Family protection dogs
Discussion
Hi
I'm looking at purchasing a family protection dog . Usual domestic family set up ie wife and two boys under the age of 13 and my elderly mother.
There are a lot of companies around and the costs are pretty significant. I must say I was quite shocked at just how much but have now got my head around it.
I can't afford to make a mistake both from a financial point of view and also for the potential repercussions for my family.
Could anybody suggest a reputable company?
Thank you.
I'm looking at purchasing a family protection dog . Usual domestic family set up ie wife and two boys under the age of 13 and my elderly mother.
There are a lot of companies around and the costs are pretty significant. I must say I was quite shocked at just how much but have now got my head around it.
I can't afford to make a mistake both from a financial point of view and also for the potential repercussions for my family.
Could anybody suggest a reputable company?
Thank you.
MYOB said:
Yes, DDR near Sittingbourne. You're aware of them then.
Yes, am aware of them. They are the first company I've come across but as I'm new to this I wanted to look at some other outfits. Also going by the dates of their reviews it doesn't seem as though they have been around for that long.Do you have personal experience of them?
Thank you
designforlife said:
What happens when the highly trained family protection dog accidentally mauls one of your son's friends because he looked at it the wrong way, or unknowingly acted as a threat?
Is that a serious question? Do you know anything about these kinds of dogs of have you just decided to make stuff up?warch said:
All you need is a dog that barks when someone comes onto the premises. My dog, a small collie b
h is good with my kids (and other peoples) but will bark if someone comes through the gate. Basically no one can come into the house or property without setting her off, day or night, which is a deterrent in most situations.
You'd be in a world of st if you owned a dangerous dog that attacks people, more so if there is an internet thread detailing your intention to have such a creature.
Sorry, who said anything about a dangerous dog? Certainly not me.h is good with my kids (and other peoples) but will bark if someone comes through the gate. Basically no one can come into the house or property without setting her off, day or night, which is a deterrent in most situations.You'd be in a world of s
t if you owned a dangerous dog that attacks people, more so if there is an internet thread detailing your intention to have such a creature. CAPP0 said:
I've kinda given up posting on PH these days but thought I'd chip in on this one. Who knows how that will end! But still...
OP, how much experience do you have of dogs? I can't say for certain but I would expect that trained protection dogs, notwithstanding their level of training, would need to be maintained very much in an "I'm pack leader" mode in order to be (a) effective and most importantly (b) safe.
Are there any reasons you wouldn't consider certain breeds but not a specifically-trained protection dog?
My own GSD, a 4 year old male, has not been trained to protect at all, not even slightly. On top of that. when he was young he was a fearful wuss. However, he has worked out for himself when to bark when something exciting is going on (for example, he LOVES our postie and goes bananas when she's coming along the close), when to bark when something's not quite right and he thinks he needs to be on full alert, and also when to bark when something is very definitely wrong and he believes he needs to step in. All these barks are completely different in tone and speed and we know which is which and react accordingly. For example, an unwanted caller at the door will get Bark 2, which is very useful in getting rid of them, but we also had someone snooping around our cars at 01.30 earlier this year and Bark 3 was very much in evidence, and got rid of the prowler once I'd got up and opened the door. He's backed up by our smaller GSD cross who is not quite as tuned-in as him but also has a different bark tones for different circumstances.
I don't know, and don't want to, whether he would actively step in if one of us was threatened. I suspect he would. But equally, the sight of a large dog from a guard breed with his teeth bared, hackles up and barking furiously would deter a lot of people before it got to that.
Another example - a friend also used to have a GSD, again a complete pet with zero security training. Her partner left her with a small baby, and the dog. She would bring him over to the field for exercise, with the baby in the pushchair, and let him run around, throw balls, etc. He was the perfect canine gentleman. But if anyone he didn't know approached the pushchair, he would just calmly, without any fuss, walk over and put himself between that person and the child. No noise, no fuss, just making sure the child was safe.
What's my point? I'm not quite sure! But I think what I'm saying is, if someone doesn't have much dog experience, I'm not sure a highly-trained protection dog is the right thing for them. Similarly, if you know your way around dogs, you can select a suitable breed/pet who'll do the job without all the potential collateral.
Just my 1p-worth. Hope it helps.
Thank you, thats very useful. I'm not about to go and purchase one tomorrow. I'm looking into the whole thing and have a load of due diligence to do before I think about commiting.OP, how much experience do you have of dogs? I can't say for certain but I would expect that trained protection dogs, notwithstanding their level of training, would need to be maintained very much in an "I'm pack leader" mode in order to be (a) effective and most importantly (b) safe.
Are there any reasons you wouldn't consider certain breeds but not a specifically-trained protection dog?
My own GSD, a 4 year old male, has not been trained to protect at all, not even slightly. On top of that. when he was young he was a fearful wuss. However, he has worked out for himself when to bark when something exciting is going on (for example, he LOVES our postie and goes bananas when she's coming along the close), when to bark when something's not quite right and he thinks he needs to be on full alert, and also when to bark when something is very definitely wrong and he believes he needs to step in. All these barks are completely different in tone and speed and we know which is which and react accordingly. For example, an unwanted caller at the door will get Bark 2, which is very useful in getting rid of them, but we also had someone snooping around our cars at 01.30 earlier this year and Bark 3 was very much in evidence, and got rid of the prowler once I'd got up and opened the door. He's backed up by our smaller GSD cross who is not quite as tuned-in as him but also has a different bark tones for different circumstances.
I don't know, and don't want to, whether he would actively step in if one of us was threatened. I suspect he would. But equally, the sight of a large dog from a guard breed with his teeth bared, hackles up and barking furiously would deter a lot of people before it got to that.
Another example - a friend also used to have a GSD, again a complete pet with zero security training. Her partner left her with a small baby, and the dog. She would bring him over to the field for exercise, with the baby in the pushchair, and let him run around, throw balls, etc. He was the perfect canine gentleman. But if anyone he didn't know approached the pushchair, he would just calmly, without any fuss, walk over and put himself between that person and the child. No noise, no fuss, just making sure the child was safe.
What's my point? I'm not quite sure! But I think what I'm saying is, if someone doesn't have much dog experience, I'm not sure a highly-trained protection dog is the right thing for them. Similarly, if you know your way around dogs, you can select a suitable breed/pet who'll do the job without all the potential collateral.
Just my 1p-worth. Hope it helps.
I don't need a full on protection dog, I'm not a VIP or drug dealer. I do however need a dog that is highly obedient/trained.
Your point about the natural instincts of many breeds is an important one and initially that was my plan ie by a GSD as a pup and let it do its thing.
However after reading some of the blurb (marketing) on the protection dogs websites they make the opposite case.
They say allowing the dog to decide who to be aggressive to and in what amount could potentially lead to disaster.
Better to have a dog trained not to be aggressive to anyone unless instructed to by the owner or in specific situations.
Whether this is true or not I don't know. As I said I'm still researching.
I appreciate your input.
rufusgti said:
He's asking you a fairly straight forward question actually. You are asking for advice on acquiring a dog that has the purpose of protecting your family. You have not stated how you expect this dog will do that. But seeing as almost any dog will bark at someone approaching the property, we can only presume you mean a dog that will take further steps.. I think thats fair to presume.
Ok, so as asked, how will you guarantee that one of your childrens friends wont be seen as a threat as they roll around playing or run around shouting as kids do.
As a young teen a friend had a doberman that was ferociously protective. It would constantly position itself between him and any guests. We were all bitten at one point over the years and nobody liked being there. Looking back it was ridiculous that the parents let it happen. We now know it was a deterrent for bailiffs but as a young lad it was just a massive scary, fierce tyrant.
We dont know Anything about your situation, so it's fair that you get asked when you come on a public forum for advice. likewise It's fair if you want to ignore the question.
HiOk, so as asked, how will you guarantee that one of your childrens friends wont be seen as a threat as they roll around playing or run around shouting as kids do.
As a young teen a friend had a doberman that was ferociously protective. It would constantly position itself between him and any guests. We were all bitten at one point over the years and nobody liked being there. Looking back it was ridiculous that the parents let it happen. We now know it was a deterrent for bailiffs but as a young lad it was just a massive scary, fierce tyrant.
We dont know Anything about your situation, so it's fair that you get asked when you come on a public forum for advice. likewise It's fair if you want to ignore the question.
I'm happy to give more info but only when asked in a reasonable manner as you have done. Not when somebody feels that they can cross examine me, question my judgement or worse still accuse me of trying to buy a dangerous dog to maul all and sundry. I'm not interested.
If people actually read my posts they would see that I said a family pet is first and foremost, obedience is paramount as I have age ranges of 11 to almost 80 in my household. I also specifically said I DON'T want an attack dog. Yet people still imply I want a dangerous dog that wants to eat children.
Rant over lol. I have to disagree with your point that all dogs will bark at a stranger approaching the property. Ok they will but they won't fulfil my requirement of being a deterrent as most burglars won't give a crap about a yapping small dog.
Rufus, I've also said quite a few times on this thread that I have only just started researching. What I wanted was some suggestions for respectable companies that sell so called protection dogs and then I would decide if they are suitable or not. If they aren't I won't buy one.
I can make that judgement call.
Regards
makaveli144 said:
Unfortunately PH probably isn't the best place to get the advice you are after. This is quite a niche area.
I have no idea how much research you have already done and depending on how soon you are wanting the dog, I would recommend going to a working dog show. There was one down south a couple of months ago, I will see if I can find dates for the next.
This will give you the opportunity to see and speak to the handlers/trainers. It will also show you what the dogs are capable of and then you can decide if its definitely what you want.
You will need some training yourself on how to be a confident handler. The dogs themselves should have and on/off command. They don't wander round in a constant state of hyper awareness and aggression contrary to some of the comments on here.They will also have a release command should they ever have the need to bite.
That been said they can be very very serious, and you need to be 100% sure you are ready for it and it's what you want.
Thank you. amongst all the noise a few people get it. I don't yet know if this is the right thing for me or not. However I would guess that a well trained protection dog living in a well balanced family is highly unlikely to attack anybody.I have no idea how much research you have already done and depending on how soon you are wanting the dog, I would recommend going to a working dog show. There was one down south a couple of months ago, I will see if I can find dates for the next.
This will give you the opportunity to see and speak to the handlers/trainers. It will also show you what the dogs are capable of and then you can decide if its definitely what you want.
You will need some training yourself on how to be a confident handler. The dogs themselves should have and on/off command. They don't wander round in a constant state of hyper awareness and aggression contrary to some of the comments on here.They will also have a release command should they ever have the need to bite.
That been said they can be very very serious, and you need to be 100% sure you are ready for it and it's what you want.
In fact I don't recall that any of the awful and sometimes fatal dog attacks in recent memory being committed by professionally trained protection dogs.
Happy to be corrected on that.
As I said before, I have only just started looking into this. It may very well end up not being the right thing for my family.
Thanks for your input
Thanks. I'm not expecting it to be a walk in the park (ahem), and have not yet made up my mind whether the family can cope with the demands of a dog like this. Or whether it is suitable for my family in other ways.
Hence my request for some reputable companies to go and visit and then try and make a sensible decision.
Thank you to those who have made a positive contribution to the thread. The voices of reason are some times drowned out by the usual knee jerk mob who assume only they have good judgement and everybody elses is flawed.
Hence my request for some reputable companies to go and visit and then try and make a sensible decision.
Thank you to those who have made a positive contribution to the thread. The voices of reason are some times drowned out by the usual knee jerk mob who assume only they have good judgement and everybody elses is flawed.
So said:
Deep, apologies if I have missed something, but why do you believe you need a family protection dog? Who do you believe you need to protect your family from?
So, a family protection dog is just a term that is used and not one that I made up.I think I've explained my circumstances and what I would like. I'll recap. I'm a normal family guy, ie not a drug dealer, loan shark etc who needs an attack dog nor a VIP who is subject to some specific threat.
As I said in my very first post, I would like the dog to act as a deterrent against unauthorised access to my property ie burglary or home invasion.
These kind of dogs seem to commonly be called 'family protection dogs', that's why I used the term.
It's not my belief that just any yapping dog will do this, your opinion may differ.
Thanks
citizensm1th said:
I am unsure if the op is of the opinion that a dog is like some kind of machine, that you can buy ready trained and then do little or no follow up training.
If he is thinking that he is in for a rude awakening.
So once again you assume that only you know what is involved and everybody else is stupid? Do you behave like this when you're not behind a keyboard?If he is thinking that he is in for a rude awakening.
Unbelievable
So said:
Yes I read your comments about what you are not. But you clearly feel the need for protection.
I am not sure if you know, but criminals who really want to get at you or your assets have ways of dealing with dogs that are really very unpleasant. Very, very unpleasant.
Keep a dog by all means, but there are more effective deterrents that don’t need feeding and don’t poo in the garden.
Interesting that you say that I feel the need for protection as though it is something that isn't universal. Can I assume that you don't feel that way? So you leave your doors unlocked? Do you tell your wife and kids to walk down dark alleys on their own in the wee small hours?I am not sure if you know, but criminals who really want to get at you or your assets have ways of dealing with dogs that are really very unpleasant. Very, very unpleasant.
Keep a dog by all means, but there are more effective deterrents that don’t need feeding and don’t poo in the garden.
It's just a matter of degrees.
I take your point that even a highly trained dog can be defeated. But then our army could be defeated by many others in the world, shall we not bother with an army then? The locks on your front door could probably be defeated in minutes, shall we not bother with those? Your window smashed in seconds, shall we just leave those open?
I'm genuinely interested in the more effective deterrents you mentioned especially if it doesn't involve poo in my garden. But please don't say CCTV cameras and lights that go on at dusk lol
MYOB said:
For those against the idea, the OP will hopefully talk to the reputable providers of these ready trained dogs and will be advised what is best for his situation. They are more likely to suggest a dog that will alert rather than an all out attack dog.
Some of you seem to think the OP wants a dangerous dog that will attack, bite and maul. That's not what he said he wants. A dog that offers protection CAN simply be a family pet that is trained to alert and deter if there are intruders
By doing his due diligence, hopefully the OP will get the right dog that fulfills his requirements.
OP, carry on with your research and talk to the specialists. Talk to more than one so you can do all the due diligence necessary, which I believe is your intention. In all likelihood, you will mostly be recommended to get a family type breed that can be trained to alert, rather than an aggressive breed that is purely for security purposes.
Good luck.
Thank you, nail on head! Why do so many others fail to grasp what I have said time and time again? Some of you seem to think the OP wants a dangerous dog that will attack, bite and maul. That's not what he said he wants. A dog that offers protection CAN simply be a family pet that is trained to alert and deter if there are intruders
By doing his due diligence, hopefully the OP will get the right dog that fulfills his requirements.
OP, carry on with your research and talk to the specialists. Talk to more than one so you can do all the due diligence necessary, which I believe is your intention. In all likelihood, you will mostly be recommended to get a family type breed that can be trained to alert, rather than an aggressive breed that is purely for security purposes.
Good luck.
Jim on the hill said:
The answer to your question was in what I quoted.
As an owner of "guard dog" breeds I am always worried when inexperienced people who can't really explain why they require a dog like this wants to get involved.
I can see that you clearly know everything apart from how to Google for someone who will sell you a bodyguard in a dog suit.
Maybe you should move to a nicer area or hit the gym so you feel a bit more confident.
I wish you the best of luck in finding peace
So you've decided that you know what sort of area I Iive in? That's quite amazing, you're one super awesome dude.As an owner of "guard dog" breeds I am always worried when inexperienced people who can't really explain why they require a dog like this wants to get involved.
I can see that you clearly know everything apart from how to Google for someone who will sell you a bodyguard in a dog suit.
Maybe you should move to a nicer area or hit the gym so you feel a bit more confident.
I wish you the best of luck in finding peace
If you think the amount I can bench press has any part to play in this conversation I think it speaks volumes about you.
Jag_NE said:
OP. Applying some harsh logic here, if the cost of the dog is troubling you, you probably don’t have assets that will attract hardcore thieves. If you can confirm that you haven’t seriously irritated any local psychos, a guard dog will be an expensive waste of time for you. I’d also argue that the risk of a big dog going loco on a family member is greater than that of a random and hypothetical intruder. Buy a cctv camera and a Labrador if you really want a dog.
Why do PHers insist on making assumptions about people? Who said the cost of the dog is troubling me? I said I didn't want to make a financial mistake, thats just good sense and not the same as the cost troubling me.Btw, do you know how much one of the fully trained dogs from the top companies cost? Starting price is £12k + vat, up to £20k.
Deep said:
Why do PHers insist on making assumptions about people? Who said the cost of the dog is troubling me? I said I didn't want to make a financial mistake, thats just good sense and not the same as the cost troubling me.
Btw, do you know how much one of the fully trained dogs from the top companies cost? Starting price is £12k + vat, up to £20k.
And I hate to have to say this as it's not my nature, but yes, I could buy one or even two of those dogs without batting an eyelid.Btw, do you know how much one of the fully trained dogs from the top companies cost? Starting price is £12k + vat, up to £20k.
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