Can i justify a performance/sportier car?
Discussion
Hi there
Some may have seen my previous posts dithering over what car i would like to get next, however i am now in two minds as to whether to change my car at all.
Some background, I currently have a 1.8 Civic (dressed up to look a bit like a type R (oh dear), i would describe it as okay. Its far from the most engaging car to drive, it certainly isnt the best built but does the job. In all honesty i bought it as a cheap car for personal use as I previously had a company vehicle.
Ive chopped and changed over the years ranging from STs, Mx5s and Gtis - probably more cars than id liked to be honest.
I am now at the point now where id like something fun to drive and have debated many a time on here and probably driven various owners forums mad with questions (i like to pick and research my cars carefully) But something at the back of my mind tells me that it is pointless getting a more powerful/fun car. I wouldn’t be looking at anything particularly expensive with around a 6k budget as i have some saved towards that amount, nothing apart from the gt86 in recent years interests me at all so im generally have been looking at stuff pre 2010.
I use my car partly for work but dont really drive in areas often enough to exploit performance etc but do like a car that is fun to drive. Ive tried a variety cars, CR-Zs, Swift Sports, FN2 Type Rs (unfortunately ive been priced out of Integras and more exotic JDM stuff) but by far the best i tried recently was a 130i (of course i made thread about that too!). It seems to cover everything, RWD, good power, good steering, not terrible on fuel, great to drive and the nicest car to drive since my old mx5 - in a way its kind of ruined everything else for me! But im not at the point where buying such cars are wasted on me, or wait until i get bored with them - of course with the age of the cars im looking at parts will need replacing, although that applies to my current car too.
But im also conscious of the steadily rising prices of older, interesting cars. Many people dont get this and scoff at why id spend so much on an older car. Im more or less surrounded by those whod rather have the newest/lowest mileage/fancy badge car they can get rather than performance/how it drives/looks/reliability etc
Does anyone else also have this sense of guilt or indecisiveness over wanting something sportier, or feel like their money could be put to better use/savings etc. I feel its a bit of a petrolheads burden but worry im getting carried away and should suck it up with what ive got to stop me from yet again changing cars.
Some may have seen my previous posts dithering over what car i would like to get next, however i am now in two minds as to whether to change my car at all.
Some background, I currently have a 1.8 Civic (dressed up to look a bit like a type R (oh dear), i would describe it as okay. Its far from the most engaging car to drive, it certainly isnt the best built but does the job. In all honesty i bought it as a cheap car for personal use as I previously had a company vehicle.
Ive chopped and changed over the years ranging from STs, Mx5s and Gtis - probably more cars than id liked to be honest.
I am now at the point now where id like something fun to drive and have debated many a time on here and probably driven various owners forums mad with questions (i like to pick and research my cars carefully) But something at the back of my mind tells me that it is pointless getting a more powerful/fun car. I wouldn’t be looking at anything particularly expensive with around a 6k budget as i have some saved towards that amount, nothing apart from the gt86 in recent years interests me at all so im generally have been looking at stuff pre 2010.
I use my car partly for work but dont really drive in areas often enough to exploit performance etc but do like a car that is fun to drive. Ive tried a variety cars, CR-Zs, Swift Sports, FN2 Type Rs (unfortunately ive been priced out of Integras and more exotic JDM stuff) but by far the best i tried recently was a 130i (of course i made thread about that too!). It seems to cover everything, RWD, good power, good steering, not terrible on fuel, great to drive and the nicest car to drive since my old mx5 - in a way its kind of ruined everything else for me! But im not at the point where buying such cars are wasted on me, or wait until i get bored with them - of course with the age of the cars im looking at parts will need replacing, although that applies to my current car too.
But im also conscious of the steadily rising prices of older, interesting cars. Many people dont get this and scoff at why id spend so much on an older car. Im more or less surrounded by those whod rather have the newest/lowest mileage/fancy badge car they can get rather than performance/how it drives/looks/reliability etc
Does anyone else also have this sense of guilt or indecisiveness over wanting something sportier, or feel like their money could be put to better use/savings etc. I feel its a bit of a petrolheads burden but worry im getting carried away and should suck it up with what ive got to stop me from yet again changing cars.
Edited by Ads22 on Friday 7th May 19:15
Unfortunately im a serial car swapper (well every 2 years or so) I dont want to change for the sake of it, and most people I know keep hold of their cars. I wish I wasn’t so fussy! I see less and less older/interesting stuff on the roads too so wonder if its a game for the brave or wealthy - but certainly get your point.
As for something like an 130i, or something of the same caliper, have i been caught up in buzz around these along with the power. Admittedly though i was just as impressed by its comfort and handling and steering as much as the power so more likely the overall package.
As for something like an 130i, or something of the same caliper, have i been caught up in buzz around these along with the power. Admittedly though i was just as impressed by its comfort and handling and steering as much as the power so more likely the overall package.
The_Nugget said:
The answer to your question is GT86.
I’m now of the opinion that powerful cars are utterly pointless 95% of the time on UK roads. All you need is powerful ‘enough.’ Sweet handling is much more fun for barrelling round nice roads at a decent lick.
I also agree with this. I prefer a good chassis and good steering/suspension over massive power. I was actually going trying see a CRZ on the same day i tried the 130 but after trying that i realised it drives more than 3 times better than one of those so would ultimately be disappointed (also quite a big difference in power) I’m now of the opinion that powerful cars are utterly pointless 95% of the time on UK roads. All you need is powerful ‘enough.’ Sweet handling is much more fun for barrelling round nice roads at a decent lick.
I do love the look of the gt86 but they are still out of budget for me.
Heathwood said:
I don’t really know what more you’re looking for from these threads. Honestly, my 130i just had a service (oil, micro filter, brake fluid, full check etc) for £250 at a well respected specialist. It needs similar once every 2 years, so costs little over £100 a year for basic maintenance. It hasn’t depreciated in years, maybe even increasing in value a little.
So, based on my experience I really can’t see much risk In you trying something like a 130i. Alternatively, I believe EP3s are fetching good money, so that’s another option if you want depreciation free motoring (and a better drive than FN2s).
I think in reality im waiting for someone to say lower your expectations. Im not an impulse purchaser but if i go on a test drive i do worry i get a bit carried away. However i did try the 130i as often id get recommendations for it when looking at other cars...i thought itd be over-exaggerated but it really is very very good. So, based on my experience I really can’t see much risk In you trying something like a 130i. Alternatively, I believe EP3s are fetching good money, so that’s another option if you want depreciation free motoring (and a better drive than FN2s).
I suppose though at the end of the day though it is just a 1 series and not a M car!....Then i would have to start slapping sense into myself!
RoVoFob said:
I really don’t get the issue here. You like the idea of a 130i - and I completely understand that, as I’m on my third one - it’s within budget and prices do seem to have firmed up over the last year, so may not be a bad time to get one. Where’s the problem?
Don’t worry what other people think. If they want to pay through the nose financing a newer car that doesn’t appeal to you, let them. Meanwhile, if an older old car is what works for you, go for it. You can always sell it for a similar amount to what you bought it for if you don’t get on with it. Where’s the risk?
I used to work for a large motoring review site and drove probably five or more completely different new cars every week. And every time I got back in the 130i, I loved it. The hydraulic steering (for pre-facelift models), a very sharp throttle response from the most powerful six-cylinder, naturally aspirated, non-M engine ever made, short gearing, lovely sound and light weight make it stand out from newer models...they really don’t make this kind of thing any more.
If you were looking at getting an automatic, four-pot diesel saloon, you could do that any time. However, cars like the 130i are not going to get any easier to buy over time as the numbers drop. As for the GT86, it handles beautifully and the driving position is spot on, but it sounds like an overheating hoover to me. Boomy and unpleasant with little torque. Swap a 130i
engine in there, though, and it be perfect!
I probably am making a bigger fuss over this than needed. I think you are right though i know cars like this are going to be harder and harder to get hold of and with climbing prices i do think to myself now is a good time. Don’t worry what other people think. If they want to pay through the nose financing a newer car that doesn’t appeal to you, let them. Meanwhile, if an older old car is what works for you, go for it. You can always sell it for a similar amount to what you bought it for if you don’t get on with it. Where’s the risk?
I used to work for a large motoring review site and drove probably five or more completely different new cars every week. And every time I got back in the 130i, I loved it. The hydraulic steering (for pre-facelift models), a very sharp throttle response from the most powerful six-cylinder, naturally aspirated, non-M engine ever made, short gearing, lovely sound and light weight make it stand out from newer models...they really don’t make this kind of thing any more.
If you were looking at getting an automatic, four-pot diesel saloon, you could do that any time. However, cars like the 130i are not going to get any easier to buy over time as the numbers drop. As for the GT86, it handles beautifully and the driving position is spot on, but it sounds like an overheating hoover to me. Boomy and unpleasant with little torque. Swap a 130i
engine in there, though, and it be perfect!
I sometimes don’t trust myself and think im just swayed by the most powerful flashy car i can get hold of but i do value how it drives/makes you feel and think this fits the bill perfectly.
They are quite special to drive and i feel as though i have driven a lot to compare it to.
Im usually more drawn to the jdm stuff but the prices are astronomical on some of these now and very hard to find a good example.
The other thing that holds me back is that I usually stick to jap (honda, mazda) for reliability but i know the 130s are seen for reliability but of course being german is more complicated. But as it drives so well i think it’s definitely an exception for me!
LightningBlue said:
I went from a Type S GT 1.8 to a Scirocco GT 2.0 TSI. I think you’d enjoy one of those if you could find a good one. I thought the Civic was quite nice to drive if a bit gutless but to me it felt like Honda skimped on build quality to make a concept car for the road. They still look fantastic and the interior shape is superb, but mine had far too many issues with stupid things like wiper motors, folding mirror motors etc. The Scirocco was a big step forward in build quality and driving dynamics. The engine was really excellent and it probably wouldn’t cost you too much to trade.
I do like these shape Civics and i like the design aswell as the dash. But annoyingly with these they are really not well screwed together, with random bits falling off and various rattles! Not to mention the absolutely appalling ride - even though my suspension is knackered. However a family member with one also has the same. Odd as I remember Hondas of old feeling very well built.Shame as i was quite set on fn2 after these, definitely a better drive but it will need ragging everywhere to enjoy it.
A CRZ was looking a nice newer alternative, but with less performance than 1.8 it would need a substantial amount to even just get it to warm hatch levels of performance, also a shame as these look great!
Unfortunately all the cars i like seem to be rare! Partly why i gave up looking for a last gen Prelude as it’s getting so difficult to find a good one!
A Scirocco has often popped up as an alternative but in my price range its bottom of the barrel stuff....these have really held their price!!
Edited by Ads22 on Sunday 9th May 13:09
AnhBanhBao said:
I was quite similar to you before I bought my GT86.
I’d wanted one for years, but was just waiting for them to fall into budget. Once they did I still had a last-minute wobble and started considering cheaper options like the Swift Sport, older Type Rs, etc.
Finally, after a few months, I just thought to hell with it and took the plunge, and I’m so glad I did. Ok, if I’d have gone for the cheaper option I’d have saved £2-3k, but seeing someone else driving a GT86/BRZ in traffic whilst I was towering above them in my Swift would have wound me up rotten!
Very lucky and honestly cannot blame you! They really are great cars, me and my friends all have different opinions on cars but the gt86 is all something we all agree on is a good one! I’d wanted one for years, but was just waiting for them to fall into budget. Once they did I still had a last-minute wobble and started considering cheaper options like the Swift Sport, older Type Rs, etc.
Finally, after a few months, I just thought to hell with it and took the plunge, and I’m so glad I did. Ok, if I’d have gone for the cheaper option I’d have saved £2-3k, but seeing someone else driving a GT86/BRZ in traffic whilst I was towering above them in my Swift would have wound me up rotten!
I also cannot knock a swift sport though and really is the most sensible option for me, i do like them and you do get a lot for your money but just found the driving position high and has a weird amount of headroom feeling very tall. Im so fussy i irritate myself sometimes!
Like someone said before i seem very indecisive considering! But keep chopping and changing cars does get expensive and really want something now i can cherish and keep hold of!
narbles said:
Then just buy the car you want, it's as simple as that.
However, I'm getting the feeling that money is playing a big factor here due to the indecisiveness and worry about maintenance etc. If this is the case my recommendation is to not buy a car, wait until you can afford 6k plus a £500 odd slush fund for things going wrong. It is not fun buying a car you want then worrying about finances.
I think its also in part as to whichever model i seem to prefer at the time i research a lot into, then come across potential expensive problems that people encounter. I £500 slush fund is perfectly acceptable and is something ive always done on my cars but its the big (engine rebuild, head removal) type problems that scare me. And probably why ive been umming and ahhhing over the 130i as BMW repair costs are of course quite a bit more than most marques. Also why part of me has said stick with Honda but unfortunately none of them have been as good to drive.However, I'm getting the feeling that money is playing a big factor here due to the indecisiveness and worry about maintenance etc. If this is the case my recommendation is to not buy a car, wait until you can afford 6k plus a £500 odd slush fund for things going wrong. It is not fun buying a car you want then worrying about finances.
stevekoz said:
You won't need to have a slush fund for the 3.0 straight six in the 130i. I've not really heard horror stories of them going wrong.
Any car you buy doesn't matter if you spend £500, £5000 or £50,000 - has a risk of going pop at some stage. Be that because it just happens and its sods law or because you do something stupid or you don't look after it etc. etc. It happens.
I'm 42 years old - i've had more than one car for every year of my life. Never spending much in honesty. Like you i like to try new things and life is too short to just have a box with wheels you don't enjoy. Some have gone majorly wrong and cost me thousands - but not my BMW's. They've actually surprised me how little they did cost to run. Most expensive infact Audi and Renault about joint. The Audi i hate and loathed spending a penny and will never buy another. The renault, i love and therefore i don't mind spending money on it. But as said in comparison the BMW's were cheap and cheerful.
That includes having owned the 130i and it was a lovely thing. It can be made better with some tweaks but they aren't cheap so to speak but modification never is. However, one thing not note is that out of the BMW's i've had, none have been ruinous to own, service and yes, when the time came, to repair. I've done injectors, calipers, servicing, coils etc. None ruinous in bills. A good specialist won't charge the earth - BMW themselves of course will but avoid them for anything other than a new car or a car in warranty.
If you service them. Enjoy them. Put aside a little money for when things do go wrong. You'll be fine. That goes for ANY car. You can't plan a purchase based on what might go wrong with the car. You simply don't know. If i did that i'd never buy one in the first place and walk everywhere.
I guess the moral of my post is swallow it and just go for it. Buy something you want and like. If after a day, week, year you feel differently, sell it on and get something else. Nothing stopping you. Some cars you'll lose on, some you'll love and keep and others will just fade, but life is too short to procrastinate on the worry above the "what if". I'd never leave home if that was the case.
Yes i do think i may over think it sometimes. I find a car quite a big expense/investment and try my best to get it right. Plus i just like fun cars. But once persistent problems arise i get bored of endless trips to garages etc and lose interest....however i do try and do any maintenance i can more recently. Any car you buy doesn't matter if you spend £500, £5000 or £50,000 - has a risk of going pop at some stage. Be that because it just happens and its sods law or because you do something stupid or you don't look after it etc. etc. It happens.
I'm 42 years old - i've had more than one car for every year of my life. Never spending much in honesty. Like you i like to try new things and life is too short to just have a box with wheels you don't enjoy. Some have gone majorly wrong and cost me thousands - but not my BMW's. They've actually surprised me how little they did cost to run. Most expensive infact Audi and Renault about joint. The Audi i hate and loathed spending a penny and will never buy another. The renault, i love and therefore i don't mind spending money on it. But as said in comparison the BMW's were cheap and cheerful.
That includes having owned the 130i and it was a lovely thing. It can be made better with some tweaks but they aren't cheap so to speak but modification never is. However, one thing not note is that out of the BMW's i've had, none have been ruinous to own, service and yes, when the time came, to repair. I've done injectors, calipers, servicing, coils etc. None ruinous in bills. A good specialist won't charge the earth - BMW themselves of course will but avoid them for anything other than a new car or a car in warranty.
If you service them. Enjoy them. Put aside a little money for when things do go wrong. You'll be fine. That goes for ANY car. You can't plan a purchase based on what might go wrong with the car. You simply don't know. If i did that i'd never buy one in the first place and walk everywhere.
I guess the moral of my post is swallow it and just go for it. Buy something you want and like. If after a day, week, year you feel differently, sell it on and get something else. Nothing stopping you. Some cars you'll lose on, some you'll love and keep and others will just fade, but life is too short to procrastinate on the worry above the "what if". I'd never leave home if that was the case.
Now with prices of more unique cars climbing im now seeing the value of keeping hold of something-big regret selling my Mx5 i think looking back but i guess i was lucky enough to be in a position where i didnt need anything practical.
Re BMW, especially N52 engined cars ive had so many people reassure me about them its borderline funny. But a reoccurring theme seems to be good service history. I think it’s because when ive researched ive stumbled across various problems on BMWs of the same era (especially the n54!) but i guess its a more complicated engine and think thats what gives me cokd feet so to speak.
Objective Alpha said:
I was in the exact same position as you and ended up with a GT86. Months of looking and nothing sticking out, got a good deal and decided to go for it and all i can say is WOW! don't worry about people who say its not got enough power, it does! (IMO) and always puts a smile on my face. Would 100% recommend
And very interesting! Id love to try one, these are the only car made in recent years that interests me as it seems. Unfortunately still out of budget for me....out of interest how much did you pay and what else did you try before buying?Mr Tidy said:
In 2014 I had a BMW 123d and had a test drive in a GT86 on my birthday!
As impressive as it was to drive it just felt a bit gutless, sounded wheezy and the prices the dealer quoted weren't exactly cheap! So a couple of months later I bought a BMW Z4 Coupe with the N52 engine that was way more impressive. I also bought an old Mazda 323f as a "snotter" but got bored with it in less than 6 months, so I replaced it with a BMW E46 325ti Sport Compact that felt like much more fun than the GT86.
At the end of 2015 my Z4 Coupe suffered the expensive death of the electric water pump so when someone was looking for one I agreed to sell it but 2 days later I was looking for another one!
So I bought my 2nd on 77K and sold it 3+ years later on 91K to get my Z4M Coupe.
In 2018 I replaced my E46 Compact with an E91 325i (also N52 engine) for practicality - at 135K that needed a new water pump! Then after a year I replaced that with an E90 330i for performance - and some sort of practicality!
I made a point of avoiding 3 Series with the N53 engine due to to HPFP, injector and coking up issues. But the N54 adds turbo issues to the mix.
Apart from the electric water pump N52 engines seem pretty bullet-proof in my experience - my current 330i is on 115K and drives really smoothly with plenty of power when required.
Im yet to try a GT86 but have heard this about them often. I dont think i will for some time though to avoid upsetting myself! These are strong money for an auto, let alone a manual.As impressive as it was to drive it just felt a bit gutless, sounded wheezy and the prices the dealer quoted weren't exactly cheap! So a couple of months later I bought a BMW Z4 Coupe with the N52 engine that was way more impressive. I also bought an old Mazda 323f as a "snotter" but got bored with it in less than 6 months, so I replaced it with a BMW E46 325ti Sport Compact that felt like much more fun than the GT86.
At the end of 2015 my Z4 Coupe suffered the expensive death of the electric water pump so when someone was looking for one I agreed to sell it but 2 days later I was looking for another one!
So I bought my 2nd on 77K and sold it 3+ years later on 91K to get my Z4M Coupe.In 2018 I replaced my E46 Compact with an E91 325i (also N52 engine) for practicality - at 135K that needed a new water pump! Then after a year I replaced that with an E90 330i for performance - and some sort of practicality!
I made a point of avoiding 3 Series with the N53 engine due to to HPFP, injector and coking up issues. But the N54 adds turbo issues to the mix.
Apart from the electric water pump N52 engines seem pretty bullet-proof in my experience - my current 330i is on 115K and drives really smoothly with plenty of power when required.
Just trying to establish a budget for 130i’s, of course for a water pump which id get done pretty sharpish if i had one. Im seeing higher mileage ones between 4.5-6ish, with decent spec but usually minus Xenons. Id prefer pre facelift for the hydraulic steering. If im correct facelift ones, mainly LEs go for considerably more?
Mr Tidy said:
I loved how GT86s drove but the engine was a real disappointment, and they aren't exactly cheap yet!
130is were just out of budget for me 2 years ago so I bought my E90 330i with the N52 engine, HPAS and Bi-Xenons for £3.5K.
LEs all have EPAS, but seeing as they are all 3 doors they weren't an option. Although Lemon leather is lovely!
No they are not and i feel you get just as much car if not more with the 1 series but if course it doesn’t have the looks and is older. 130is were just out of budget for me 2 years ago so I bought my E90 330i with the N52 engine, HPAS and Bi-Xenons for £3.5K.
LEs all have EPAS, but seeing as they are all 3 doors they weren't an option. Although Lemon leather is lovely!
Ive looked at so much different machinery in my budget and these 130s certainly stand out. Ive found some nice examples just below 5k minus some extras however have waterpump due but other work done factored into price.
Failing this i think my only other option is to up my budget somewhat and jump back to a Mk7 fiesta ST, i used to own one and are great fun but these start at around £7k for a non battered example.
Edited by Ads22 on Wednesday 12th May 14:03
Obee72 said:
Join the BMW 130i Owners group on FB. You'll get sales on their before they hit the mainstream sites and a lot of useful info. Don't be scared about higher miles but look for good SH. I bought mine for just under £5k on 120k and sold for £100 less than I bought it for with 130k. It did have a folder full of receipts and I did the waterpump, £400 roughly at independent. We had a change in vehicles at the time so needed a bigger car but do I still miss it - absolutely !!!
Well its proving tricky to find one. Unfortunately just missed out on one with fsh and recent gasket changes. The rest im looking at all seem to have sketchy service history or based hundreds of miles away. So think this is going to take some time....Back again! So fairly set on 130i’s and am actively looking (quite tricky to find!) however the problem i have is when i do drive them i do get this nagging sense that its more car than i need again leading me back to what I originally posted (too fast and capable maybe?). I wont lie they are very very impressive and the engine really is versatile but because a lot of my driving is restricted to town the majority of my driving i rarely go above 50mph, and do the running costs justify driving something i wont be using to its best.
This probably applies to a lot of the alternatives ive considered too, ive also thought looking at something newer like a Fiesta ST - as being newer would less likely throw an expensive bill a 10year plus car would. However the initial cost would be higher - although thanks to a being turbo would probably be more fun around town at sensible speeds. However again would barely be making the most of its capabilities.
A lot of the newer stuff doesnt do much for me however so relegated to older stuff with higher running costs and performance. Ive looked at the inbetween more run of the mill type sportyish stuff, Swift Sports, C30, CRZs, but come away wanting something that feels a bit more special. The obvious answer would be something sport car shaped! mx5, mr2, Z4 but i do need practicality for work.
Am I overthinking this or is this legitimate way of thinking. I think this is whats causing me to be indecisive about my next purchase.
This probably applies to a lot of the alternatives ive considered too, ive also thought looking at something newer like a Fiesta ST - as being newer would less likely throw an expensive bill a 10year plus car would. However the initial cost would be higher - although thanks to a being turbo would probably be more fun around town at sensible speeds. However again would barely be making the most of its capabilities.
A lot of the newer stuff doesnt do much for me however so relegated to older stuff with higher running costs and performance. Ive looked at the inbetween more run of the mill type sportyish stuff, Swift Sports, C30, CRZs, but come away wanting something that feels a bit more special. The obvious answer would be something sport car shaped! mx5, mr2, Z4 but i do need practicality for work.
Am I overthinking this or is this legitimate way of thinking. I think this is whats causing me to be indecisive about my next purchase.
ChrisH72 said:
Very definitely over thinking!
I like my Fiesta ST but its not the best town car. The low speed ride is busy but other than that it feels like any other Fiesta. Light and easy though so no bother.
You can't really use the performance of any sporty car in most day to day driving. It's for that odd occasion that we buy them and that alone is worth it. You clearly care about having a quick car so even though you don't need one you'll be disappointed with anything too pony.
Im inclined to agree there actually. I remember these being quite firm and crashy around town but found the engine was good for small spurts and pretty zingy. Really nice little cars but think there are quite a lot of them around now and many have fallen into the wrong hands unfortunately. I do have a soft spot for the fn2 but again are even crashier. I wonder if a 125i would fit the bill as it shares the same 130i engine in a coupe body albeit with less power. Only downsides are you lose the hydraulic steering and they are more expensive but in general than the 130. I like my Fiesta ST but its not the best town car. The low speed ride is busy but other than that it feels like any other Fiesta. Light and easy though so no bother.
You can't really use the performance of any sporty car in most day to day driving. It's for that odd occasion that we buy them and that alone is worth it. You clearly care about having a quick car so even though you don't need one you'll be disappointed with anything too pony.
I think the problem is my head says get something along the lines of a warm hatch but heart says something rare, collectible with an exciting engine as they will get harder and harder to find eventually with paying large sums of money.
ChrisH72 said:
I do like these. Do seem to command more of a premium but i think the 130i will overtake them eventually. Finding a coupe is nearly as hard as the hatch ive discovered. Think in regards to the overall search i think its the fear of acquiring a bad example that worries me. Ive not had much luck with some cars in the past so in my mind newer = less likely to go wrong but no thats not always true. Everyone does applaud the 130i for reliability though, but think its because im dealing with a BMW (not a brand renown for reliability and potentially being quite expensive to fix) that gives me some doubts. However even though ive considered the FN2s aswell these can also potentially throw big bills.
dontfollowme said:
Agree with the posters saying go for it. I ended up in a car for four years that was fine but no fun. In hindsight I should of bought the car I have now fours years ago but played safe.
I think if you buy something else you'll regret it when you see another on the road.
Yes unfortunately i am one of those annoying people who dithers, agonising over any big financial decision. As mentioned in a different post ive chopped and change my car quite often but really want to try and go for something id like to keep long term. I do get what you mean though, if i was floating around in a Honda Jazz and saw a nice 130i rock up beside me i think id feel pretty deflated (no offence to the Jazz though!) I think if you buy something else you'll regret it when you see another on the road.
The problem i have is both the cars at the top of my list, Type R and 130 are both considered fun cars so struggling to make up my mind. Id say the R is the slightly safer option but the 130 seems to be the better car with most owners really satisfied by them!
I know the Civic quite well (Hondas in the family with 2 civics and have found the standard car to be decent but the suspension and build quality to be a weak point but the engine and transmission very good)
I think ill give the 1 series a fighting chance, find a really good example to potentially buy and see how i feel after driving it.
Edited by Ads22 on Tuesday 8th June 19:11
Just bringing things back to the 130i briefly. How much is expected to pay for a good example for one of these. They seem to have a wide range but basically must have good service history. Obviously the lower end of 4-5k is where all the very high mileage ones are at. Im wondering with my budget (max 6-7k) that i will get an average example as apposed to a good one whereas with the fn2 ive also been debating ill get a very good one, however it is not as nice to drive regardless.
RoVoFob said:
I’ve just had a quick look through Auto Trader and eBay and these are the three that jumped out to me...
2007 (07) 130i M Sport 3dr, 143,000 miles - £6,500. This has a full service history and has been recently serviced and MOT’d, uprated suspension, new rear brakes and decent tyres that should last for a while. It also has a raft of desirable options fitted. The MOT mentions an oil leak and that the handbrake needs adjusting, but out the £500 left in the budget towards this (and anything else you can haggle off towards this and you should have all the major things covered).
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202104231...
2007 (07) 130i M Sport 3dr, 116,000 miles - £6,995. This has a full service history with 14 stamps, a decent spec (albeit the most basic audio speaker setup, I think), has been very recently serviced and MOT’d, though the MOT flags a little corrosion underneath (you can have a look under the car to gauge how extensive this is), corroded springs and one of the front shocks having a light misting of oil or limited damping effect. With that in mind, I’d expect the suspension to be original and need replacing soon. If it were me and the rest of the car was OK, I’d be haggling on the price to free up some budget to replace the suspension.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202106033...
2005 (55) BMW 130i M Sport 5dr, 86,600 miles - £7,250. This is the kind of owner I’d want to buy from: the spec of the car isn’t the best in this case, but it looks like they’ve maintained it very well. It has some desirable BMW Performance extras (intake and exhaust) and a second set of wheels, all of which you could sell to free up some cash if you didn’t want them (the BMW Performance bits are pretty valuable and in demand on BabyBMW), plus a private plate that could also be sold. Sell those bits and you free up cash - potentially more than £1,000 I’d imagine - that you can put aside for any work that might need doing in future, so there’s no need to stress. The seller has said £7,250 ‘or nearest offer’, so I’d imagine you could get it for £7,000 or less.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265180423294?hash=item3...
Have you spoken to any owners/sellers? This can be a really good way to gauge how well they’ve looked after the car and whether they’ve actively kept the car in good condition or waited until any issue is marked as ‘dangerous’ on the MOT and they’ve been forced to change things. Many adverts don’t list all the work done and you won’t know which is which unless you speak to them. Find someone who’s kept on top of maintenance and there should be fewer unexpected issues.
Some sound advice with these @RoVofob and much appreciate looking into these.2007 (07) 130i M Sport 3dr, 143,000 miles - £6,500. This has a full service history and has been recently serviced and MOT’d, uprated suspension, new rear brakes and decent tyres that should last for a while. It also has a raft of desirable options fitted. The MOT mentions an oil leak and that the handbrake needs adjusting, but out the £500 left in the budget towards this (and anything else you can haggle off towards this and you should have all the major things covered).
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202104231...
2007 (07) 130i M Sport 3dr, 116,000 miles - £6,995. This has a full service history with 14 stamps, a decent spec (albeit the most basic audio speaker setup, I think), has been very recently serviced and MOT’d, though the MOT flags a little corrosion underneath (you can have a look under the car to gauge how extensive this is), corroded springs and one of the front shocks having a light misting of oil or limited damping effect. With that in mind, I’d expect the suspension to be original and need replacing soon. If it were me and the rest of the car was OK, I’d be haggling on the price to free up some budget to replace the suspension.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202106033...
2005 (55) BMW 130i M Sport 5dr, 86,600 miles - £7,250. This is the kind of owner I’d want to buy from: the spec of the car isn’t the best in this case, but it looks like they’ve maintained it very well. It has some desirable BMW Performance extras (intake and exhaust) and a second set of wheels, all of which you could sell to free up some cash if you didn’t want them (the BMW Performance bits are pretty valuable and in demand on BabyBMW), plus a private plate that could also be sold. Sell those bits and you free up cash - potentially more than £1,000 I’d imagine - that you can put aside for any work that might need doing in future, so there’s no need to stress. The seller has said £7,250 ‘or nearest offer’, so I’d imagine you could get it for £7,000 or less.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265180423294?hash=item3...
Have you spoken to any owners/sellers? This can be a really good way to gauge how well they’ve looked after the car and whether they’ve actively kept the car in good condition or waited until any issue is marked as ‘dangerous’ on the MOT and they’ve been forced to change things. Many adverts don’t list all the work done and you won’t know which is which unless you speak to them. Find someone who’s kept on top of maintenance and there should be fewer unexpected issues.
One of them i am actively enquiring about! Im sure you can guess which one! But yes i find it difficult to work out what to spend on these but like you said recent work is massive bonus if its been done. I have found though the higher up the budget you go the more solid service history and maintenance history there is, which on any car like this is definitely worth it.
Ive researched these cars to death so feel like i know exactly what to look for now. From what ive seen you don’t get any major issues, just niggly vanos related issues usually leading to solenoids, sparks, coils etc. Usually pops up on owners pages/forums.
Diagnosed with rough idle, lack of torque etc. For what its worth ivtec does seem like a more straightforward reliable setup but i guess at the end if the day its not attached to a 6 cylinder engine and the car it’s equipped with is not quite as nice of a car to drive day to day.
I think with these it also certainly involves travelling some distance to find a good one. There doesn’t seem to be a stong quality supply of them in the south, and if there are it’s usually through suspect looking trade dealers.
If it becomes a hardship to really find a good one i guess theres the 125i coupe as a next best thing but these seem nearly as rare and sadly you lose that lovely manual steering.
Edited by Ads22 on Friday 11th June 10:31
I think for a lot of older cars it involves travelling now as well looked after examples are harder to find. In terms of budget I think I would find a good example, I want to avoid the lower end of the market and be potentially hit with some big bills.
Speaking of which, a lot of people recommend that these N52 engined cars are not ruinous to run, well compared to a lot of performance cars at least. While its not going to be a Nissan Micra, as you're knowledgable with these I wanted to ask if I am potentially over my head with running costs. The reason being im still apprehensive that this car is a bit too good for me, this would be technically the first 'premium marque' car id have whereas my past cars have involved Ford, VW, Mazda, Honda - So would im guessing I would need to expect 'Premium running costs. However I guess finding the right well maintained car would mean less to replace earlier on into ownership.
I don't necessarily need 265hp but I do very much like the way these drive. Whereas ive still considered cars like the Type R of the same vintage is it unrealistic to expect that to be less hassle and cost to run. I do also very much like the K20 unit and it overall seems more reliable than the N52 but I suppose both have their advantages. Ultimately don't want to start resenting it if it develops into a money pit.
I also do a quite a bit of stop start driving and roughly average about 30- 50ish miles a day around town so wouldn't want to end up driving something where short journeys could potentially put a lot of wear on the engine.
Speaking of which, a lot of people recommend that these N52 engined cars are not ruinous to run, well compared to a lot of performance cars at least. While its not going to be a Nissan Micra, as you're knowledgable with these I wanted to ask if I am potentially over my head with running costs. The reason being im still apprehensive that this car is a bit too good for me, this would be technically the first 'premium marque' car id have whereas my past cars have involved Ford, VW, Mazda, Honda - So would im guessing I would need to expect 'Premium running costs. However I guess finding the right well maintained car would mean less to replace earlier on into ownership.
I don't necessarily need 265hp but I do very much like the way these drive. Whereas ive still considered cars like the Type R of the same vintage is it unrealistic to expect that to be less hassle and cost to run. I do also very much like the K20 unit and it overall seems more reliable than the N52 but I suppose both have their advantages. Ultimately don't want to start resenting it if it develops into a money pit.
I also do a quite a bit of stop start driving and roughly average about 30- 50ish miles a day around town so wouldn't want to end up driving something where short journeys could potentially put a lot of wear on the engine.
Edited by Ads22 on Saturday 12th June 00:31
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