997 GTS manual... would you?

[MC99]

About to bite the bullet. Seems to be a great blend of usable and desirable. Manual cars carry a big premium, is it worth it and does everyone here believe they will still be sought after? 60-70 seems to be the market for a clean, manual carerra 2 GTS.

Should I spend a bit more for a 991? It’s a weekend car for me and occasionally the kids

Any input from owners greatly appreciated

[MC99]

Thanks, hard to justify.. for sure! Man maths reduces it :-) centrelock wheels! :-)
Manuals and low GTS numbers are the only way I can even think of the premium over a really well specd C2S..

[MC99]

Thanks and yes, a v Low 997 like the one at JZM or a 991 like this, ashgood appear to hold some decent stock, don’t know them by reputation

Grantstown said:

https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...

This is a lovely 991.1 GTS and there would probably be some wiggle room.

997 GTS also a wonderful car.

It all depends on your tastes, but perhaps the newer the water cooled car, the less the risk of needing bits of work done.

[MC99]

Thanks for the link and viewpoint. This is an unnecessary purchase from a pure transport viewpoint, as you say the 991 is a “better car” but being an 80s child something less refined is possibly more me...

Fl0pp3r said:

Have a gander through this thread OP, some useful info:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Personally I’d go with the 997 as I think they offer the best modern 911 experience - the right size, still feels like a sports car, brilliant steering feel...the 991 is objectively a “better” all round car perhaps - faster, bigger, more stable, better interior, better daily driver, more of a GT car than the 997.....but it depends what you’re after.

For the Sunday morning hoon has to be a manual 997 I’d say!

[MC99]

Cheib said:

Fl0pp3r said:

Have a gander through this thread OP, some useful info:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Personally I’d go with the 997 as I think they offer the best modern 911 experience - the right size, still feels like a sports car, brilliant steering feel...the 991 is objectively a “better” all round car perhaps - faster, bigger, more stable, better interior, better daily driver, more of a GT car than the 997.....but it depends what you’re after.

For the Sunday morning hoon has to be a manual 997 I’d say!

I think what you really need to decide is what’s important

Noise- 991.1 GTS wins though you can improve the 997 with a Sharwerks or other crosspipe relatively cheaply
Steering - 997 wins last development of hydraulic steering vs first gen EPS (which has been improved on hugely in 991.2)
Gearbox - Six speed with the short shift in 997 is much nicer than the 7 speed in the 991.1. Second and third in 997 are just great ratios when you’re doing say 40mph to 70 mph on a country road. The engine is where you want it in the rev range.
Interior - 997 needs the Alcnatara and leather dash (plastic is a bit cheap looking and maybe 30% of cars have leather). 991 is more up to date but doesn’t have Apple Car Play so you’ll still get in it and think PCM is dated. I use a Bluetooth connection on my 997 with a phone mount. Does the job which is what I’d need with the 991.1....I use Waze every time I get in the car.
Size- They’re identical at the rear wheel arches so size on the road isn’t different. But 997 has smaller glasshouse and is narrower at wing mirrors so feels smaller.
Suspension/Chassis- Not driven a 991.1 But 991.2 GTS feels a bit more grown up....is a bit better at dealing with uneven road surfaces but still feels great when pushing on, 997 to me feels totally at home on country roads...just a really nice set up for enjoying UK country roads but maybe feels a but less “sophisticated” than 991.

Thanks for insights, as a purely weekend car the level of schlep type drives should be minimal. Not every drive will be a sunny Sunday morning so that’s the necessity for a reliable and somewhat (cough) practical car : 991.1 manual boxes got mixed reviews so really useful to break it down as you did, cheers

[MC99]

Cheib said:

So said:

Desert Dragon said:

Non CL model must be worth more?!

If you mean on the GTS then no. People want CLs and alcantara; those cars without tend to stick around.

Yup.

The things people want in a GTS are

Manual
Alcantara
Leather Dash
Sports Chrono
CL’s
Bose

Not many have all of that. You also want the Short Shift (SSK) but that can be retrofitted,

JZM car doesn’t have Sports Chrono and has the plastic dash, Without the former there’s no Sport button....that gives you a slightly sharper throttle response which I think is better for heel and toe. Maybe it’s just me but I’d want those for that money.

Edited by Cheib on Sunday 14th June 09:02

Didn’t spot the lack of sports Chrono, yep would need that at the money

[MC99]

Agree. Thanks
The four essentials are as you set out. I can live with or without Bose or leather clad dash.
That’s the list, now to find the right one!
I’m indifferent to colour tbh, condition/history most important with spec as above

Thanks for all the contributions, this has been really helpful to clarify.

That ashgood 991.1 is really distracting though!!

So said:

Cheib said:

So said:

Desert Dragon said:

Non CL model must be worth more?!

If you mean on the GTS then no. People want CLs and alcantara; those cars without tend to stick around.

Yup.

The things people want in a GTS are

Manual
Alcantara
Leather Dash
Sports Chrono
CL’s
Bose

Not many have all of that. You also want the Short Shift (SSK) but that can be retrofitted,

JZM car doesn’t have Sports Chrono and has the plastic dash, Without the former there’s no Sport button....that gives you a slightly sharper throttle response which I think is better for heel and toe. Maybe it’s just me but I’d want those for that money.

Edited by Cheib on Sunday 14th June 09:02

Manual
Alcantara
Sports Chrono
CL’s

Bose
Leather Dash

The last two are not essential IMHO.

Bose is a bit chavtastic; I turned the bass on mine right down to -6 when I had it in a 911, otherwise it had an unnatural booming Max Power bass. The standard Porsche kit is alright. Not the last word in hi-fi, but you're driving a sports car with a loud exhaust , not sitting feet up in the music room listening to Vivaldi.

Leather dash - when I first got my GTS I was delighted that I hadn't got the dreadful plastic dash that PH seemed to be obsessed with. Then I found out that mine has a plastic dash. I imagined that the "dreadful plastic dash" would be a cheap, hard plastic like in a Fiat. In fact it's soft touch like any other German car and more than luxurious enough for most people. I very much doubt that, outside of Porsche forums, anyone has been bothered about a GTS not being covered in leather.

[MC99]

Thanks all for contributing, little did I know that wheel nuts could be so polarising! :-)
I’ve done the deal, GTS Manual, with the CL, Sports Chrono and alcantara... narrowly missed out on a lovely 991 Carerra T, but really happy to be back in a manual, NA, impractical, unreliable shed

[MC99]

c4sman said:

MC99 said:

Thanks all for contributing, little did I know that wheel nuts could be so polarising! :-)
I’ve done the deal, GTS Manual, with the CL, Sports Chrono and alcantara... narrowly missed out on a lovely 991 Carerra T, but really happy to be back in a manual, NA, impractical, unreliable shed

Fantastic and congratulations. Where’s the pictures (or at least a link to the dealer)!

Will add pics once I collect! I’ll omit shots of the CL for a separate “specialist interest” forum :-)

[MC99]

Cheib said:

MC99 said:

Thanks all for contributing, little did I know that wheel nuts could be so polarising! :-)
I’ve done the deal, GTS Manual, with the CL, Sports Chrono and alcantara... narrowly missed out on a lovely 991 Carerra T, but really happy to be back in a manual, NA, impractical, unreliable shed

Nice work !

If it hasn’t got the SSK fitted I would thoroughly recommend it.

according to what I’ve read the GTS has SSK, there is an even shorter throw kit from the GT3, is there one you recommend?

[MC99]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Just off to research Thule roof top boxes, or “CL mobility storage” as I will explain to the kids

[MC99]

Thanks to everyone, all the help. This is what I collected today. Manual, Alcantara, CLs (shhh), retro fit of chrono+... already thinking of retro fitting the dash in leather/alcantara. So far, so good!!

Edited by MC99 on Saturday 4th July 19:42

[MC99]

ArchiesDad said:

Looks lovely..... Has it got the Sport Chrono added retrospectively or are you going to do it ??

Had it added as part of the deal

[MC99]

Cheib said:

What’s the interior like now then ?!

Standard, Factory alcantara/leather and standard non leather dash

[MC99]

c4sman said:

Recommend sharkwerks or similar centre bypass if you are into modding And want more noise. I think their all similar results but my sharkwerks has been on the car for 4 years and performed great. SSK is straightforward DIY. Did it on previous 997

It has SWerks back box (I have orig PSE back box) will def look at SSK. Did your kit come from OPC?

[MC99]

Porsche911R said:

MC99 said:

Standard, Factory alcantara/leather and standard non leather dash

Non leather then, which car was it ?
Most seem to not have leather which was standard on the S, and as they are so rare you just have to make do, a bit frustrating on cars worth so much when a S is nicer in side.
Not sure why very few did not spec GTS interior.

Enjoy the car, one which has so far slipped me by.

It’s the JZM 6,000 mile car. I like the GTS Alcantara /leather combo, just think a leather dash retrim is achievable and keep it the right side of OEM+

[MC99]

GT4P said:

Well done lovely car, I have had my eye on that one for a quiet a while but been unable to buy anything until our house sells in a couple of weeks thus releasing funds.I am also looking for a 997.2 or 997.2S along with many others but that Gts would have been first port of call.
I would ditch the CL wheels and put the 997sc Fuchs on. Some cars came with the optional Carrera sport wheels which I like over the CLs.

Edited by GT4P on Saturday 4th July 16:48

I’ve read a Little on changing from CLs (feels a bit like life of brian, People’s Front Against Centre Locks anyone??) :-)
Apparently depending on the wheel choice you move to, it’s circa break even if you sell the CLs on. Although non CL GTS seem to stick around longer and sell slower, but I get it, right now my plan is to keep the car OEM+.

Edited by MC99 on Saturday 4th July 18:18