My Saab 9000 Aero

[griffin dai]

Just joined so thought I'd quickly stick mine up here.

Had it almost 3 years now, bought with a Maptun Stage 3 tune already on it so roughly 280-290bhp & 324 ft/lbs torque (440Nm) so pretty quick but loads more potential! Here's how it was when I bought it:





Had a fair bit of work done to it and taken it through stages 4 and 5 and tried out a GT28RS for a year (great turbo) up to its current Stage 6 with a GT3076R, cams, bigger IC etc etc, last dyno was putting out 450bhp & 425 ft/lbs torque (576Nm) @ 1.6 bar but feels slightly more now after turning the boost up a little bit to 1.7 bar. (Another RR needed early next year to find out!)

Full write up here on UKSaabs: http://uksaabs.co.uk/UKS/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=...

Pics:









Still to be fitted...but might swap the lot for coilovers.


Future plans are a bit up in the air at the moment as to if I'll keep it or sell, but a tubular manifold is definitely on the cards for Jan/Feb to break this 500bhp barrier which has been the goal! Also going to have a crack at live mapping it myself after the tubulars fitted, then will see how I get on before looking at either a GT35R or big Holset and push to over 600bhp with forged pistons, 4.45 box and colour change..... or just swap what I can into a 9-3, sell the rest for parts and go from there for a similar power output as this ones getting a bit rusty now!! Body work needs attention!

[griffin dai]

mazdajason said:

A GT35R will see you with BIG power so good luck with that. Did/have you considered the GT30R and running NOS for quicker spooling and near enough similar BHP?
What is the car mainly used for? Do you take it on track or is it a sleeper?

It was my daily but not getting used much now, never tracked it (will probably wrap it knowing my luck!!) I'm hoping the tubular will shave a couple hundred rpm off the spool up time plus I'd still like to get these cams adjusted slightly as they were just dropped it the stock T5 cam position. After speaking to Catcams there should be some nice gains made there. Its not mega laggy but a slightly earlier spool up will be nice! Not much life below 3k and doesn't really get going in 3rd until 65/70 so 2nd gears been getting a pasting recently! I'm finding I keep it above 4k a lot more than I ever have! Everything's been shifted up a good 1k rpm compared to the GT28RS. Could really do with some uprated valve springs now to give a bit more safety margin above 6k and the odd 7k run in 3rd & 4th

My only real concern with the GT35R is the reliability side of it, but there's quite a few 9k's in Sweden & the US with it fitted running big numbers with no problems and a few have the Holset HX35 & Super 40 so thats another option. Super 40 sounds a cracking turbo, seems to be around the same as the 3076 on the lag side of life but gives a load more up top. Will see how it goes with the tubular.

One of he guys had a NOS system on his with either a HX35 or HE351 (cant remember which) but that made some decent numbers and went like stink Too much hassle for me though...

[griffin dai]

Max M4X WW said:

Looks great, love the carbon vinyl inside but not so keen on the tyre pen!

Nice figures too

LOL Yeah the tyre pen is gone now! I made up a few dash kits for the guys so got the hang of it after a couple sets, takes hours though to get right. This was the first one I covered and its not the best job tbh....just cant be arsed taking it all appart again, last time drove me nuts

[griffin dai]

chriis said:

Cracking big thing

Did prefer the standard look though !

Yep its pretty chunky! My old E55 merc felt huge in comparison though...massive cars!
I think the black alloys are a bit marmite on a silver car! Some love it some hate it! The ones I really wanted were 16" Carlsson alloys, they're graphite with a polished lip and look great on a silver 9k...but finding a decent set was almost impossible, these Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.2's came off a Citroen C2! Will be trying some 16" banded steelies next year for a change.

[griffin dai]

Thanks! The pics make it look a bit better condition than it is though...really needs the rusty bits sorted now as its getting on a bit!

Couple of engine pics, 1st lot with the GT28RS:




And now with the GT3076R, air-cons been ditched here but was more or less a straight turbo swap.

[griffin dai]

MrMoonyMan said:

Hello Dave!

Aloha!!

[griffin dai]

Not too bad with the bigger turbo mate as theres not as much wheel spin as i had on the TD04. I had some Bridgestones on there for over a year and these Toyos have been fitted since Feb and have been great...ill give some Kumho V70A's a shot after the winter.

[griffin dai]

Lol! Thanks, yeah the yellow pen experiment was another marmite moment of mine! Used to get lots of unwanted attention

[griffin dai]

Thanks There's a couple really nice ones around now, one or two 500bhp monsters back here in the UK and a fair few closer to and over 600bhp in Sweden and the US, mines not in the best condition bodywise tbh and looks a bit tired at the moment with the rusty arches but mechanically its fine.

I don't think I'll start a fresh build thread on here as I've got a couple going already so will just put down the current spec with some vids/pics and add to it as and when I get things done next year.

Curent spec is:

Engine;

GT3076R 0.86a/r turbo
T5 Suite Custom Map
T7 APC with modded ECU
Maptun 3 Bar Map Sensor
Forge Actuator with Red Spring
Forge Competition DV
Custom Braided Turbo Hoses
Aerodyte 3" Modular Downpipe
Aerodyte GTBB Fitting Kit
Abbott Racing 3" Stainless Catback Exhaust
Magnaflow Race Cat
Siemens Dekka 630cc Injectors
Walbro 255 Fuel Pump
Abbott Racing 243º Stage 1 Cams
Abbott Racing Delivery Pipe Kit
Blitz Sonic Power Filter
3" Stainless Intake Pipe
450x300x76mm Intercooler with 76mm core
Red silicone piping throughout
Body Coloured Cam Cover
Bosch Silver S5 Battery
NGK BCR8ES Plugs
A/C delete
Mobil 1 0w40

Transmission;

4.05 ratio box from a CSE
Sachs Uprated Pressure Plate
Aero Friction Disc
Abbott Racing CNC Ligtweight Flywheel
Abbott Racing Stainless Clutch Pressure & Feed Pipe Kit
Amsoil Gearbox Oil

Suspension;

Abbott Racing Lowering Springs (the older green ones)
Koni Adjustable Dampers
Speedparts Strut Brace
Abbott Racing Rear Anti Roll Bar with Poly Bushes
Abbott Racing Poly Butterfly Wishbone Kit
Abbott Racing Poly Front Anti Roll Bar Bush Kit
Abbott Racing Poly Gearbox Mount Kit
Abbott Racing Poly Engine Mount Kit

Brakes;

EBC Turbo Grooved Dics
EBC Yellow Stuff 'R' Pads front
Pagid pads rear
Goodridge Stainless Braided Hoses
DOT 5.1 Fluid

Wheels/Tyres;

7x17 Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.2 Alloys in Gloss Black
235/40/17 Toyo R1R Tyres

Misc;

Rear Seats Removed
Subs/amps etc removed (too heavy!!)
Front seats swapped to Sandy Beige Aero Seats
Sandy Beige/Rocky Black Door Cards
Carbon Fibre Vinyl Wrapped Dash & Door Caps & Trim Parts


I 'think' thats about it so far! More changes for 2012 (if I keep it!)

Have tried a couple different, gearbox ratio, Turbo's, Injectors, IC's and filter etc combo's out. The 4.45 ratio box from the N/A car was just mental compared to the Aero's 3.61 box and I had virtually no turbo lag here... but didn't last long and died a loud death the day after a bit of fun with a Volvo V70R!!!
GT28RS was just fantastic between 30-90.
The 600 quid Abbott Racing High Flow Intercooler was great sub 400bhp but really struggled above this as soon as the GT30 was fitted so got swapped for the £70 Chinese Ebay one!! No probs since.
I'll probably swap this Blitz Filter for another ITG Maxogen one again as the induction noise was much better on the ITG.
Injectors were Bosch Green Giants at stage 4 but had to be swapped for the 630's with the larger turbos....car idles a bit lumpy since fitting them and the cams and cold starts take 2 or 3 attempts to get going!!

Couple Vids of the current set up (turn the volume down though as the SQ is bad!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KH2QXzWg_Co

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYf_VMXJhGo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkPWW28_0u4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VynGeUjSTNw

Edited by griffin dai on Friday 18th November 20:01

[griffin dai]

SlowStig said:

How much do you think this car has cost you to build upto the current performance specification? I love the saab 9000 and wanted one but couldn't justify the running costs doing 30 miles a day on a part time job!

Would be interested to hear the period of time its been built over as well, some people know exactly what they are doing and just throw a lot of money at it over a short period and others do the polar opposite and do little bits over long periods of time.

Hi, difficult to say really as I've been taking it through the different stages so it got expensive changing/uprating things all the time. Probably around the £7-£8k mark over the 3 years. Would have been miles cheaper to go straight to stage 6 but I fancied trying out the different stages and a GT28RS, cams, gear ratios etc.

Now I know what kind of power I want for the next car I'll be going straight from standard to stage 6 or maybe 7 in one go.I think you could probably go straight to this level for around the £2.5 - £3k mark depending on what parts you get. The IC for example was originally an Abbott Racing one so your looking at around £550-£600 there but its no good above 400bhp so needs upgrading again. Swapped for a cheap £70 Chinese Ebay one and its been great! Turbo's I got lucky with and had the GT28RS pretty cheap, then sold it to a mate for the GT3076R and was £100 in pocket! A lot of the parts are 2nd hand, would have cost a fortune to get everything brand new. Some parts like the 3"DP were imported from the US so cost close to double what one should cost in the UK but its a really good one and worth it. Clutch was another pretty expensive part and took ages to get with the problems Saab are having at the moment

Also gone through a couple gearboxes at stage 3 & 4 but it seems to be holding up ok with the GT30!

[griffin dai]

ferkle said:

Bloody nice car that, Dai.

The 4.05 'box must be fun. My old aero with only 300bhp was a bit mad with the box in after I grenaded the original 3.61.

I like this a lot... sadly mine succumbed to rust and mileage - I was spending more and more each month on the old thing. I still own it, but its been in a strippedish state for a while. Considering putting a B234R into a 9-5 estate next year, or maybe the 9-3 I'm in at the moment...

Still, good work, and I'd love to see some updates when you clearly go stark raving bonkers on a holset (you beautiful crazy bd, and man after my own heart)

Cheers! Ha...yeah my 3.61 went bang after too many traffic light sprints and booting it everywhere in 1st & 2nd! What stuck the nail in though was having some fun with a nice fast Volvo V70R!! Box exploded the next day! Swapped that for a 4.45 which was just mental compared to the Aero box!! That died a loud death around 4 months later when the diff went! Will be going back to a 4.45 when this one gives up on life but swap the 5th gear for the longer one out of the 9-3 box. 5th on the 4.45 was terrible for MPG on the motorway! Should be a fair bit quicker then.

I've been looking into a facelift 9-5 B234R/B235 engine swap the last few months, either that or swap what I can into a og9-3 and go for a Aero bodykit. Not sure yet. Gonna be pretty expensive which ever I decide as I'm no mechanic and will have to pay the garage again... so I can see me being stuck around this power level then with no spare cash to go any higher! Can see me getting bored though.

Knowing me I'll probably just sell this GT30 and go for a Holset Super40 instead! Will need forged pistons, bigger injectors and some other bits so it'll cost around the same as the engine swap but end up with a much quicker car. Wouldn't mind 600-650bhp next as I don't get to drive it much so want something a bit loopy for the odd day I use it!

[griffin dai]

Lol!! Mine wasn't that spectacular, just a bang....bang....bang getting louder until BANG and then the wheels locked up!!! Did get marooned in the snow year last New Years Eve in it though with the busted diff and hysterical missis screaming at me coz "I've just ruined her NYE night"!!! She hates this car now!

Yeah Kaylan's 9k was just lovely before it went up in flames. Thousands of dollars spent there and it looked mint!! I'm sure I've read she's building another one!! Would love mine to look 1/2 as good as hers.

I bought my 630's from some VW tuning shop in the States, I think they came to around £150 shipped? Is it the 630's you meant or 870's? Have also seen these pretty cheap on the US ebay stores. Also bought some RC750's for it last year pretty cheap but sold them to one of the guys on UKS. I should really get mine cleaned as somethings not right here, cant really pinpoint it though as I had the cams fitted same time. Had the injectors adjusted slightly but still the same. Got a pretty lumpy idle. Seems a few of us have problems with them with cold starts and stalling, have been recommended to go for some Injector Dynamics ones instead but its more £££ I cant afford at the mo.

I think the pistons will be fine on this turbo, with the tubular I'm hoping to get around the 520/530 mark but will see how it goes, wouldn't mind a bit more torque from 425 to 440/450. From what some of the blokes have said anymore and I could be in trouble!! One thing I really need to do (and stupidly sold these earlier this year!!) is get some uprated Volvo valve springs in there. Just feels like it wants to give a bit more above 7k.

Mapping side I've been getting it done by post, Faero off UKSaabs has been mapping it since I bought it. Really happy there, his stage 3 map was even better than the Maptun one I had on there!! Also this map is slightly modded from his and his been tweaked here and there over the years so is now incredibly smooth!! Was expecting it to be pretty aggressive and hard to control when it came on boost but its nice and really easy to drive. I've just got hold of a CombiAdapter from JohnC off ECU Project, going to have a play with my spare ECU next year and see if I can improve at all on my 60-100 time! Goal is 3.5 secs 60-100 and closer to 9 secs 0-100
Then its going on the strip to see how well it gets on the 1/4 mile...just hope the box survives!

Here's the adapter if you've not seen it?


With this I should be able to map off the car same as the BDM, then also data log and live map the car same as with a Lawicel. Cant wait for that!! Should have done it ages ago.

[griffin dai]

Mastodon2 said:

Looks a nice car, I'd remove the fuzzy dice and I'm not keen on the way the back wheels have disappeared under the arches. If they were raised (and maybe the original wheels were put back on) I think it would improve the car a lot, give it a real sleeper status.

Yeah the dice really need to go!! Have drooped down like an old mans testicles now!!

The back suspension has sagged mate, one side is worst than the other. Most of them do look a bit nose up though from what I've seen. I've got a complete fresh set up to go on there but keep putting it off as I've got my eye on some cheapish Coilovers instead (just waiting on a reply from the supplier) I organised a pretty big Eibach group buy last year across 3 or 4 Saab forums and I think I'm the last one to get them fitted!! Typical!
Also have some Bilstein B6 dampers and SAS ARB kit to fit.

Original wheels have been long sold. Wish I'd kept these for a set of winter tyres now though

[griffin dai]

ferkle said:

Lol, yeah, a single bang and that's all she wrote here! Actually, just remembered, I have some pics

Looking at the bellhousing - you can see the slave cylinder to the right with the boot on it

And a closeup of the damage

Changed out on the pavement outside my house in a weekend



I'll have to have a look at the combi adapter, I'm still working off the old solder posts onto the board then bdm out download map, tweak, upload, back onto the car, adapt etc etc! I've had some very dull weekends with interesting bits and expensive bits.

Good luck on the times, I reckon you'll be good on the 'in-gear' times, but the 0-100 will be the sum of your weakest part, i.e. the gearbox. If you're happy to settle for 10-100 times then low 9 or even high 8 is feasible, its just getting the thing moving that I always had trouble with - especially on the low ratio box - the slightest bit of moisture within 300 miles caused the fronts to light up!

Re the suspension, mine was exactly the same, looks nose up tail down, but in fact sat flat - I did go a bit silly on a 35mm drop though so the tops of the rear tyres disappeared into the arches. Damned if I can find a picture at the moment though.

I miss that car.

Nice hole!!

I never got to see the damage on mine but the first box started going when I couldn't select any gears, then could get all gears but the gear change went very heavy, then completely slack! and then could only get 2nd & 4th with no reverse!!
2nd box just went with no warning though, just three or four quick bangs and then locked up. Really lucky I was in a car park at the time and not booting it!

This Combiadapter is meant to be pretty easy to use mate, I gave up on the BDM last year!! Just couldn't get it to work on my pc. Just hope I get the hang of this one ok!!

Yeah getting this 60-100 & 70-120 down is the main goal now, 0-60 I cant see me getting much lower than its current 5 secs as I cant get much traction in 1st and 2nd lets go unless its bone dry, would be great to have a 4.5 second 0-60 car but it'll just kill the gearbox if I keep trying
I should be able to get my 0-100 a bit closer to 9 secs though with some 3rd gear live mapping and a bit more weight loss. Seats have got to go

[griffin dai]

Small update.

I collected the tubular manifold yesterday. This ones a 200sx tubular that's been modified to fit the Saab block. Looks like the Nissan flange has been cut off and a Saab flange welded on. The exhaust ports on both engines are almost the same so I think this will be a popular mod in the future! Quickly looking at it the turbo will be moved a few inches to the right so the DownPipe will need modifying to bolt back up to the turbo, might just get two 3" vband clamps welded onto a short 3" pipe here to save hacking up my DP! Also the inlet pipe might need to be shortened as the air filters probably going to foul against the wing now. Heavy thing though!! Will need to be braced up nice & tight, I was going to wrap it but after reading some horror stories of engines going up in flames after gaps appearing in the wrap etc I'll leave it!
Pics;








No idea how much extra power this'll give though? Will fit it in Jan then get it back on the dyno in Feb. For the price on it....Dai's happy

[griffin dai]

New filter fitted today. Bit of a pita to get the old one off as there's only a few mm clearance to get a spanner on the jubilee clip and pull the thing off. Putting the new one on took two of us (me & missis griffin!!) her job was to push the intake pipe down a few mm so I could get the new bloody silicone reducer on there!

Pics...

JC60/99 ITG Maxogen Filter, 4" inlet and around a 5.5" foam filter!! Bought this thinking I needed the large one for 3
520bhp but it's only relevant to N/A cars! So a smaller one would have done the job...but it's on there now!







And with the 4"-3" reducer:


Fitted...around a 2mm gap!!


Intake pipe is now lying ontop of the delivery pipe since fitting the larger IC back in August!! Had to adjust the delivery pipe a bit to just squeeze the filter onto the intake.




Filter buried in the wing, would be miles easier to have it in the engine bay for easy access but it's nice & cold in the wing!!

[griffin dai]

bd iPhone!!!

Verdict on the filter; I've had a similar one before from Abbott Racing and these are a tad smaller but come in a hugely expensive Carbon Fibre enclosure...something like £350...plus vat...plus delivery!!! So my £60 filter jubilee clipped to the intake pipes a bit of a bargain! Induction noise is a bit different to the Abbott one and the Blitz Sonic Power filter it's replaced. Blitz was a more deep 'baaarrrp'!! This sounds more like a jet on take off! Can't really hear it much though as my turbo - manifold flange is blowing with one stud missing, 2 just sat there doing nothing and 1 left holding the turbo on
So sounds like a beetle at the moment!
New turbo fitting kit ordered yesterday, should be here tomorrow/Saturday.

[griffin dai]

Also starting to get my head into the remaping side of things. Not going very well at the moment!! All the hardwares been bought & connected up but after 2 days trying...still no joy getting the computer to talk to the car
Black art this stuff

Ecu opened up and connected to the CombiAdapter:




Parts I've got for this are the CombiAdapter (pictured a few posts above) which I've now fitted into a type8 video case and taped up. Zippo lighter & Stanley knife came in handy!


Ribbon connector for bdm tuning and canbus cable connected to check it fits ok.


The BDM is used for mapping the ecu off the car, canbus for in car mapping.

Taped up to keep it closed when in car mapping!


I'm not gonna BS and say I know what I'm doing here as it's all new to me & driving me barmy at the moment hopefully should be all sorted tomorrow morning if I get the combiadapters drivers to work! (got a box of matches waiting to burn the laptop by now)

Plan here is to hopefully sort out my lumpy idle and constant stalling on cold starts. As the cars fitted with the dreaded TCS it could be this causing it or the 630cc injectors as they can have some problems or the cams or something else! We'll see!

Mapping side.... I'm not going to even attempt yet! Just want to log everything and send them to my tuner and see what he thinks is going on.
When I'm confident with it I'd like to add a bit more boost in 2nd as it's currently in base boost (1.1 bar) then really get cracking on the 3rd gears 60-100 performance by mapping it on 8-10% thinners and Vpower. 4th gear is just loopy above 100 so happy with that but wouldn't complain with a bit more oomph! 5th gear I haven't really pushed yet tbh.

Aim is to get the 60-100 below 3.5 secs. Should be possible as it's 3.8 now and still missing 0.3 bar boost...plus the tubulars yet to be fitted. 0-60 I cant seeing it getting much quicker than its 5 secs being fwd but would like to bring the 0-100 down a bit from 10 to 9 seconds without killing another gearbox! (all this is in the dry....damp or wet roads its all over the place) Then it's off to the strip and get the 1/4 mile timed

So!! with the extra 0.3 bar boost, big tubular and live mapping the nuts off it on thinners! I'm hoping for a bit over 500bhp....we'll see!

[griffin dai]

Cars now being broken just too much ££££ to get it sorted so most of the performance parts will be transferred to the new car.

Have swapped it with this;


Missing the 450bhp performance a bit!!

[griffin dai]

themanwithnoname said:

Sorry to hear it. How are you finding the 9-3? I've been running a 5dr SE T for about 15k miles, just turned 197000 yesterday. Though I'm currently in the market for a 9-5 Aero - missing anything approaching my old 9000.

That said, get the VRK and subframe brace, throw on some suspension etc and transfer some parts from the 9000 and build yourself a hybrid T5/T7 engine for a 450bhp monster again

In case you've not seen them the T5/T7 hybrid uses the B204/234 block and a T7 head with T5/enem cams - sounds promising and am currently collecting parts to build one myself.

Really enjoying it! No where near as quick as the 9000 but so much nicer to drive...hard to believe its only 5 years younger!
These get properly put down in the handling dept but it's not as bad as I expected, the 9000 used to be a nightmare anyway especially in the wet (would just swap lanes on me when the turbo kicked in!!)

I've ordered a PFS steering rack clamp, should have the 6 point subframe brace this month then probably go for Bilstein B8 dampers with either Maptun or Eibach springs....and Pollybush EVERYTHING!!!
Tyres are ok on standard power, have had no wheel spin but it's only putting out around 150! Will fit some Kuhmo V70A's when I sort the engine out.

It's the B204 in here mate, so good for 500. Yeah a lot of guys go for the b2x4/T7 head and that was on the cards if I went for a 9-3 Aero. Will just be taking this to stage 1 for now to give it a bit more poke, then once the handlings sorted I'll take it straight to stage 6 with the bits off my 9k! Just going to fit a TD04 Hybrid this time as it's a bolt on swap and meant to be very good. Then add my Abbott Racing cams, 200sx tubular manifold and Viggen clutch. Should get a nice useable 350bhp then...not going mad on this one!! Was initially thinking of 600+ with a Holset turbo but it's not the car for it. Will keep it nice and quick below a ton instead!