Is Scots a language or dialect?
Discussion
This came up in the angry Scots thread but thought it worth its own discussion. To be honest I had never heard that Scots was considered a language in its own right. I had always assumed it was a regional dialect of English - albeit one more difficult to understand than many.
Swiss German is usually seen as a dialect of German yet in my experience it is at least, it not more different, from standard German than Scots appears to be different to standard English.
I suppose if it were a separate language then that increases the number of languages I understand by one.
Swiss German is usually seen as a dialect of German yet in my experience it is at least, it not more different, from standard German than Scots appears to be different to standard English.
I suppose if it were a separate language then that increases the number of languages I understand by one.
GrizzlyBear said:
I believe Scottish is a P-Gaelic Language with similar roots to Irish, (the Cornish, Welsh and Breton Languages being distinct Q-Gaelic, and they are apparently quite different), unsurprisingly it was more common on the West side of Scotland, I think there is also a Scottish Language on the East side that is a derivative of old English (I know there are going to be some protests about that...).
Although, I also understand that there are also some more southerly areas of Scotland where the language was more similar to Welsh, in fact I think there were some connections between clans of Sothern Scotland and the tribes of North Wales.
Scots is not Scottish Gaelic (which was my preconception).Although, I also understand that there are also some more southerly areas of Scotland where the language was more similar to Welsh, in fact I think there were some connections between clans of Sothern Scotland and the tribes of North Wales.
This is an example of modern Scots:
Noo the nativitie o' Jesus Christ was this gate: whan his mither Mary was mairry't till Joseph, 'or they cam thegither, she was fund wi' bairn o' the Holie Spirit.
Than her guidman, Joseph, bein an upricht man, and no desirin her name sud be i' teh mooth o' the public, was ettlin to pit her awa' hidlins.
wisbech said:
The difference between a dialect and a language is politics...
There's more difference between Scottish English and Standard English than there is between Norwegian and Danish - and Norwegian became an official language rather than a dialect when Norway separated from Sweden.
Similarly, Cantonese is more different to Mandarin than Spanish to French, but is called a dialect
Who calls Cantonese a dialect? The CCP? Cantonese is a much a dialect of Mandarin as English is a dialect of German. There's more difference between Scottish English and Standard English than there is between Norwegian and Danish - and Norwegian became an official language rather than a dialect when Norway separated from Sweden.
Similarly, Cantonese is more different to Mandarin than Spanish to French, but is called a dialect
wisbech said:
Swedish, Danish and Norwegian are all mutually intelligible dialects, but count as 3 different languages for political reasons. (Icelandic has diverged a longer way).
One of the reasons why Scandi's can get away with two years less of school, but end up as well or better educated is that their languages where all basically codified relatively recently, so the spelling is very close to the pronunciation. So less effort required to become literate. English, as we all know, has a large gap between spoken and written forms, especially if your dialect is not standard.
Scots was the official language of Scotland in the 15th and 16th centuries, but the merger with England turned it into a dialect
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scots_language
Not sure of your point above.One of the reasons why Scandi's can get away with two years less of school, but end up as well or better educated is that their languages where all basically codified relatively recently, so the spelling is very close to the pronunciation. So less effort required to become literate. English, as we all know, has a large gap between spoken and written forms, especially if your dialect is not standard.
Scots was the official language of Scotland in the 15th and 16th centuries, but the merger with England turned it into a dialect
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scots_language
Edited by wisbech on Monday 8th March 02:43
Edited by wisbech on Monday 8th March 02:45
Many years ago I tried to learn some Danish. The grammar and vocabulary were not that difficult but pronunciation was a nightmare - didn’t seem much correspondence between what was written on the page and what came out of Danish people’s mouths.
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