STI 2006 - To tune or not to tune, that's the question?
Discussion
Evening chaps,
As mentioned in another post, I've just got my hands on a 2006 WRX STI with 77k on the clock.
Initially I'm going to take it to my local Scuby Indy (East Kent Subaru) to have a general look over it. I had a Click Mechanic pre purchase inspection and it did well bar the back brake pads needing changing, so will obviously do that. I will say the brakes too feel a little spongy in comparison to my older e46 M3. That might be a characteristic, or might require a recondition of kinds. I'm open to either really, but pretty sure the guy in East Kent Subaru will figure that out.
The first change I want to make is to change the standard head unit to a Android Auto double din. This will then have a cable going into the glove box for my phone so i can run google maps / contacts etc. I may even get a reverse camera, but not 100% sure where the camera will sit yet. thoughts welcome! In terms of android auto, I like the Sony XAV-AX3005DB (~£300 ex cables and install).
Tyres seem in good condition and service history seems alright, but nothing has been done in terms of pressure testing the cylinders. I say that as if I know a lot, but I really don't, but from common sense point of view (turbo / these cars generally getting ragged) I would think it would be a good thing to get checked regardless... on that note, is this quite a specialist thing to get checked, or would my local Indy be able to do this? If more specialist, what price would this be at roughly?
I believe one of the cats is already gone from the car, other than that it's stock.
Regarding tuning, I'm really in two minds... here's my thoughts so far:
Pros of NOT tuning
- Keeping value on the car... I'm the kind of guy who generally gets the car checked out quite a lot, so it will probably be in a better condition when / if I hand it over in X years time
- It's already a fantastic car, so why bother
- I'm primarily a family guy, so don't really need it. Save money and use that to take it over to Europe once ban lifts.
- Insurance stays the same
- Less chance of blowing up things
Pros of tuning
- I have only ever remapped a Seat Ibiza TDI (from 130bhp to ~160bhp), other than that, I haven't really tuned anything or modded performance wise. Might be nice for a change! The performance bump in the Seat was great, so something similar might be nice, especially if it doesn't kill the MPG but not toooo much (not that fussed really, but not looking at <10mpg on average).
- IF I do mod, I will keep the original parts and put back if / when I feel like it. When I bought my E46 M3 it had an after market exhaust. Great for a holiday, not great for every day. I kinda like the idea of having something special for a few months of the year and then switching over. Admittedly, changing an exhaust is ~£100 in labour, so much less than say a turbo or likes of.
- Part of me is interested in a twin scroll turbo to balance out the power a bit, perhaps going for something a little more than normal, but i guess this will cause problems with other elements and may not be worth it until I have forged components? That being said, I have heard the JDM twin scrolls dont sound as good?
- Forged - part of me likes the idea of this, just for peace of mind, regardless of power output. But I have no idea what this looks like cost wise. But the main thing here is confidence that IF i did put anything beyond stock, then this element is already sorted. Also I guess I can remap to a more 'sensible' bhp or go more crazy depending on what I feel is manageable.
- From speaking with East Kent Subaru, he said he will need to look at the puppy, but roughly speaking an air filter change, new fuel system and good remap could bring it to ~350bhp (not sure if this is wheel horse power though!?). Either way, I'm guessing that isn't too drastic in cost, and might provide a similar bump to my old Seat. I also understand anything beyond 350bhp gets sketchy on other elements of the engine? This is just based on american Youtube stuff (based in the UK btw).
In addition to the above, I love the various non exhaust sounds the car makes. I guess it's the subtle winning of various elements and generally solid clunks and the likes of that make it sound so good. I'm guessing it sounds slightly agricultural, or like a toned down rally car, but either way it's very nice! Only slight downside is the somewhat loud road noise, but that could be tyre related.
Part of me loves the idea of mods enhancing the general engines sounds, sounding more like a rally car. To be frank, the burble is nice (nothing on an e46 m3) but the other noises I find just as pleasing, so perhaps it could be a mod also for the sound!? That being said, it will need to go down a motorway without sounding trashy.
I know there are loads of articles out there, but I'm worried something from say 2011 may have been good on a car of that age, but I'm worried how the car will fair with the age it is now!?
Thoughts welcome, and thanks for everyone's feedback so far, really impressed!
Best
T
As mentioned in another post, I've just got my hands on a 2006 WRX STI with 77k on the clock.
Initially I'm going to take it to my local Scuby Indy (East Kent Subaru) to have a general look over it. I had a Click Mechanic pre purchase inspection and it did well bar the back brake pads needing changing, so will obviously do that. I will say the brakes too feel a little spongy in comparison to my older e46 M3. That might be a characteristic, or might require a recondition of kinds. I'm open to either really, but pretty sure the guy in East Kent Subaru will figure that out.
The first change I want to make is to change the standard head unit to a Android Auto double din. This will then have a cable going into the glove box for my phone so i can run google maps / contacts etc. I may even get a reverse camera, but not 100% sure where the camera will sit yet. thoughts welcome! In terms of android auto, I like the Sony XAV-AX3005DB (~£300 ex cables and install).
Tyres seem in good condition and service history seems alright, but nothing has been done in terms of pressure testing the cylinders. I say that as if I know a lot, but I really don't, but from common sense point of view (turbo / these cars generally getting ragged) I would think it would be a good thing to get checked regardless... on that note, is this quite a specialist thing to get checked, or would my local Indy be able to do this? If more specialist, what price would this be at roughly?
I believe one of the cats is already gone from the car, other than that it's stock.
Regarding tuning, I'm really in two minds... here's my thoughts so far:
Pros of NOT tuning
- Keeping value on the car... I'm the kind of guy who generally gets the car checked out quite a lot, so it will probably be in a better condition when / if I hand it over in X years time
- It's already a fantastic car, so why bother
- I'm primarily a family guy, so don't really need it. Save money and use that to take it over to Europe once ban lifts.
- Insurance stays the same
- Less chance of blowing up things
Pros of tuning
- I have only ever remapped a Seat Ibiza TDI (from 130bhp to ~160bhp), other than that, I haven't really tuned anything or modded performance wise. Might be nice for a change! The performance bump in the Seat was great, so something similar might be nice, especially if it doesn't kill the MPG but not toooo much (not that fussed really, but not looking at <10mpg on average).
- IF I do mod, I will keep the original parts and put back if / when I feel like it. When I bought my E46 M3 it had an after market exhaust. Great for a holiday, not great for every day. I kinda like the idea of having something special for a few months of the year and then switching over. Admittedly, changing an exhaust is ~£100 in labour, so much less than say a turbo or likes of.
- Part of me is interested in a twin scroll turbo to balance out the power a bit, perhaps going for something a little more than normal, but i guess this will cause problems with other elements and may not be worth it until I have forged components? That being said, I have heard the JDM twin scrolls dont sound as good?
- Forged - part of me likes the idea of this, just for peace of mind, regardless of power output. But I have no idea what this looks like cost wise. But the main thing here is confidence that IF i did put anything beyond stock, then this element is already sorted. Also I guess I can remap to a more 'sensible' bhp or go more crazy depending on what I feel is manageable.
- From speaking with East Kent Subaru, he said he will need to look at the puppy, but roughly speaking an air filter change, new fuel system and good remap could bring it to ~350bhp (not sure if this is wheel horse power though!?). Either way, I'm guessing that isn't too drastic in cost, and might provide a similar bump to my old Seat. I also understand anything beyond 350bhp gets sketchy on other elements of the engine? This is just based on american Youtube stuff (based in the UK btw).
In addition to the above, I love the various non exhaust sounds the car makes. I guess it's the subtle winning of various elements and generally solid clunks and the likes of that make it sound so good. I'm guessing it sounds slightly agricultural, or like a toned down rally car, but either way it's very nice! Only slight downside is the somewhat loud road noise, but that could be tyre related.
Part of me loves the idea of mods enhancing the general engines sounds, sounding more like a rally car. To be frank, the burble is nice (nothing on an e46 m3) but the other noises I find just as pleasing, so perhaps it could be a mod also for the sound!? That being said, it will need to go down a motorway without sounding trashy.
I know there are loads of articles out there, but I'm worried something from say 2011 may have been good on a car of that age, but I'm worried how the car will fair with the age it is now!?
Thoughts welcome, and thanks for everyone's feedback so far, really impressed!
Best
T
Not a Diesel said:
Might be worth saying if its 2.0 Blob or a 2.5 Hawkeye.
As I think his was a transition year.
You will get some differing opinions depending on which based on the underlying engine reliability.
I am running a standard 2.0 UK Blob with the PPP.
Good shoutAs I think his was a transition year.
You will get some differing opinions depending on which based on the underlying engine reliability.
I am running a standard 2.0 UK Blob with the PPP.
2.5L single turbo Hawkeye (on a 56 plate)
Morning all
So if I were to remap + filter + Exhaust adjustment + fuel pump, you think the value won't go down much?
Just had some clarification on the car decat situation - it seems the mid decat was done but not downpipe. It didn't have PPP on purchase. So initially it came with two cats. Hope this adds clarity.
So if I were to remap + filter + Exhaust adjustment + fuel pump, you think the value won't go down much?
Just had some clarification on the car decat situation - it seems the mid decat was done but not downpipe. It didn't have PPP on purchase. So initially it came with two cats. Hope this adds clarity.
plenty said:
theog87 said:
Would you say there is a go to brand for parts in general? Jap speed?
Not really as it varies depending on part category.Instead, there a number of trusted retailers who have been around a long time and have a good reputation in the Subaru community. Import Car Parts for OEM parts. Roger Clark Motorsport for tuning parts and AS Performance for both.
You can still get many OEM parts new directly from Subaru dealers.
Thanks for all the above everyone.
I know this might be contradiction in it's own right, but as well as loving cars, I don't really want to be screwing up the environment. Carbon offsetting is something I want to be doing this year. There are various ways of doing this, but the area which interesting me is putting money into protecting various rainforests. This saves animals etc and also the trees keep the carbon and the likes of. Really not as expensive as you think.
With the above in mind, I'm still playing with the idea of modding the car, but I understand that a number of routes requires decat or the likes of. This then brings me onto the sports cats and the likes of.
Is there a general consensus on which brand / type is the most effective at cutting out carbon / nasty's, and also has high flow rate? I'm also assuming you would only need 1 sports cat, or would you require 2?
I know this might be contradiction in it's own right, but as well as loving cars, I don't really want to be screwing up the environment. Carbon offsetting is something I want to be doing this year. There are various ways of doing this, but the area which interesting me is putting money into protecting various rainforests. This saves animals etc and also the trees keep the carbon and the likes of. Really not as expensive as you think.
With the above in mind, I'm still playing with the idea of modding the car, but I understand that a number of routes requires decat or the likes of. This then brings me onto the sports cats and the likes of.
Is there a general consensus on which brand / type is the most effective at cutting out carbon / nasty's, and also has high flow rate? I'm also assuming you would only need 1 sports cat, or would you require 2?
Ah.....hmmm..... just watched this from Engineer Explained.
Would I be right in saying that cats don't actually remove CO2? That's a bit of a game changer. Not really sure how worried I am about nitrogen etc as 99% of my driving is through the country where very few people will be breathing it in!?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HADOcrcMikA
Would I be right in saying that cats don't actually remove CO2? That's a bit of a game changer. Not really sure how worried I am about nitrogen etc as 99% of my driving is through the country where very few people will be breathing it in!?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HADOcrcMikA
trails said:
No...vastly different in many ways 
Probably worth getting the pedant hat on and saying an Impreza isn't a sports car, it's a quick saloon...I think the excepted definition of a sports car is a (typically) two seat car designed from its very inception to focus on the driving experience. Maybe.
Haha looolsProbably worth getting the pedant hat on and saying an Impreza isn't a sports car, it's a quick saloon...I think the excepted definition of a sports car is a (typically) two seat car designed from its very inception to focus on the driving experience. Maybe.
Edited by trails on Friday 19th February 23:29
There was a typo in my last message. Meant to say "are all sports Cats the same" e.g. I see with impreza after market sports cats, it says 200 particles or something flow.
Are some brands better than others? Is 200 like for like 200, or some just superior?
Quite like the idea that if I do mod, I use all the same brand throughout the whole car. COBB is it?
My cars got around 77k on the clock, running really well.
Might sound crazy but would modding the car make it more reliable? E. G. If I forged the engine and upgraded the head gasket (cosworth? Sorry for lack of knowledge + other bits + new turbo) would this decrease the chances of engine failure?
I like the idea of reconditioning parts. I reconditioned the brakes on my old e46 m3 and loved the difference. Really like the idea of 'up cycling'.
Also would selling a car forged increase the value at all given that its rebuilt?
I think I remember seeing it costing £6k or so to rebuild, so I doubt you would get that, but could you sell for say £12k (rebuilt) rather than say £10k (stock) as it currently stands?
Might sound crazy but would modding the car make it more reliable? E. G. If I forged the engine and upgraded the head gasket (cosworth? Sorry for lack of knowledge + other bits + new turbo) would this decrease the chances of engine failure?
I like the idea of reconditioning parts. I reconditioned the brakes on my old e46 m3 and loved the difference. Really like the idea of 'up cycling'.
Also would selling a car forged increase the value at all given that its rebuilt?
I think I remember seeing it costing £6k or so to rebuild, so I doubt you would get that, but could you sell for say £12k (rebuilt) rather than say £10k (stock) as it currently stands?
Elatino1 said:
I would get the map checked and upgrade things as and when they become a problem. I'm now on 380bhp on the standard engine just with uprated head gaskets and ARP head studs with an SC42 turbo.
I love my twin scroll as the power is strong from low down and I think it sounds better than a single scroll at full chat but unfortunately doesn't have that nice burble at low revs.
380 bhp seems a good wack. I love my twin scroll as the power is strong from low down and I think it sounds better than a single scroll at full chat but unfortunately doesn't have that nice burble at low revs.
Is that a twin scroll on a 2L or 2.5L?
I like the idea of a twin scroll on a 2.5L but I think it's a lot of work. If changing the turbo on a 2.5L then might be tempting
I don't mind no turbo power sub 3k (single turbo 2.5L) as I can just pootle along and get good mpg (my average speed is 25mph or something).
What would be nice is power from 3k all the way up, rather than just mid range power, so maybe a bigger twin scroll turbo and forged, then I guess better intercooler too?
I'm worried if I do anything to my 2.5L it will increase chances of headgasket or something, so would prefer to say put £1k aside per year and upgrade as I go along.
Normally I would use second hand parts (on exterior / interior fittings etc), but not sure if engine. The concept of billet steel everywhere is pretty rad.
Ok thanks for the info.
So lets just say (hard to tell really) that I fully forge the engine, without turbo chargers etc just rebuilt for peace of mind (head gasket issues and the likes of). Say this costs £5-6k.
If i bought the car for ~£10k. Do you think it would still be worth £10k or gone down, or up?
Just thinking I could do bit's at a time to save up front costs. Question is, will it trash the overall value of the car, whilst spending £xxxx?
Just got the car back from an indy scuby place (just did a health check for peace of mind) and they said there could be signs of head gasket issues, but could be fine. He said to keep an eye on coolant levels, oil levels and temps. I normally glance at temps (on dash) frequently when driving, and will check oil + coolants before every drive (only drive on weekends) and when car is cool.
From what I gather when it next goes in (a month or so time) he is going to replace fluids and 'give it a clean' (sorry for lack of knowledge) and then I will bring back in a couple of months to see if the same issue. I believe he is referring to oil getting into the coolant... once again, sorry for lack of knowledge. He said the engine coolant level rose quite a bit, which could be a sign of something funny!? I might have been totally misunderstanding it, so sorry if I'm adding confusion.
On a separate note, he noticed some oil splashes, which could have been done when a DIY oil change was done (before i owned the car), or could be a sign of oil leaking from the engine. He said he will need to take off cambelt to have a proper look "OIL LEAKAGE APPARENT AT N/S CAMBELT CASING AND CENTRE CAMBELT CASING, POSSIBLE CAM SEAL LEAKAGE OR BLOCK BUNG LEAK,"... he said he wouldn't really know what it is until cambelt is off, so said he may as well do a cambelt change whilst at it. Also fluid change wont hurt. Cambelt change n fluids (~£600 ex any other nasties).
I'm guessing I have done around 1.5k miles in the car since i got it (~a month ago) and I'm pretty positive the engine oil hasn't gone (check fairly frequently), but then again i guess even if it has a leak it will be small amounts? FYI no oil leaks on the floor in my garage where I keep it the whole time.
For what it's worth, he did a test drive of the car and said it's pulling well and doesn't miss a beat. Only slight thing to notice is break pads probably need doing (which i knew).
FYI this was the East Kent Subaru. For what it's worth, they seemed pretty legit and very nice chaps.
So lets just say (hard to tell really) that I fully forge the engine, without turbo chargers etc just rebuilt for peace of mind (head gasket issues and the likes of). Say this costs £5-6k.
If i bought the car for ~£10k. Do you think it would still be worth £10k or gone down, or up?
Just thinking I could do bit's at a time to save up front costs. Question is, will it trash the overall value of the car, whilst spending £xxxx?
Just got the car back from an indy scuby place (just did a health check for peace of mind) and they said there could be signs of head gasket issues, but could be fine. He said to keep an eye on coolant levels, oil levels and temps. I normally glance at temps (on dash) frequently when driving, and will check oil + coolants before every drive (only drive on weekends) and when car is cool.
From what I gather when it next goes in (a month or so time) he is going to replace fluids and 'give it a clean' (sorry for lack of knowledge) and then I will bring back in a couple of months to see if the same issue. I believe he is referring to oil getting into the coolant... once again, sorry for lack of knowledge. He said the engine coolant level rose quite a bit, which could be a sign of something funny!? I might have been totally misunderstanding it, so sorry if I'm adding confusion.
On a separate note, he noticed some oil splashes, which could have been done when a DIY oil change was done (before i owned the car), or could be a sign of oil leaking from the engine. He said he will need to take off cambelt to have a proper look "OIL LEAKAGE APPARENT AT N/S CAMBELT CASING AND CENTRE CAMBELT CASING, POSSIBLE CAM SEAL LEAKAGE OR BLOCK BUNG LEAK,"... he said he wouldn't really know what it is until cambelt is off, so said he may as well do a cambelt change whilst at it. Also fluid change wont hurt. Cambelt change n fluids (~£600 ex any other nasties).
I'm guessing I have done around 1.5k miles in the car since i got it (~a month ago) and I'm pretty positive the engine oil hasn't gone (check fairly frequently), but then again i guess even if it has a leak it will be small amounts? FYI no oil leaks on the floor in my garage where I keep it the whole time.
For what it's worth, he did a test drive of the car and said it's pulling well and doesn't miss a beat. Only slight thing to notice is break pads probably need doing (which i knew).
FYI this was the East Kent Subaru. For what it's worth, they seemed pretty legit and very nice chaps.
plenty said:
East Kent have been around for a long time and have a decent rep.
You won't get all your money back from forging, but you will add a bit of value and most importantly your car will be easier to sell on afterwards.
Ok great, just what I want to hear to be honest!You won't get all your money back from forging, but you will add a bit of value and most importantly your car will be easier to sell on afterwards.
I can imagine if put a massive pink wing on the back it probably wont be great, but 'health proof upgrades' i guess cant hurt.
Pupbelly said:
Cam cover gaskets are a common thing and easy to resolve. Usually the drivers side will leak due to the higher temperatures from the turbo. Worth doing and likewise the cambelt is defo worth doing for peace of mind. I would certainly investigate further the oil/coolant thing. You can get a 'sniff test' which could determine any head gasket issues. Worth checking out before you shell out on the belts etc being done otherwise you will be seeing some big bills potentially.
Depending on where you are I can happily recommend these guys: http://bentensautocare.co.uk/ Dedicated Subaru guys with superb service and a no nonsense and very honest approach to work. They have done any major work on my Blobeye for years and I'm always pleased with their work and prices.
I spoke to east kent and they said the sniff test is ok, but normally only really works when it's truly fu**ed, so he said he wouldn't really bother. That's just his opinion.Depending on where you are I can happily recommend these guys: http://bentensautocare.co.uk/ Dedicated Subaru guys with superb service and a no nonsense and very honest approach to work. They have done any major work on my Blobeye for years and I'm always pleased with their work and prices.
Edited by Pupbelly on Friday 12th March 12:26
Edited by Pupbelly on Friday 12th March 12:27
To be frank, often the biggest costs are the labour and getting the car there n back and organising it all. Sometimes easier just to go straight into it if you get me.
Never heard of bentens!? They are just down the road from me!!! Wish I had known sooner. That being said, the setup at east kent seems pretty comprehensive and it's pretty safe to say they have done more than a couple rebuilds, so somewhat tempted to stick with them to be honest. Not done any true work with them yet, so cant really vouch for them yet, but indications are good. Just hoping pricing wont escalate.
How much work you had done there? It is mainly stock stuff, or they known for more performance stuff? The guys at east kent seem almost more tuning work than standard stuff, which is quite interesting!
I've mainly been with BMW indys. I think they have their hands generally full enough with normal repairs hahaha
The truth is, I really dont mind paying people for a good job. It's just when your not technical, and you take your car to the average 'fixer', i cant help but feel cautious half the time. I generally stick with people I know, but going from BMW to subaru mean finding a new team so to speak.
Pupbelly said:
Benten are a traditional independent with many many years of knowledge. Clive had worked for Subaru for 25+ years and really knows his stuff. They do engine rebuilds, in fact anything but are not performance tuners, they will give you good honest work for sensible money. I think unless you’re desperate to go the performance route they’re a good place to know and even if you do get yours done at East Kent, Benten will keep things running nicely for other things.
I’ve had my Blobeye wagon 6 years now (didn’t mean to but just love it!) and Benten do the stuff I can’t. Mine is mildly modified and Clive always give straight advice.
If you’re not driving your car hard point to point and track daying it a regular setup with sensible modifications and proper ECU map will see you fine for a daily driver.
Rust is the biggest enemy of our Imprezas. What looks shiny from the kerbside can be a whole world of pain underneath. I’d ensure yours it tip top underneath and make sure the rear turrets, rear arches and cills are all properly solid before committing to thousands of pounds of engine work. I’ve known many who shell out loads on the engine and polish the paint to find their car is rotten in crucial areas that mean either epic welding bills or scrapping the car!! Get it checked properly first.
Ok great thanks for this, great to know!I’ve had my Blobeye wagon 6 years now (didn’t mean to but just love it!) and Benten do the stuff I can’t. Mine is mildly modified and Clive always give straight advice.
If you’re not driving your car hard point to point and track daying it a regular setup with sensible modifications and proper ECU map will see you fine for a daily driver.
Rust is the biggest enemy of our Imprezas. What looks shiny from the kerbside can be a whole world of pain underneath. I’d ensure yours it tip top underneath and make sure the rear turrets, rear arches and cills are all properly solid before committing to thousands of pounds of engine work. I’ve known many who shell out loads on the engine and polish the paint to find their car is rotten in crucial areas that mean either epic welding bills or scrapping the car!! Get it checked properly first.
Edited by Pupbelly on Sunday 14th March 08:03
Edited by Pupbelly on Sunday 14th March 08:03
I had a clickmechanic check out for rust, and he said it aint too bad. I would like to thinkt he east kent guys would have picked up on this whilst on the ramp also.... still tempted with an underseal though tbh.
Pupbelly said:
theog87 said:
Ok great thanks for this, great to know!
I had a clickmechanic check out for rust, and he said it aint too bad. I would like to thinkt he east kent guys would have picked up on this whilst on the ramp also.... still tempted with an underseal though tbh.
I would still be tempted to (if you can) get the car in on axle stands, take the rear wheels off and have a good squirt around with a hose pipe or pressure washer and an old paint brush and get right up into those turrets. Get all the dirt and baked on sh-te that accumulates up there and check the turret wall that faces the wheelarch. I had a clickmechanic check out for rust, and he said it aint too bad. I would like to thinkt he east kent guys would have picked up on this whilst on the ramp also.... still tempted with an underseal though tbh.
This is the one that will be crusty if there is a problem and this is the one that will mean lots of awkward welding!! A pig to get your head in to see, but once its all been cleaned off, shine a decent torch up there and have a poke about with your fingers and don't be shy to press on the metalwork. Better to find out now than after a £5k engine rebuild and detailing session!
Assuming it's all good up there go crazy with underseal etc. Make sure everything is prepped before undertaking the work otherwise you'll end up trapping water or creating water traps and you're back to square one if you intend to keep the car long term. Do some research for the best underseal everyone has their favourites and I'm sure some folk one here will be able to advise.
I would also be tempted to strip out the boot linings to gain access to the inside of the rear panels too and take a look at the rear arches & rear 1/4 from inside the boot. If there are any turret issues they will also show themselves in these areas too.
Just my input!
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