Fast Fords

[theplayingmantis]

Will there ever be another one?

I grew up with my old man buying german import mark ii grenadas, that had been made fast. before that and my time he had sport cortinas (not sure if thats a contradiction). and would have liked to carry on the tradition one day.

I dont know too much of the heritage of fast fords, but i do know they don't make them anymore (im not talking hot hatches or muscle cars)

will we ever see the likes of a Sierra RS Cosworth again? could a RS mondeo be a thing ever?

the last full size car that could be described as such was variations of the Falcon down under i think. thats now been canned.

its sad

[theplayingmantis]

M-SportMatt said:

theplayingmantis said:

Will there ever be another one?

I grew up with my old man buying german import mark ii grenadas, that had been made fast. before that and my time he had sport cortinas (not sure if thats a contradiction). and would have liked to carry on the tradition one day.

I dont know too much of the heritage of fast fords, but i do know they don't make them anymore (im not talking hot hatches or muscle cars)

will we ever see the likes of a Sierra RS Cosworth again? could a RS mondeo be a thing ever?

the last full size car that could be described as such was variations of the Falcon down under i think. thats now been canned.

its sad

So you're not on about hatches.....but then quote two hatches....Sierra RS Cosworth is a hatch ( saph was the later saloon ) and the mondeo is a hatch.

The Focus RS is the current Fast Ford...or the Mustang depending on your point of view.....

dont be pedantic.

i clearly quote full size car. i consider a focus a hot hatch. to compare it to a rs cosworth is just silly,

[theplayingmantis]

M-SportMatt said:

theplayingmantis said:

dont be pedantic.

i clearly quote full size car. i consider a focus a hot hatch. to compare it to a rs cosworth is just silly,

If you meant 'Full Size' whatever the hell that means ( i mean are there any 3/4 sized replicas about? ) surely you meant Granada's then or Scorpios


Is it silly to compare the Sierra to the Focus? The Mk3 focus is way bigger than a Mk1 Sierra Hatch, way more powerful and way faster so yes maybe I shouldn't compare them....BUT

Both were/are HALO performance models and both compete/competed in the BTCC and both are hatches, they couldn't be more similar apart from AWD vs RWD.


if you meant it, why not just ask if Ford are going to make a big performance saloon?

It's because the answer is a resounding no, who in their right mind is going to pay what would surely be north of 40k for a Ford Saloon in a hugely competitive segment.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full-size_car

ok will ford ever make a fast saloon again rather than a chavvy (perceived) fast focus.

how much is a mondeo vignale in full spec?

GM, and maybe PSA, did will do it woth the vxr insignia.

[theplayingmantis]

M-SportMatt said:

Given the issues they had with producing a low volume high performance model ( see Mk2 and Mk1 FRS - neither made fully on the main production line, Mk1 sold at a loss, Mk2 quality issues ) then unless they can integrate into the main production line ( hence 5 dr focus rs this time ) and produce it at a profit then i doubt it.

Never say never but there is no real need and dare I say it no real market.

if they could knock a fast saloon (edit, saloon style, yes the sierra was a hatchback, but not at least in my perception as an out and out one like a focus is)out for under 40k i would consider one. but i fear sadly you are right and they never will again.

Edited by theplayingmantis on Monday 21st August 14:45

[theplayingmantis]

KevinCamaroSS said:

Going from the thread title, there are several current UK models that fall into that grouping, Mustang, Focus RS, GT etc. Not sure what saloon style cars are available in the US at present?

im talking about the man on the streets family car. yes appreciate the focus fill that gap but i mean the mondeo/sierra model the flagship model for want of a better word. an ordinary car made fast, a mondeo rs is such a thing existed

[theplayingmantis]

Resolutionary said:

theplayingmantis said:

im talking about the man on the streets family car. yes appreciate the focus fill that gap but i mean the mondeo/sierra model the flagship model for want of a better word. an ordinary car made fast, a mondeo rs is such a thing existed

Earlier, in the M / AMG / RS Heritage thread, referring to sport prefixes:

theplayingmantis said:

the average buyer wouldnt know what either meant or represented

If the man on the street happens to be the average buyer, they probably aren't in the market for anything particularly akin to 'flagship'. Ford have decidedly shifted their efforts to the hatchback market more than saloon, where they do bloody well in this country, and to the GT market where they pick up on historic lineage.

I would have loved to see the Cosworth / Ford partnership survive into the 2000's and present day with uber saloons but as others have mentioned, the Aussie and US markets are offered fast four door cars because they're still deemed a reasonable option, for a plethora of reasons.

im not saying the man on the street would know what the suffix meant! im using the man on the streets car to convey what im trying to get across when i say by fast ford when people point out they already exist in the focus/mustang.

whats the us fast 4 door ford

[theplayingmantis]

jsf said:

theplayingmantis said:

M-SportMatt said:

theplayingmantis said:

Will there ever be another one?

I grew up with my old man buying german import mark ii grenadas, that had been made fast. before that and my time he had sport cortinas (not sure if thats a contradiction). and would have liked to carry on the tradition one day.

I dont know too much of the heritage of fast fords, but i do know they don't make them anymore (im not talking hot hatches or muscle cars)

will we ever see the likes of a Sierra RS Cosworth again? could a RS mondeo be a thing ever?

the last full size car that could be described as such was variations of the Falcon down under i think. thats now been canned.

its sad

So you're not on about hatches.....but then quote two hatches....Sierra RS Cosworth is a hatch ( saph was the later saloon ) and the mondeo is a hatch.

The Focus RS is the current Fast Ford...or the Mustang depending on your point of view.....

dont be pedantic.

i clearly quote full size car. i consider a focus a hot hatch. to compare it to a rs cosworth is just silly,

The Escort Cosworth is a direct comparison to the current Focus range I would suggest.

The Escort Cosworth was built on the Sierra platform, not the FWD escort platform. When the original UK focus came out it was smaller, but the USA version was about the size of the Escort Cosworth, they then went to a world platform that is the same size of the US spec car, its bigger than it looks.

When we ran a Group A Sapphire, we reshelled that into an Escort Cosworth, then we looked at reshelling that into a Focus (the original UK one), but decided not too because it was heavier!

yes thats how the focus sits in my head, equivalent to the old escort, regrdless of how fast and long its now got. the sierra is the mondeo, not sure wtf an orion is?

[theplayingmantis]

Zetec-S said:

I'd love it if they made an "RS Mondeo" - RWD and the same V8 as in the Mustang

Trouble is it would probably cost more than a Mustang, and getting on towards 'M' car territory. So they'd only sell a handful. Either that or to keep the cost competitive they'd have to sell at a loss. I'm sure neither option is in line with their "corporate goals".

would it need to cost that much? how much is/was vxr insignia (or equivalent)

[theplayingmantis]

M-SportMatt said:

theplayingmantis said:

jsf said:

theplayingmantis said:

M-SportMatt said:

theplayingmantis said:

Will there ever be another one?

I grew up with my old man buying german import mark ii grenadas, that had been made fast. before that and my time he had sport cortinas (not sure if thats a contradiction). and would have liked to carry on the tradition one day.

I dont know too much of the heritage of fast fords, but i do know they don't make them anymore (im not talking hot hatches or muscle cars)

will we ever see the likes of a Sierra RS Cosworth again? could a RS mondeo be a thing ever?

the last full size car that could be described as such was variations of the Falcon down under i think. thats now been canned.

its sad

So you're not on about hatches.....but then quote two hatches....Sierra RS Cosworth is a hatch ( saph was the later saloon ) and the mondeo is a hatch.

The Focus RS is the current Fast Ford...or the Mustang depending on your point of view.....

dont be pedantic.

i clearly quote full size car. i consider a focus a hot hatch. to compare it to a rs cosworth is just silly,

The Escort Cosworth is a direct comparison to the current Focus range I would suggest.

The Escort Cosworth was built on the Sierra platform, not the FWD escort platform. When the original UK focus came out it was smaller, but the USA version was about the size of the Escort Cosworth, they then went to a world platform that is the same size of the US spec car, its bigger than it looks.

When we ran a Group A Sapphire, we reshelled that into an Escort Cosworth, then we looked at reshelling that into a Focus (the original UK one), but decided not too because it was heavier!

yes that's how the focus sits in my head, equivalent to the old escort, regrdless of how fast and long its now got. the sierra is the mondeo, not sure wtf an orion is?

That's exactly what it is...but Escort/Focus/Sierra/Mondeo are all hatches and the focus is bigger than the sierra.......the OP also stated "Full Sized" which of course refers to the Granada and latterly the Scorpio....so what he's looking for a replacement for is a Granada 2.8i Sport with X pack RS accessories.......obviously ;-)

i bet your popular at parties!

[theplayingmantis]

LandRoverManiac said:

The last 'biggish' Fast Ford (pointless getting into a car-size category debate - since the metric changes depending on what continent and decade you're talking about) would have been the Mondeo ST 220 in my book.

The modern Mondeo ST is just a glorified trim level - which is a shame, because fast saloons are fun in their own unique way.

i remember this from when i was a teen, what years where they made, googling it i distinctly remember that blue colour and those alloys. such a shame nothing like it in the mondeo now over here.

[theplayingmantis]

Zetec-S said:

Glasgowrob said:

Current Mondeo is sold as a fusion in the US as mentioned above Same car btw not just the same platform

Lucky butters get a twin turbo v6 ecoboost 4wd making 325bhp

Knock that up to somewhere approaching 375-400 bhp stick on a cosworth badge and sell it for around 26-27k you would clean house with the Germans.


Basing this on the fact I can order right now a fully species brand new xpack 150 with led headlights and leather for 21k quoted this last week from my dealer

Fully specced with AWD and a few more horses and toys is 24k

Don't see why a v6 and some sportier suspension couldn't be swapped in for another 2-3k and still churned out for a profit


Even allowing for some cosworth fettling and some recalls and I still reckon Ford could turn it out under 30k

Would be great to see another cosworth badged RS Ford.

If they ever do and offer an estate I'm all over one

Even if the economics worked, why on earth would they do it? Focus RS is £30k+ so it just wouldn't fit in the range at that price.

Times have moved on since the RS/Cosworth glory days. The Germans have captured the market for the "compact executive" segment because most people want the 2.0 TDi version of whichever badge sparkles best on their driveway. And anyone who wants performance over economy goes for an M/AMG version. The Germans have been very successful developing the technology, and they have been marketed aggressively for the last 25 years. Ford hasn't followed this path, and are too far behind.

The only way I could see it working would be to produce a proper Mondeo Cosworth, but on a proper limited production run. So say 500 units sold (in the UK) for £35-40k ish. The Cosworth badge would probably be enough to bring out the hardcore fans.

its what the people (well me) want!