Suzuki Alto Works 2016
Discussion
Hi everyone, I'm Martin!
So in July I gave up on my VW Up! order as (like many) I was getting frustrated, so went crazy and imported this using BHP Imports in Newcastle:
It's a Suzuki Alto Works. Permanent AWD - which I've already had out in the snow!
I was going to get one brand spankers, but in the UK this wasn't going to leave me any change out of £18k! So I bought a nearly new one.
I believe this to be the first one registered in the UK, I haven't found anyone else to make Alto Works friends with yet
- I think everyone is fixated on the S660!
IVA tested was a ballache for the speedo, had a specialist try to convert the speedometer into mph with no luck. So have a custom dial face made by Lockwood (remember them?) and they did a cracking job! The good news if you want to import one, is that the development has already been done!
Some more pics:
So all in I was nearly £15000. (the car I bought at Auction for only £7800!)
Cheers for looking
So in July I gave up on my VW Up! order as (like many) I was getting frustrated, so went crazy and imported this using BHP Imports in Newcastle:
It's a Suzuki Alto Works. Permanent AWD - which I've already had out in the snow!
I was going to get one brand spankers, but in the UK this wasn't going to leave me any change out of £18k! So I bought a nearly new one.
I believe this to be the first one registered in the UK, I haven't found anyone else to make Alto Works friends with yet
- I think everyone is fixated on the S660!IVA tested was a ballache for the speedo, had a specialist try to convert the speedometer into mph with no luck. So have a custom dial face made by Lockwood (remember them?) and they did a cracking job! The good news if you want to import one, is that the development has already been done!
Some more pics:
So all in I was nearly £15000. (the car I bought at Auction for only £7800!)
Cheers for looking
Thanks! I usually get very marmite comments about it haha, it's surprising how many people haven't even heard of these. They are literally everywhere in Japan.
It's a little bit shorter and narrower than a VW Up!/Toyota Aygo etc but with more passenger space - 3 of my mates all over 6 foot can get in no problem and still have leg room. Boot space is the only sacrifice.
Japanese Kei Car Spec, 658cc 64hp limited to 140km/h.
Being the 4WD it's heavier, so it's 720Kg.
Using a newer Suzuki engine (R06A) which is and UNDER square engine so not as revvy as kei cars of old, but combined with the turbo it's got loads of torque (100Nm) and it's really good on fuel. I'm currently at 19km/l <54mpg> with town driving.
As for tuning, I'm investigating with a local tuner. I know that ktag has been used in japan so the software should be available here. The limiter is a pain in the ass.
In the meantime I've got a tuningbox from tdituning in chelmsford - except in chelmsford they told me they didn't make it anymore so couldn't get me one in the UK, so I bought from their distributor in japan and had it posted to me in the UK - the Japanese distributor told me they buy the units from chelmsford... CONSPIRACY!
Supposedly about 80hp with the box but it's maybe more like 70/75hp.
I'll go over the spec:
Suzuki R06A 658cc turbo with top mount intercooler - oversquare cylinders with single VVT on the inlet.
5 speed manual with permanent AWD - viscous coupled.
Rear diff is a solid axle, attached by 2 independent trailling arms - looks very Jimny!
Kayaba (KYB) suspension - which is absolutely solid.
Enkei 15x4.5J alloys - they look black but they're kinda blueish, a bit like Carbonschwarz
Bridgestone RE050 in 165/55/15 size - damn awkward getting these in the UK.
TCS you can actually turn totally off - ESP is de-sensitised but it's still on. You can turn it off completely if you fit a switch with a piece of wire and a scotch lock, but you can still drift in the snow with it on.
Front disc brakes - pretty much identical to the old Ignis Sport
Rear drums - but it only weighs 720Kg so they're ideal.
Head lights are Auto Levelling Bi-Xenon
Auto Lights
Recaro SR7F Bucket seats in the front
Automatic climate control (AWD models have PTC to assist the heater and heated exterior rear view mirrors)
Electric folding mirrors
Electric windows in all doors, drivers door auto up/down.
Electric power steering - it's got a good feel at higher speeds.
Keyless entry
Push button start
The radio is useless in the UK, so I'll not go over that, There are controls on the steering wheel though!
Only speakers in the front 2 doors on the Works model. there is wiring for speakers in the rear doors though.
And the most important feature of all, a turbo symbol on the dash that glows more intensely red as boost increases
Drivers reverse light has been sacrificed and has a red 21w bulb in it for the rear fog!
It's a little bit shorter and narrower than a VW Up!/Toyota Aygo etc but with more passenger space - 3 of my mates all over 6 foot can get in no problem and still have leg room. Boot space is the only sacrifice.
Japanese Kei Car Spec, 658cc 64hp limited to 140km/h.
Being the 4WD it's heavier, so it's 720Kg.
Using a newer Suzuki engine (R06A) which is and UNDER square engine so not as revvy as kei cars of old, but combined with the turbo it's got loads of torque (100Nm) and it's really good on fuel. I'm currently at 19km/l <54mpg> with town driving.
As for tuning, I'm investigating with a local tuner. I know that ktag has been used in japan so the software should be available here. The limiter is a pain in the ass.
In the meantime I've got a tuningbox from tdituning in chelmsford - except in chelmsford they told me they didn't make it anymore so couldn't get me one in the UK, so I bought from their distributor in japan and had it posted to me in the UK - the Japanese distributor told me they buy the units from chelmsford... CONSPIRACY!
Supposedly about 80hp with the box but it's maybe more like 70/75hp.
I'll go over the spec:
Suzuki R06A 658cc turbo with top mount intercooler - oversquare cylinders with single VVT on the inlet.
5 speed manual with permanent AWD - viscous coupled.
Rear diff is a solid axle, attached by 2 independent trailling arms - looks very Jimny!
Kayaba (KYB) suspension - which is absolutely solid.
Enkei 15x4.5J alloys - they look black but they're kinda blueish, a bit like Carbonschwarz
Bridgestone RE050 in 165/55/15 size - damn awkward getting these in the UK.
TCS you can actually turn totally off - ESP is de-sensitised but it's still on. You can turn it off completely if you fit a switch with a piece of wire and a scotch lock, but you can still drift in the snow with it on.
Front disc brakes - pretty much identical to the old Ignis Sport
Rear drums - but it only weighs 720Kg so they're ideal.
Head lights are Auto Levelling Bi-Xenon
Auto Lights
Recaro SR7F Bucket seats in the front
Automatic climate control (AWD models have PTC to assist the heater and heated exterior rear view mirrors)
Electric folding mirrors
Electric windows in all doors, drivers door auto up/down.
Electric power steering - it's got a good feel at higher speeds.
Keyless entry
Push button start
The radio is useless in the UK, so I'll not go over that, There are controls on the steering wheel though!
Only speakers in the front 2 doors on the Works model. there is wiring for speakers in the rear doors though.
And the most important feature of all, a turbo symbol on the dash that glows more intensely red as boost increases
Drivers reverse light has been sacrificed and has a red 21w bulb in it for the rear fog!
The 2WD models are a deformable rear axle - like most cars these days.
I'm about as far from a jap fanboy as you can get, I've had Peugeot 106's for the last 9 years and I still own 2!
Anyways it's subjective, 15k isn't ridiculous at all for a personal import, I reckon Suzuki could afford to sell these in the UK at £14-15k NEW. which would put it right in line with the VW Up GTi. and the Alto is a better spec standard too. Climate control is a £256 extra on the Up, for example, and you have to destroy your phones processor if you want to use sat nav with VW Maps and More app.
Of course Suzuki won't limit the car to 64hp or 140kmh for a European market! Just 80hp would put the heaviest Alto at the same power to weight and it's better on fuel about town.
The reason my used one was so expensive, Customs took 10% then you pay VAT on the value of the car AND the customs charges. The importer took £1500 which is reasonable. The remaining £3k was shipping, bank fees, de-registration fees in Japan and registering in the UK with IVA test.
Brand new in Japan, this car is £10,750 (£11500 for 4WD), a base model Alto is £6k new. The cheapest Up is £9825 - arguably both just as s
t as each other in base specs!
The interior of the new ignis isn't what I look for in a car, I like the Alto for it's simplicity plus one of my neighbours has one lol
haha yes, the number plate, those who know know! 峠
ANYWAYS end of slight rant.
HKS make a range of bolt on exhaust, but I'll probably just make one because it'll be easier for me.
I'm about as far from a jap fanboy as you can get, I've had Peugeot 106's for the last 9 years and I still own 2!
Anyways it's subjective, 15k isn't ridiculous at all for a personal import, I reckon Suzuki could afford to sell these in the UK at £14-15k NEW. which would put it right in line with the VW Up GTi. and the Alto is a better spec standard too. Climate control is a £256 extra on the Up, for example, and you have to destroy your phones processor if you want to use sat nav with VW Maps and More app.
Of course Suzuki won't limit the car to 64hp or 140kmh for a European market! Just 80hp would put the heaviest Alto at the same power to weight and it's better on fuel about town.
The reason my used one was so expensive, Customs took 10% then you pay VAT on the value of the car AND the customs charges. The importer took £1500 which is reasonable. The remaining £3k was shipping, bank fees, de-registration fees in Japan and registering in the UK with IVA test.
Brand new in Japan, this car is £10,750 (£11500 for 4WD), a base model Alto is £6k new. The cheapest Up is £9825 - arguably both just as s
t as each other in base specs!The interior of the new ignis isn't what I look for in a car, I like the Alto for it's simplicity
plus one of my neighbours has one lolhaha yes, the number plate, those who know know! 峠
ANYWAYS end of slight rant.
HKS make a range of bolt on exhaust, but I'll probably just make one because it'll be easier for me.
dom9 said:
Talk 106s to me - I have my full XSi rebuild to finish!
How does this compare to say a 106 for fun etc?
I need to get that finished but things like this and the S660 keep tempting me... lucky we just bought a house, which wiped out the pennies!
In comparison, the 106 really feels its age. The Alto chassis is a LOT stiffer - a chassis design nearly 30 years newer as the 106 floorpan stems from the AX.How does this compare to say a 106 for fun etc?
I need to get that finished but things like this and the S660 keep tempting me... lucky we just bought a house, which wiped out the pennies!
Feels like a 106 with full roll cage and a B12 pro suspension kit
it's about as fast as a standard S1 Rallye and just as irritating to drive at 70mph having no 6th gear. (somewhere about 4500-5000rpm) but luckily I rarely do any dual carriageway driving.The steering is quick, brakes are light and sharp. Front brakes are the same as old Ignis Sport
I'll fiddle about with the ESP next year, you can't turn it off fully as standard. only the TCS can be turned off. But a switch to ground and pressing the brake pedal can turn the ESP fully off.
The S660 is a brilliant car, I'd have bought one as it's a similar price, but occasionally I need to move more than 1 passenger and luggage bigger than a tin of beans. No doubting that they handle better because of weight distribution and low CofG.
You might like some of Hot-Version videos on Youtube of the S660, Alto and Copen etc. Some of them are English subtitiled.
https://youtu.be/4io9_sAUdQ8?t=197
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJZLo74sctk
I'm enjoying it so far anyway that's for sure! it's brilliant on fuel too.
Suzuki have always sold "kei" cars here, all the Alto's are Kei. just the last chassis they sold in the uk was HA35 - this one is HA36. I guess they think it would kill Ignis sales? I've no idea.
I know what you mean though, you think there would be a market in the UK for similar sized cars. 660cc is maybe a bit extreme but 800-1000 turbo and the same size. it's definitely not short on passenger space anyway.
that bit made me laugh
I'm not sure what I'm going to do with the car in terms of modifications, I've still got my 1.3 106 Rallye to finish!
Suzuki have always sold "kei" cars here, all the Alto's are Kei. just the last chassis they sold in the uk was HA35 - this one is HA36. I guess they think it would kill Ignis sales? I've no idea.
I know what you mean though, you think there would be a market in the UK for similar sized cars. 660cc is maybe a bit extreme but 800-1000 turbo and the same size. it's definitely not short on passenger space anyway.
SloppyClock said:
I WANT I WANT I WANT I WANT I WANT
seriously SERIOUSLY cool car, very much jelous and will be watching this thread like the proverbial hawk
seriously SERIOUSLY cool car, very much jelous and will be watching this thread like the proverbial hawk
that bit made me laughI'm not sure what I'm going to do with the car in terms of modifications, I've still got my 1.3 106 Rallye to finish!
Only 30Kg difference in weight between FF and 4WD models so not really much to consider given the roads I drive on are mostly steep and need the traction over the winter months - although so far it has been unusually mild! Also you can't do donuts with the 2WD version... :P
Nearly all the roads I drive on are C and U/Z class so barely even get above 40mph. Typical Kei car at 70mph though, it's hard work trying to hold it at a steady speed. The aero drag knocks off speed quickly, the turbo and the almost linear throttle pedal means really tiny adjustments.
The double din radio is fantastic, you get a choice of radios and speaker upgrades from the factory - including Kenwood etc so all their stuff fits no problem - so I was without too much hassle fitting my new unit.
I can't think why Suzuki wouldn't offer it in the UK, maybe the cost of NCAP and WLTP etc? Or they think it'll impact on the sales of Ignis? Who knows
I made a few modifications today, so the tape on my foglight melted and it looks like a strawberry chocolate sweetie. Also found out it was only 16W, so I've got a 21W bulb fitted now. I've used red and orange tint film on the clear part of the lights - which won't melt. Obviously this doesn't look the best but in my defence I'm probably going to buy the LED tail lights soon which are far superior.
Also decided to take some stuff off in the engine bay, just to have a good look at it. I'm amazed how easy everything is to access. it's been well designed - unlike any Euro cars I've come across.
could probably squeeze a 1.2 three cylinder in there without too much hassle if it ever came to it!
Also you can't do donuts with the 2WD version... :PNearly all the roads I drive on are C and U/Z class so barely even get above 40mph. Typical Kei car at 70mph though, it's hard work trying to hold it at a steady speed. The aero drag knocks off speed quickly, the turbo and the almost linear throttle pedal means really tiny adjustments.
The double din radio is fantastic, you get a choice of radios and speaker upgrades from the factory - including Kenwood etc so all their stuff fits no problem - so I was without too much hassle fitting my new unit.
I can't think why Suzuki wouldn't offer it in the UK, maybe the cost of NCAP and WLTP etc? Or they think it'll impact on the sales of Ignis? Who knows
I made a few modifications today, so the tape on my foglight melted and it looks like a strawberry chocolate sweetie. Also found out it was only 16W, so I've got a 21W bulb fitted now. I've used red and orange tint film on the clear part of the lights - which won't melt. Obviously this doesn't look the best but in my defence I'm probably going to buy the LED tail lights soon which are far superior.
Also decided to take some stuff off in the engine bay, just to have a good look at it. I'm amazed how easy everything is to access. it's been well designed - unlike any Euro cars I've come across.
could probably squeeze a 1.2 three cylinder in there without too much hassle if it ever came to it!
Cambs_Stuart said:
Would a hayabusa engine fit?
Yes that could be made to fit, however I do daily the car and motorbike engines are usually quite inefficient However when you're chopping everyone, who cares about mpg?
RC1807 said:
Readers' car of the week on PH!
No idea how I didn't see that! I guess I'll be forced to modify it now
The real skodaman said:
mhr1294 said:
You'll find me in the Scrutineers hut!
Except SLS days because im entering my Supercharged 106 diesel. Got some R888 R for it
I do have an itch to take this on a wet track day though
Definately do that - I rallied a daihatsu cuore, with very similar spec many years ago. One event was on an airfield coated liberally with cow sExcept SLS days because im entering my Supercharged 106 diesel. Got some R888 R for it
I do have an itch to take this on a wet track day though
t and a morning of frost and good scottish drizzle - was up against grp a 4wd escorts, even a 6r4, and I was on road tyres. By lunchtime I was running 12th overall, the lightwieght, narrow track, limited power and 4wd was perfect for the conditions. Then the sun came out, the money and power cars got traction and I dropped to about 42nd.I'm not quite brave enough to race mine just yet. Maybe 5 years down the line or something. Short wheelbase and low weight makes it a blast on back roads even with the ESP interfering.
PaulJC84 said:
Spotted this pass by the cafe over the weekend and knew I recognised it. Good effort helping marshal in that weather! I found it bad enough helping my friends taking part in the Cooper S race.
Ahh yes that would have been me collecting my wheels for the Peugeot. Had some R888R fitted and didn't fancy carrying them to my car so I drove round!Luckily most of my day was spent inside the scrutineering shed! So at least I was out of the rain. Still bloody cold though, there's 2 roof mounted infrared heaters are they're absolutely crap.
Today I completed my first oil change on this car, finally translated the sticker under the bonnet.
Oil change every 5000km and a filter every 10,000km... 5W-30 for turbocharged engines, the non turbo R06A takes 0W-20!
2.4 litres on a change, so straight onto eurocarparts for 5L of their finest and an oil filter for a Suzuki Celery is the same size so bought one of those too.
Really struggled getting the old filter off, eventually drove a screwdriver through it, got it loosened but my screwdriver is bent!!! HAND TIGHT it says on it, someone clearly didn't notice must have been torqued to over 9000.
I think I know the answer to this already, but does anyone know why my engine needs oil changing so frequently?
Oil change every 5000km and a filter every 10,000km... 5W-30 for turbocharged engines, the non turbo R06A takes 0W-20!
2.4 litres on a change, so straight onto eurocarparts for 5L of their finest and an oil filter for a Suzuki Celery is the same size so bought one of those too.
Really struggled getting the old filter off, eventually drove a screwdriver through it, got it loosened but my screwdriver is bent!!! HAND TIGHT it says on it, someone clearly didn't notice
must have been torqued to over 9000.I think I know the answer to this already, but does anyone know why my engine needs oil changing so frequently?
Unfortunately no mapping today, just a power run to see what she's doing.
So yeah as expected, the boost is forced down (which lowers the torque) to keep it under 64hp, even although it made 68hp. What's a few hp on a dyno though? Not sure what caused the sudden dip between 5500 and 6000.
Major problem with the standard intercooler, inlet temps getting to 57 degrees c at some points! I have already got a new intercooler planned though which I will be fitting shortly.
If it can hold that torque (Which I know it can as I've seen it blogged on a few Japanese websites), it should be good for about 90-95hp. The injectors and fuel pump have the capacity which is a good start.
So plans are Exhaust, new intercooler and a live remap to get it just right. There's probably not much point trying to get this engine past 100hp, it'll be too difficult I think seeing as it's designed for economy and efficiency.
Had the car weighted too, 750Kg with a full tank
So yeah as expected, the boost is forced down (which lowers the torque) to keep it under 64hp, even although it made 68hp. What's a few hp on a dyno though? Not sure what caused the sudden dip between 5500 and 6000.
Major problem with the standard intercooler, inlet temps getting to 57 degrees c at some points! I have already got a new intercooler planned though which I will be fitting shortly.
If it can hold that torque (Which I know it can as I've seen it blogged on a few Japanese websites), it should be good for about 90-95hp. The injectors and fuel pump have the capacity which is a good start.
So plans are Exhaust, new intercooler and a live remap to get it just right. There's probably not much point trying to get this engine past 100hp, it'll be too difficult I think seeing as it's designed for economy and efficiency.
Had the car weighted too, 750Kg with a full tank
Edited by mhr1294 on Saturday 8th June 17:00
Edited by mhr1294 on Saturday 8th June 17:01
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