Lease something semi-quick or buy older and faster?

[Brett99]

I’m leasing a golf gti at the moment and starting to think about my next car as the lease runs out in December.
Interested in opinion on going for another lease on something similar (or Golf R, S3, m140i etc) or going down a different route and buying something older where much of the depreciation has already happened. Eg Audi Rs4 Avant, or similar.
My concern with the used option is the unknown running and maintenance costs. Will I end up paying more than a lease once these are factored in?
My Annual mileage is low and estimated at 6-7k per year.

[Brett99]

Thanks. Wasn’t on my radar tbh!

[Brett99]

rallycross said:

How much have you spent on hiring a car in the past few years? Hopefully that answers your question.

I’m not someone to get hung up on the whole issue of whether I actually own the car. Ultimately I get to drive it. Someone owning it doesn’t get an enhanced experience vs leasing. For me it’s whats the most cost effective way to own the car.
The Golf gti dsg lease will cost me just 6800 over the 2 years. A quick look at Autotrader shows me that the car is already selling at 6k less than the new price. With 8 months of my term left I’ll therefore be quids in vs someone who purchased at the same time.

[Brett99]

Efbe said:

Brett99 said:

I’m not someone to get hung up on the whole issue of whether I actually own the car. Ultimately I get to drive it. Someone owning it doesn’t get an enhanced experience vs leasing. For me it’s whats the most cost effective way to own the car.
The Golf gti dsg lease will cost me just 6800 over the 2 years. A quick look at Autotrader shows me that the car is already selling at 6k less than the new price. With 8 months of my term left I’ll therefore be quids in vs someone who purchased at the same time.

maybe, but someone that bought it at a year older would be laughing all the way to the bank.

And would you fund that through pcp or a bank loan?

[Brett99]

Funk said:

Efbe said:

Brett99 said:

I’m not someone to get hung up on the whole issue of whether I actually own the car. Ultimately I get to drive it. Someone owning it doesn’t get an enhanced experience vs leasing. For me it’s whats the most cost effective way to own the car.
The Golf gti dsg lease will cost me just 6800 over the 2 years. A quick look at Autotrader shows me that the car is already selling at 6k less than the new price. With 8 months of my term left I’ll therefore be quids in vs someone who purchased at the same time.

maybe, but someone that bought it at a year older would be laughing all the way to the bank.

And you're then comparing a new car and a used car which aren't the same thing.

Honestly, this has been done to death many, many times on PH - let's not do it again.

Before starting this I did take a look to see if there was a thread within the forum discussing this but I couldn’t see one.

[Brett99]

Efbe said:

Funk said:

And you're then comparing a new car and a used car which aren't the same thing.

Honestly, this has been done to death many, many times on PH - let's not do it again.

it has been done to death, but that seems to be what the OP is asking.

Unfortunately it's such an open ended question, without detail of what car/year/up front money/monthly money he is after it is quite pointless.

The OP seems to be evading these questions for some reason though...

Sorry, not intentionally evading. Key criteria is fast and practical. 5 doors is a must. Sub 6.5 0-60. Max budget is £350 a month, including deposit. So my choice is either spend that on a lease and as others have pointed out, have hassle free motoring....or...I opt for something older and cheaper in terms of up front or monthly costs, but understand that I’ll spend more on fuel and maintenance.
My mileage is low at 6-8k a year.

[Brett99]

Efbe said:

culpz said:

That's pedantry at it's finest right there. So, what you're essentially saying is that brand new cars don't exist?

I've just shown, you. OP has just shown you. £6800 over 2 years for brand new compared to a 15-20k bank loan for the 3 year old car. If the latter is "laughing to the bank", then you must have some serious number issues.

The reason that you're doing the old new vs old debate is that you're categorically stating that new cars aren't real.

if you want those specific numbers, then...

I don’t agree with your calculations. Continuing my example of paying £6800 for a golf gti dsg nav over 2 yrs...
Cost of car new is circa £27.5k
Avg price of 2 year old version of same car advertised car on Auto Trader with FSH is

Person 1 leases a brand new car for £350 a month.
Person 2 takes a loan for £16.5k and buy a 3 year old car. pay back £350 a month for 5 years. (10% Loan... for a 2.5% loan, get a car worth £20k and walk away with 15k)
After 5 years car might sell for £12k.

Person 1 has 3 years newer car initially, and 6 years newer car after 3 years, but loses everything they have paid in.
Person 2 walks away with 12k after 5 years, but has to put up with an older car.

New vs old is a pointless argument if you purely talk money. There is no way it can ever make sense, so I have no idea why you would try to argue it.
The only reason for getting a new car is either as a company car which works out well in tax, or because you want something brand new... which is a completely okay argument. I wouldn't buy a used phone/tv/clothes etc, though financially it would be more sensible.

Edited by Efbe on Thursday 26th April 12:08

Edited by Efbe on Thursday 26th April 12:08

I would question your figures if we use my current Golf gti lease deal cost of £6800 over two years.
Cost of car new to buy is around £27k
2 year old versions are going on Autotrader now for 20k. And they are dealers not private, so the owner would have likely sold to them for 18-19k. Lease deals include car tax, Therefore the costing around Of owning for the two year period would be around £8.5k. This example would seem to show that leasing in this case is definitely the winner over buying the car new and owning for the same two year period.

Now let’s look at your example of buying at 3 years old.
The cheapest 3 year old Golf gti (same spec as mine) is on AT for £17750. £1250 more than your example. If I then keep that car for 5 years as you suggest, I would then sell it at 8 years old for around £10k based on current 8 year old versions on AT. Therefore costing around £8k for 5 years. Not the £5k you calculated. Plus the uncertainty of maintenance, MOTs and road tax costs over 5 years. Adding up the greater initial cost and lower sale price at the end, I would be £3250 worse off than your calculations.

I agree that buying the used 3 year car would be overall the cheaper option, but would I rather personally be paying more and getting some piece of mind than driving round in an 8 year old car and all that comes with it. Therefore I think I have just answered my own original question in the post!

[Brett99]

ayman82 said:

I'm in the same predicament. Golf R cost £6.4k over two years, I've ordered an S4 to replace it, but thought that a B7 RS4 would be a good substitute or a C5 RS6. Can get them for around the same amount that I'll be paying over two years. Albeit pretty leggy. Not sure what to do.

And that my exact problem! I could get an RS4 for say, 15k. Run it for 3years and it’ll probably be worth 12k still. Maybe more as I’ll be doing low mileage. It’s the unknown of the costs of anything major goes wrong that putting me off.

[Brett99]

Brett99 said:

Efbe said:

culpz said:

That's pedantry at it's finest right there. So, what you're essentially saying is that brand new cars don't exist?

I've just shown, you. OP has just shown you. £6800 over 2 years for brand new compared to a 15-20k bank loan for the 3 year old car. If the latter is "laughing to the bank", then you must have some serious number issues.

The reason that you're doing the old new vs old debate is that you're categorically stating that new cars aren't real.

if you want those specific numbers, then...
So I range vwfs last week to see how much extending my 2 year lease by an additional 6 months would be. £118 a month is the answer!!

I don’t agree with your calculations. Continuing my example of paying £6800 for a golf gti dsg nav over 2 yrs...
Cost of car new is circa £27.5k
Avg price of 2 year old version of same car advertised car on Auto Trader with FSH is

Person 1 leases a brand new car for £350 a month.
Person 2 takes a loan for £16.5k and buy a 3 year old car. pay back £350 a month for 5 years. (10% Loan... for a 2.5% loan, get a car worth £20k and walk away with 15k)
After 5 years car might sell for £12k.

Person 1 has 3 years newer car initially, and 6 years newer car after 3 years, but loses everything they have paid in.
Person 2 walks away with 12k after 5 years, but has to put up with an older car.

New vs old is a pointless argument if you purely talk money. There is no way it can ever make sense, so I have no idea why you would try to argue it.
The only reason for getting a new car is either as a company car which works out well in tax, or because you want something brand new... which is a completely okay argument. I wouldn't buy a used phone/tv/clothes etc, though financially it would be more sensible.

Edited by Efbe on Thursday 26th April 12:08

Edited by Efbe on Thursday 26th April 12:08

I would question your figures if we use my current Golf gti lease deal cost of £6800 over two years.
Cost of car new to buy is around £27k
2 year old versions are going on Autotrader now for 20k. And they are dealers not private, so the owner would have likely sold to them for 18-19k. Lease deals include car tax, Therefore the costing around Of owning for the two year period would be around £8.5k. This example would seem to show that leasing in this case is definitely the winner over buying the car new and owning for the same two year period.

Now let’s look at your example of buying at 3 years old.
The cheapest 3 year old Golf gti (same spec as mine) is on AT for £17750. £1250 more than your example. If I then keep that car for 5 years as you suggest, I would then sell it at 8 years old for around £10k based on current 8 year old versions on AT. Therefore costing around £8k for 5 years. Not the £5k you calculated. Plus the uncertainty of maintenance, MOTs and road tax costs over 5 years. Adding up the greater initial cost and lower sale price at the end, I would be £3250 worse off than your calculations.

I agree that buying the used 3 year car would be overall the cheaper option, but would I rather personally be paying more and getting some piece of mind than driving round in an 8 year old car and all that comes with it. Therefore I think I have just answered my own original question in the post!

[Brett99]

Brett99 said:

Efbe said:

culpz said:

That's pedantry at it's finest right there. So, what you're essentially saying is that brand new cars don't exist?

I've just shown, you. OP has just shown you. £6800 over 2 years for brand new compared to a 15-20k bank loan for the 3 year old car. If the latter is "laughing to the bank", then you must have some serious number issues.

The reason that you're doing the old new vs old debate is that you're categorically stating that new cars aren't real.

if you want those specific numbers, then...
So I range vwfs last week to see how much extending my 2 year lease by an additional 6 months would be. £118 a month is the answer!!

I don’t agree with your calculations. Continuing my example of paying £6800 for a golf gti dsg nav over 2 yrs...
Cost of car new is circa £27.5k
Avg price of 2 year old version of same car advertised car on Auto Trader with FSH is

Person 1 leases a brand new car for £350 a month.
Person 2 takes a loan for £16.5k and buy a 3 year old car. pay back £350 a month for 5 years. (10% Loan... for a 2.5% loan, get a car worth £20k and walk away with 15k)
After 5 years car might sell for £12k.

Person 1 has 3 years newer car initially, and 6 years newer car after 3 years, but loses everything they have paid in.
Person 2 walks away with 12k after 5 years, but has to put up with an older car.

New vs old is a pointless argument if you purely talk money. There is no way it can ever make sense, so I have no idea why you would try to argue it.
The only reason for getting a new car is either as a company car which works out well in tax, or because you want something brand new... which is a completely okay argument. I wouldn't buy a used phone/tv/clothes etc, though financially it would be more sensible.

Edited by Efbe on Thursday 26th April 12:08

Edited by Efbe on Thursday 26th April 12:08

I would question your figures if we use my current Golf gti lease deal cost of £6800 over two years.
Cost of car new to buy is around £27k
2 year old versions are going on Autotrader now for 20k. And they are dealers not private, so the owner would have likely sold to them for 18-19k. Lease deals include car tax, Therefore the costing around Of owning for the two year period would be around £8.5k. This example would seem to show that leasing in this case is definitely the winner over buying the car new and owning for the same two year period.

Now let’s look at your example of buying at 3 years old.
The cheapest 3 year old Golf gti (same spec as mine) is on AT for £17750. £1250 more than your example. If I then keep that car for 5 years as you suggest, I would then sell it at 8 years old for around £10k based on current 8 year old versions on AT. Therefore costing around £8k for 5 years. Not the £5k you calculated. Plus the uncertainty of maintenance, MOTs and road tax costs over 5 years. Adding up the greater initial cost and lower sale price at the end, I would be £3250 worse off than your calculations.

I agree that buying the used 3 year car would be overall the cheaper option, but would I rather personally be paying more and getting some piece of mind than driving round in an 8 year old car and all that comes with it. Therefore I think I have just answered my own original question in the post!