Becoming deliberately less bulky in middle age.
Discussion
When I was in my 20s and early 30s I was 11-12 stone and pretty fit most of the time. But in my 40s I had children and became lardy, so hit the gym hard from mid-40s onwards. I became stocky. I have a photo of me on my 50th birthday and I look like a rugby player with a 50 year old's head on.
My next big birthday is 60 and I don't want to be 14 stone at 5ft 9.5in, but it seems that is what my body wants to be.
I eat cleanly the majority of the time, but do partake of a little alcohol at weekends. I almost feel like I'd need to be abstemious and eating 1250 calories per day for life to see 12 stone again. But last time I got down to below 15%bf I was 13 stone and looked gaunt, so I am not entirely sure that 12 stone is a desirable goal anymore.
As things stand, I have gone back to 5 days a week of HIIT, steady state cardio and light weights. If I continue, by summer I will be 14 stone and stocky. Exactly like before.
Has anyone else tried to skinny down in middle age and encountered resistance?
ORD said:
I dont really know what you're asking. If you want to lose weight, reduce your calories :-)
That's my point. My body seems quite elastic with regard to calorie intake and seems to want to be 14 stone, regardless of what body composition that is.Interestingly, when I was young my "natural" bodyweight was 12st 3lbs and I had to do quite a lot to change it up or down.
R56Cooper said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Louis Balfour said:
That's my point. My body seems quite elastic with regard to calorie intake and seems to want to be 14 stone,
All those people freed from concentration camps at the end of the war, who'd had very little to eat but had had to physically work really hard for 18 hours a day, none of their bodies wanted to stick at 14st. Every single one of them was around 5 stone. Not a single guy anywhere was stuck on 14st because his body was elastic to calories. Eat much less and do much more. You will then lose weight.
I agree with your aim though, makes sense as you get older to lighten the load on joints and ensure focus on mobility, although 14 stone isn't what I'd call heavy in the first place.
Resistance exercises are essentially to maintain bone density and mitigate against the gradual loss in muscle mass that comes with aging. I'm sure many blokes would be happy with the build you describe though!
Of course drastically reducing calories will do it (eventually). But it isn't healthy or proportionate. Health wasn't high on the list of Nazi priorities when managing the diets of the Jews, however.
My OP was really a thinking out loud exercise pondering how I am finding it difficult to become smaller (not necessarily leaner).
LordGrover said:
I was/am similar to OP.
Was 10.5-11 stones (65-70 kg) as a teenager (6'1").
By my early forties I was out of shape, run down, XL T's, out-growing 36" waist jeans and over 90 kgs.
Spent the next decade dieting/exercising/lapsing - repeat... sometimes got down to 80 kgs and had almost accepted my lot.
Then got into many/most of the 'fad'/trendy diets of the time; Paleo, Low carb, Veggie, Vegan, Keto, Carnivore - probably others, and reasonably consistent in the gym lifting weights. I was probably at my 'then' happiest eating paleo and lifting 5-6 times a week - but I was still north of 80 kgs, but a better composition as I'd gained quite a lot of muscle.
Anyway, long story short I've been 72 kgs for the last couple of years with relatively low BF but not as much lean muscle as I had a few years ago. I can eat pretty much what I want, when I want and remain the same. Much happier.
It can be done - you just need to find what works for you.
What was it that worked for you?Was 10.5-11 stones (65-70 kg) as a teenager (6'1").
By my early forties I was out of shape, run down, XL T's, out-growing 36" waist jeans and over 90 kgs.
Spent the next decade dieting/exercising/lapsing - repeat... sometimes got down to 80 kgs and had almost accepted my lot.
Then got into many/most of the 'fad'/trendy diets of the time; Paleo, Low carb, Veggie, Vegan, Keto, Carnivore - probably others, and reasonably consistent in the gym lifting weights. I was probably at my 'then' happiest eating paleo and lifting 5-6 times a week - but I was still north of 80 kgs, but a better composition as I'd gained quite a lot of muscle.
Anyway, long story short I've been 72 kgs for the last couple of years with relatively low BF but not as much lean muscle as I had a few years ago. I can eat pretty much what I want, when I want and remain the same. Much happier.
It can be done - you just need to find what works for you.
LordGrover said:
Louis Balfour said:
What was it that worked for you?
TBH, I'm not sure it's any one thing, except changing perceptions and desires.In ye olden dayes, I was a bugger for pasties, sausage rolls and the like, plus I ate takeaways at least once a week. Also drank for England.
I think the two extremes of Vegan and Carnivore helped a lot. Both are very restrictive so I learnt that there is nothing I absolutely must have. I was 14 months vegan and ate no animal products - missed meat, milk and cheese the most - but I survived and was at least initially pretty healthy. Some time later went full Carno for a year - no fruit or veg though I did have occasional nuts/seeds. Felt great and very strong. Now, I'm probably 90% carnivore - I eat some veg most days, but they're just an accompaniment to the meat/fish/cheese. I never eat breakfast, decent lunch and biggish dinner. No snacks, except occasional sweet binge.
Whatever I was eating, and ever since I've eaten no refined 'vegetable' oils. I think that's important.
Olive oil, butter and similar no problem. - just none of the novel industrial products.
I have no longer desire rubbish, so not eating it is no hardship.
There are echoes of what I learned when I used to train a lot (you have just applied it to diet) and that is that you don't get where you're going in one go.
popeyewhite said:
Louis Balfour said:
Has anyone else tried to skinny down in middle age and encountered resistance?
Lots of people, I've trained a few. Slash carbs and think about a lightweight 5/2 diet. You seem to know enough about exercise. Good luck.I have reduced carbs. I am not decided whether to go back to keto for a while. I don't like it as a lifestyle choice and personally I find it is bad for my gut.
I also think fasting is good news. It is a lever that I am saving for later.
mattuk89 said:
https://tdeecalculator.net/
Be honest as you fill it in, work out maintenance calories and drop 300/500.
Download MyFitnessPal, and track food for a week weigh yourself, see if you have lost weight, if you have carry on, if not drop calories/increase cardio, repeat eat week..
It’s that simple
I disagree, I don't think it is that simple. Though monitoring calories is important.Be honest as you fill it in, work out maintenance calories and drop 300/500.
Download MyFitnessPal, and track food for a week weigh yourself, see if you have lost weight, if you have carry on, if not drop calories/increase cardio, repeat eat week..
It’s that simple
popeyewhite said:
gregs656 said:
popeyewhite said:
"..middle age"
Makes no difference. 
When I was 13st and 13%bf the fat nurse doing my over 50s health check said I should be 10.5 stone.
ORD said:
People’s metabolisms vary by only a small amount. And exercise burns surprisingly few calories. People differ hugely in how much high calorie food they eat.
Drop the junk food and you’ll likely lose weight.
I don't eat junk food. The closest I come to it is a Chinese meal very occasionally from a quality takeaway and I usually stick to the meat and vegetable dishes. No sugar, cakes, sweets, processed food (outside a rasher of bacon on Saturday).Drop the junk food and you’ll likely lose weight.
But anyway, the main thrust of my post has been lost. I don't have a problem with losing fat. The problem is that my body seems to consider 14 stone my "natural" weight. If I exercise a lot, which keeps me stay fit and strong, that is where I end up. No doubt as I age and my test drops that will change somewhat. But I'd rather it was a controlled process.
I may bin the weights entirely for a bit and stick with various forms of cardio. I row a lot, so I probably don't NEED the weights.
ORD said:
You don’t seem to want to hear anything other than ‘You’re a unicorn’. If you eat fewer calories than you burn, you will lose weight. I lift 3 times per week and row 2-3 times per week. I can can 1kg per week or lose 1kg a week by tweaking a few hundred calories per day. That’s how it works.
It really isn't. There is more to it. As I said previously, I think it is a sort of hysteresis.But you can call me a unicorn if you want. If I can call you Dorothy.
ORD said:
Louis Balfour said:
It really isn't. There is more to it. As I said previously, I think it is a sort of hysteresis.
But you can call me a unicorn if you want. If I can call you Dorothy.
:-) Honestly, I’ve read thousands of pages and listened to probably hundreds of hours of high quality content on this stuff. Metabolic differences are very small. You will lose weight fast if you reduce your daily intake by 200-500 calories. But you can call me a unicorn if you want. If I can call you Dorothy.
But in all seriousness, cals in vs cals out is important. Of course it is.
But there are other factors, diet history and gut function to name but two. I also as I said up there ^ I think there are certain weights / sizes at which a person's body "settles" and I am increasingly of the opinion that may be influenced by training history.
Burrow01 said:
Louis Balfour said:
ORD said:
People’s metabolisms vary by only a small amount. And exercise burns surprisingly few calories. People differ hugely in how much high calorie food they eat.
Drop the junk food and you’ll likely lose weight.
I don't eat junk food. The closest I come to it is a Chinese meal very occasionally from a quality takeaway and I usually stick to the meat and vegetable dishes. No sugar, cakes, sweets, processed food (outside a rasher of bacon on Saturday).Drop the junk food and you’ll likely lose weight.
But anyway, the main thrust of my post has been lost. I don't have a problem with losing fat. The problem is that my body seems to consider 14 stone my "natural" weight. If I exercise a lot, which keeps me stay fit and strong, that is where I end up. No doubt as I age and my test drops that will change somewhat. But I'd rather it was a controlled process.
I may bin the weights entirely for a bit and stick with various forms of cardio. I row a lot, so I probably don't NEED the weights.
ORD said:
Same here. I absolutely love food. Not junk. But good quality, tasty food. I’ve almost never felt ‘full’ in the last decade. I think that’s what you have to accept. If you love food and don’t want to be fat, either move a huge amount or accept that you’ll have to feel tempted to eat and resist it every day.
It’s actually not that hard. But it is constant.
You say that, but when I have been at my leanest I have been far less bothered about food. The fatter the hungrier, generally.It’s actually not that hard. But it is constant.
gregs656 said:
Louis Balfour said:
gregs656 said:
Louis Balfour said:
This is of course quite true. It can be difficult to reduce food intake when not training.
It is unlikely your training enough to make a difference to your average calorie requirement.I think it is true to say that the body is quite efficient at preserving energy as it becomes fitter. Which is another reason to change up the exercise you're doing, to provide new challenges. It is possible burn "useful" numbers of calories. I think success is 80% diet however.
mcelliott said:
Giving my own experience, this time last year I was 215ib at 5 7' carrying a lot muscle and pretty lean too, since then I have lost around 28lb simply by reducing calorie intake and upping my cardio, the weight came off without any effort, nearly 50 by the way.
Why did you decide to lose the mass?Anonymous-poster said:
ORD said:
Anonymous-poster said:
Would be very difficult if not in possible to sustain 2kg fat loss even for a few weeks!
If you’re not super fat to start with, sure. But if you’re not super fat, you won’t need to lose 2kg per week for more than a few weeks!mcelliott said:
Louis Balfour said:
Why did you decide to lose the mass?
Because I didn't feel that comfortable at that weight and although I was eating clean the sheer amount I was consuming to keep that weight was taking a toll on my digestive system, feeling way better now light on my feet a generally a lot healthier.Gassing Station | Health Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff