High grip or lower grip tyres for road use?
Discussion
Inspired by the improving wet wether traction thread running at the moment.
I'm wondering what the consensus is on how much grip a road going weekend car should have?
At present I'm in the process of getting my TR7 V8 back on the road, as I haven't used it much for a few years. I'm considering tyres. To which my thoughts were some semi-slicks.... just because...
The car will never be used for commuting. Only for fun and pleasure driving. I've run semi-slicks in the past on it. And should I choose to do a track day or even an auto solo with it, they would be a much better choice.
But semi slicks make it much harder to wheel spin and requires higher speed and a more aggressive driving style to get the back to be playful. As there are no trophies, podiums or prize money for driving on the road. Do I really need the higher cornering speeds and late braking that semi-slicks offer?
Or would it be more fun to take a leaf out of the GT86's ethos and fit some relatively crappy tyres to it and just enjoy going most places sideways?
I can see the arguments for both camps. But that doesn't make me any less torn in making a decision?
I'm wondering what the consensus is on how much grip a road going weekend car should have?
At present I'm in the process of getting my TR7 V8 back on the road, as I haven't used it much for a few years. I'm considering tyres. To which my thoughts were some semi-slicks.... just because...
The car will never be used for commuting. Only for fun and pleasure driving. I've run semi-slicks in the past on it. And should I choose to do a track day or even an auto solo with it, they would be a much better choice.
But semi slicks make it much harder to wheel spin and requires higher speed and a more aggressive driving style to get the back to be playful. As there are no trophies, podiums or prize money for driving on the road. Do I really need the higher cornering speeds and late braking that semi-slicks offer?
Or would it be more fun to take a leaf out of the GT86's ethos and fit some relatively crappy tyres to it and just enjoy going most places sideways?
I can see the arguments for both camps. But that doesn't make me any less torn in making a decision?
My rule of thumb for a fun road car would generally be at a bare minimum, a tyre that you could drive in most conditions without having serious twitchy bum moments. This doesn't necessarily mean it needs to be high end tyres like Pilot Sports, P Zero etc and it doesn't need to be eco ditch finders.
The likes of falken do lots of great mid range tyres that will allow for fun levels of hooliginism & spirited driving but are still comfortable and safe to drive on if you get caught in crap weather.
Saying that, I fit Pilot Sports to my car
The likes of falken do lots of great mid range tyres that will allow for fun levels of hooliginism & spirited driving but are still comfortable and safe to drive on if you get caught in crap weather.
Saying that, I fit Pilot Sports to my car
Going through this right now. E36 328 with some mods. I like to slide it around at low speed - currently had Continental Premium Contacts on it which were OK but I am going up a size to 16" wheels.
Don't seem to have lots of choice - MPS or P Zeros at the higher end. Or Avon ZV7, Hankooks mid range.
Reading the reviews, the Pilot Sports give best feedback and overall ability but seem quite grippy. Ideally I want something with decent wet weather characteristics and progression without high grip.
I am tempted to try the Michelins but wonder if something like a Primacy would be better - the price is similar but the reviews not as good.
Don't seem to have lots of choice - MPS or P Zeros at the higher end. Or Avon ZV7, Hankooks mid range.
Reading the reviews, the Pilot Sports give best feedback and overall ability but seem quite grippy. Ideally I want something with decent wet weather characteristics and progression without high grip.
I am tempted to try the Michelins but wonder if something like a Primacy would be better - the price is similar but the reviews not as good.
LordGrover said:
I suspect a TR8 would be a little tail happy and unpredictable at the best of times anyway, no?
It's quite a sideways car, but nice and progressive. Not snappy. Love sliding it about, it's all part of its character. It's not mega quick. 200'ish hp. Sort of DC5 ITR straight line pace (0-100mph in 15'ish sec) and weighs a shade over 1 tonne.Used to run Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tyres on it many years ago. Lots more grip, but less hooliganism. Has been on a variety of road tyres since then though.
Depends how and when you drive, if you fit anything too sticky you may miss some of the handling characteristics enjoyed at slower speeds in the dry and give yourself a white knuckle ride in the wet. I have to work much harder getting a little sideways action on one of mine - tyres are only hankook ventus evos. I have been surprised at how much more grip they seemed to have in the dry (and seem ok in the wet), they replaced goodyear eagles, which in there own right were light years ahead of the bridgestone run flats originally fitted: the ride was crap and they were frankly dangerous in anything other than completely dry.
Some decent summer tyres for road and some spare wheels for track use?
Some decent summer tyres for road and some spare wheels for track use?
Edited by MDUBZ on Friday 3rd July 15:13
SidewaysSi said:
Going through this right now. E36 328 with some mods. I like to slide it around at low speed - currently had Continental Premium Contacts on it which were OK but I am going up a size to 16" wheels.
Don't seem to have lots of choice - MPS or P Zeros at the higher end. Or Avon ZV7, Hankooks mid range.
Reading the reviews, the Pilot Sports give best feedback and overall ability but seem quite grippy. Ideally I want something with decent wet weather characteristics and progression without high grip.
I am tempted to try the Michelins but wonder if something like a Primacy would be better - the price is similar but the reviews not as good.
Loads of the mid rangers are good, Hankook Evo(2) are good Goodyear F1 assymetrics, I think it you avoid the really low rent stuff you'll be all good. I like to research reviews/tests and I like it when perhaps it scores well bar wear, as then the price is often low mainly because of wear rate. I particularly favour this on low usage per annum cars.Don't seem to have lots of choice - MPS or P Zeros at the higher end. Or Avon ZV7, Hankooks mid range.
Reading the reviews, the Pilot Sports give best feedback and overall ability but seem quite grippy. Ideally I want something with decent wet weather characteristics and progression without high grip.
I am tempted to try the Michelins but wonder if something like a Primacy would be better - the price is similar but the reviews not as good.
As long as the miles allow, I'd run something very grippy up front like Michelin Cups or A048s.
Then on the rear I'd be looking at mid to budget type things, maybe a Falken or even something like an eco Dunlop. Something that isn't an absolute ditchfinder, but you definitely don't want too much grip.
Then on the rear I'd be looking at mid to budget type things, maybe a Falken or even something like an eco Dunlop. Something that isn't an absolute ditchfinder, but you definitely don't want too much grip.
After unexpectedly driving in some rain in a GT3 RS with the Cup (2RS?) tyres it comes with, I really would think twice about putting any semi-slick or similar track tyre on any car that's used on the road. While obviously no kittens, humans, trees or cars were harmed, it was far from a pleasant experience... Perhaps a seasoned rally driver might have revelled in such levels of lateral freedom, but it just put me on edge and wasn't enjoyable!
On older/lighter/less powerful cars, I find a mid range tyre with decent wet weather performance normally has a good balance of dry grip with enough playfulness for UK roads/weather.
On older/lighter/less powerful cars, I find a mid range tyre with decent wet weather performance normally has a good balance of dry grip with enough playfulness for UK roads/weather.
300bhp/ton said:
Inspired by the improving wet wether traction thread running at the moment.
I'm wondering what the consensus is on how much grip a road going weekend car should have?
At present I'm in the process of getting my TR7 V8 back on the road, as I haven't used it much for a few years. I'm considering tyres. To which my thoughts were some semi-slicks.... just because...
The car will never be used for commuting. Only for fun and pleasure driving. I've run semi-slicks in the past on it. And should I choose to do a track day or even an auto solo with it, they would be a much better choice.
But semi slicks make it much harder to wheel spin and requires higher speed and a more aggressive driving style to get the back to be playful. As there are no trophies, podiums or prize money for driving on the road. Do I really need the higher cornering speeds and late braking that semi-slicks offer?
Or would it be more fun to take a leaf out of the GT86's ethos and fit some relatively crappy tyres to it and just enjoy going most places sideways?
I can see the arguments for both camps. But that doesn't make me any less torn in making a decision?
Honestly I don't know why anyone wouldn't fit the very best tyres you can for your use.I'm wondering what the consensus is on how much grip a road going weekend car should have?
At present I'm in the process of getting my TR7 V8 back on the road, as I haven't used it much for a few years. I'm considering tyres. To which my thoughts were some semi-slicks.... just because...
The car will never be used for commuting. Only for fun and pleasure driving. I've run semi-slicks in the past on it. And should I choose to do a track day or even an auto solo with it, they would be a much better choice.
But semi slicks make it much harder to wheel spin and requires higher speed and a more aggressive driving style to get the back to be playful. As there are no trophies, podiums or prize money for driving on the road. Do I really need the higher cornering speeds and late braking that semi-slicks offer?
Or would it be more fun to take a leaf out of the GT86's ethos and fit some relatively crappy tyres to it and just enjoy going most places sideways?
I can see the arguments for both camps. But that doesn't make me any less torn in making a decision?
These days Goodyear Eagle or Michelin PS4 are excellent all rounders and even able to use on track.
If it's literally a weekend or sunny use only car with some track time, then semi slicks are OK .
If you're not on track. No need for Semi Slicks.
I hate ungrippy tyres. Dangerous at worst.
I run Michelin PS4 and have no need for anything more. They work all year round and on track and last very well.
I actually had a set of Cup2s and sold them
Edited by xjay1337 on Friday 3rd July 16:00
Krikkit said:
As long as the miles allow, I'd run something very grippy up front like Michelin Cups or A048s.
Then on the rear I'd be looking at mid to budget type things, maybe a Falken or even something like an eco Dunlop. Something that isn't an absolute ditchfinder, but you definitely don't want too much grip.
So you'd want literally zero wet weather grip on the front (IE no ability to clear standing water) and then a poor low grip tyre on the back?Then on the rear I'd be looking at mid to budget type things, maybe a Falken or even something like an eco Dunlop. Something that isn't an absolute ditchfinder, but you definitely don't want too much grip.
Why?
Scootersp said:
SidewaysSi said:
Going through this right now. E36 328 with some mods. I like to slide it around at low speed - currently had Continental Premium Contacts on it which were OK but I am going up a size to 16" wheels.
Don't seem to have lots of choice - MPS or P Zeros at the higher end. Or Avon ZV7, Hankooks mid range.
Reading the reviews, the Pilot Sports give best feedback and overall ability but seem quite grippy. Ideally I want something with decent wet weather characteristics and progression without high grip.
I am tempted to try the Michelins but wonder if something like a Primacy would be better - the price is similar but the reviews not as good.
Loads of the mid rangers are good, Hankook Evo(2) are good Goodyear F1 assymetrics, I think it you avoid the really low rent stuff you'll be all good. I like to research reviews/tests and I like it when perhaps it scores well bar wear, as then the price is often low mainly because of wear rate. I particularly favour this on low usage per annum cars.Don't seem to have lots of choice - MPS or P Zeros at the higher end. Or Avon ZV7, Hankooks mid range.
Reading the reviews, the Pilot Sports give best feedback and overall ability but seem quite grippy. Ideally I want something with decent wet weather characteristics and progression without high grip.
I am tempted to try the Michelins but wonder if something like a Primacy would be better - the price is similar but the reviews not as good.
xjay1337 said:
Honestly I don't know why anyone wouldn't fit the very best tyres you can for your use.
These days Goodyear Eagle or Michelin PS4 are excellent all rounders and even able to use on track.
If it's literally a weekend or sunny use only car with some track time, then semi slicks are OK .
If you're not on track. No need for Semi Slicks.
I hate ungrippy tyres. Dangerous at worst.
I run Michelin PS4 and have no need for anything more. They work all year round and on track and last very well.
I actually had a set of Cup2s and sold them
Agreed. Would be nonsense to do anything else.These days Goodyear Eagle or Michelin PS4 are excellent all rounders and even able to use on track.
If it's literally a weekend or sunny use only car with some track time, then semi slicks are OK .
If you're not on track. No need for Semi Slicks.
I hate ungrippy tyres. Dangerous at worst.
I run Michelin PS4 and have no need for anything more. They work all year round and on track and last very well.
I actually had a set of Cup2s and sold them
Edited by xjay1337 on Friday 3rd July 16:00
rockin said:
df76 said:
xjay1337 said:
Honestly I don't know why anyone wouldn't fit the very best tyres you can for your use.
Agreed. Would be nonsense to do anything else.Do you up you tyre widths to be even safer than the standard fit tyres?
rockin said:
df76 said:
xjay1337 said:
Honestly I don't know why anyone wouldn't fit the very best tyres you can for your use.
Agreed. Would be nonsense to do anything else.What an odd comment.
SidewaysSi said:
rockin said:
df76 said:
xjay1337 said:
Honestly I don't know why anyone wouldn't fit the very best tyres you can for your use.
Agreed. Would be nonsense to do anything else.What an odd comment.
Some people! Concerned about there being others one the road who just want to get the tail out at will. You carry on mate. After all if you injure someone it probably won't be a member of your family.
Honestly , how old are you?
rockin said:
df76 said:
xjay1337 said:
Honestly I don't know why anyone wouldn't fit the very best tyres you can for your use.
Agreed. Would be nonsense to do anything else.I generally prefer a lower grip tyre for fun, but with consistent response and feel (no soft wobbly sidewalls) and avoiding really budget tyres which are often ok in the dry but teflon in the wet. Its hard to find a lower grip tyre with a firm sidewall though.
The 'won't somebody think of the children you must have the grippiest tyres you can possibly afford' brigade are wrong when it comes to enthusiastic driving IMO - with stickier tyres you won't have any less desire to play with their limits at times, but the speeds will be higher with less margin for error when you do.
I had semislicks on a turbo MX5 for a while. They were actually still better than most road tyres I've had in the wet, but they raised the limits in the dry so high that road driving became less fun. On an interesting road you were often limited by visibility before you felt like you were really working the tyres, and if you did let loose and have fun you quickly found yourself in irresponsible territory. Magic on track though, you could still play sideways games just at higher speed and without melting and falling apart like road tyres on track.
The 'won't somebody think of the children you must have the grippiest tyres you can possibly afford' brigade are wrong when it comes to enthusiastic driving IMO - with stickier tyres you won't have any less desire to play with their limits at times, but the speeds will be higher with less margin for error when you do.
I had semislicks on a turbo MX5 for a while. They were actually still better than most road tyres I've had in the wet, but they raised the limits in the dry so high that road driving became less fun. On an interesting road you were often limited by visibility before you felt like you were really working the tyres, and if you did let loose and have fun you quickly found yourself in irresponsible territory. Magic on track though, you could still play sideways games just at higher speed and without melting and falling apart like road tyres on track.
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