Citroen Saxo VTS.
Discussion
In September 2016, rather impulsively and on a hunch, I bought a Saxo VTS.
I always wanted one ever since owning my first car, a Saxo 1.4 Furio.
One owner, 47,000 miles and a decent amount of MOT is all the convincing I needed and within a month of first hearing about it I handed over £500 and had the keys!
It is a late model so came with all the toys a UK spec Saxo ever did! (RHD never got AirCon). 15 inch alloys, tilt and slide roof, alarm, rear headrests, four airbags, ABS, oil temperature gauge to name a few. While that may not be deemed noteworthy on a modern hot hatch, it was fairly respectable (if not a little spartan) back then! The spec list is not what these little cars were about any how!
This particular car was local from new; a mature owner, never modified, never crashed, sensible colour and most importantly a solid shell! Great then?
Well yes and no..! At this point you are probably picturing a minter? Perhaps maybe one which hasn't seen a bit of love in a while but can be easily brought back up to scratch with a bit of love? The latter would be the kindest description of the state of the car at the moment I handed over my cash, signed the old style blue log book and received the keys!
The paintwork was dreadful, contaminated with old bird lime and iron fillings from the custodians place of work, scratches and scuffs on ever corner and panel, paint peel, flat paint around the fuel filler where spilt and most annoyingly vandal damage to the front wing, both mirrors and tailgate.
Mechanically the car was in better fettle. Bills and evidence of linear yearly services, two timing belt changes, routine work when things broke! The history read pretty well. The mechanic in me however knew that it had just had the work to keep it going, rather than out of love!
The exhaust downpipe was cracked, the engine mounts tired out, front wheel alignment way out, tyres were on budgets at the front and the original Michelin SX GT on the rear!! The locking nut was missing for the wheels to add to the misery!
Here are the pictures when I got it home..!
Now instead of letting on too much regarding its present state, I am going to see how much response I get on this initial post. While not new to forums, I am fairly new to progress threads. I did one on piston heads a while back didn't get much interest; I enjoy reading some updates on here and am an OCD diagnosed individual with a keen interest in detailing so felt this may be a good place to try again!
Let me know your thoughts,
Many Thanks,
Danny.
I always wanted one ever since owning my first car, a Saxo 1.4 Furio.
One owner, 47,000 miles and a decent amount of MOT is all the convincing I needed and within a month of first hearing about it I handed over £500 and had the keys!
It is a late model so came with all the toys a UK spec Saxo ever did! (RHD never got AirCon). 15 inch alloys, tilt and slide roof, alarm, rear headrests, four airbags, ABS, oil temperature gauge to name a few. While that may not be deemed noteworthy on a modern hot hatch, it was fairly respectable (if not a little spartan) back then! The spec list is not what these little cars were about any how!
This particular car was local from new; a mature owner, never modified, never crashed, sensible colour and most importantly a solid shell! Great then?
Well yes and no..! At this point you are probably picturing a minter? Perhaps maybe one which hasn't seen a bit of love in a while but can be easily brought back up to scratch with a bit of love? The latter would be the kindest description of the state of the car at the moment I handed over my cash, signed the old style blue log book and received the keys!
The paintwork was dreadful, contaminated with old bird lime and iron fillings from the custodians place of work, scratches and scuffs on ever corner and panel, paint peel, flat paint around the fuel filler where spilt and most annoyingly vandal damage to the front wing, both mirrors and tailgate.
Mechanically the car was in better fettle. Bills and evidence of linear yearly services, two timing belt changes, routine work when things broke! The history read pretty well. The mechanic in me however knew that it had just had the work to keep it going, rather than out of love!
The exhaust downpipe was cracked, the engine mounts tired out, front wheel alignment way out, tyres were on budgets at the front and the original Michelin SX GT on the rear!! The locking nut was missing for the wheels to add to the misery!
Here are the pictures when I got it home..!
Now instead of letting on too much regarding its present state, I am going to see how much response I get on this initial post. While not new to forums, I am fairly new to progress threads. I did one on piston heads a while back didn't get much interest; I enjoy reading some updates on here and am an OCD diagnosed individual with a keen interest in detailing so felt this may be a good place to try again!
Let me know your thoughts,
Many Thanks,
Danny.
Edited by Willo26 on Saturday 24th November 19:09
Progress at first came mostly from removing years of neglect to see what I was up against. As the vital mechanicals were all okay, I didn't feel too silly starting with cleaning jobs! I knew I'd have to do these jobs a million times over before it was anywhere near as clean as I'd hope it to be; however the first time is always the most noticeable and therapeutic!
First up I fitted a new old stock grille I had been dying to fit since I was 17. I bought it when I worked at the Citroen dealer as I had butchered the grille on my Furio and meshed it; as you do! Sold the car with the grille on so the new old stock one had never been fitted before. The black badges were a result of my teenage self, however with the car been black I figured it suited and they stayed.
A coat of bumper and trim gel took years off of the plastic instantly!
I gave the paintwork a treat with a clay bar! I knew this wouldn't be the last time I did so, as the paint was unbelievably contaminated with metal fillings on the bonnet and roof and plastered in tar along the sides. I could not yet see the state of the arches properly as I could not remove the wheels, thanks to the garage which the original owner used whom had rounded off the locking nuts and thrown away the key. This is what came out of the bonnet on the first session..
The difference after the first clay and bumper and trim treatment was evident!
I also got round to giving the interior a minor strip down in order to get any hidden nasties! Carpets cleaned up extremely well; as did the hard wearing velour trim. Sadly the rip in the drivers seat did not clean out..
I love the interior of this car, classically and unmistakably Citroen!
Like a naughty teenager, the owner of this car swore it was never smoked in, however I found evidence to suggest otherwise! Fags in the ashtray enough for you??
Due to my findings I decided to strip the heater vents, soak in soapy water and re assemble!
I removed the hideous gear knob which I presume the original owner plucked from the options list and also the original stereo believe it or not. I've never had one of these units which is able to play a CD without spitting it out; this one was no exception! As I was using this as a daily at the time I popped a Sony bluetooth unit in, which worked a treat. The original was wrapped in cotton wool and kept.
The gear knob is from a Peugeot 106 as some of you may notice. I do have an OE one but thought this looked better, for now at least!
I also found some genuine rubber mats as you may note in the last picture!
After some quick but therapeutic jobs I felt much better about my purchase; a car always feels more yours after the first clean. So while sat there ordering all the history into date order in my newly bought file, I felt I could final start fettling with the car for real. Little did I know just how much fettling lie ahead..!
Danny.
First up I fitted a new old stock grille I had been dying to fit since I was 17. I bought it when I worked at the Citroen dealer as I had butchered the grille on my Furio and meshed it; as you do! Sold the car with the grille on so the new old stock one had never been fitted before. The black badges were a result of my teenage self, however with the car been black I figured it suited and they stayed.
A coat of bumper and trim gel took years off of the plastic instantly!
I gave the paintwork a treat with a clay bar! I knew this wouldn't be the last time I did so, as the paint was unbelievably contaminated with metal fillings on the bonnet and roof and plastered in tar along the sides. I could not yet see the state of the arches properly as I could not remove the wheels, thanks to the garage which the original owner used whom had rounded off the locking nuts and thrown away the key. This is what came out of the bonnet on the first session..
The difference after the first clay and bumper and trim treatment was evident!
I also got round to giving the interior a minor strip down in order to get any hidden nasties! Carpets cleaned up extremely well; as did the hard wearing velour trim. Sadly the rip in the drivers seat did not clean out..
I love the interior of this car, classically and unmistakably Citroen!
Like a naughty teenager, the owner of this car swore it was never smoked in, however I found evidence to suggest otherwise! Fags in the ashtray enough for you??
Due to my findings I decided to strip the heater vents, soak in soapy water and re assemble!
I removed the hideous gear knob which I presume the original owner plucked from the options list and also the original stereo believe it or not. I've never had one of these units which is able to play a CD without spitting it out; this one was no exception! As I was using this as a daily at the time I popped a Sony bluetooth unit in, which worked a treat. The original was wrapped in cotton wool and kept.
The gear knob is from a Peugeot 106 as some of you may notice. I do have an OE one but thought this looked better, for now at least!
I also found some genuine rubber mats as you may note in the last picture!
After some quick but therapeutic jobs I felt much better about my purchase; a car always feels more yours after the first clean. So while sat there ordering all the history into date order in my newly bought file, I felt I could final start fettling with the car for real. Little did I know just how much fettling lie ahead..!
Danny.
Edited by Willo26 on Saturday 24th November 19:10
The progress continued into November 2016.
I got a professional to remove the locking nuts and replaced them with some matching ones I had lying around! I could finally get a proper look at the brakes and the state of the arches etc!
What I found was brand new discs and pads, which was a good start! I promptly stripped and cleaned the brakes. I gave the callipers a quick lick of paint and the suspension struts and backing plates also got a bit of treatment. This was a more of a temporary preservation measure rather than a 'that'll do' job.
I replaced the soggy mount which had caused the delay in power transfer; the problem diagnosed as the bottom gearbox mount. At first the power flex mount was far too stiff causing things to rattle on idle which did not before. Once worn in though I was very impressed with the results. The little rasper was much more responsive!
If only it wasn't for that blowing exhaust.. Well that was next on my list!
I replaced the cracked down pipe (the one which bolts to the hideous cast manifold; which curves round the engine to meet the cat pipe! Catalytic converter is underneath even on a MK2 VTS, unlike the 8V variants which changed to a mani-cat around early 2001). Unfortunately no pictures on this one but what a difference..! The car finally being quiet really dragged into a different league for me; and prepare me to elaborate..
For I have been through the whole model range of Saxo's (1.5D Excluded) and just quite how grown up the VTS feels compared to any other model is quite something! The combination of the more sophisticated 16v engine (and added weight at the front) coupled with them comfy seats and more toys I believe is what gives that illusion! And what an illusion it is; because the power delivery is achieved at much higher revs that the 8v, you tend to forget just how willing and capable this car is in that sweet RPM spot! Naturally aprehensive as I was of the VTS at first; I'm the kind of guy who would choose a 205 1.6 over the 1.9. This car is nuts; and I'm really starting to come round to why the VTS was the one to have!
At this stage, I also found a back box which was much better condition than the one I had fitted! This I do have a picture of.. although rather non specific!
I also did a couple more bits such as these Furio door handles which again gave the little VTS a more premium feel. Why these were never fitted I will never know!
I also did a meticulous strip down of the centre console, replaced all the non working bulbs. Just another little touch again!
I would like to take this opportunity to apologise if you feel there are not as many pictures or details as you would hope! I do a lot in such a short space of time and I have really had to dig hard to find these pictures and remember this information. As I stated at the start of the thread it was September 2016 when I purchased the car and my aim is to bridge the gap and bring you up to speed with current affairs!
This was November 2016; and as the car was a cheap purchase and I only use my other vehicle in summer, the plan was to run it all winter.
As you will find out soon; this did not happen! More to be revealed soon.
(The front plate was a gift which ended up been ordered in the wrong dimensions)
Thanks for reading, Danny.
I got a professional to remove the locking nuts and replaced them with some matching ones I had lying around! I could finally get a proper look at the brakes and the state of the arches etc!
What I found was brand new discs and pads, which was a good start! I promptly stripped and cleaned the brakes. I gave the callipers a quick lick of paint and the suspension struts and backing plates also got a bit of treatment. This was a more of a temporary preservation measure rather than a 'that'll do' job.
I replaced the soggy mount which had caused the delay in power transfer; the problem diagnosed as the bottom gearbox mount. At first the power flex mount was far too stiff causing things to rattle on idle which did not before. Once worn in though I was very impressed with the results. The little rasper was much more responsive!
If only it wasn't for that blowing exhaust.. Well that was next on my list!
I replaced the cracked down pipe (the one which bolts to the hideous cast manifold; which curves round the engine to meet the cat pipe! Catalytic converter is underneath even on a MK2 VTS, unlike the 8V variants which changed to a mani-cat around early 2001). Unfortunately no pictures on this one but what a difference..! The car finally being quiet really dragged into a different league for me; and prepare me to elaborate..
For I have been through the whole model range of Saxo's (1.5D Excluded) and just quite how grown up the VTS feels compared to any other model is quite something! The combination of the more sophisticated 16v engine (and added weight at the front) coupled with them comfy seats and more toys I believe is what gives that illusion! And what an illusion it is; because the power delivery is achieved at much higher revs that the 8v, you tend to forget just how willing and capable this car is in that sweet RPM spot! Naturally aprehensive as I was of the VTS at first; I'm the kind of guy who would choose a 205 1.6 over the 1.9. This car is nuts; and I'm really starting to come round to why the VTS was the one to have!
At this stage, I also found a back box which was much better condition than the one I had fitted! This I do have a picture of.. although rather non specific!
I also did a couple more bits such as these Furio door handles which again gave the little VTS a more premium feel. Why these were never fitted I will never know!
I also did a meticulous strip down of the centre console, replaced all the non working bulbs. Just another little touch again!
I would like to take this opportunity to apologise if you feel there are not as many pictures or details as you would hope! I do a lot in such a short space of time and I have really had to dig hard to find these pictures and remember this information. As I stated at the start of the thread it was September 2016 when I purchased the car and my aim is to bridge the gap and bring you up to speed with current affairs!
This was November 2016; and as the car was a cheap purchase and I only use my other vehicle in summer, the plan was to run it all winter.
As you will find out soon; this did not happen! More to be revealed soon.
(The front plate was a gift which ended up been ordered in the wrong dimensions)
Thanks for reading, Danny.
Edited by Willo26 on Saturday 24th November 19:11
I'll pick up where I left off in the last update; November 2016!
As stated previously the initial plan for this car was to daily it and make sure the mechanicals were all as they seemed while doing little tidying up jobs. With it looking fairly 'doggy' I needed in my own mind to decide wether this little blighter was actually going to be a reliable car worth putting money into; a sort of personal justification process if you like!
Well I was certainly bonding with the car despite its many faults, mainly due to a strong engine and box just as you'd expect from a low miler with one mature owner. However the brakes left a lot to be desired, the much larger servo and ABS certainly gave it a different feel to the VTR, but the discs and pads were quite clearly cheap motor factor ones as they lacked bite and were certainly not confidence inspiring. The suspension also felt a bit tried, I suspect the shocks have never been replaced; the rear beam never touched and while the front springs had been replaced due to necessity there were not of OE quality! Tracking was still miles out too; probably due to a track rod end replacement with no wheel alignment done afterwards. Coupled with the budget front and ancient original fit rear tyres, the drive was still disappointing to say the least!
I knew this car had so much more to give.
Well my mind was about to be made up really! After a fairly uneventful run up to Christmas in the VTS (and another Saxo purchase) I woke up to a flat tyre on the morning of the 25th! The inner sidewall of the budget had a huge spilt it in! Spare wheel on; I set of to continue my day of festivities at a families house. I left a few hours later; pulling up to the road end out of the estate I was surprised to find that my brake pedal went to the floor. Yes; that's right, two Christmas gifts from this bundle of joy!! Can't beat a bit of Christmas Day brake failure! I gingerly continued the short drive home on the handbrake!!
On inspection the next day I found the brake pipe which runs round the bulkhead and disappears underneath the vehicle heading towards the OSR calliper had failed! There was already one copper pipe sticking out of the ABS block, so only a matter of time before another one goes I suppose! I would have to wait to do this repair as my flaring tool was at work!
New Year passed and back to work I went; first thing on my mind was to get this brake pipe made up! Using the old one as a template I made a quick pipe up, and slapped it on. A matter of necessity over anything!
I managed to get the first bleed nipple open after a bit of heat, it was very tender and had lost a bit of shape over the years! Round to the NSF calliper and snap! This happened again on the OSR despite attacking with heat until almost glowing!
I'd really lost my way with this sorry looking, shoe string ran little Citroen; so with other projects and general life on the go and no real reason or motivation to get it going again I parked it up in my lockup and the car wasn't to see light again for another year..! Little did I know the events happening while this car was tucked away would seal this cars fate! But why? and what was that to be?
Stay tuned!
Meanwhile This was the little backup car which was dragged out of hiding and ended up becoming my girlfriends first car!
£200, 70k, local from new, my boss used to take me to work every morning in this exact car when I started my apprenticeship at Citroen!
Lovely bodywork; rotten as a pear as it turned out!
Apologies for the lengthy update with no real pictures; really desperate to bring you guys up to speed with the car and its fate. Lots of pictures and satisfying info coming up..!
As stated previously the initial plan for this car was to daily it and make sure the mechanicals were all as they seemed while doing little tidying up jobs. With it looking fairly 'doggy' I needed in my own mind to decide wether this little blighter was actually going to be a reliable car worth putting money into; a sort of personal justification process if you like!
Well I was certainly bonding with the car despite its many faults, mainly due to a strong engine and box just as you'd expect from a low miler with one mature owner. However the brakes left a lot to be desired, the much larger servo and ABS certainly gave it a different feel to the VTR, but the discs and pads were quite clearly cheap motor factor ones as they lacked bite and were certainly not confidence inspiring. The suspension also felt a bit tried, I suspect the shocks have never been replaced; the rear beam never touched and while the front springs had been replaced due to necessity there were not of OE quality! Tracking was still miles out too; probably due to a track rod end replacement with no wheel alignment done afterwards. Coupled with the budget front and ancient original fit rear tyres, the drive was still disappointing to say the least!
I knew this car had so much more to give.
Well my mind was about to be made up really! After a fairly uneventful run up to Christmas in the VTS (and another Saxo purchase) I woke up to a flat tyre on the morning of the 25th! The inner sidewall of the budget had a huge spilt it in! Spare wheel on; I set of to continue my day of festivities at a families house. I left a few hours later; pulling up to the road end out of the estate I was surprised to find that my brake pedal went to the floor. Yes; that's right, two Christmas gifts from this bundle of joy!! Can't beat a bit of Christmas Day brake failure! I gingerly continued the short drive home on the handbrake!!
On inspection the next day I found the brake pipe which runs round the bulkhead and disappears underneath the vehicle heading towards the OSR calliper had failed! There was already one copper pipe sticking out of the ABS block, so only a matter of time before another one goes I suppose! I would have to wait to do this repair as my flaring tool was at work!
New Year passed and back to work I went; first thing on my mind was to get this brake pipe made up! Using the old one as a template I made a quick pipe up, and slapped it on. A matter of necessity over anything!
I managed to get the first bleed nipple open after a bit of heat, it was very tender and had lost a bit of shape over the years! Round to the NSF calliper and snap! This happened again on the OSR despite attacking with heat until almost glowing!
I'd really lost my way with this sorry looking, shoe string ran little Citroen; so with other projects and general life on the go and no real reason or motivation to get it going again I parked it up in my lockup and the car wasn't to see light again for another year..! Little did I know the events happening while this car was tucked away would seal this cars fate! But why? and what was that to be?
Stay tuned!
Meanwhile This was the little backup car which was dragged out of hiding and ended up becoming my girlfriends first car!
£200, 70k, local from new, my boss used to take me to work every morning in this exact car when I started my apprenticeship at Citroen!
Lovely bodywork; rotten as a pear as it turned out!
Apologies for the lengthy update with no real pictures; really desperate to bring you guys up to speed with the car and its fate. Lots of pictures and satisfying info coming up..!
Edited by Willo26 on Saturday 24th November 19:13
I opened the lock up door, peeled the cover off the car and surprisingly; there was still a Saxo there! Looking exactly how I left it too, bonus! Or err perhaps not because I didn't really leave it in a deserved state and really did feel guilty losing my temper with this little number in the first place. After all this was New Year 2018 and it had spent just short of a year on the naughty step! This was my 'fresh start' to the year, a resolution if you like!
With a new purchase arriving and requiring the lockup space and a Clio already in the garage at home; I needed to start making progress with this little car! It was gonna be a push though for various reasons!
In the year that this car hadn't turned a wheel; I had severed my middle finger in an accident and my hand had just been released from a huge cast after a lengthy and painful tendon operation. I hadn't driven for months (at least thats what I told the doctor) and my hand was a numb painful balloon.
In other news my girlfriend had fallen in love..! No not with another bloke.. Or a another woman!! With a rusty old piece of metal; this rusty old piece of metal to be precise.
Looks much better than it was..
Despite its many (many) faults and being given no love what so ever; she had become smitten. So much so that at 18 years of age she had put it upon herself to show me cheap insurance quotes in a bid to convince me that the unloved piece of French metal that sit in the lockup should be hers; after all I didn't actually have any use for it and the Saxo she was currently using had inner wings which looked like a block of Emmental cheese (and about as much structural rigidity)! Good point; actually! You win.
So bombshell; I gave the car away for free and I'm now writing a post about a car I no longer own! .. I do however work on it; constantly in fact. Much more than my own car! I'm happy to say however she is more than happy to throw money at it! (Not literally, that would be silly)
Anywho, with one working hand and the temperature barely registering above freezing, we swapped the battery, was deafened by the alarm and with flat soggy tyres rolled it out of the garage! The first port of call was to remove both front callipers in preparation to refurbish and clean.
Everything thus far on the car had fought me to the death, from the locking wheel nuts when first purchased to the snapped bleed nipples and countless rounded off captives and bolts along the way; so I expected no less this time round. At least I wasn't too surprised then when I heated rusted on Flexi hose nut and this happened!
The state of the calliper including bleed nipple snapped.
So I took them to work, completely ground them down, replaced rubbers, cleaned sliders, replaced bleed nipple and resealed piston and hey presto..
Both sides completed, I bought some lovely new braided Flexi hoses.
Here is one side after I'd just built it up, unfortunately arch looking fairly unloved after winter use followed by year of sitting!
The clock was ticking, as was the job list slowly. Join me again for more calamities soon!
Thanks for reading, Danny.
With a new purchase arriving and requiring the lockup space and a Clio already in the garage at home; I needed to start making progress with this little car! It was gonna be a push though for various reasons!
In the year that this car hadn't turned a wheel; I had severed my middle finger in an accident and my hand had just been released from a huge cast after a lengthy and painful tendon operation. I hadn't driven for months (at least thats what I told the doctor) and my hand was a numb painful balloon.
In other news my girlfriend had fallen in love..! No not with another bloke.. Or a another woman!! With a rusty old piece of metal; this rusty old piece of metal to be precise.
Looks much better than it was..
Despite its many (many) faults and being given no love what so ever; she had become smitten. So much so that at 18 years of age she had put it upon herself to show me cheap insurance quotes in a bid to convince me that the unloved piece of French metal that sit in the lockup should be hers; after all I didn't actually have any use for it and the Saxo she was currently using had inner wings which looked like a block of Emmental cheese (and about as much structural rigidity)! Good point; actually! You win.
So bombshell; I gave the car away for free and I'm now writing a post about a car I no longer own! .. I do however work on it; constantly in fact. Much more than my own car! I'm happy to say however she is more than happy to throw money at it! (Not literally, that would be silly)
Anywho, with one working hand and the temperature barely registering above freezing, we swapped the battery, was deafened by the alarm and with flat soggy tyres rolled it out of the garage! The first port of call was to remove both front callipers in preparation to refurbish and clean.
Everything thus far on the car had fought me to the death, from the locking wheel nuts when first purchased to the snapped bleed nipples and countless rounded off captives and bolts along the way; so I expected no less this time round. At least I wasn't too surprised then when I heated rusted on Flexi hose nut and this happened!
The state of the calliper including bleed nipple snapped.
So I took them to work, completely ground them down, replaced rubbers, cleaned sliders, replaced bleed nipple and resealed piston and hey presto..
Both sides completed, I bought some lovely new braided Flexi hoses.
Here is one side after I'd just built it up, unfortunately arch looking fairly unloved after winter use followed by year of sitting!
The clock was ticking, as was the job list slowly. Join me again for more calamities soon!
Thanks for reading, Danny.
Edited by Willo26 on Saturday 24th November 19:14
April 2018 and next on the list was to get them god awful wheels and tyres off. The long term plan to rip the ancient tyres off, get the alloys blasted, powder coated in OE silver etc. For now though my girlfriend (Hannah) had a set of these lying around!
I was not willing to run decent tyres however until that poor alignment was sorted. Thankfully know some really nice guys who have a camera alignment machine; I was able to use this and fettle it myself! A country mile out on front toe, just as I'd suspected, track rod ends replaced without any adjustments afterwards! A huge surprise came when I changed the machine to the back to find all the values on the rear axle near perfect!
We now had a straight steering wheel and for the first time quality rubber. Once again another job that made the car feel reborn!
Next was the dreadful Frankenstein exhaust! Like a scrap yard assortment bin, all parts had rusted different amounts and were from totally different manufacturers which also meant it really wasn't a great fit!
I replaced it with a Scorpion SaxSport which I bought brand new then sold with my old VTR and we bought back for £50 when the guy decided to go for something else! Nonsensical man logic right there.. Any who the guy who had the exhaust for a while unlike me did not put his car on the ramp every month to clean underneath! It had gotten a bit dirty, but a little tar remover and washing up liquid was all this formerly waxed up exhaust needed to return to it former glory! The sax sport looks and sounds great and since the genuine exhaust parts are not available and never made the most of that little raspy 16v; it's a modification I'm happy to do!
When I owned the exhaust first time round on my old VTR, all detailed up!
After a year with someone else!
After some Autosol and Machine Polisher!
I had the front bumper off which revealed a little rot on one of the bumper brackets! I will attend to that at a later date as the bumper requires a respray at some point. For now I removed the fog lights, baked at low heat in the oven, split the glass and wiped that misty wispy condensation that often lurks in Saxo fog lights! I also changed the orange indicator bulbs in the lights for Phillips SilverVison, which surprisingly changes the look of the front lamp clusters quite a bit! Obviously detailed up the cooling fans etc while the bumper was off too!
I chose Total 10w40 for the Saxo engine and 75w80 for the gearbox. I replaced the plugs, fuel filter, air filter and gave the car a thorough checking over!
Everything checked out apart from one small matter. I checked for play up and down and side to side and nothing! A tip an old boy once gave me when I used to work at Citroen is to grab the wheel and a 5 to 5 position which me reveal some hidden play in a rear torsion beam axle such as the one found on a Saxo! Well hey presto, minuscule play! This was picked up by the MOT tester as was a tender brake pipe surrounding the rear axle!
My girlfriend decided the best plan of attack was to off road the car this coming winter and remove the rear axle and replace it with a refurbished and painted axle from IM Axles. While the axle is off, tend to any rot in the boot floor and rear arch area, stone chip and paint it. Re new the shocks and re pipe the rear brakes with copper. Thankfully we have brand new flexi hoses left over when I bought a new set when the fronts needed doing! Phew.. looks like I'll be busy as ever this winter!
To celebrate the fresh test ticket Hannah paid for a paintless dent repair on the whole car which a brave man undertook! It nearly cost the initial purchase price of the car but oh boy what a difference!
2016.
After. (You may notice the black badges, they are temporary as I inadvertently polished the sliver off of them!)
2016.
Smooth!
There was also may small parking dings which were attended to! The car was truly dent free and still fully original paint, no body filler, welding etc ever done!
In addition I gave the car a full machine polish with my new toy; a Meguiars MT230 DA polisher which I highly recommend!
While the paintwork was abused and heavily soiled when I got the car, it was beginning to look better. Although the scuffed bodykit was still to be attended to and the tarnished roof and bonnet proving difficult.
Bonnet after a machine polish!
With a fresh MOT and less faults than it had had for a long while but still far from where we wanted it we headed for the Lake District! It preformed faultlessly, which is odd really as an impeding fault was about to reveal itself..
Stick around for more!
Highest road in England.
Wastwater.
Back home and waxed up!
Thanks for reading. Danny.
I was not willing to run decent tyres however until that poor alignment was sorted. Thankfully know some really nice guys who have a camera alignment machine; I was able to use this and fettle it myself! A country mile out on front toe, just as I'd suspected, track rod ends replaced without any adjustments afterwards! A huge surprise came when I changed the machine to the back to find all the values on the rear axle near perfect!
We now had a straight steering wheel and for the first time quality rubber. Once again another job that made the car feel reborn!
Next was the dreadful Frankenstein exhaust! Like a scrap yard assortment bin, all parts had rusted different amounts and were from totally different manufacturers which also meant it really wasn't a great fit!
I replaced it with a Scorpion SaxSport which I bought brand new then sold with my old VTR and we bought back for £50 when the guy decided to go for something else! Nonsensical man logic right there.. Any who the guy who had the exhaust for a while unlike me did not put his car on the ramp every month to clean underneath! It had gotten a bit dirty, but a little tar remover and washing up liquid was all this formerly waxed up exhaust needed to return to it former glory! The sax sport looks and sounds great and since the genuine exhaust parts are not available and never made the most of that little raspy 16v; it's a modification I'm happy to do!
When I owned the exhaust first time round on my old VTR, all detailed up!
After a year with someone else!
After some Autosol and Machine Polisher!
I had the front bumper off which revealed a little rot on one of the bumper brackets! I will attend to that at a later date as the bumper requires a respray at some point. For now I removed the fog lights, baked at low heat in the oven, split the glass and wiped that misty wispy condensation that often lurks in Saxo fog lights! I also changed the orange indicator bulbs in the lights for Phillips SilverVison, which surprisingly changes the look of the front lamp clusters quite a bit! Obviously detailed up the cooling fans etc while the bumper was off too!
I chose Total 10w40 for the Saxo engine and 75w80 for the gearbox. I replaced the plugs, fuel filter, air filter and gave the car a thorough checking over!
Everything checked out apart from one small matter. I checked for play up and down and side to side and nothing! A tip an old boy once gave me when I used to work at Citroen is to grab the wheel and a 5 to 5 position which me reveal some hidden play in a rear torsion beam axle such as the one found on a Saxo! Well hey presto, minuscule play! This was picked up by the MOT tester as was a tender brake pipe surrounding the rear axle!
My girlfriend decided the best plan of attack was to off road the car this coming winter and remove the rear axle and replace it with a refurbished and painted axle from IM Axles. While the axle is off, tend to any rot in the boot floor and rear arch area, stone chip and paint it. Re new the shocks and re pipe the rear brakes with copper. Thankfully we have brand new flexi hoses left over when I bought a new set when the fronts needed doing! Phew.. looks like I'll be busy as ever this winter!
To celebrate the fresh test ticket Hannah paid for a paintless dent repair on the whole car which a brave man undertook! It nearly cost the initial purchase price of the car but oh boy what a difference!
2016.
After. (You may notice the black badges, they are temporary as I inadvertently polished the sliver off of them!)
2016.
Smooth!
There was also may small parking dings which were attended to! The car was truly dent free and still fully original paint, no body filler, welding etc ever done!
In addition I gave the car a full machine polish with my new toy; a Meguiars MT230 DA polisher which I highly recommend!
While the paintwork was abused and heavily soiled when I got the car, it was beginning to look better. Although the scuffed bodykit was still to be attended to and the tarnished roof and bonnet proving difficult.
Bonnet after a machine polish!
With a fresh MOT and less faults than it had had for a long while but still far from where we wanted it we headed for the Lake District! It preformed faultlessly, which is odd really as an impeding fault was about to reveal itself..
Stick around for more!
Highest road in England.
Wastwater.
Back home and waxed up!
Thanks for reading. Danny.
Edited by Willo26 on Saturday 24th November 19:15
Flying along then I'll hit you with another update!
So while not perfect yet, the little Saxo had been through the biggest transformation and more owners than ever before in its life! The road trip to the Lakes went off without a hitch, climbing effortlessly (if not noisily) up the highest mountain pass in England! Its small size made squeezing past family tourist SUV's much easier and its nippy handling and revvy engine made it a joy! As I mentioned before it had always been the same mature hands since new so the original engine, box and clutch all preformed strongly as you would expect! Anyone who tells you these cars eat gearboxes cannot drive or have bought a lemon. Driveshafts however, perhaps so..! Not that this car needed them!
No sooner than we got back from the Lake District it was arranged we was to go to Edinburgh to visit the better halves family! Confident on its impeccable performance I had no doubts!
In the mean time we got some new plip keys that actually worked!
So off to Edinburgh we went..
Silly O'Clock in the morning!
We split the journey pretty nicely travelling from North Yorkshire stopping for some fuel first, then half way roughly at Hexham to see a friend then 3/4 at Jedburgh for some lunch. This is when a problem appeared! Sat still at a junction, I watched the temperature gauge rise from half to full in seconds, red light flashing! Hastily we pulled up had some lunch and let the car cool!
It was a very hot day, as has been the case with this year and the car had only been used to short trips and furthermore had been sat for a while! I feared for the head gasket; not because I thought it was at fault (although everyone automatically assumes this when a car is overheating) but because I know running an engine over temperature is truly what knackers the head gasket hence the association!
Back on the road and the temperature behaved itself once again, it seemed to run fine air-cooled.
On the night we decided to park in the city centre! This journey did not go off without a hitch! Regular stops ensured the journey took us twice as long, the thing just would not stay cool! The coolant level looked slightly low but very hard to tell in the header tank as it's positioned awkwardly and not really opaque!
Trip over we headed home! The car hit a milestone (not literally).
50k!
The trip was brilliant, the car was not!
We travelled late and kept our speed up which meant the little Saxo ran air cooled and behaved temperature wise but been my girlfriends daily; I wasn't happy with these issues at all!
Because we car share and do only 5 miles a day from and to work, we suspected the problem had started during or after the Lake District trip, something we would not have picked up on, on short trips!
I got to work, stripping the front end off the Saxo and draining the coolant fully! We only got short of three litres way too little! However there was no evidence of a leak on our driveway or in the garage? I removed the radiator and flushed only to find it was impeccable and blockage free! I changed the thermostat and housing as a matter of procedure and gave the engine bay a thorough check for leakage especially round the timing area! Nothing not a drop! Checked the heater matrix area and all the carpets but nothing. Even had the car on my ramp at work and nothing could be identified!
Three litres of genuine coolant and de ionised water was put back in and after a good bleed through it appeared the problem was history.
That was until three weeks later when my girlfriend noticed the gauge rising in traffic.. Overheated again!
The cause would turn out to be a simple one but a fiddly job..!
For now though, thanks for reading.
Danny!
So while not perfect yet, the little Saxo had been through the biggest transformation and more owners than ever before in its life! The road trip to the Lakes went off without a hitch, climbing effortlessly (if not noisily) up the highest mountain pass in England! Its small size made squeezing past family tourist SUV's much easier and its nippy handling and revvy engine made it a joy! As I mentioned before it had always been the same mature hands since new so the original engine, box and clutch all preformed strongly as you would expect! Anyone who tells you these cars eat gearboxes cannot drive or have bought a lemon. Driveshafts however, perhaps so..! Not that this car needed them!
No sooner than we got back from the Lake District it was arranged we was to go to Edinburgh to visit the better halves family! Confident on its impeccable performance I had no doubts!
In the mean time we got some new plip keys that actually worked!
So off to Edinburgh we went..
Silly O'Clock in the morning!
We split the journey pretty nicely travelling from North Yorkshire stopping for some fuel first, then half way roughly at Hexham to see a friend then 3/4 at Jedburgh for some lunch. This is when a problem appeared! Sat still at a junction, I watched the temperature gauge rise from half to full in seconds, red light flashing! Hastily we pulled up had some lunch and let the car cool!
It was a very hot day, as has been the case with this year and the car had only been used to short trips and furthermore had been sat for a while! I feared for the head gasket; not because I thought it was at fault (although everyone automatically assumes this when a car is overheating) but because I know running an engine over temperature is truly what knackers the head gasket hence the association!
Back on the road and the temperature behaved itself once again, it seemed to run fine air-cooled.
On the night we decided to park in the city centre! This journey did not go off without a hitch! Regular stops ensured the journey took us twice as long, the thing just would not stay cool! The coolant level looked slightly low but very hard to tell in the header tank as it's positioned awkwardly and not really opaque!
Trip over we headed home! The car hit a milestone (not literally).
50k!
The trip was brilliant, the car was not!
We travelled late and kept our speed up which meant the little Saxo ran air cooled and behaved temperature wise but been my girlfriends daily; I wasn't happy with these issues at all!
Because we car share and do only 5 miles a day from and to work, we suspected the problem had started during or after the Lake District trip, something we would not have picked up on, on short trips!
I got to work, stripping the front end off the Saxo and draining the coolant fully! We only got short of three litres way too little! However there was no evidence of a leak on our driveway or in the garage? I removed the radiator and flushed only to find it was impeccable and blockage free! I changed the thermostat and housing as a matter of procedure and gave the engine bay a thorough check for leakage especially round the timing area! Nothing not a drop! Checked the heater matrix area and all the carpets but nothing. Even had the car on my ramp at work and nothing could be identified!
Three litres of genuine coolant and de ionised water was put back in and after a good bleed through it appeared the problem was history.
That was until three weeks later when my girlfriend noticed the gauge rising in traffic.. Overheated again!
The cause would turn out to be a simple one but a fiddly job..!
For now though, thanks for reading.
Danny!
Edited by Willo26 on Saturday 24th November 19:16
So June 2018 and after some digging I found.. A tell tale dried up ethylene glycol trail on the back of the sump! Bizarre I thought at first until I had my powerful LED torch up in the engine bay, buried up there was a plastic coolant outlet and sure enough had the dried up gunk on it! Very very slight loss of coolant was playing havoc with this sensitive little 16v TU5J4 engine!
I really couldn't find any information regarding this rear coolant outlet other than a few pictures! I realised that I would have to remove the inlet manifold to get to this troublesome part.
With fiddly Allen key screws and limited access taking the inlet off wasn't particularly enjoyable, however once off the access to the fault was great!
The new genuine replacement ordered from Citroen using my chassis number however was all back to front!
After some digging and showing the parts guy the one that came off the matter was put through Citroen technical which found my part, oddly corresponding to a Xsara Picasso 16v rather than a Saxo. Every single picture online showed the green one as above, so why my vehicle has this one on is a mystery although its certainly the one it came out the factory with! If anyone else has a Saxo/106 16v would love to know which type it has on!
The correct replacement against the old one, which if you squint has a hairline crack all the way around it!
While off we took the opportunity to clean up the inlet manifold and air box.
All built up and topped up with fresh stuff once more, this time I'm confident the system is properly bled and should prove reliable! It's nice to finally have it mechanically sound with all fresh fluids etc!
With fresh enthusiasm Hannah bought a couple of nice touches to lift the Saxo!
Lovely window sticker to replace dowdy old one!
Much fresher!
There are still problems though! Handbrake low effort on N/S believe it to be slightly seized calliper. Slight play in NSR axle bearing. Scuffed mirrors (got a brand new set to go on) Engine light intermittent as it doesn't seem to like the SaxSport cat, clicky top mounts when turning side to side, many scuffs to body kit which look better after a polish but creep back over time!
Body shell wise I haven't really mentioned so far but fear not; I'm not naive! Despite it being a good shell I'm well aware that it isn't perfect!
The jacking points don't look brilliant..
The rear arch at one side is separating layers..
Lower cross member has surface rust..
Inner wings aren't looking too bad however I imagine something will be lurking if only minor!
Rear arch where fuel filler is, sometimes a bad spot!
Boot floor surface rust.
This post is probably the last I will do for a while as you are now up to date! I've been firing out updates to try and get to where we are today and due to the passage of time there are things I have forgotten or missed which over time I'll include or elaborate. I'll now be uploading more infrequent and this thread has turned into a current rather than perspective!
The little Saxo has purpose and has proved to be a decent car which was the original mission of purchase! It's changed hands and my girlfriend is extremely willing to get this car perfect; whatever it takes. Plans for this winter include taking it off road (Winter car post possibly on the way!) and replacing the rear axle with a refurbished part from IM axles, repiping the rear brakes, stripping and protecting the boot floor and refurbishing the OE alloys with new quality rubber to finish! Beyond plans include engine removal and further body shell tidying and protection! After getting this car to a reasonable standard, the real work now begins!
For now thats me!
Regards, Danny.
I really couldn't find any information regarding this rear coolant outlet other than a few pictures! I realised that I would have to remove the inlet manifold to get to this troublesome part.
With fiddly Allen key screws and limited access taking the inlet off wasn't particularly enjoyable, however once off the access to the fault was great!
The new genuine replacement ordered from Citroen using my chassis number however was all back to front!
After some digging and showing the parts guy the one that came off the matter was put through Citroen technical which found my part, oddly corresponding to a Xsara Picasso 16v rather than a Saxo. Every single picture online showed the green one as above, so why my vehicle has this one on is a mystery although its certainly the one it came out the factory with! If anyone else has a Saxo/106 16v would love to know which type it has on!
The correct replacement against the old one, which if you squint has a hairline crack all the way around it!
While off we took the opportunity to clean up the inlet manifold and air box.
All built up and topped up with fresh stuff once more, this time I'm confident the system is properly bled and should prove reliable! It's nice to finally have it mechanically sound with all fresh fluids etc!
With fresh enthusiasm Hannah bought a couple of nice touches to lift the Saxo!
Lovely window sticker to replace dowdy old one!
Much fresher!
There are still problems though! Handbrake low effort on N/S believe it to be slightly seized calliper. Slight play in NSR axle bearing. Scuffed mirrors (got a brand new set to go on) Engine light intermittent as it doesn't seem to like the SaxSport cat, clicky top mounts when turning side to side, many scuffs to body kit which look better after a polish but creep back over time!
Body shell wise I haven't really mentioned so far but fear not; I'm not naive! Despite it being a good shell I'm well aware that it isn't perfect!
The jacking points don't look brilliant..
The rear arch at one side is separating layers..
Lower cross member has surface rust..
Inner wings aren't looking too bad however I imagine something will be lurking if only minor!
Rear arch where fuel filler is, sometimes a bad spot!
Boot floor surface rust.
This post is probably the last I will do for a while as you are now up to date! I've been firing out updates to try and get to where we are today and due to the passage of time there are things I have forgotten or missed which over time I'll include or elaborate. I'll now be uploading more infrequent and this thread has turned into a current rather than perspective!
The little Saxo has purpose and has proved to be a decent car which was the original mission of purchase! It's changed hands and my girlfriend is extremely willing to get this car perfect; whatever it takes. Plans for this winter include taking it off road (Winter car post possibly on the way!) and replacing the rear axle with a refurbished part from IM axles, repiping the rear brakes, stripping and protecting the boot floor and refurbishing the OE alloys with new quality rubber to finish! Beyond plans include engine removal and further body shell tidying and protection! After getting this car to a reasonable standard, the real work now begins!
For now thats me!
Regards, Danny.
So I'll hit with one more update which may well be the last in a while!
Recently I've sold a vehicle, bought a winter car, been on a long deserved holiday and been very busy as per travelling the country with my job!
Saxo ownership has been fairly uneventful however which isn't bad news! Is it?
After an enjoyable summer and autumn, the time has come to off road the little Saxo for necessary repairs and preservation of the ageing body shell from the salty badness which we all hate! Now that I've sold a project, I have a spare lockup space where it can hide away which is all good!
So after a good clean of the body arches and underside, I removed all the tar it had gained from our hot summer (surpisingly visible on a black car) and hand polished the paint. I do want to attack it with a clay bar and machine polisher again but removing contamination and especially anything from the arches which would stay wet and or rot it; was my main goal.
I discovered a broken spring on the NS which was a surprise although lock to lock was a bit clicky I put that down to worn strut top bearings! This now presents us with a dillema however.. As described in an earlier post a refurbished axle from IM axles is on the cards due to slight play in the current one. This means new shocks new springs and new rear axle!
Is this a perfect time to lower the car? I was thinking 25mm/ 20mm front and rear respectively would be ideal to take away the slighty comical arch gap?
After the pre storage clean heres how things are..
Looks clean enough but what's lurking underneath!
Not bad on first inspection!
Over painted this when first bought as a preventative short term measure, doesn't seem to have worsened although I hate to think what I'll find when stripping!
The seams are bleeding out in places, again unsure what the stonechip could be hiding!
It was the rear arch at the drivers side which concerned me the most!
...
...
Certainly some work will be needed for this!
Plans then for the future then, straight away the rear axle is coming off, as are all the rear brake lines (the only two advisorys on MOT). Strip the boot floor and the rear arches and see whats left. Weld accordingly and protect. New shocks, new handbrake cables, new axle, discs and pads, new brake lines and flexis should see the back end right.. Thats before I've even touched the front! I can see this been off the road for longer than a winter..!
Your thoughts on the shell condition; wether we should go lower and the future plans would be much appreciated!
Regards, Danny.
Recently I've sold a vehicle, bought a winter car, been on a long deserved holiday and been very busy as per travelling the country with my job!
Saxo ownership has been fairly uneventful however which isn't bad news! Is it?
After an enjoyable summer and autumn, the time has come to off road the little Saxo for necessary repairs and preservation of the ageing body shell from the salty badness which we all hate! Now that I've sold a project, I have a spare lockup space where it can hide away which is all good!
So after a good clean of the body arches and underside, I removed all the tar it had gained from our hot summer (surpisingly visible on a black car) and hand polished the paint. I do want to attack it with a clay bar and machine polisher again but removing contamination and especially anything from the arches which would stay wet and or rot it; was my main goal.
I discovered a broken spring on the NS which was a surprise although lock to lock was a bit clicky I put that down to worn strut top bearings! This now presents us with a dillema however.. As described in an earlier post a refurbished axle from IM axles is on the cards due to slight play in the current one. This means new shocks new springs and new rear axle!
Is this a perfect time to lower the car? I was thinking 25mm/ 20mm front and rear respectively would be ideal to take away the slighty comical arch gap?
After the pre storage clean heres how things are..
Looks clean enough but what's lurking underneath!
Not bad on first inspection!
Over painted this when first bought as a preventative short term measure, doesn't seem to have worsened although I hate to think what I'll find when stripping!
The seams are bleeding out in places, again unsure what the stonechip could be hiding!
It was the rear arch at the drivers side which concerned me the most!
...
...
Certainly some work will be needed for this!
Plans then for the future then, straight away the rear axle is coming off, as are all the rear brake lines (the only two advisorys on MOT). Strip the boot floor and the rear arches and see whats left. Weld accordingly and protect. New shocks, new handbrake cables, new axle, discs and pads, new brake lines and flexis should see the back end right.. Thats before I've even touched the front! I can see this been off the road for longer than a winter..!
Your thoughts on the shell condition; wether we should go lower and the future plans would be much appreciated!
Regards, Danny.
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