close to check fit (providing correct screws etc are used haha), if you’re happy with the fit, then add the rest of the screws. If the door binds a little bit - adding all the screws usually corrects this by pulling the door over.
Sorry if that still doesn’t explain it, in person, demonstrating it would be 2 minutes and I’ve found it a lot faster than lifters and air bags. I hang fire doors the same way, it’s how I was shown to do them on site.
Edited by WishIWasAJoiner on Wednesday 29th December 14:41
timberman said:
If you intend using a router to cut out the hinge recesses then don't bother with a hinge jig,
just get one of these
bearing guided template bit
and make your own jig to suit whichever hinges you get ( I used to make mine out of left over bits of 3/4" ply or mdf)
you can also make jigs to help with drilling holes for the spindle bar and other parts if you want,
I have a corner chisel,
if using a router it does make cleaning the corners up a bit easier but isn't absolutely necessary, a sharp chisel will work easily enough
also one of these
drill guide
is good for centring the drill bit on the door edge when drilling to fit the mortice latch/lock
you will need a drill with a 43mm collar to use this though, which might be an issue if you only have cordless drills
I had one of those Axminster drill guides for years and never used it so gave it away when I moved house 6 years ago.just get one of these
bearing guided template bit
and make your own jig to suit whichever hinges you get ( I used to make mine out of left over bits of 3/4" ply or mdf)
you can also make jigs to help with drilling holes for the spindle bar and other parts if you want,
I have a corner chisel,
if using a router it does make cleaning the corners up a bit easier but isn't absolutely necessary, a sharp chisel will work easily enough
also one of these
drill guide
is good for centring the drill bit on the door edge when drilling to fit the mortice latch/lock
you will need a drill with a 43mm collar to use this though, which might be an issue if you only have cordless drills
I have several drills. Even got my dad's old Black & Decker metal cased drill. (My dad dies in 1985 so it's probably 45, if not 50 years old) which should fit it. ISTR there were different colour plastic collars with the drill guide I had.
I've got an electric plane(r) (Erbauer) and I like the look of the feet to hold the doors but they do look rather expensive for what they are. I was planning on making a stand from some bits i have lying about.
As I said, I already have a door lifter (the metal pivot one mentioned earlier) from when I fitted the doors in my last house and I've already bought a pair of air bags so I'll try both and see what works for me.
I'll confess I bought a s/h router off Gumtree but didn't do my homework first and I bought a 1/2" draper which is way too big and cumbersome. When I picked it up it was like new. Only when I got it home did I realise the depth adjuster was missing (despite me asking the vendor if it was complete and nothing missing
). So I may well invest in a budget 1/4" palm router hence my question originally about the best tools to do this.
Now I just need to choose and buy the doors. A local firm was quoting around £3K to supply and fit 12 oak veneer doors which is why I am where I am now.
All advice is much appreciated. Thanks to all who have contributed thus far.
As I said, I already have a door lifter (the metal pivot one mentioned earlier) from when I fitted the doors in my last house and I've already bought a pair of air bags so I'll try both and see what works for me.
I'll confess I bought a s/h router off Gumtree but didn't do my homework first and I bought a 1/2" draper which is way too big and cumbersome. When I picked it up it was like new. Only when I got it home did I realise the depth adjuster was missing (despite me asking the vendor if it was complete and nothing missing
). So I may well invest in a budget 1/4" palm router hence my question originally about the best tools to do this.Now I just need to choose and buy the doors. A local firm was quoting around £3K to supply and fit 12 oak veneer doors which is why I am where I am now.
All advice is much appreciated. Thanks to all who have contributed thus far.
Evoluzione said:
AlmostUseful said:
Evoluzione said:
Half of the talent is knowing at what point to do one or the other.
The old “you’re not paying for the 30 seconds it took me to grab my hammer and tap, you’re paying for the 30 years I spent learning where to tap”It's like getting plaster on a ceiling without throwing it all over the place. To watch someone put something with the consistency somewhere between double cream and whipped cream on a ceiling and making it like a billiard table without spilling it is a delight and worth paying for.
Gtom said:
All the talent is knowing how to get over something when you inevitably balls it up. That’s where the years of experience come in.
No. If you know what you're doing you don't balls it up in the first place, but knowing how to get out of it is worth knowing for that odd occasion.I did 7yrs in college from basic carpentry and joinery, to advanced. Then Woodwork machinery, then Series 600 building management as it was.
If you want me to set up a Wadkin 220 5 cutter to run off 5 miles of skirting, floorboard or whatever i'll do it, likewise a double ended tenoner or a Whitehill block in a spindle moulder. I'll fit it too if you want with a mitre saw and a coping saw.
I was lucky in that respect, I had an employer who backed me and I rewarded them too. I made them money, they taught me. There weren't many places back then who did it, even less now.
If i wanted a fancy staircase building I'd be happy to pay for your training and skill but... IME hanging doors isn't that difficult. I've done quite a few in the past and just wanted to do them better and quicker and therefore have the right tools without investing thousands.
Gtom said:
Tyre Tread said:
I don't doubt your skill and knowledge but hanging a door is the woodwork equivalent of changing a wheel on a car rather then rebuilding an engine.
If i wanted a fancy staircase building I'd be happy to pay for your training and skill but... IME hanging doors isn't that difficult. I've done quite a few in the past and just wanted to do them better and quicker and therefore have the right tools without investing thousands.
I guess the question that hasn’t been asked yet (I don’t think so anyway) how old is the house and what type of doors are you intending to fit? Obviously old houses almost always have casing that are out of plumb/level with twisted legs and 10mm difference in size from top to bottom and that’s where the experience comes in. If i wanted a fancy staircase building I'd be happy to pay for your training and skill but... IME hanging doors isn't that difficult. I've done quite a few in the past and just wanted to do them better and quicker and therefore have the right tools without investing thousands.
My brother in law has got the Rob Clevett jig and little 1/4” router and he says it’s spot on, he also had a cheap tracksaw for trimming the heads and bottoms which also speeds it up no end.
I guess it’s a case of how much you want to spend but you could always sell some stuff after to recoup some costs.
I don't have a track saw but can probably borrow one and I did thing about selling off the Trend jig if I bought it but one of the smalller jigs would probably do and therefore not a huge loss if I didn't re-sell it
This looks good and good value. Any thoughts?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ryobi-A99HT3-Installation...
And this?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ryobi-A99LM2-Installation...
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ryobi-A99HT3-Installation...
And this?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ryobi-A99LM2-Installation...
After much deliberation and procrastination, the doors I wanted came up on offer at the Local (Regional) builders merchants at £20+VAT off each so a reasonable saving. I have now ordered the doors and am back looking at routers etc.
The doors are Oak veneer and I must admit to being worried about damaging them having read the previous comments but will now gen up to remind myself of all the tips, tricks and advice and will report back in a while when I have begun/finished.
Thanks for all the input.
The doors are Oak veneer and I must admit to being worried about damaging them having read the previous comments but will now gen up to remind myself of all the tips, tricks and advice and will report back in a while when I have begun/finished.
Thanks for all the input.
Taff107 said:
Evoluzione said:
I don't disagree.
I have both and can use either very efficiently. I wouldn't buy a router to do 12, I wouldn't even get my router out to do two.
For the learner you have to make the decision which to learn, traditional or modern. Really one should come before the other, if your router is unavailable, stops working, cutter breaks whatever you're a bit buggered when you don't know how to do it manually.
It's like passing your driving test in an automatic.
You'll make a far bigger unrepairable mess of something with a machine than by hand though.
Everyone is different, my own thread has shown a surprising interest in getting back to basics with lime and doing masonry. There is a lot of enjoyment to be had in learning the traditional skills, using the tools and working with the material rather than just ploughing through it with a machine. It's good for the soul rather than just getting something done and out of the way.
Its all power tools for everything these days, When I did my apprenticeship in the 80's it was pretty much all manual. Learn to do it and do it well, manually first is far better in my opinion. As you have said, I could hang a door with a good chisel quicker than someone pissing about with a router. I have both and can use either very efficiently. I wouldn't buy a router to do 12, I wouldn't even get my router out to do two.
For the learner you have to make the decision which to learn, traditional or modern. Really one should come before the other, if your router is unavailable, stops working, cutter breaks whatever you're a bit buggered when you don't know how to do it manually.
It's like passing your driving test in an automatic.
You'll make a far bigger unrepairable mess of something with a machine than by hand though.
Everyone is different, my own thread has shown a surprising interest in getting back to basics with lime and doing masonry. There is a lot of enjoyment to be had in learning the traditional skills, using the tools and working with the material rather than just ploughing through it with a machine. It's good for the soul rather than just getting something done and out of the way.
Almost 3 months on and the doors are still standing in the hall.
I got slightly distracted with a Strange Rover.
Anyway, while waiting for parts to turn up I started to make a jig for the hinges and play with the router.
It took me a couple of attempts to make the jig satisfactorily and its nit that pretty but it works. Well, on scrap wood it does anyway. I haven't had chance or brave enough to try it on a real door yet.
I'll need to make a jig for the handle fitting too so that'll be next.
Wonder if I can get the doors fitted by Christmas?
I got slightly distracted with a Strange Rover.
Anyway, while waiting for parts to turn up I started to make a jig for the hinges and play with the router.
It took me a couple of attempts to make the jig satisfactorily and its nit that pretty but it works. Well, on scrap wood it does anyway. I haven't had chance or brave enough to try it on a real door yet.
I'll need to make a jig for the handle fitting too so that'll be next.
Wonder if I can get the doors fitted by Christmas?
AlmostUseful said:
I had 2x door stood in the room before I fitted them, one of the warped about 7mm on one corner, I’d lay them down if I were you…
Thanks, they were stood fully vertical but have checked them all and all seem square.I made a jig today for the hinges and to route out the recess for the catch.
I might even get some fitted this week
Wacky Racer said:
hyphen][Img said:
I have one of these.They are excellent.
S6PNJ said:
Tyre Tread said:
Wacky Racer said:
hyphen][Img said:
I have one of these.They are excellent.
https://media.screwfix.com/is/image//ae235?src=ae2...
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