Work woes- anxiety
Discussion
Hi,
I'm not sure where to start really. Feel a bit silly typing it down and keep telling myself to man up but those close to me have seen a definite change in my mood and attitude since a new manager was introduced, the working relationship is sour and becoming unbearable. I've tried to construct the below into something meaningful, but appreciate it's a bit of ramble and I wonder if it's just me. The structure isn’t great, but I just can’t seem to type it our coherently. For anyone who reads through and has constructive advice I’m most grateful.
I've a call with HR later today and I'll be seeing my doctor later today also. I feel embarrassed that I left someone get to me this much. I know the answer is to just quit, but it's well paid and very suitable to my current situation. If I didn't have a mortgage or financial responsibilities I would just walk out. I realised today that after the rolled eyes from a colleague across the meeting room that they think the same as me, but won’t say anything. After the meeting I could feel myself tense up and concentration go so worked the rest of the day from home
I've been in my current role for two years, was contracting on and off before that and various other bits in between. Like most people I can get along with others and make friends and I think this flexible nature and attitude is essential for contracting and customer facing roles. It leads me to think that the problem isn't me as I've never had these issues in 15 years of working, although I appreciate no one is perfect. I'm in no way selling myself as an angel. I constantly second guess myself now and feel like I'm treading on egg shells and even ask those I'm close to in work if I'm imagining things, or am I just being sensitive? They always agree and tell me I'm not and that there is a definite issue between my manager and myself. Others sitting around our desk have commented on the issues as they've noted the things I'm about to describe and have mentioned how they couldn't work on our team due to the talking over and raised voices and mood swings essentially. One day you'll just be ignored, or I will, it’s petty subtle behaviour at times.
We're a small team of 8 at the moment, with one of them being the team manager. They were recently promoted to this role and that's where the problems started. We're on the same salary as the new job didn't offer more, but did offer experience. Even if it is more money, it's not about salary, or job title as I'm quite happy working in a technical capacity, nor is a female manager as I've had both male and female mangers, project managers etc.
Basically bad decisions after bad decisions are being made and every time I try and suggest something better its shot down, even if on a team meeting others have agreed with the suggestion, these are people with years of experience. Countless times these decisions have come back to bite us but others won't speak up and just speak in private. Perhaps it's the fact that I speak up marks me with a black card.
If on a conference call someone asks a question, they'll be met with a polite answer, so to test this I asked the same question about how my manager would like work prioritised and was belittled in front of others saying "I shouldn't have to tell you what to do, you know what to do, I can assign all your work if you need me to" The reason for asking the question was to see if there were any gaps or help needed as I'd just returned from annual leave. I feel that's a reasonable thing to ask. As other days she’ll stop you doing something and say how xyz is more important, but then moan how ABC wasn’t done, rather than just let you get on with it. Constant updates, AKA micro management are required.
If I say I'm late for work due to transport delays or cancellations I'm pulled up on it (something I take a screen shot of to prove), yet a younger team member who travels twice as far is giving carte blanche due to travelling so much for work and even on a team meeting when someone else was late it was said that only that one person has an excuse.
At the moment we have an external party in to do some development work, I was pulled off of this project and one of our two contractors assigned to it to justify keeping them on. I was asked about this prior as it was supposed to be a project that I could get myself stuck into as I'd been overseeing some pretty tedious work. I said that's fine for the bigger picture as helps with workload, trying to be a team player as such and as long as I pick up a project soon. No one likes being stuck floating on BAU and as backfill, and also it doesn't help personal development. Now the next project has come along it's been assigned to them again and I'm left floating and picking up the pieces of the other project that they haven't finished. I suggested to change the first project location as the external party wanted to come into London as they'd dealt with me previously whilst the contractor was away and was happier with my work and asked me to come into the office to meet them. I was told to be involved in an assistant role and only to be involved as an escalation point and pulled off of it as now that the contractor had returned from sickness. I suggested why don't we send the third party to our remote office where the contractor is so that I don't have to sit there logging them onto a laptop so they can share screens over Skype with our contractor, as it doesn't make sense that they're sitting next to me but they have to deal with our remote contractor via Skype as I'm moved onto BAU activities and assisting on other projects, it would be better of time and saves me from being a glorified babysitter (how I felt).
Regarding this same project when the timelines were given to us, I tried to push back on certain days due to team members being on holiday and made suggestions to change the dates and was told that 'no the project has to continue etc' and it was managed and scheduled for me. Sure enough on those days they visited I could only give 50% of my attention. On a follow up call a few weeks later I was blamed for not managing the timelines of the project efficiently and how I should have pushed back. I said I don't feel it's my place to question as when trying to schedule a meeting room during a conference call leading up to this visit my manager is on another call but over hear hears and tells me not to book a meeting room as they can just sit next to me and we need to be visible at our team desks. I tried to explain that we have tight desks and I can book a dedicated room with screen sharing capabilities and conference phone so that all parties can talk in private rather than us two sitting next to each other with headsets and our remote colleagues chatting to us. So I can work as normal and hear all the conversations on a conference and glance up at a screen if needed. Makes sense to me. Rather than visibility of being seen at our desks. People know to Skype, or call, or email etc if they need me.
We were assigned desk in an office move. I was opposite my manager and came in one day and she'd swapped my seat with another member of the team so that I'm sitting next to her, without even consulting me, just told the other person to move the day before I was due back in, under the guise that they need to work more closely with me. Surely you consult people about this first?
I constantly feel like any suggestion of mine is dismissed, I can do no right and frankly no idea why I let it get to me. Others seem to just roll eyes, or laugh it off as most people find our manager hard work. I guess previously I was brushing it under the carpet. One member of the team has left due to her behaviour. I feel I’m not alone, it just depends who it’s directed at and if you shut up. I asked why others will discuss with me but not bring it up with our manager but they’re afraid to and just want to keep their head down.
I'm not sure where to start really. Feel a bit silly typing it down and keep telling myself to man up but those close to me have seen a definite change in my mood and attitude since a new manager was introduced, the working relationship is sour and becoming unbearable. I've tried to construct the below into something meaningful, but appreciate it's a bit of ramble and I wonder if it's just me. The structure isn’t great, but I just can’t seem to type it our coherently. For anyone who reads through and has constructive advice I’m most grateful.
I've a call with HR later today and I'll be seeing my doctor later today also. I feel embarrassed that I left someone get to me this much. I know the answer is to just quit, but it's well paid and very suitable to my current situation. If I didn't have a mortgage or financial responsibilities I would just walk out. I realised today that after the rolled eyes from a colleague across the meeting room that they think the same as me, but won’t say anything. After the meeting I could feel myself tense up and concentration go so worked the rest of the day from home
I've been in my current role for two years, was contracting on and off before that and various other bits in between. Like most people I can get along with others and make friends and I think this flexible nature and attitude is essential for contracting and customer facing roles. It leads me to think that the problem isn't me as I've never had these issues in 15 years of working, although I appreciate no one is perfect. I'm in no way selling myself as an angel. I constantly second guess myself now and feel like I'm treading on egg shells and even ask those I'm close to in work if I'm imagining things, or am I just being sensitive? They always agree and tell me I'm not and that there is a definite issue between my manager and myself. Others sitting around our desk have commented on the issues as they've noted the things I'm about to describe and have mentioned how they couldn't work on our team due to the talking over and raised voices and mood swings essentially. One day you'll just be ignored, or I will, it’s petty subtle behaviour at times.
We're a small team of 8 at the moment, with one of them being the team manager. They were recently promoted to this role and that's where the problems started. We're on the same salary as the new job didn't offer more, but did offer experience. Even if it is more money, it's not about salary, or job title as I'm quite happy working in a technical capacity, nor is a female manager as I've had both male and female mangers, project managers etc.
Basically bad decisions after bad decisions are being made and every time I try and suggest something better its shot down, even if on a team meeting others have agreed with the suggestion, these are people with years of experience. Countless times these decisions have come back to bite us but others won't speak up and just speak in private. Perhaps it's the fact that I speak up marks me with a black card.
If on a conference call someone asks a question, they'll be met with a polite answer, so to test this I asked the same question about how my manager would like work prioritised and was belittled in front of others saying "I shouldn't have to tell you what to do, you know what to do, I can assign all your work if you need me to" The reason for asking the question was to see if there were any gaps or help needed as I'd just returned from annual leave. I feel that's a reasonable thing to ask. As other days she’ll stop you doing something and say how xyz is more important, but then moan how ABC wasn’t done, rather than just let you get on with it. Constant updates, AKA micro management are required.
If I say I'm late for work due to transport delays or cancellations I'm pulled up on it (something I take a screen shot of to prove), yet a younger team member who travels twice as far is giving carte blanche due to travelling so much for work and even on a team meeting when someone else was late it was said that only that one person has an excuse.
At the moment we have an external party in to do some development work, I was pulled off of this project and one of our two contractors assigned to it to justify keeping them on. I was asked about this prior as it was supposed to be a project that I could get myself stuck into as I'd been overseeing some pretty tedious work. I said that's fine for the bigger picture as helps with workload, trying to be a team player as such and as long as I pick up a project soon. No one likes being stuck floating on BAU and as backfill, and also it doesn't help personal development. Now the next project has come along it's been assigned to them again and I'm left floating and picking up the pieces of the other project that they haven't finished. I suggested to change the first project location as the external party wanted to come into London as they'd dealt with me previously whilst the contractor was away and was happier with my work and asked me to come into the office to meet them. I was told to be involved in an assistant role and only to be involved as an escalation point and pulled off of it as now that the contractor had returned from sickness. I suggested why don't we send the third party to our remote office where the contractor is so that I don't have to sit there logging them onto a laptop so they can share screens over Skype with our contractor, as it doesn't make sense that they're sitting next to me but they have to deal with our remote contractor via Skype as I'm moved onto BAU activities and assisting on other projects, it would be better of time and saves me from being a glorified babysitter (how I felt).
Regarding this same project when the timelines were given to us, I tried to push back on certain days due to team members being on holiday and made suggestions to change the dates and was told that 'no the project has to continue etc' and it was managed and scheduled for me. Sure enough on those days they visited I could only give 50% of my attention. On a follow up call a few weeks later I was blamed for not managing the timelines of the project efficiently and how I should have pushed back. I said I don't feel it's my place to question as when trying to schedule a meeting room during a conference call leading up to this visit my manager is on another call but over hear hears and tells me not to book a meeting room as they can just sit next to me and we need to be visible at our team desks. I tried to explain that we have tight desks and I can book a dedicated room with screen sharing capabilities and conference phone so that all parties can talk in private rather than us two sitting next to each other with headsets and our remote colleagues chatting to us. So I can work as normal and hear all the conversations on a conference and glance up at a screen if needed. Makes sense to me. Rather than visibility of being seen at our desks. People know to Skype, or call, or email etc if they need me.
We were assigned desk in an office move. I was opposite my manager and came in one day and she'd swapped my seat with another member of the team so that I'm sitting next to her, without even consulting me, just told the other person to move the day before I was due back in, under the guise that they need to work more closely with me. Surely you consult people about this first?
I constantly feel like any suggestion of mine is dismissed, I can do no right and frankly no idea why I let it get to me. Others seem to just roll eyes, or laugh it off as most people find our manager hard work. I guess previously I was brushing it under the carpet. One member of the team has left due to her behaviour. I feel I’m not alone, it just depends who it’s directed at and if you shut up. I asked why others will discuss with me but not bring it up with our manager but they’re afraid to and just want to keep their head down.
Hi everyone.
Thank you for the replies. I did read them earlier but refrained from replying as I was trying to clear my head and not think about it, I’ve had a few sleepless nights since posting this thread. This afternoon I finally decided to write down all the past instances and comments. I’m thinking that viewed individually some look silly but I’m hoping to bring it all together to paint a bigger picture. I’m sure some could be dismissed but I have 5 A5 pages detailing specific events. Perhaps I’ll post them up here to get more advice. It’s generally more of the one rule for everyone else and then something different to me. Or me being pullled up on something or asked to work a certain way, which then isn’t followed by my manager. A case of do as I say, not as I do. After being lectured for 15 mins on how to do something and not agreeing with it, only to have them do it the way you wanted to do it in the first place is just mind numbing. Whether it’s a procedure, work method, or technical application. I fear that they’ll be dismissed, or I’ll be classed as being sensitive and suspect some of this will be difficult to prove. Hopefully I’m wrong.
I visited my GP the same day that I left work. My GP noted high blood pressure and could see I was stressed, anxious and agitated. I was then signed me off from work for 10 days. I return to see my GP next week.
I spoke to the HR person whom I’d previously spoken to before and sent them my fit note. They had previously suggested occupational health when I’d raised concerns, so I will follow this up. I’m confident that this isn’t in my head, especially after someone who witnessed that final uncomfortable moment agreed that my manager ‘had a bone to pick with me’ for no apparent reason.
I’m aware that all the advice on this thread applies, hence reading a few times and contemplating it all. Whether it’s the advice saying to go to HR and how others have had difficult situations like this, or those who suggest to firm up my responses and to let it just over my head. I think I would benfift from help I dealing with difficult situations and how to let things go that I can’t ckntrol. Those that suggest HR will look after the manager and themselves rings a potential truth. As the last call with them was along the lines of ‘stick to your doctors recommendation about no contact with work although we encourage you to keep seeing them so they can help you get back to work.’ Or something along those lines. Leaving may be an option if I study and move in a new direction, or even work out finances and budget differently to make a pay cut an option and take a different approach. It’s not nice but I realise the little things that stick to my mind now. Such as our manager never coming with us for drinks after work, or chatting to our old team, desk buddies in our old building. Even though the rest of us stay in touch. My manager will go out for drinks if managers higher up the chain are out and will hang around. It’s all about career advancement. Which is fine, but there isn’t any interest in anyone unles she gets something out of it.
I feel better not being at work to deal with it, but know that I have to go back to face the music. I guess I’m expecting my manage to really have it in for me, or deny it all, but at least this has given me some breathing space and time for me to reflect.
Thanks for the replies. It really has helped.
Thank you for the replies. I did read them earlier but refrained from replying as I was trying to clear my head and not think about it, I’ve had a few sleepless nights since posting this thread. This afternoon I finally decided to write down all the past instances and comments. I’m thinking that viewed individually some look silly but I’m hoping to bring it all together to paint a bigger picture. I’m sure some could be dismissed but I have 5 A5 pages detailing specific events. Perhaps I’ll post them up here to get more advice. It’s generally more of the one rule for everyone else and then something different to me. Or me being pullled up on something or asked to work a certain way, which then isn’t followed by my manager. A case of do as I say, not as I do. After being lectured for 15 mins on how to do something and not agreeing with it, only to have them do it the way you wanted to do it in the first place is just mind numbing. Whether it’s a procedure, work method, or technical application. I fear that they’ll be dismissed, or I’ll be classed as being sensitive and suspect some of this will be difficult to prove. Hopefully I’m wrong.
I visited my GP the same day that I left work. My GP noted high blood pressure and could see I was stressed, anxious and agitated. I was then signed me off from work for 10 days. I return to see my GP next week.
I spoke to the HR person whom I’d previously spoken to before and sent them my fit note. They had previously suggested occupational health when I’d raised concerns, so I will follow this up. I’m confident that this isn’t in my head, especially after someone who witnessed that final uncomfortable moment agreed that my manager ‘had a bone to pick with me’ for no apparent reason.
I’m aware that all the advice on this thread applies, hence reading a few times and contemplating it all. Whether it’s the advice saying to go to HR and how others have had difficult situations like this, or those who suggest to firm up my responses and to let it just over my head. I think I would benfift from help I dealing with difficult situations and how to let things go that I can’t ckntrol. Those that suggest HR will look after the manager and themselves rings a potential truth. As the last call with them was along the lines of ‘stick to your doctors recommendation about no contact with work although we encourage you to keep seeing them so they can help you get back to work.’ Or something along those lines. Leaving may be an option if I study and move in a new direction, or even work out finances and budget differently to make a pay cut an option and take a different approach. It’s not nice but I realise the little things that stick to my mind now. Such as our manager never coming with us for drinks after work, or chatting to our old team, desk buddies in our old building. Even though the rest of us stay in touch. My manager will go out for drinks if managers higher up the chain are out and will hang around. It’s all about career advancement. Which is fine, but there isn’t any interest in anyone unles she gets something out of it.
I feel better not being at work to deal with it, but know that I have to go back to face the music. I guess I’m expecting my manage to really have it in for me, or deny it all, but at least this has given me some breathing space and time for me to reflect.
Thanks for the replies. It really has helped.
Figured this was due an update. Partly due to typing it out and thinking about it and also to say thanks to those who replied.
I’ve spoken to occupational health and they’ve asked for feedback and examples. We discussed at length the things that I had a problem with and even with me taking a step back and trying to take emotion out of it they agreed that there is a problem with management and communication. So they’ve passed this on to the senior manager that I asked them to. I guess
whether he and HR can actually do something to make a positive change is another matter.
My GP has also referred me to Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. We discussed my reactions to certain incidents, whether it’s work or someone sitting over two seats on the train, or not saying thank you when I hold a door open. I know they’re being an arse but why get worked up over it?
Thanks for the replies and advice and hopefully it’s a positive step forward for me personally and also in work.
I’ve spoken to occupational health and they’ve asked for feedback and examples. We discussed at length the things that I had a problem with and even with me taking a step back and trying to take emotion out of it they agreed that there is a problem with management and communication. So they’ve passed this on to the senior manager that I asked them to. I guess
whether he and HR can actually do something to make a positive change is another matter.
My GP has also referred me to Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. We discussed my reactions to certain incidents, whether it’s work or someone sitting over two seats on the train, or not saying thank you when I hold a door open. I know they’re being an arse but why get worked up over it?
Thanks for the replies and advice and hopefully it’s a positive step forward for me personally and also in work.
I did wonder about the personal life and I think there have been personal relationship problems and children are a touchy subject. Something my partner commented on and wondered if it was projected outwards towards me.
My manager does have a reputation, as people in the business have said “oh, you know what she’s like” and she’s had run ins with people.
I need to start working out what I want HR to do and what next steps are. I’m going to type out all the incidents again more clearly and ask a friend to read over them. I can’t remember the exact dates but I’d know it was a call around xyz project for example. Is it worth me going back to my Outlook calendar and emails and even WhatsApp conversationswith my partner where I was moaning about work to try and pint point the exact date to help strengthen my case?
Thanks again for the replies.
My manager does have a reputation, as people in the business have said “oh, you know what she’s like” and she’s had run ins with people.
I need to start working out what I want HR to do and what next steps are. I’m going to type out all the incidents again more clearly and ask a friend to read over them. I can’t remember the exact dates but I’d know it was a call around xyz project for example. Is it worth me going back to my Outlook calendar and emails and even WhatsApp conversationswith my partner where I was moaning about work to try and pint point the exact date to help strengthen my case?
Thanks again for the replies.
Thanks for the replies.
If something came up with my old team, I’d jump at it. I’m glad to hear that worked out for you. It would at least solve this problem.
I just had my catch up call with HR who had been sent the occupational health report.
It ended up leaving me feeling frustrated and like it was my fault. I’ve a summary below.
Essentially the call boiled down to:
The HR person said that they want to use this call to move forward and not look at the past.
Suggested that perhaps I’d done something to give my manager a reason not to trust me and they’ve not communicated this to me well enough, hence the micro managing etc.
I gave examples and said if you think interrupting me on conference call whilst my manager is on another conference call to tell me what to say, or moving my desk is acceptable then I’m going to have to disagree with you. Same goes for moving my allocated desk without telling me and just telling another team member to move before I came in.
Then repeat of well we can’t change your manager and there are always personality clashes. I said I appreciate that and I’ve been working for 16 years. I’ve had clashes or disagreements, but nothing like this and I feel this is personal. I had to hammer home the point that I won’t be returning to work (they asked when I think I’ll be returning) until we had looked at the historic issues. I agreed we need to look forward and build relationships and I’m open that there might be something that I need to change, which is my reactions, but to ignore what’s happened isn’t productive. I know I don’t deal with confrontation well so the CBT I’m hopefully will be positive for me.
In essence it felt like the call was to sweep it under the carpet, what do you want from this, how we can get back to work? With there being a follow up call with HR and the senior manager that I asked for this to go to next week.
I spoke to Occupational Health, who are independent and relayed the HR conversation and they agreed that it didn’t sound a productive call. They suggested what others on here have suggested, which is to write out the list of events and issues in a structured, non personal format and send this to them once the calendar invite has been sent to me.
Felt myself very agitated today but kept myself clear, concise and composed on the HR call but was flustered when explaining to the Occupational Health person.
Thanks again, just feeling frustrated and weathered and think it’s basically become gloves off now and I need to send that letter in an email and be clear about it so they’ve read it and perhaps even have a mock call with friends so I can keep my composure.
If something came up with my old team, I’d jump at it. I’m glad to hear that worked out for you. It would at least solve this problem.
I just had my catch up call with HR who had been sent the occupational health report.
It ended up leaving me feeling frustrated and like it was my fault. I’ve a summary below.
Essentially the call boiled down to:
The HR person said that they want to use this call to move forward and not look at the past.
Suggested that perhaps I’d done something to give my manager a reason not to trust me and they’ve not communicated this to me well enough, hence the micro managing etc.
I gave examples and said if you think interrupting me on conference call whilst my manager is on another conference call to tell me what to say, or moving my desk is acceptable then I’m going to have to disagree with you. Same goes for moving my allocated desk without telling me and just telling another team member to move before I came in.
Then repeat of well we can’t change your manager and there are always personality clashes. I said I appreciate that and I’ve been working for 16 years. I’ve had clashes or disagreements, but nothing like this and I feel this is personal. I had to hammer home the point that I won’t be returning to work (they asked when I think I’ll be returning) until we had looked at the historic issues. I agreed we need to look forward and build relationships and I’m open that there might be something that I need to change, which is my reactions, but to ignore what’s happened isn’t productive. I know I don’t deal with confrontation well so the CBT I’m hopefully will be positive for me.
In essence it felt like the call was to sweep it under the carpet, what do you want from this, how we can get back to work? With there being a follow up call with HR and the senior manager that I asked for this to go to next week.
I spoke to Occupational Health, who are independent and relayed the HR conversation and they agreed that it didn’t sound a productive call. They suggested what others on here have suggested, which is to write out the list of events and issues in a structured, non personal format and send this to them once the calendar invite has been sent to me.
Felt myself very agitated today but kept myself clear, concise and composed on the HR call but was flustered when explaining to the Occupational Health person.
Thanks again, just feeling frustrated and weathered and think it’s basically become gloves off now and I need to send that letter in an email and be clear about it so they’ve read it and perhaps even have a mock call with friends so I can keep my composure.
Just to update work have provided the first CBT session tomorrow as I hadn’t heard from the NHS again.
Also I’m aware that perhaps some smaller things with my manager I’ll react to because I’m allowing other stuff to bubble up. So I’m trying to be self aware, but HR didn’t seem to be concerned when I gave examples and just said it’s food that I self aware as people always rant and rave and think it’s the other person. To be honest I’ll give the next call a go, but if it’s the same sort of attitude I think I’ll have to ask Occupational Health to step in/advise.
Also I’m aware that perhaps some smaller things with my manager I’ll react to because I’m allowing other stuff to bubble up. So I’m trying to be self aware, but HR didn’t seem to be concerned when I gave examples and just said it’s food that I self aware as people always rant and rave and think it’s the other person. To be honest I’ll give the next call a go, but if it’s the same sort of attitude I think I’ll have to ask Occupational Health to step in/advise.
Thanks for the reply.
Do I have to tell them that I’m recording? Or can I use an app on an iPhone?
I’ve a friend who went through similar and had a positive outcome where the manager was moved onto another role. I guess I was hoping for some kind of yes, this doesn’t sound right and we’ll look into it and monitor it.
Do you work in this sort of area? Sorry if a nosy question, just you’ve been pretty clued up as have other posters on here.
I guess I need to think about plan b if I don’t find HR forthcoming. I’d like to keep my job etc, but if that’s not going to happen, or not be a happy place to be then financial security is my next priority. How does the whole dismissal thing go? I suspect it’s going to be a he said/she said and if anyone is willing to be a witness of agree to what they’ve noticed in meetings (career risk for them) and I’ll be relying on the work assigned documents showing how I’ve not been given access to the same opportunities. (Projects to contractor continuously) etc.
Do I have to tell them that I’m recording? Or can I use an app on an iPhone?
I’ve a friend who went through similar and had a positive outcome where the manager was moved onto another role. I guess I was hoping for some kind of yes, this doesn’t sound right and we’ll look into it and monitor it.
Do you work in this sort of area? Sorry if a nosy question, just you’ve been pretty clued up as have other posters on here.
I guess I need to think about plan b if I don’t find HR forthcoming. I’d like to keep my job etc, but if that’s not going to happen, or not be a happy place to be then financial security is my next priority. How does the whole dismissal thing go? I suspect it’s going to be a he said/she said and if anyone is willing to be a witness of agree to what they’ve noticed in meetings (career risk for them) and I’ll be relying on the work assigned documents showing how I’ve not been given access to the same opportunities. (Projects to contractor continuously) etc.
Just doing some reading; https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/unfair-and-constructi...
How would it be my employers fault regarding bullying and constructive dismissal? I’m not arguing, just trying to see another perspective and it’s probably me being negative. Does it mean if they just hear what I have to say and that’s that and expect me to return to work?
I understand that’s it my manager who is responsible for her own behaviour, but is it because they employ her they’re responsible?
How would it be my employers fault regarding bullying and constructive dismissal? I’m not arguing, just trying to see another perspective and it’s probably me being negative. Does it mean if they just hear what I have to say and that’s that and expect me to return to work?
I understand that’s it my manager who is responsible for her own behaviour, but is it because they employ her they’re responsible?
Thanks all. Had my first therapy session yesterday and felt positive from it. We discussed work but also how I can change how I react to things I can’t control.
I’ve been asked for a follow up call with the senior manager I asked to be involved and HR. Spoken to OH and they’ve suggested to me to provide the list of events/examples and proof. For example, emails or meeting date etc. I’ll need to log on to my laptop and get this at the weekend just need to make it factual.
After thinking about this, my first line is to ask for the senior manager who’s aware what my manager can be like what he can do or suggest.
Secondly would be to ask about is there another role if not able to resolve.
Third... I’m not so sure. Cross that bridge when I come to it. Probably involving leaving as you’ve suggested. The legal fight, I’ve been thinking of that as worst case.
I’ve been asked for a follow up call with the senior manager I asked to be involved and HR. Spoken to OH and they’ve suggested to me to provide the list of events/examples and proof. For example, emails or meeting date etc. I’ll need to log on to my laptop and get this at the weekend just need to make it factual.
After thinking about this, my first line is to ask for the senior manager who’s aware what my manager can be like what he can do or suggest.
Secondly would be to ask about is there another role if not able to resolve.
Third... I’m not so sure. Cross that bridge when I come to it. Probably involving leaving as you’ve suggested. The legal fight, I’ve been thinking of that as worst case.
I figured that this is due an update as I was offered some great advice and perspective and perhaps it will help others if they read, or search on here.
I’ve been back to work the past couple of weeks on reduced hours following mediation sessions and then therapy and come CBT sessions.
HR have as previously suggested taken an indirect siding with my manager who exhibits the same behaviour, but has seemed to have reigned it in a bit. HR hasn’t brought up the list of grievences again and I need to finish the mediation sessions and then next step is official grievance if no improvement.
When it was discussed about my health and CBT helping me and improving me I had to change the direction of conversation and say it’s more about me being able to deal with a difficult situation and changing my reactions and perceptions with regards to difficult situations as they seemed to not really acknowledge that my manager was/is part of the problem.
Another person has just started and asked me about our manager, so that goes as far as confirming it’s not expected behaviour. How long they’ll be there for, or whether they’ll say something is another matter.
During the mediated session with workplace mediators we discussed various things. I was able to reflect and see some of the things that I did to help escalate the tension, but my manager ended up arguing with the mediators. So actually displayed the same behaviour with them when they were discussing the unhelpful attitudes and behaviour, but unfortunately this can’t be used as reference due to confidentiality etc. It did help though to confirm my points and I’ll see what happens on the follow up session.
I’ve learned that perhaps I was stressed for a while with money worries and two members of the family that are ill and the work environment where I spent most of my day sent me over that edge. The counselling was useful just to help me process and start to learn about my thoughts and behaviours and I’m carrying on with the CBT. I don’t see work changing in the desired way but I’ll use my phased return to gain my work confidence back and mostly like look for a new role later in the year. The biggest thing is the CBT has helped me to learn with difficult situations better and not to let things build up. I’ve learned something about myself and improved in that respect so that’s a positive.
Thanks again for the support.
I’ve been back to work the past couple of weeks on reduced hours following mediation sessions and then therapy and come CBT sessions.
HR have as previously suggested taken an indirect siding with my manager who exhibits the same behaviour, but has seemed to have reigned it in a bit. HR hasn’t brought up the list of grievences again and I need to finish the mediation sessions and then next step is official grievance if no improvement.
When it was discussed about my health and CBT helping me and improving me I had to change the direction of conversation and say it’s more about me being able to deal with a difficult situation and changing my reactions and perceptions with regards to difficult situations as they seemed to not really acknowledge that my manager was/is part of the problem.
Another person has just started and asked me about our manager, so that goes as far as confirming it’s not expected behaviour. How long they’ll be there for, or whether they’ll say something is another matter.
During the mediated session with workplace mediators we discussed various things. I was able to reflect and see some of the things that I did to help escalate the tension, but my manager ended up arguing with the mediators. So actually displayed the same behaviour with them when they were discussing the unhelpful attitudes and behaviour, but unfortunately this can’t be used as reference due to confidentiality etc. It did help though to confirm my points and I’ll see what happens on the follow up session.
I’ve learned that perhaps I was stressed for a while with money worries and two members of the family that are ill and the work environment where I spent most of my day sent me over that edge. The counselling was useful just to help me process and start to learn about my thoughts and behaviours and I’m carrying on with the CBT. I don’t see work changing in the desired way but I’ll use my phased return to gain my work confidence back and mostly like look for a new role later in the year. The biggest thing is the CBT has helped me to learn with difficult situations better and not to let things build up. I’ve learned something about myself and improved in that respect so that’s a positive.
Thanks again for the support.
Hi all,
Feel strange updating this again, but having a bit of a crap time at work. Im still on a phased return until 2020. Essentially I feel like all of this has been blamed on my mental health (was signed off with stress) and down to my perception of things and that management/HR think it’s me and not my manager. Whether this is true or not I don’t know, but it is how I feel. So I’m leaving that open to perception.
On my last conversation with the occupational health (independent) who send a report to my employer. I said I feel like I’m the one being punished and having CBT and told that we meet difficult people in life and have to learn to deal with it. I said this is true and it does help but if someone is impossible to deal with then only so much CBT, mindfulness and patience can help and if they’re still exhibiting the behaviour that the mediators advised against then perhaps I’m not the only part of the problem.
I’ve done what’s been asked of my manager, HR and OH. I’ve not done any overtime, not to taken on complex pieces of work and to leave to the contractors (advice from my manager). Something I wasn’t happy with that we’re using contractors instead of allowing me to work on some of these pieces of work as it’s related to my job description. Not just because they’re more interesting but because they develop your skills and expand your awareness amongst other teams and surely we should use contractors equally across tasks. Not just give them all the interesting stuff. This isn’t a case of bringing them on because I/rest of the team don’t have the knowledge as just recently one of the contractors was sent on a training course with another member of the permanent team.
On recents discussions with my manager I’ve had this sort of comment.
“I need to be careful how I say the following to you as I know how you take things”
The final straw for me was a recent piece of work where my manager asked another member of the team to shadow me and be of assistance as I hadn’t touched these production/important servers in a while and because they had and recently experienced problems working on them and could be there to assist if there are any issues. I didn’t feel the need to have my hand held but using CBT and trying to think the best I try and take it as my manager covering her bases and being helpful. She said she’d be around and would check in or be there if we need her.
What proceeds to happen is she joins the conference call, asks me to share my screen so they can see what I’m doing. This starts to be the down hill if the day. At many steps as I’m looking at logs I’m told to go back a step, or hang on go back a step what did that screen say. After experiencing some failures and resolving some she told me what commands to run and what not to do. In the end I said you don’t trust me to carry out this work and I don’t need two people either side of my shoulder and that if you’re both explaining to me what to do then that’s belittling and not trusting me or respecting me and as I wanted to run something to resolve an
Issue in was told no by manager. So in the end I didn’t. The response to this was you hadn’t touched these servers since being off sick and my response was that I shouldn’t be penalised for being off sick. To note I’d carried out this type of upgrade on the test environments before hand and had documented the process. As I was sharing my screen for example and the progress bar had completed I was getting hello are you there, as I’d happened to go get myself a drink and hadn’t sat watching paint dry the whole time and as I’m thinking what to do next, they’re both discussing right do this now etc.
I feel like based on the previous posts that I have no option but to leave.
I’m a grown man close to tears, shaking, and don’t know what to do. The thought of a applying for another job terrifies me as I think will
I get the job, will I be able to keep it. Then I think is it really me? Am I the problem? Then I tell myself I’ve not had this problem in all my years of working. Others on the team moan but don’t say anything and have said to me in private that I’m treated different, but then are they just telling me what I want to hear.
The above isn’t clear to read and I apologise but I’m just feeling trapped. My partner has just been made redundant so I feel I can’t risk walking out, leaving for another job until they are settled.
Feel strange updating this again, but having a bit of a crap time at work. Im still on a phased return until 2020. Essentially I feel like all of this has been blamed on my mental health (was signed off with stress) and down to my perception of things and that management/HR think it’s me and not my manager. Whether this is true or not I don’t know, but it is how I feel. So I’m leaving that open to perception.
On my last conversation with the occupational health (independent) who send a report to my employer. I said I feel like I’m the one being punished and having CBT and told that we meet difficult people in life and have to learn to deal with it. I said this is true and it does help but if someone is impossible to deal with then only so much CBT, mindfulness and patience can help and if they’re still exhibiting the behaviour that the mediators advised against then perhaps I’m not the only part of the problem.
I’ve done what’s been asked of my manager, HR and OH. I’ve not done any overtime, not to taken on complex pieces of work and to leave to the contractors (advice from my manager). Something I wasn’t happy with that we’re using contractors instead of allowing me to work on some of these pieces of work as it’s related to my job description. Not just because they’re more interesting but because they develop your skills and expand your awareness amongst other teams and surely we should use contractors equally across tasks. Not just give them all the interesting stuff. This isn’t a case of bringing them on because I/rest of the team don’t have the knowledge as just recently one of the contractors was sent on a training course with another member of the permanent team.
On recents discussions with my manager I’ve had this sort of comment.
“I need to be careful how I say the following to you as I know how you take things”
The final straw for me was a recent piece of work where my manager asked another member of the team to shadow me and be of assistance as I hadn’t touched these production/important servers in a while and because they had and recently experienced problems working on them and could be there to assist if there are any issues. I didn’t feel the need to have my hand held but using CBT and trying to think the best I try and take it as my manager covering her bases and being helpful. She said she’d be around and would check in or be there if we need her.
What proceeds to happen is she joins the conference call, asks me to share my screen so they can see what I’m doing. This starts to be the down hill if the day. At many steps as I’m looking at logs I’m told to go back a step, or hang on go back a step what did that screen say. After experiencing some failures and resolving some she told me what commands to run and what not to do. In the end I said you don’t trust me to carry out this work and I don’t need two people either side of my shoulder and that if you’re both explaining to me what to do then that’s belittling and not trusting me or respecting me and as I wanted to run something to resolve an
Issue in was told no by manager. So in the end I didn’t. The response to this was you hadn’t touched these servers since being off sick and my response was that I shouldn’t be penalised for being off sick. To note I’d carried out this type of upgrade on the test environments before hand and had documented the process. As I was sharing my screen for example and the progress bar had completed I was getting hello are you there, as I’d happened to go get myself a drink and hadn’t sat watching paint dry the whole time and as I’m thinking what to do next, they’re both discussing right do this now etc.
I feel like based on the previous posts that I have no option but to leave.
I’m a grown man close to tears, shaking, and don’t know what to do. The thought of a applying for another job terrifies me as I think will
I get the job, will I be able to keep it. Then I think is it really me? Am I the problem? Then I tell myself I’ve not had this problem in all my years of working. Others on the team moan but don’t say anything and have said to me in private that I’m treated different, but then are they just telling me what I want to hear.
The above isn’t clear to read and I apologise but I’m just feeling trapped. My partner has just been made redundant so I feel I can’t risk walking out, leaving for another job until they are settled.
Thanks all.
I know I had a lot of good advice before as well. It’s not a case of not listening. It’s a matter of confidence now and taking that leap. It’s strange how this has crept up on me as I used or contract and was happy moving around.
I’ve looked at other jobs and it’s a considerable pay cut (10%) as I was asked to move to this company for my skills. I think it’s about me letting go and being ‘beaten’ and accepting that walking away is the best option rather than pride and wanting to stay in my good job. That is good, apart from this problem that outweighs the positives.
I know I had a lot of good advice before as well. It’s not a case of not listening. It’s a matter of confidence now and taking that leap. It’s strange how this has crept up on me as I used or contract and was happy moving around.
I’ve looked at other jobs and it’s a considerable pay cut (10%) as I was asked to move to this company for my skills. I think it’s about me letting go and being ‘beaten’ and accepting that walking away is the best option rather than pride and wanting to stay in my good job. That is good, apart from this problem that outweighs the positives.
I’ve started looking for jobs today in my spare time. Will at least update my CV and start the process and get the ball rolling. Like you say happiness is more important and I’m seemingly struggling with getting my backside in gear.
My partner has an interview lined up so maybe this is the start of a positive change.
I guess I just feel the weight on my shoulders, especially until she has an new job.
Thanks again. I really do appreciate it.
My partner has an interview lined up so maybe this is the start of a positive change.
I guess I just feel the weight on my shoulders, especially until she has an new job.
Thanks again. I really do appreciate it.
Hoofy said:
RTB said:
Work out what the pay cut would actually mean per day and decide whether your current misery is worth it. I bet it works out at between 10 and 20 quid a day unless you're a proper PHer on 6 figs.
People are willing to allow others to put their mental health at risk in ways they would never allow if it was their physical well being at risk, but the outcomes are often the same.
Severe anxiety and depression can be debilitating and can lead to an early death. If someone was expecting you smash up sheets of asbestos with nothing more than a hanky tied around your face you'd walk off the job because you don't want to end up with a debilitating disease that may lead to an early death.....
People are willing to allow others to put their mental health at risk in ways they would never allow if it was their physical well being at risk, but the outcomes are often the same.
Severe anxiety and depression can be debilitating and can lead to an early death. If someone was expecting you smash up sheets of asbestos with nothing more than a hanky tied around your face you'd walk off the job because you don't want to end up with a debilitating disease that may lead to an early death.....
I’m just waiting to hear back about a job I applied for.
I’m making the right moves. Just needed that kick up the ass from you all.
I guess it’s something that I didn’t realise had gotten worse as I think the CBT was really beneficial. However it’s now gotten to a point where I’m like “yes, it is”, but it doesn’t stop you being immune to complete nonsense and that buffer has been reached when I last updated this thread a few days ago and I’ve stopped making allowances and thought enough is enough. I’m not the same person I used to be but I need to sort that now by looking forward.
Thanks. I think it took me to this point to go enough is enough and look at the CBT and go ‘you’re blaming the victim for feeling a victim’ and telling them how to keep allowing it to happen. Victim may be a strong word but it’s how i feel. I know others would think just get on with it, get paid and go home and some people can do that, but we’re not all the same.
I’ve sorted of taken a weight off of my shoulders and just let out a big breath the last few days and tried to stop caring.
I’ve sorted of taken a weight off of my shoulders and just let out a big breath the last few days and tried to stop caring.
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