- The riddle pf the Toyota GT86- the car for purist drivers.
Discussion
It seems strange to me that there is a recurrent theme on PH about the loss of driving feel, the move to electronics/flappy paddles/electronics/self driving and so on. Part of that theme has been that it would be MUCH better to have a slower, more fun, all manual car as the more powerful cars are not engaging.
Enter the Toyota GT86.
Great reviews, high fun factor. Nobody bought it.
Has PH become a dinosaur, out of touch with ordinary drivers?. Or it is that the journos no longer represent the buying public who just want commuter cars or SUVS?.... Sad that this was a failure:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/cars/toyota/toyota-gt86...
Enter the Toyota GT86.
Great reviews, high fun factor. Nobody bought it.
Has PH become a dinosaur, out of touch with ordinary drivers?. Or it is that the journos no longer represent the buying public who just want commuter cars or SUVS?.... Sad that this was a failure:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/cars/toyota/toyota-gt86...
I wasn't expecting this post to generate so much discussion but the reason I started it was because I was trying to understand why people buy very fast cars when most roads are speed limited. The usual reason given is that they are fun to drive. Manuals allow you to be engaged ,simple cars with no nannies sort out the real drivers from the posers. Thus the GT 86 should have been a mega hit. Practicality can't be such a big reason. Try loading an F type or a Cayman.
I was curious because I was thinking about my own motivations. I used to have a few manual cars but now have one. 9 year old GT3RS. Everything else is auto or PDK. When it comes to driving on fairly congested roads the RS in 50 mph traffic or stop and go stuff is far from being my first choice. So, in a way my PH credentials are slipping. Of course the odd track day is fun and a sporty car is rewarding ,though skilled track drivers do better than I do in more regular wheels. I will keep the old RS permanently just to have the option but I suspect I will not buy another. PDK works fine for me on road or track
Most modern high performance cars have recognized this and no longer offer manuals. I had all sorts of manual BMWs but even they got out of the raw performance car business. I recognize that there will always be Caterhams and the like and genuinely applaud those who drive them. However the GT86 for me is symptomatic of the fact that what people say and do is different.
I was curious because I was thinking about my own motivations. I used to have a few manual cars but now have one. 9 year old GT3RS. Everything else is auto or PDK. When it comes to driving on fairly congested roads the RS in 50 mph traffic or stop and go stuff is far from being my first choice. So, in a way my PH credentials are slipping. Of course the odd track day is fun and a sporty car is rewarding ,though skilled track drivers do better than I do in more regular wheels. I will keep the old RS permanently just to have the option but I suspect I will not buy another. PDK works fine for me on road or track
Most modern high performance cars have recognized this and no longer offer manuals. I had all sorts of manual BMWs but even they got out of the raw performance car business. I recognize that there will always be Caterhams and the like and genuinely applaud those who drive them. However the GT86 for me is symptomatic of the fact that what people say and do is different.
RobM77 said:
Me too!
As I said on the previous page, BMWs are becoming FWD from the bottom of the range upwards, and 4WD now sells well for them across the range, in the UK at least. This is consistent with what I still think is the case: most buyers don't care; they either want a family wagon or something that looks subtle but flashy and has loads of horsepower. People who care about the sort of things Lotus do with their cars are a very rare breed (just ask Lotus' accountants!).
I think that is true. At least in North America we are seeing the depopulation of the country areas as young people continue to move to cities which are becoming densely populated. They are moving to smaller accommodations often too. Cities are becoming less car friendly. Add to this the prevalence of WhatsApp and all the other social media environments and a car of any kind is becoming less necessary, so people are getting their drivers permits much later than previously. The minority who what sports cars are shrinking even faster. Thus, it seems to me that the future of the Driver's car is not sunny at least on this side of the pond.As I said on the previous page, BMWs are becoming FWD from the bottom of the range upwards, and 4WD now sells well for them across the range, in the UK at least. This is consistent with what I still think is the case: most buyers don't care; they either want a family wagon or something that looks subtle but flashy and has loads of horsepower. People who care about the sort of things Lotus do with their cars are a very rare breed (just ask Lotus' accountants!).
ian2144 said:
FIREBIRDC9 said:
em177 said:
But I'd rather be a few hundred yards down the road behind. Grinning.
If you don't understand that then that's fine. But that's your problem. Not the cars.
Truer words have never been spoken!If you don't understand that then that's fine. But that's your problem. Not the cars.
Edited by em177 on Sunday 15th January 22:27
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