Batteries dead after 5 years

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No, this is not hypothetical but a new scandal in France. In 2012 a man purchased a Peugeot Ion for €11,285. The battery is guaranteed for 5 years or 30,000, whichever comes first. Fair play I suppose, but by March 2017 he had done 60,000 miles and the batteries failed, so he went to the dealers for advice, thinking it would be easy to resolve. But no, a new battery was needed at a cost of €17,750. Peugeot, all heart, offered him a 30% discount or €5,200 against a new electric car. He contacted a French magazine and they worked out that over the 60,000 miles his "consumption" had worked out at €18 per 60 miles, or the equivalent of 21 litres per 100 miles. If my poor maths is correct that equated to about 18 mpg for a small car which would do well over 50mpg. Yes I know things have moved on since then, but I certainly will be keeping my hands in my pockets until I see where this is leading us.

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There are the usual replies above, but in over 50 years of car ownership I have never had an engine fail on me. I've rebuilt two one for more power and the other because it had done substantial mileage, but in the last 25 years I've paid out £4,000 only in car repairs - and I change my cars every 150,000 miles. Yes, i guess servicing is dearer, but still considerably less than battery packs it seems. The last rebuilt engine cost only £6,000. But I accept thatthe world is changing whether we want it to or not but I'm still not yet convinced in the economies of EVs.

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gangzoom said:

lowdrag said:

No, this is not hypothetical but a new scandal in France. In 2012 a man purchased a Peugeot Ion for €11,285.

The iON was close to £20k UK price in 2012, so if you cannot get the orginal price of the car right than what ever else you quote is just pointless....

What the price in the UK was interests me not because the car was bought in France, and that is the price quoted in the motoring magazine. There are many discrepancies in pricing between the two countries, and not only cars. An electric golf trolley is 50% dearer in France than in the UK for example - exactly the same make and model.

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gangzoom said:

Just looking at another post on this forum about combustion cars breaking down.....£10k+ repair bills on brands like Audi/BMW - with supposedly amazing build quality.

I find it halirous people on this forum think EVs will become too expensive to keep longterm when we all know just how much combustion cars cost to keep going.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Some of your statements about my OP are, as you, um, put it are "halirous". Do you mean "hilarious" perhaps? Whatever, I repost to correct your "factual" statements. I posted an article from a French magazine to provoke thought. I expect I had an electric vehicle way before you even thought they existed; 1977 in fact. I went to work in it, returned, plugged it in, and hey-ho, there it was all ready for the next day. It never let me down and was perfect for the job. I have not tried a modern one but mine was just fine back then. What I do object to is this evangelism that tries to ram down my throat that the future is electric. It may well be so, but there are enough reasons to doubt that the time has yet come. The question of global warming is one in point. If batteries are made in China and then shipped to the UK in a diesel-glugging ship and cars are not built to last 20 years we have some serious counter-balancing questions to ask. Some of us are not instantly converted by this evangelism and sit back, watch developments, and then take a considered decision. We should all have bought Betamax in the day but publicity meant that VHS won the day.

"£10K" repair bills on ICE vehicles huh? Well, was the car properly maintained, did it have enough oil, was it hitting the rev limiter every time it was driven? Just a few questions that pop into my head. I need more information before condemning out of hand a form of transport I have used all my life - with never an engine failure. I calculate that I am well north of one million miles in this antiquated form of transport by the way, and in the last 25 years I have owned three cars, driven 600,000 miles, and not one engine failure. In fact, I have spent just £4,000 on repairs, usual servicing and consumables apart. Will an EV match that in the near future? I don't know, but at the moment it doesn't fit my profile, such as driving to Alicante in one day, or 880 miles, at an average speed of over 80 mph. In under 11 hours.

So if you don't mind I'll sit back and await developments before jumping off into space. My post pointed out that there are some cars that are problematical (the Leaf has been mentioned numerous times) but I have absolutely no personal experience. As that funny little robot used to say, "I need input".

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[quote] 1) I bought the milk float having done the maths on range with a not new battery pack in the depths of winter. It’ll still get me to work.

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Which was what I was referring to in my post above. 26mph downhill, 12 up the other side, and a maximum of 15 mph on the flat. And no quicker when i had delivered the milk and only had the empties on the back. Roller blind doors, and believe me it was cold in the winter when the milk froze and the tops lifted off the bottle!

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I saw my first colour TV at a friend's parents house in 1967. It was a 21" and had cost £379, the equivalent, so the B of E calculator tells me, to £6,539 today.

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Evanivitch said:

You're missing step 1) tax gas. Gas is the cheapest way to currently heat a conventional home. The investment required to buy heat pump and adapt the home to use it efficiently is prohibitive at this time.

I disagree. After years of old fashioned electric radiators and a big log fire for heating I installed two heat pumps, five cassettes and one big console (radiator) two years ago. Total cost £10,000, which has resulted in a lower electricity bill overall (we live in the forest so all electric) and a saving of £600 on wood, plus the cost of the chimney sweep. And the "renewable" wood gets more expensive every year too. And no problems of dust everywhere. I reckon that the cost will be amortised well before 10 years are up.

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Heres Johnny said:

Gas is the cheapest...

Response.. disagree, heat pumps are cheaper than my electricity and wood..

Conclusion.. apples are not the same as pears

So the installation of a gas tank and gas delivery has been considered in the equation? I don't think so.