Obesity, is it really an illness or a lifestyle choice?
Discussion
BBC article suggests it is genetic, biological and 'how we live today'.
I'm a little sceptical.
Living with obesity: 'My genes mean I’m hard-wired to store fat' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57419041
I'm a little sceptical.
Living with obesity: 'My genes mean I’m hard-wired to store fat' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57419041
BritishBlitz87 said:
In summary, no, we just eat too much and losing weight is bloody hard work with temptation on every corner.
That seems to be the most common cause. Unhealthy food is cheap and easy, the discipline to reduce weight and get fit is hard.Now the hidden costs, like diabetes are becoming clear perhaps it is time to treat the obese in the same ways as smokers or alcoholics. The sugar tax seems to have had little effect, what else can be done?
FNG said:
And if you’re right (I think you’re wrong) how do you get someone to change from that mindset to one that will get them to lose the lard? Tell them to pull themselves together?
That is one way. How did we reduce smoking? Heavy taxation, restricting purchase and consumption, great social pressure. A lot of stick, little carrot.What would you see as being effective?
FNG said:
We didn't tell smokers to pull themselves together, that's not one way of tackling it at all.
Punitive taxes on sugary, takeaway, processed or fast foods, yes that may have an impact. Can you see it happening? I can imagine the backlash.
Without high taxation and restricting purchase options, you're left with social pressure. Basically fat shaming. Not going to make many people change their ways when if they had any self respect and motivation, they'd already be losing weight or wouldn't have gained it in the first place.
First step might be getting away from the "fat prisons", "eat less", "it's laziness pure and simple" mindset that some have outlined on here and start treating it as addiction, depression, self esteem, self image. Alongside positive reinforcement of the benefits and the fact that the vast majority of people can do it if they try, but that it's hard and it takes time.
All that said, it was interesting that the BBC article mentioned that essentially there's a body-memory aspect, so if you get large then diet, your body can strive to recover to that size again. That's biological and evolutionary, and I don't know how you combat that to be honest.
It does also suggest though that recognising that people find it incredibly hard to lose weight and keep it off is the very first stepping stone along the way. The lack of empathy shown in some of this thread is depressingly familiar and I'd suggest combating that is as important as helping individuals to recognise their potential and fight their demons.
So, in summary, the opposite approach to smoking cessation, much more carrot than stick.Punitive taxes on sugary, takeaway, processed or fast foods, yes that may have an impact. Can you see it happening? I can imagine the backlash.
Without high taxation and restricting purchase options, you're left with social pressure. Basically fat shaming. Not going to make many people change their ways when if they had any self respect and motivation, they'd already be losing weight or wouldn't have gained it in the first place.
First step might be getting away from the "fat prisons", "eat less", "it's laziness pure and simple" mindset that some have outlined on here and start treating it as addiction, depression, self esteem, self image. Alongside positive reinforcement of the benefits and the fact that the vast majority of people can do it if they try, but that it's hard and it takes time.
All that said, it was interesting that the BBC article mentioned that essentially there's a body-memory aspect, so if you get large then diet, your body can strive to recover to that size again. That's biological and evolutionary, and I don't know how you combat that to be honest.
It does also suggest though that recognising that people find it incredibly hard to lose weight and keep it off is the very first stepping stone along the way. The lack of empathy shown in some of this thread is depressingly familiar and I'd suggest combating that is as important as helping individuals to recognise their potential and fight their demons.
As an ex smoker, the fat shaming type social pressure was a very effective incentive to stop.
I suspect the answer is to make obesity less socially acceptable, much like other socially harmful habits. The trick is how to do that quickly, effectively and with respect.
Mexico is an interesting study in the growth of obesity. Not much mention anything but poor diet.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/...
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/...
deckster said:
Thank god you're here. Because, y,'know, nobody else has ever said that. And now you're here, to tell us all the blindingly f
king obvious, the obesity epidemic is solved! Future generations will bow down before your (slim, toned) image in thanks that after your piercing insight was shared on an obscure web forum in mid-2021, there were no more fat people, ever. Because now we know that there are no other factors - psychology is bunk, sugar isn't addictive, dopamine doesn't exist, people aren't susceptible to advertising, peer pressure isn't a thing. Everybody just exercise more and eat less. Damn, I wish we'd thought of that years ago.
Cretin.
For future reference, we don't do signatures on PH.king obvious, the obesity epidemic is solved! Future generations will bow down before your (slim, toned) image in thanks that after your piercing insight was shared on an obscure web forum in mid-2021, there were no more fat people, ever. Because now we know that there are no other factors - psychology is bunk, sugar isn't addictive, dopamine doesn't exist, people aren't susceptible to advertising, peer pressure isn't a thing. Everybody just exercise more and eat less. Damn, I wish we'd thought of that years ago.Cretin.
Adverts for unhealthy foods banned pre 21:00.
Anti-obesity drive: Junk food TV adverts to be banned before 9pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-57593599
Anti-obesity drive: Junk food TV adverts to be banned before 9pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-57593599
smn159 said:
GloverMart said:
"Can I lose 2 pounds a week by consuming less & doing lots of walking (nothing strenuous like cycling or running)?" The answer to that is also "Yes"
If it was me I'd want to be factoring some decent exercise in that significantly raises the heart rate while losing 8 stones - you're doing it for health reasons after all, so why not exercise properly as well? Good luck though
Using an app like my fitness pal is useful for keeping any eye on what is good or not good. Helps stay focussed.
glazbagun said:
If you look at the NHS "healthy platter" it's the same it's been for years- a mix of carbs, proteins and vegetables.
If you live on fast food you're not going to be close to that.
I'm not obese but living in a flat share I do find that it takes my old student/gym mentality to burn my valuable remaining spare time on cooking up something decent at the end of the day when I can afford junk food.
I think a generational change has occurred where people are less likely to cook and we importantly now follow working patterns which allow undisciplined snacking. So rather than going to work on an egg before standing at a machine all day, we start off with two coffees and graze on treats whilst sat at our desk all morning.
I have watched with mild dismay at a some of the pretty young office girls who started work young and slim and are now carrying loads of fat in the space of only a year or two. Sitting down at work all day before sitting down with Netflix should require bare minimum calories but both behaviours invite grazing.
The lockdown fattening up?If you live on fast food you're not going to be close to that.
I'm not obese but living in a flat share I do find that it takes my old student/gym mentality to burn my valuable remaining spare time on cooking up something decent at the end of the day when I can afford junk food.
I think a generational change has occurred where people are less likely to cook and we importantly now follow working patterns which allow undisciplined snacking. So rather than going to work on an egg before standing at a machine all day, we start off with two coffees and graze on treats whilst sat at our desk all morning.
I have watched with mild dismay at a some of the pretty young office girls who started work young and slim and are now carrying loads of fat in the space of only a year or two. Sitting down at work all day before sitting down with Netflix should require bare minimum calories but both behaviours invite grazing.
Edited by glazbagun on Tuesday 27th July 06:45
Lockdown weight gain averaging half a stone - survey https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57968651
SlimJim16v said:
Something that popped up on my Facebook. I'd be ashamed to leave the house, let alone post videos of myself if I looked like that.
https://m.facebook.com/watch/?v=499334738253705&am...
Those teeth are gruesomehttps://m.facebook.com/watch/?v=499334738253705&am...
Super Sonic said:
My brother went abroad at not inconsiderable expense and risk to have an operation to have half his insides removed so he could lose weight. He steadily put on weight since puberty til he hit twenty-four stone and had serious back, knee and ankle pain. All this time he held down a job as a mechanic and mot tester, so no, it's not a lifestyle choice. Try putting your self in someone else's place before making judgements. FFS
It is an addiction much like alcohol or smoking.Seems that having bariatric blocking treatment tends towards treating symptoms rather than the disease, but great if works and stops the real desire to overconsume.
The Moose said:
eldar said:
Super Sonic said:
My brother went abroad at not inconsiderable expense and risk to have an operation to have half his insides removed so he could lose weight. He steadily put on weight since puberty til he hit twenty-four stone and had serious back, knee and ankle pain. All this time he held down a job as a mechanic and mot tester, so no, it's not a lifestyle choice. Try putting your self in someone else's place before making judgements. FFS
It is an addiction much like alcohol or smoking.Seems that having bariatric blocking treatment tends towards treating symptoms rather than the disease, but great if works and stops the real desire to overconsume.
It is certainly a very useful treatment, but patients need to understand the range of possible outcomes.
I wonder why the brother went abroad for treatment, the NHS does offer it.
LordGrover said:
'They' say all kinds of things, though I think it's not quite as simple as that.
The consensus seems to be the combination of sugar and fats in highly processed foods, plus the alchemy employed to make these products hyper-palatable. Another popular combination for the food industry is fat and salt, which has a similar effect. Pretty much all the fats used in these products is from industrial seed oils which are novel, and when combined with sugar and/or salt which is simply not found in nature we can struggle to control intake.
That is part of it. Also people seem to be disconnected from sourcing, preparing and eating even vaguely healthy foods. Processed pre-prepared is just easier.The consensus seems to be the combination of sugar and fats in highly processed foods, plus the alchemy employed to make these products hyper-palatable. Another popular combination for the food industry is fat and salt, which has a similar effect. Pretty much all the fats used in these products is from industrial seed oils which are novel, and when combined with sugar and/or salt which is simply not found in nature we can struggle to control intake.
poo at Paul's said:
You see, cases like that, I’m convinced there’s some mental disorder at the root of it. It’s like he has an eating disorder, but not those at the other end of the spectrum.
I suspect that despite his bravado on social media he was a deeply unhappy man.
I wonder who was feeding him.I suspect that despite his bravado on social media he was a deeply unhappy man.
TyrannosauRoss Lex said:
I think it's a bit more than that. Humans also have a very long after-birth caring necessity. If you procreate and die whilst giving birth, if thr child has no other care it'll die. There are many reasons why we ought to live into later life.
In that case the space those deaths leave may be filled by someone better fitted to the situation. Better adapted genes survive.Gassing Station | The Lounge | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff