Why wouldn't I?
Discussion
So I'm in the market for a McLaren. 650S or 12C with the 5xx models a contender.
Coupe/Spider is not a deal breaker for me.
Seen a 12C that has a lovely (although not my most preferred colour) exterior /interior colour combo, sports exhaust, carbon interior, done less than 10k miles. 2011 and had the Iris upgrades. For sale at sub £120k.
I know there is a difference in performance to the 650S in a number of areas. But the 12C is definitely 'fast enough' for me as this would be my first true 'supercar' and I do like the looks very much (always subjective, but I like the unfussyness of it). The sound (important) should be ok as it has the sports exhaust.
I intend to keep long term (5 years) as I want a car that will be fun to own and drive and be (relatively) easy to live with i.e. not in a garage being fixed or breakdown! (this is important to me: psychological scars of owning a Lada as a student!). Also for this 2011/sub £120k car it's got to have taken its biggest hit on depreciation ? Does anyone have a clue where these will be in 3 or 5 more years?
Budget can stretch to £200k which brings the entire model range in scope.
So at the moment I think I only rule out £140k+ 12C cars as that seems to bring used 650S spiders into serious consideration (carbon brakes and the convertible options would make up a chunk of the price difference plus the newer model improvements).
So why wouldn't I go for the 12C that I've seen (as described above) assuming I don't need an axel lifter...
1. My big concern about 2011 cars is mechanical - there is t'internet 'talk' about quality issues for early cars but apart from comments about Iris (which this has upgraded), I can't find out what the concerns are.
2. Depreciation doesn't seem to be a concern unless the 3/5 year view is that these are going to be £50k/£30k cars. If the view on the future values is that they will be at these levels, I may as well go for a used 650S.
Views/advice always appreciated.
Cheers
Coupe/Spider is not a deal breaker for me.
Seen a 12C that has a lovely (although not my most preferred colour) exterior /interior colour combo, sports exhaust, carbon interior, done less than 10k miles. 2011 and had the Iris upgrades. For sale at sub £120k.
I know there is a difference in performance to the 650S in a number of areas. But the 12C is definitely 'fast enough' for me as this would be my first true 'supercar' and I do like the looks very much (always subjective, but I like the unfussyness of it). The sound (important) should be ok as it has the sports exhaust.
I intend to keep long term (5 years) as I want a car that will be fun to own and drive and be (relatively) easy to live with i.e. not in a garage being fixed or breakdown! (this is important to me: psychological scars of owning a Lada as a student!). Also for this 2011/sub £120k car it's got to have taken its biggest hit on depreciation ? Does anyone have a clue where these will be in 3 or 5 more years?
Budget can stretch to £200k which brings the entire model range in scope.
So at the moment I think I only rule out £140k+ 12C cars as that seems to bring used 650S spiders into serious consideration (carbon brakes and the convertible options would make up a chunk of the price difference plus the newer model improvements).
So why wouldn't I go for the 12C that I've seen (as described above) assuming I don't need an axel lifter...
1. My big concern about 2011 cars is mechanical - there is t'internet 'talk' about quality issues for early cars but apart from comments about Iris (which this has upgraded), I can't find out what the concerns are.
2. Depreciation doesn't seem to be a concern unless the 3/5 year view is that these are going to be £50k/£30k cars. If the view on the future values is that they will be at these levels, I may as well go for a used 650S.
Views/advice always appreciated.
Cheers
cho said:
Slightly off topic but it looks like mclaren are still pushing cars through to dealers without owners. Just noticed Birmingham have another coupe in at almost delivery miles. Not bad for a buyer as it's at a discount but would anyone be able to get similar on a new order if they didn't mean no waiting
Saw those and precisely why it's difficult for me to go for a £140k+ 12C. Great cars - and I do really like the look of the 12C - but there is the opportunity to go for 650S without (relatively) too big a jump.Will wait for the right car (will keep my powder dry a little longer to learn a bit more about the car) as I would expect that the usual seasonal cycle will present more opportunities later in the year. Will be very interesting to see the effect of the new range will do to support the 12C/650S range, which I think might be a risk on the price side when buying (i.e. hold them up).
So it's difficult to see the 12Cs being negatively affected by the 5xx cars price wise, unless others have a different view...and as said there are very few 12C about (a couple from each year '11, '12, '13,'14) and a few buyers looking probably for the same car
So that leaves the mechanicals (which is the main question for me) of the earlier cars. I've not heard anything specific either...
Cheers for the feedback.
I wouldn't say I've I preference for coupe over spider, just don't have a need for a spider - but what you say is correct, if everything else is equal (colour, spec, age etc) then of course the spider would the choice.
The reason for not going down the 458 route and yes lots around, is my perception (and it is only perception as I've no first hand experience) of reliability with Ferrari in general and apart from cost, I really don't want a car that's going to be in and out of garages being fixed. It will be my second car and I want to drive it, a lot. Although I suspect there will be lots of people with positive experiences of the 458 reliability to put me right on that.
Huracan is another option. I think I have my heart set on the McLaren though (British, real motor sport pedigree, stunning performance and a doddle to drive around the crowded South East, not forgetting the doors!) and the early 12Cs, on the surface of things, seem to be a great way of getting that. But I shall bide my time and see what comes up.
The reason for not going down the 458 route and yes lots around, is my perception (and it is only perception as I've no first hand experience) of reliability with Ferrari in general and apart from cost, I really don't want a car that's going to be in and out of garages being fixed. It will be my second car and I want to drive it, a lot. Although I suspect there will be lots of people with positive experiences of the 458 reliability to put me right on that.
Huracan is another option. I think I have my heart set on the McLaren though (British, real motor sport pedigree, stunning performance and a doddle to drive around the crowded South East, not forgetting the doors!) and the early 12Cs, on the surface of things, seem to be a great way of getting that. But I shall bide my time and see what comes up.
Thanks for the feedback guys. Very helpful.
As TISPKJ says, the 12C seems to be firm in price and rarely available. The rarity, as others point out is interesting in itself. Overall it seems so much supercar for the money and rare. I daresay there will be competition
Isaldiri - interesting points about the mechanicals and good to be aware of, only heard about the Iris performance issues before. I would definitely only purchase a car with Warranty. I assume McLaren will extend the Warranty for a few more years for the 2011 cars (assuming servicing done correctly etc)??
Not having had much experience with the supercars, 12C feels more than enough performance for me (and I really like the looks), but I think at the moment, with so few cars around, it will probably come down to just finding the right spec car (650S or 12C) at the right price.
For those lucky enough to have theirs, hopefully the weather improves and have a great weekend!
Cheers
As TISPKJ says, the 12C seems to be firm in price and rarely available. The rarity, as others point out is interesting in itself. Overall it seems so much supercar for the money and rare. I daresay there will be competition
Isaldiri - interesting points about the mechanicals and good to be aware of, only heard about the Iris performance issues before. I would definitely only purchase a car with Warranty. I assume McLaren will extend the Warranty for a few more years for the 2011 cars (assuming servicing done correctly etc)??
Not having had much experience with the supercars, 12C feels more than enough performance for me (and I really like the looks), but I think at the moment, with so few cars around, it will probably come down to just finding the right spec car (650S or 12C) at the right price.
For those lucky enough to have theirs, hopefully the weather improves and have a great weekend!
Cheers
isaldiri said:
Yep warranty extensions are available for cars coming off manufacturer warranty. Main dealer cars should be offered with 2 year ones i think and if buying privately the extended warranty is transferable. I extended it on my car but a friend who has a similar age car did not. We'll see who ends up having done better in a year or 2...
Good luck with the search, as a road car I think they are really quite hard to beat given the breadth of ability they have.
Yes...I just view it in the same category as insurance. Hopefully won't need it, but gives a bit of peace of mind and removes some of the potential hassle of ownership.Good luck with the search, as a road car I think they are really quite hard to beat given the breadth of ability they have.
I'm just scarred by my Lada experience as a 17 year old. Kept on breaking down, but learned a bit about engines!
...and on a different technological plane of existence to a McLaren! Although it helped me work out that the number one priority for me is a car that gets from A to B! That puts the later 12C into a bit more perspective, thanks. Wasn't aware there were other gradual improvements, only knew about the Iris and HP upgrades. Will now add that to the mix!
The 12C I drove was a 2013 car and felt fantastic and, in a test drive, felt 'looser' (in a good way) than the 650 I drove, which i put down the the 650 being brand new.
The 12C I drove was a 2013 car and felt fantastic and, in a test drive, felt 'looser' (in a good way) than the 650 I drove, which i put down the the 650 being brand new.
Funnily enough, performance between the two hasn't come into my thinking (much) as they are both faster than anything I've previously experienced and probably faster than most things out on the road. My limited experiences of the two also indicate the 12C brings a fantastic level of comfort on the poor roads we have here, as does the 650S I'm sure: they are both (much) faster and more plyable than my previous cars.
Being on a budget (the wife and 14 kids have to come somewhere in the consideration) and coming to this forum has helped me appreciate better the options on offer from the c£100k early cars to the £200k+ newer models. Clearly I would expect (and hope) that there would be differences between the early 12C and 650S. However, given the 'base' car is so good my questions have come down to reliability (struggling to find horror stories), vehicle lifter (need to get one to try it out on my drive) and finally, because there are so few cars on sale: do I need sports exhaust (coming from an Aston Virage ...for the uninitiated think of the newer DB9...not as raucous as a Vantage!) on this point I'm going to do some personal research this weekend and take a look and listen to a standard exhaust.
The carbon interior is growing on me as well.
I've been looking for under a month now, which is a lifetime for my impulse purchases!
More test drives are necessary.
Being on a budget (the wife and 14 kids have to come somewhere in the consideration) and coming to this forum has helped me appreciate better the options on offer from the c£100k early cars to the £200k+ newer models. Clearly I would expect (and hope) that there would be differences between the early 12C and 650S. However, given the 'base' car is so good my questions have come down to reliability (struggling to find horror stories), vehicle lifter (need to get one to try it out on my drive) and finally, because there are so few cars on sale: do I need sports exhaust (coming from an Aston Virage ...for the uninitiated think of the newer DB9...not as raucous as a Vantage!) on this point I'm going to do some personal research this weekend and take a look and listen to a standard exhaust.
The carbon interior is growing on me as well.
I've been looking for under a month now, which is a lifetime for my impulse purchases!
More test drives are necessary.
Edited by SELON on Tuesday 5th May 23:19
mrloudly said:
Yes suspension is firmer, but the only thing you notice is a lack of crashing over bumps because of the new geometry. The steering gives more feel, some may like some may not. Turbo lag is virtually non-existent compared to the 12C because the torque
"wallops" in much lower down! Think you need a proper drive in one ;-)
Increased Turbo Lag is visible here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FS1EKOAuD_w
Is watching this video going to cost me money?? "wallops" in much lower down! Think you need a proper drive in one ;-)
Increased Turbo Lag is visible here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FS1EKOAuD_w
Edited by mrloudly on Wednesday 6th May 13:03
I hope owning a McLaren isn't going to be like this video...
http://youtu.be/K2k1iRD2f-c
To be fair I have found you all to be very positive and really helpful in my initiation to buying a McLaren, especially those that have PM'd me with good advice, real experience and insights and nothing but positivity to whatever car I discuss.
It's very much appreciated.
http://youtu.be/K2k1iRD2f-c
To be fair I have found you all to be very positive and really helpful in my initiation to buying a McLaren, especially those that have PM'd me with good advice, real experience and insights and nothing but positivity to whatever car I discuss.
It's very much appreciated.
Edited by SELON on Wednesday 6th May 19:18
I hope owning a McLaren isn't going to be like this video...
http://youtu.be/K2k1iRD2f-c
To be fair I have found you all to be very positive and really helpful in my initiation to buying a McLaren, especially those that have PM'd me with good advice, real experience and insights and nothing but positivity to whatever car I discuss.
It's very much appreciated.
http://youtu.be/K2k1iRD2f-c
To be fair I have found you all to be very positive and really helpful in my initiation to buying a McLaren, especially those that have PM'd me with good advice, real experience and insights and nothing but positivity to whatever car I discuss.
It's very much appreciated.
Edited by SELON on Wednesday 6th May 19:19
Guys,
Do I need the iris2 hardware upgrade?
Assume most cars have the software upgrades.
Reading mixed reports: some say Iris2 isn't much less worse than Iris1.
What're your thoughts?
I only play music from iPhone or radio. That's only on long trips as well. Would be good if Satnav was ok but that's all I'm looking for.
Do I need the iris2 hardware upgrade?
Assume most cars have the software upgrades.
Reading mixed reports: some say Iris2 isn't much less worse than Iris1.
What're your thoughts?
I only play music from iPhone or radio. That's only on long trips as well. Would be good if Satnav was ok but that's all I'm looking for.
Hi all,
Do I need the axle lifter on a 12c? Will it really limit where I can go? I have plenty of speed umps nearby (driving in London).
There seem to be very few out there for sale with them on and have chosen a car - but it doesn't have the axle lifter.
The concern I have is that my Aston has to be nursed up the driveway backward to avoid bottoming out. Which it does ok.
The car I am close to buying is 150 miles away and have no obvious way of getting the car to my house pre-sale to test it.
Any way of measuring ???
Thanks for your help.
Do I need the axle lifter on a 12c? Will it really limit where I can go? I have plenty of speed umps nearby (driving in London).
There seem to be very few out there for sale with them on and have chosen a car - but it doesn't have the axle lifter.
The concern I have is that my Aston has to be nursed up the driveway backward to avoid bottoming out. Which it does ok.
The car I am close to buying is 150 miles away and have no obvious way of getting the car to my house pre-sale to test it.
Any way of measuring ???
Thanks for your help.
mikey k said:
Nice idea!
I must admit I keep coming back to the McLaren spiders on here
A 650S is going to make the Virage feel like a bus!
The McLaren's are a different type of beast entirely and the Virage isn't exactly slow or lack punch either! I must admit I keep coming back to the McLaren spiders on here
A 650S is going to make the Virage feel like a bus!
12c is quite quick as well Mikey
But in the interests of keeping it a buyers market, I should add that the McLaren's are massively overhyped, not as quick as people make out and have a rubbish ride in any mode. They look awful and sound like a wailing cat as well. Build quality is really shambolic to boot. Don't buy them...at least not till I've got one!
That's a lovely car....saw VO car in the metal as well - stunning in the sunlight.
Agreed - there aren't really 'bad' colours for these IMO (different thread)
Glasgow have a supernova silver demo that could be had Mikey...
I promised myself not silver when I started looking, but it's a stunning colour and contrasts really well with the rest of the car. The spec is most important in my process. Find the right spec and the colour is secondary IMO.
Agreed - there aren't really 'bad' colours for these IMO (different thread)
Glasgow have a supernova silver demo that could be had Mikey...
I promised myself not silver when I started looking, but it's a stunning colour and contrasts really well with the rest of the car. The spec is most important in my process. Find the right spec and the colour is secondary IMO.
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