Honey, I shrunk the Defender...
Discussion
Having had my Defender 110 for just over a year, took it on one final journey up a misty M40 to Solihull to swap it over early this morning. Very sad to see it go.
Was back out of the plant before 9am in the new one. I’ve now got a 21MY Defender 90 D250 X-Dynamic HSE. We’ve just announced the 22MY programme which brings in the V8, but will be building and delivering 21MYs for some time to come, and customer deliveries of the 90 have only just begun (most people holding off for a 21 plate). The D250 is the new Ingenium straight six diesel unit.
I’ve got another Pangea Green one, but without the satin wrap this time, and coil springs rather than air. The X-Dynamic also gets gloss black lower body panels instead of the self coloured black trim on my other one. Also gets darker bumper / grille insert, 20” wheels (without off road tyres on mine) and the fixed rear towing eyes which look great, and as Top Gear Magazine proved, are capable of hanging three Defenders off!
I’ll try and take some more pictures tomorrow, so a very quick snap taken on the drive when I got home will have to do for now.
If anyone has any questions, or wants pictures of anything specific, please shout!
Was back out of the plant before 9am in the new one. I’ve now got a 21MY Defender 90 D250 X-Dynamic HSE. We’ve just announced the 22MY programme which brings in the V8, but will be building and delivering 21MYs for some time to come, and customer deliveries of the 90 have only just begun (most people holding off for a 21 plate). The D250 is the new Ingenium straight six diesel unit.
I’ve got another Pangea Green one, but without the satin wrap this time, and coil springs rather than air. The X-Dynamic also gets gloss black lower body panels instead of the self coloured black trim on my other one. Also gets darker bumper / grille insert, 20” wheels (without off road tyres on mine) and the fixed rear towing eyes which look great, and as Top Gear Magazine proved, are capable of hanging three Defenders off!
I’ll try and take some more pictures tomorrow, so a very quick snap taken on the drive when I got home will have to do for now.
If anyone has any questions, or wants pictures of anything specific, please shout!
Dedders said:
That looks really smart. Do you get a choice of spec and colour or is it just what you are given?
Does it drive very differently from the 110 (accepting the engines are different).
Not much of a choice for these early cars, but you can decline the opportunity if you want!Does it drive very differently from the 110 (accepting the engines are different).
It only had 29 miles on when I picked it up, and I’ve only done about 40 miles more, virtually all on motorway, so it’s a bit early to tell too much. Different wheelbase, suspension and tyres, so lots of change! Engine sounds significantly different - smoother and more refined, but not really ‘driven’ it yet.
Crazy4557 said:
I’ve got the 90 Hard top on order, not been able to test drive one yet and wondered what the ride quality is like on springs, any experience or just the air sprung versions? I’m thinking it may be quite choppy being a swb.
Good choice! I’ve not driven one either, but have had a good look round a couple. What options did you add? Hope you kept the steelies though 
Again, not really driven on anything other than motorways. The air suspension is going to be better I’m sure, but I’m interested to see how the coil spring version compares. Need to remember this one doesn’t have access mode to lower the car - it’s a long way down!
Crazy4557 said:
I've gone for the same wheels as yours but they are sooo expensive but look the nuts to me. Mine's a 22MY in Santorini black with black pack and mainly comfort spec like heated seats/leather wheel etc. Not interested in locking diffs as I can't see me going off road too much, it's a van to me so will work on the roads.
Interested about the long way down comment, maybe I need the steps added so I'll look at that.
Yes, the wheels look great, but would look even better with the off road tyres like my last one had.Interested about the long way down comment, maybe I need the steps added so I'll look at that.
I wouldn’t worry about steps; certainly not until you’ve lived with it for a while. I’m just used to the access mode. And I can no longer annoy my wife by picking her up with the car at off-road height
This one is an X-Dynamic, which is new at 21MY. Gets gloss black body lowers (instead of self coloured plastic), darker grey badges, grille bar and bumper parts. My car is actually the first one I’ve seen in the flesh and it loo,s much better than in the pictures I’ve seen.
X-Dynamic also adds the fixed recovery eyes at the back which I think look great and very Defender...
X-Dynamic also adds the fixed recovery eyes at the back which I think look great and very Defender...
Edited by 595Heaven on Tuesday 2nd March 20:01
Interior...
Front is identical to the 110, but very different to my last car which was base spec so has cloth seats and the walk through centre console. The tread plates are illuminated, and still have their protective plastic covering on which I must remove
Rear has loads of space - basically the same as the 110, and access seems pretty good through the big front doors. Seats tip forwards manually, and then can be motored back and forth.
Also has a big opening pano roof so the rear is a light and airy place to be.
Damn these rotated pictures!!!
Front is identical to the 110, but very different to my last car which was base spec so has cloth seats and the walk through centre console. The tread plates are illuminated, and still have their protective plastic covering on which I must remove
Rear has loads of space - basically the same as the 110, and access seems pretty good through the big front doors. Seats tip forwards manually, and then can be motored back and forth.
Also has a big opening pano roof so the rear is a light and airy place to be.
Damn these rotated pictures!!!
So... to the load space. Bear in mind the car is a lot shorter, but keeps the second row seat legroom unchanged. Clearly, something has to give, and the boot is where the cuts are...
The seat back is 40:20:40 split, so possible to load longer loads and maintain rear passenger seats.
The seat base does not flip forwards like on the 110 5 seat, so when you tip the seat backs forward, you don’t get a flat floor. The bag holds the detachable tow bar - there is no space under the boot floor. I’d have chosen a deployable one if I could have.
The seat back is 40:20:40 split, so possible to load longer loads and maintain rear passenger seats.
The seat base does not flip forwards like on the 110 5 seat, so when you tip the seat backs forward, you don’t get a flat floor. The bag holds the detachable tow bar - there is no space under the boot floor. I’d have chosen a deployable one if I could have.
Edited by 595Heaven on Tuesday 2nd March 20:02
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I haven’t bought it! There are cheaper cars out there, and there are more expensive cars. Whether it represents good value for you is ultimately your decision. I’ll price this up tomorrow.Off road? Pretty damned good! Not done anything remotely off road in this one, but the 110 was amazing.
Edited by 595Heaven on Tuesday 2nd March 22:11
Sorry I've not repsonded to any of the messages before now - busy time!
The seat can't fold flat, as the row 2 seat base doesn't flip forwards, so the seat backs sit on top of them.
Bear in mind that for many buyers, a Defender is not the main car, and I suspect for the 90, that %age is even higher. For those that need more loadspace, the 110 in 5- or 6-seat form has a totally flat load area, and then there is the Hard Top in both 90 and 110 bodystyles. There is no lack of choice for a Defender buyer!
Great car the Yeti, but I don't really see the likeness
Mrs HH has excellent taste
Build quality? My 110 was one of the very first cars, and I have to say it was very impressive. No squeaks, and one rattle for the first 100 miles or so in the door that disappeared of its own accord. The A-Pillar capping made some noise, but this was a two-minute job to fix on the drive, and was updated for later cars. And that was it. Had masses of SOTA (Software Over The Air) updates, mainly to test the SOTA backend infrastructure, but this all happened seamlessly. I've probably had 15-20 JLR products and just one has ever needed Roadside Assistance.
As for the 90, I've barely had a chance to drive it, but it was immaculate when I picked it up.
Rear lights are all-LED as well. The two smaller ones have a red outer ring which forms part of the tail light graphic, and the inners are the indicators. Main lamps also have outer rings that are the tail lights, and circular elements within for the brakes. Reverse light sits between the two, and fog / reflector in the bumper.
The passenger car range starts at £44,825 for the 300PS petrol 90.
Keep the questions coming. I'm sure you'll understand there may be some which I'll decline to answer, but if you want pictures or to understand specs, let me know!
cerb4.5lee said:
It is nice to see one of these in detail, thanks for the photos. 
No worries - glad you like them, and let me know if you want to see any other deatilsShelsleyf2 said:
Is that the chrome suspension rod, the cover leaves the strut exposed?. The gaiter should surely seal the rod from the elements?
Hmmm... Not sure. I'll try and take some more photos soontake-good-care-of-the-forest-dewey said:
The lack of flat load area when the seats are folded is such an own goal.
What the hell where LR thinking with that design decision.
Remember, this is a small, well short, car - a Qashqai is longer than a 90. The front structure and row 1 are basicaly the same as a 110, and the row 2 legroom is the same (i.e. very spacious), so the length has to be lost somehow, and it is the loadspace that takes the hit. What the hell where LR thinking with that design decision.
The seat can't fold flat, as the row 2 seat base doesn't flip forwards, so the seat backs sit on top of them.
Bear in mind that for many buyers, a Defender is not the main car, and I suspect for the 90, that %age is even higher. For those that need more loadspace, the 110 in 5- or 6-seat form has a totally flat load area, and then there is the Hard Top in both 90 and 110 bodystyles. There is no lack of choice for a Defender buyer!
Easternlight said:
Looks like my Yeti's big brother!
Hmmm..... Great car the Yeti, but I don't really see the likenesshad ham said:
I think this looks wonderful, and I'm assured (from your thread and other, more direct, feedback) that the drive is very good both on and off-road. Love the colour and the wheels, but not sure about the gloss black external trim, although that just might be how it looks in the photos. Pricey, but not outrageously so. Just a very attractive vehicle and it will (is) sell very, very, strongly.
Mrs HH was equally impressed when I showed her your previous, and now this, thread. She has as a result decided that something like this one needs to be her next car - she was actually on the configurator last night trying to decide spec. She used to run 'rugged' 4x4s before converting to sportier and smaller cars when the kids all started to drive/get their own cars, but she now has a desire/need (we are sticks-dwellers) to get back into a 4x4 again. Nothing on the market has remotely interested her of late until this came along. So thanks, this could cost me!
I'll end with a somewhat sensitive question - are you able to comment on the build quality? As a consultant in the Auto industry of some 25+ years, I'm cognisant of the less than perfect in-market quality performance of LR products, particularly as they have become increasingly complex in recent years - have Nitra and its' supply chain been able to address some of these shortcomings do you think? Will understand of course if you don't wish to comment.
Thanks for sharing, and enjoy!
My car was the first X-Dynamic I'd actually seen (still WFH), and the gloss black lowers and darker grey bumper inserts coupled with gloss paint (my 110 was satin) make it look very different in the flesh. Mrs HH was equally impressed when I showed her your previous, and now this, thread. She has as a result decided that something like this one needs to be her next car - she was actually on the configurator last night trying to decide spec. She used to run 'rugged' 4x4s before converting to sportier and smaller cars when the kids all started to drive/get their own cars, but she now has a desire/need (we are sticks-dwellers) to get back into a 4x4 again. Nothing on the market has remotely interested her of late until this came along. So thanks, this could cost me
! I'll end with a somewhat sensitive question - are you able to comment on the build quality? As a consultant in the Auto industry of some 25+ years, I'm cognisant of the less than perfect in-market quality performance of LR products, particularly as they have become increasingly complex in recent years - have Nitra and its' supply chain been able to address some of these shortcomings do you think? Will understand of course if you don't wish to comment.
Thanks for sharing, and enjoy!
Mrs HH has excellent taste
Build quality? My 110 was one of the very first cars, and I have to say it was very impressive. No squeaks, and one rattle for the first 100 miles or so in the door that disappeared of its own accord. The A-Pillar capping made some noise, but this was a two-minute job to fix on the drive, and was updated for later cars. And that was it. Had masses of SOTA (Software Over The Air) updates, mainly to test the SOTA backend infrastructure, but this all happened seamlessly. I've probably had 15-20 JLR products and just one has ever needed Roadside Assistance.
As for the 90, I've barely had a chance to drive it, but it was immaculate when I picked it up.
Nickbrapp said:
I really like the looks of these, but when you say upgraded lights please don’t tell me standard lowest trim models get non LED headlamps on a 50k+ car?!
Also what are the 2 smaller lights at the back they look a bit awkward
I was next to a 110 recently in traffic and it looked huge! As big as a Range Rover!
They do look cool though
The base lights are 'Premium LED' - they miss out on the 'signature DRL' which is effectively a lit half circle section of the light, but worked well. Mine are the mid-range lights - there is a matrix LED version above them as an option.Also what are the 2 smaller lights at the back they look a bit awkward
I was next to a 110 recently in traffic and it looked huge! As big as a Range Rover!
They do look cool though
Rear lights are all-LED as well. The two smaller ones have a red outer ring which forms part of the tail light graphic, and the inners are the indicators. Main lamps also have outer rings that are the tail lights, and circular elements within for the brakes. Reverse light sits between the two, and fog / reflector in the bumper.
2Btoo said:
A quick glance at the Land Rover website says that the new Defender is available "From £44200". I don't know what you get for that but assume it's something with a completely plastic interior and a basic, rough-as-you-like diesel engine.
For £44,200, you get a 90 Hard Top. Same interior as the passenger car at that trim level. The diesel is a 200PS straight-6 unit. Again, the same unit as in the passenger car. You also get a fixed bulkhead and a beautifully trimed loadspace. You are certainly not slumming it - I'd love one!The passenger car range starts at £44,825 for the 300PS petrol 90.
Keep the questions coming. I'm sure you'll understand there may be some which I'll decline to answer, but if you want pictures or to understand specs, let me know!
had ham said:
Many thanks for taking to the time to respond, and great to hear that it's all positive so far - here's hoping they've got it right! I look forward to future updates as and when they arrive, and watch with interest.
BTW - are there any discounts available via the Privilege (is it even still called that?) family and friends employee purchase scheme? If so, can I be your brother, briefly?
No problem!BTW - are there any discounts available via the Privilege (is it even still called that?) family and friends employee purchase scheme? If so, can I be your brother, briefly
?As to the discount... Cheers, bro
Mikebentley said:
I remember when the first Freelander was being developed. My brothers next door neighbour who worked at LR came home in a brand new Rav 4. We asked him why and he explained they had one to test and pull to pieces to help with the design process of the Freelander.
I suspect every OEM will have a competitor fleet, and many will also do teardowns, or buy into a tear down service. There are always things to learn...Tesla sold a lot of cars to other OEMs, and I remember seeing pictures of the Porsche R&D Zentrum with a couple of Jaguar I-PACE outside before Taycan came to market.
After 28 months I’ve finally said goodbye to the 90 and picked up its replacement…
Another Pangea Green 90 X-Dynamic HSE...
I didn’t choose the spec, and certainly would not have chosen the diamond turned wheels, nor the khaki interior, but I have to say both are really growing on me.
This is a 24MY so has improvements to the row 2 seat folding (now folds flat) as well as a manual tip and slide front passenger seat so ingress / egress for the rear is much much quicker.
Air suspension also help here as the car sits in access height which also helps loading Row 2
The bigger Pivi Pro screen is also much better than the original smalll one
Another Pangea Green 90 X-Dynamic HSE...
I didn’t choose the spec, and certainly would not have chosen the diamond turned wheels, nor the khaki interior, but I have to say both are really growing on me.
This is a 24MY so has improvements to the row 2 seat folding (now folds flat) as well as a manual tip and slide front passenger seat so ingress / egress for the rear is much much quicker.
Air suspension also help here as the car sits in access height which also helps loading Row 2
The bigger Pivi Pro screen is also much better than the original smalll one
Edited by 595Heaven on Saturday 12th August 08:00
Macron said:
28 months seems like a long time to have kept it, was that just how things have worked out for everyone with a JLR provided vehicle?
Was there any pressure to give it up during that time?
When we were owned by Ford, my wife would normally have one of their vehicles on the scheme. She’d get through three or four cars in a year. Was there any pressure to give it up during that time?
By the time I’d got back to my desk from swapping one, I’d have the email to order the next. Was actually quite annoying.
This was at the other end of the scale and by far the longest I’ve ever kept a car, but I wasn’t really too unhappy as I loved the 90. Priority was rightly given to supplying cars to customers.
I’ve not driven a 90 V8 but have spent a week or so in both a 110 and a 130 V8. The engine is just superb. Great noise, effortless waftiness and properly quick when you ask more of it. Wasn’t so keen on the range - I’ve got used to getting up to 600 miles from a tank of diesel but the V8 does a lot less…
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