Ask an Engineer anything

[Fusion777]

Thought I'd jump on the bandwagon/pass on some useful information. Don't want to be super specific about everything as like to keep some anonymity, but can hopefully offer some insights/advice/opinions for anyone interested.

In short- work in manufacturing engineering. 10 years experience. Came through the uni route. Worked for a few different firms in different UK regions. Find the job enjoyable and very varied, and would recommend it. Fire away

[Fusion777]

h0bbsy said:

How hard is it to compete with overseas competition, eg outsourcing to China?

The companies I've worked for don't really have this issue. We've developed, patented and own our own designs. A precision/metrology company I was at had very, very nice profit margins on their products. They also developed a great reputation for after sales service, which many companies in general just lack. We would also liaise with the end user from start to finish- advise them on what kit they needed, install it, service it, upgrade it, etc, etc. It's really a fully package.

The company I'm at now has similar advantages in that our products are all bespoke- not off the shelf. Customers come to us with a requirement, and we develop it from start to finish. It can all be done in both cases with a far eastern company, but it would be much, much harder.

Develop/offer something original, bespoke, high quality or with great service, and you can prosper manufacturing in the UK.

[Fusion777]

Clifford Chambers said:

When you've something that works perfectly well, why do feel the need to fiddle?

I'm thinking of the guy who thought it was a good idea to do away with dipsticks for instance.

Depends what it is! Some things have stood the test of time, and don't need to be fiddled with. Many things can be improved, one way or another. Technology is evolving all the time. Lasers are playing a much bigger part in assembly processes, whether it's cutting, welding, marking/etching, you name it.

The technology is there to be taken advantage of, and it can be faster, better, and more reliable.

[Fusion777]

Ambleton said:

What sort of manufacturing engineer?

Are you a process engineer that designs the processes and the route through the manufacturing process from one end to the other?

A fixtures and robots design engineer for the manufacturing processes, actually designing in CAD the robots and handling process?

A coder that designs the robots tool and paths and what they do from one thing to the next?

(It will change the questions asked)

I'm actually involved in all three, although we tend to buy robots off the shelf rather than design them. We modify them and add tooling for them though.

[Fusion777]

h0b0 said:

Do you get angry when plumbers call themselves “heating engineers”?

Yes! Although they're actually more befitting of the title than techies that install phone lines and routers, etc.

[Fusion777]

r159 said:

My lad (year 7) was in some engineering careers on line thing on Friday, he was very interested, when I asked him what kind the Engineer the speaker was things were a bit vague.

Eventually I managed to prise out that the person managed people in engineering....this I had to explain was what happened when you worked your way up the ladder, which put him off a bit.

Needing to be good at maths did make him happy though as it’s his favourite subject.

Engineering is a vast field, there are so many different roles and disciplines. That's good that he's good at maths- you don't necessarily need to be a whizz in it to succeed, it's more that it enables you to take the right degree course or do well in the theoretical modules if you go down the apprenticeship route.

It does help to have an analytical mind, naturally. But don't be put off if you're not an A grade Maths student.

[Fusion777]

dvs_dave said:

Do you think the title of “Engineer” should be a protected one in the UK, as it is in other countries? And do you think this lack of protection has eroded both the interest in, but also the market value of the profession?

I'm speaking out of self interest here, but it would be nice. I don't think it's eroded interest in engineering, but I don't think the profession has the same prestige levels as others, nor are engineers as well regarded as in other countries. That might sound a little bit conceited, but it's just my personal opinion.

[Fusion777]

Clifford Chambers said:

Oh, and you're just like the engineers at work.

"ask us anything"

We've asked you 3 things and you've not replied yet. i

I laughed

[Fusion777]

coppernorks said:

As any fule kno a straight line is the shortest distance between two points so why
is the Liverpool Queensway Tunnel anything but straight, it swerves all over the place ?

Looks pretty straight to me under the water- presuming you mean at the ends? If there wasn't a large bend radius in the route, it would have to be very steep to rise to ground level from the level it's at below water. This is less of a problem now, but it was built in the 1930s when vehicles didn't have anywhere near the power levels they have now.

[Fusion777]

Cyder said:

Do you get annoyed when the design engineers keep changing the design and expect you to modify your robots/manufacturing process to keep up with the changes?

Asking for a friend

This can be an issue, for sure. If things are communicated well in advance, then it's usually fine. But we do get design changes dropped on us at short notice. When we're in the early stages of a project, things can change with pretty much zero notice.

Being a great multi-tasker is probably one of the most desirable attributes needed to do well in this field. Being adaptable, too. These words always sound like CV buzzwords, but they really are essential. I've met engineers who are steadfast in refusing to adapt and be flexible, and they always end up being worse off for it. It's no good trying to take the high ground every time- you've got to give and take.

It's like being on a battlefield at times

[Fusion777]

dudleybloke said:

How strong do you make your tea?

99% of the time, I'm a coffee man (and yes, I drink a fair bit). If I have tea, it's always black.

[Fusion777]

jet_noise said:

Much resonance, I was on the other side - design electronics man & boy /fast show.

Are you making assemblies or parts?
And are they mech or elect or a bit of both?

Assemblies. The firms I've been at have made some of their own parts too though- machined components, injection moulded parts and surface mount PCBs. They've always been mechanical and electronics. Have worked with allsorts from lasers, LIDAR systems, infra-red ranging hardware, plenty of bits in the automotive world (motorbikes, supercars, agriculture) and more.

[Fusion777]

Thought I'd help some more by adding some questions and answers of my own

What do you do?

Take a concept from design to full production. This includes all aspects from deciding how the product will be made, to specifying, sourcing, installing and setting up of equipment, jigs and fixtures, having input in the product design, performing capability analysis and fault finding on products.

The role is incredibly varied and can also entail investigation and research into new technologies and materials, resolution of production issues, flow and lean type improvements, product cost reduction and other cost saving exercises. It can be highly theoretical (diving into Minitab performing statistical analysis, FMEAs) or completely hands on.

What are the best bits?

Lots of things! Learning about new technology and putting it into practice is a big one, particularly when it’s a step change over existing technology (as I’ve mentioned before, laser welding is a great example of this). Dealing with a vast array of people and departments. Variety and rarely getting bored. There being tons of potential opportunities to improve things. Working with some talented, dedicated and committed people.

Worst bits?

There are many different management styles and cultures as in any field, and some will suit you more than others. The place I’m at now is very lean and things happen quickly, which I like. I’ve been in more bureaucratic environments before which were meeting-heavy, and it can take the energy out of you at times. On the flip side, if a place is too quick to dive into decision making, things can end up rushed and confusion can reign. You need the right balance of planning and action. Pay is decent but not stellar.

What are the prospects like for Engineering in the UK?

Great! There is generally a shortage of engineers, particularly experienced people. It’s a huge field, and can be incredibly specialised. You don’t even have to work in manufacturing. All sorts of enterprises require skills gained in engineering- I’ve seen adverts from e-commerce and logistics businesses and financial services for process engineering type roles.

What would you recommend to anyone starting out?

Ask lots of questions! There’s lots to learn, and the faster you can learn, the greater an asset you’ll be. Find a good mentor(s). Volunteer for extra experience in different areas of the business if you’re really keen to learn and get on. Don’t be scared of proposing new things, but make sure you’ve done your research and thought about how your ideas are relevant. You can gain familiarity with CAD/stats software at home- free drawing programs such as FreeCAD exist.

My Dad/mate/teacher/source of information says engineering and manufacturing are dying/dead in this country

This is far from the truth. Engineers will always be needed, unless we develop a race of robots with strong AI capabilities, by which time we might all be retired early. Engineers are basically problem solvers, and there are lots of problems. 3D printing/additive manufacturing is a great technology which could (and is) taking work from machining businesses, but they still need people to design the parts that go on the printers. Engineers are still needed to design the machines that make the parts. There is still a healthy, thriving manufacturing sector in the UK, that spans many disciplines. Certain steel mills and car plants may be closing, but a plethora of new businesses and sectors are taking their place.

Great! Where do I start?

STEM subject at a good university or a quality apprenticeship (which do still exist. Places are very competitive though). Industry experience if you’re doing a degree will help you massively.

Edited by Fusion777 on Saturday 6th March 20:26

Edited by Fusion777 on Saturday 6th March 20:30

[Fusion777]

S6PNJ said:

WW or BSF?

Going back a bit there

[Fusion777]

S6PNJ said:

Just checking credentials. OK, BA or UNF then?

I quite like staying in the 21st Century, thanks! It’s bad enough when we have to deal with stateside organisations still using inches full stop. #4 this, TPI that. Join the rest of the world, America.

There are still people in the industry that refer to the “thou”, even though they’re young enough to have been taught in metric at school. Guess old habits die hard.

[Fusion777]

mcg_ said:

are you underpaid?

I'd say I'm ballpark for my experience level/industry. Would definitely appreciate more though. Given the skillset many engineers bring to the table, compensation can be lacking compared to many other sectors.

A good thing is that jobs are spread throughout the country, so you're not forced to live in London, the SE or anywhere really expensive, which helps.

[Fusion777]

r159 said:

Which university did you study at and do you think the course content was relevant to the job you do?

I actually did Physics at a Russell Group institution, which had particular relevance as I'd studied/done quite a lot of work on lasers/optical systems. I've always been hands on and have a wide range of interests.

Relevance of course content overall? Frankly, a lot of it isn't directly relevant. I think this would be the case for Mechanical Engineering also though. A lot of courses are heavy on theory, and you don't tend to use that much of your strictly theoretical knowledge in something like manufacturing.

I did the course that interested me the most though, rather than what would net me the largest salary or be the most applicable to the jobs market. It's strange that your degree defines you a bit when you start out, because I think like many people that we're just people orientated towards a particular way of thinking which can adapt to lots of different scenarios. I'm equally happy learning about manufacturing engineering as I am philosophy, and economics. I've always been a naturally curious person that just wants to absorb knowledge and pass it on.

[Fusion777]

h0b0 said:

I realize the question was aimed at the OP, as it’s his thread, I still want to provide an answer. I went to the University of Birmingham and graduated in 2000.

Many people question the value of education at all levels. “Algebra! When will I use that?!?!?”

Engineering provides a mind set and a logical approach to understanding and solving complex problems. Being able to see through the many stages and link everything together. Breaking down an issue to solvable components. This can apply to any situation inside work and at home. Does an engineering degree provide an engineering mind? Probably not. But, it can provide some of the skills to those that aspire and can hone the skills of those that have it. I spent 3 years with some of the smartest (drug/alcohol abusing) people I have even met. I don’t expect them to all be engineers now, I am not, but in a room of people I would expect them to be the problem solvers.

Exactly.

[Fusion777]

lord trumpton said:

OP - how you finding CI? Your life will revolve around this ethos right?

Edited by lord trumpton on Sunday 7th March 04:41

I'm a full paid up subscriber of CI/Six Sigma and associated methodologies. Unfortunately, it seems many companies are not! I think there's a distrust of systems sometimes, and a lack of willingness to throw resources at solving problems properly in this sort of structured manner. It does require lots of time, meetings and analysis. But how else are you supposed to bottom out root causes properly, to prevent the same kind of issues cropping up over and over?

As mentioned earlier, I'm intensely logical and love systems and structure. Many engineers are similar. But you have to work within the confines of accounting-orientated mindsets, where time and money sometimes matter more than providing the most complete solution. I get it- we're in business at the end of day, not the academic world where we can sit around all day discussing and pondering. But you need a balance of getting things done and seeing the big picture or what will help the business long term.

[Fusion777]

Poisson96 said:

What's your thoughts on apprenticeship training vs university for going into the area?

Good question. Another posted touched on this- that apprenticeships can be as good as, if not better than doing a degree. I'm inclined to agree. If you're sure that you want to work in engineering, then apprenticeships are a great route. I've met and worked with plenty of apprentices, and overall I've been really impressed. They tend to be genuinely passionate about the field and industry and knowledgable/skilled, especially on the practical side.

I don't think the lack of a full degree hinders them at all. In something like manufacturing, a lot of what you learn is on the job anyway. What I've tended to find is that by working in a mixed team, knowledge of certain things (like six sigma for example) can be passed around from member to member. You don't all need to go on a particular course. An apprentice working in several different teams over 4 years is going to absorb a ton of knowledge, and be well versed in dealing in real life problem solving.

It depends what the individual wants. You've got to be fairly sure at 18 (or thereabouts) that you want to work in that sort of field, even if it is initially. I didn't know at that age exactly what I field I wanted to work in- only what I wanted to study. You're tying up 4 years of your life early on, and are most likely going to be working/studying within a smallish radius of where you live, and you'll be living at home still. You'll be earning though while your friends aren't (or you'll be earning more), and you won't have the debt that they'll have.

I, and many others were fortunate in that we could study before the £9k+ a year tuition fees, which is scandalous really, especially for STEM subjects. I don't think it would have put me off, though.