Newbie GT4 Vs. 981 Spyder
Discussion
So a few on here may know that I recently picked up a GT4 and a couple of PH'er's asked if I'd I report back on how I found the GT4 in general and also vs. my 981 Spyder (that I've had for about 18 months and love to bits)
So first things first, it's early days; I've really only had a full afternoon on great A & B roads that I know well in the GT4, so my views will no doubt evolve
over time. But based on a tiny amount of seat time in the real world (rather than the track, which is where my previous experience with the GT4 has been - not that I'd ever call my track driving - well err ... track driving. It's very average to say the least. As such I'm not qualified to comment, so I'll keep my comments based around spirited road use.)
The first thing that I really notice is how nicely balanced the car is - it cossets you - you feel like you are at the centre of everything, very balanced & connected - it fits like a glove and the cabin is a lovely place to be (mine is alcantara / leather)
It's very easy to drive at speed and is confidence inspiring - a very flattering car. It's very pleasant to potter in too - you certainly don't have to be "on it" for it to feel alive and for it to feel like fun; I like that, I like that a lot as this is how, on public roads, it should really be driven. However ..... It; the GT4 likes to be "on it" - a lot ! It's a car that you'll get in and just drive for drivings sake - I popped out for 20 mins and came back over two hours later and felt compelled to write this rubbish - apologies for that.
So .............VS. the 981 Spyder:
To me they actually feel very different - the comparison is slightly unfair as my Spyder has steels and the GT4 has ceramics - I think a combination of the brakes (unsprung weight possibly?) and the GT3 front suspension means that the GT4 feels more agile and very, very planted.
The steering feel is different - not necessarily better, but the steering feels heavier to me - feels like you have to work harder - but not in a bad way - it's hard to explain as this sounds like it contradicts my unsprung weight PCCB agility comment - but I think both are true - yes - more planted , heavier steering but more agile, fluid, "darty" - not sure how to explain this - sorry ; Others who are better at this type of thing may be able to do explain this more clearly - that would be great - feel free to add to this.
People have criticised the engine in relation to the lump in a GT3 (old or 991) and I get this, but for road use it's quick enough. I also found the gearing fine - sorry.
One thing though : STOP PRESS : This is NOT a GT3 or an RS - these cars are in a different league, no question. However, they should be; they cost roughly twice as much - but for the money (when new and now the overs are becoming more reasonable), this is a great car and is excellent value and in reality on public roads may be "better". It's a sexy car but it doesn't have the presence of a GT3 or an RS, but actually, again in the real world, it just seems a bit more, well, "real"
The 918 buckets are very comfortable and I like the fact you can amend the height - they are very easy to live with once you work out how to get in and out of them. I would never spec anything else & I suffer from a bad back; they are more comfortable and supportive than 18 ways IMHO.
The clutch in the GT4 feels lighter than on the Spyder - it's not - it's just the adjustable seating height altering the angle that is helping this. The clutch doesn't feel at all tiring - just firm and measured - very nice, as is the short throw of the gear level - this is the same in the Spyder.
Do I think it's a better car than the Spyder; definitely not. I think they are different ; The GT4 is a more serious thing. It's more planted, more confidence inspiring. The Spyder is all about fun; it moves around more, it sounds so much better & guess what; you can also take the roof off - what's not to like? In the real world it's just as quick, oh and did I mention it sounds amazing ! If you could only have one (and you were buying for road use) I think the versatility of the Spyder means it would win this one. But who knows, give me a few more weeks in the GT4 and I may change my mind.......
I am however plesently surprised how much I like the GT4 and I think as time goes on I'll grow to love it even more. I plan to use it as my DD, so this will be interesting.
Oh yes - I know it's not everyones cup of tea - but I absolutely love the colour - it feels really, really special inside and out.
I only have one or two gripes and it's a big one for me and that's the sound you get from the engine - not when you are on it and it's howling and barking at you no that's lovely. But, in the background, I can't stop hearing a whirring type of noise; it almost sounds like when you haven't shut a car window properly and you get that white noise, the one that you can't quite place and you aren't even sure that it's there and then you shut the windows and it goes and you think .....ahhhhh ..... it's a bit like this. It's been in all the GT4's I've driven & unfortunately, I think it's going to really annoy me; which is a shame as everything else is just so right. Does this resonate with any of you guys - does anyone technical know whats causing it ?
Oh and there is one other tiny gripe - the auto blip in sports mode - in the Spyder you have : Sport (no auto blip) and Sports + (with auto blip - but same set up as Sport) I find it really odd that the GT4 didn't follow this set up as others will want to H&T in full fat mode (I would too, but I'm just not very good at it)
So in conclusion : Porsche are really rather good at making cars - hats off to them
So first things first, it's early days; I've really only had a full afternoon on great A & B roads that I know well in the GT4, so my views will no doubt evolve
over time. But based on a tiny amount of seat time in the real world (rather than the track, which is where my previous experience with the GT4 has been - not that I'd ever call my track driving - well err ... track driving. It's very average to say the least. As such I'm not qualified to comment, so I'll keep my comments based around spirited road use.)
The first thing that I really notice is how nicely balanced the car is - it cossets you - you feel like you are at the centre of everything, very balanced & connected - it fits like a glove and the cabin is a lovely place to be (mine is alcantara / leather)
It's very easy to drive at speed and is confidence inspiring - a very flattering car. It's very pleasant to potter in too - you certainly don't have to be "on it" for it to feel alive and for it to feel like fun; I like that, I like that a lot as this is how, on public roads, it should really be driven. However ..... It; the GT4 likes to be "on it" - a lot ! It's a car that you'll get in and just drive for drivings sake - I popped out for 20 mins and came back over two hours later and felt compelled to write this rubbish - apologies for that.
So .............VS. the 981 Spyder:
To me they actually feel very different - the comparison is slightly unfair as my Spyder has steels and the GT4 has ceramics - I think a combination of the brakes (unsprung weight possibly?) and the GT3 front suspension means that the GT4 feels more agile and very, very planted.
The steering feel is different - not necessarily better, but the steering feels heavier to me - feels like you have to work harder - but not in a bad way - it's hard to explain as this sounds like it contradicts my unsprung weight PCCB agility comment - but I think both are true - yes - more planted , heavier steering but more agile, fluid, "darty" - not sure how to explain this - sorry ; Others who are better at this type of thing may be able to do explain this more clearly - that would be great - feel free to add to this.
People have criticised the engine in relation to the lump in a GT3 (old or 991) and I get this, but for road use it's quick enough. I also found the gearing fine - sorry.
One thing though : STOP PRESS : This is NOT a GT3 or an RS - these cars are in a different league, no question. However, they should be; they cost roughly twice as much - but for the money (when new and now the overs are becoming more reasonable), this is a great car and is excellent value and in reality on public roads may be "better". It's a sexy car but it doesn't have the presence of a GT3 or an RS, but actually, again in the real world, it just seems a bit more, well, "real"
The 918 buckets are very comfortable and I like the fact you can amend the height - they are very easy to live with once you work out how to get in and out of them. I would never spec anything else & I suffer from a bad back; they are more comfortable and supportive than 18 ways IMHO.
The clutch in the GT4 feels lighter than on the Spyder - it's not - it's just the adjustable seating height altering the angle that is helping this. The clutch doesn't feel at all tiring - just firm and measured - very nice, as is the short throw of the gear level - this is the same in the Spyder.
Do I think it's a better car than the Spyder; definitely not. I think they are different ; The GT4 is a more serious thing. It's more planted, more confidence inspiring. The Spyder is all about fun; it moves around more, it sounds so much better & guess what; you can also take the roof off - what's not to like? In the real world it's just as quick, oh and did I mention it sounds amazing ! If you could only have one (and you were buying for road use) I think the versatility of the Spyder means it would win this one. But who knows, give me a few more weeks in the GT4 and I may change my mind.......
I am however plesently surprised how much I like the GT4 and I think as time goes on I'll grow to love it even more. I plan to use it as my DD, so this will be interesting.
Oh yes - I know it's not everyones cup of tea - but I absolutely love the colour - it feels really, really special inside and out.
I only have one or two gripes and it's a big one for me and that's the sound you get from the engine - not when you are on it and it's howling and barking at you no that's lovely. But, in the background, I can't stop hearing a whirring type of noise; it almost sounds like when you haven't shut a car window properly and you get that white noise, the one that you can't quite place and you aren't even sure that it's there and then you shut the windows and it goes and you think .....ahhhhh ..... it's a bit like this. It's been in all the GT4's I've driven & unfortunately, I think it's going to really annoy me; which is a shame as everything else is just so right. Does this resonate with any of you guys - does anyone technical know whats causing it ?
Oh and there is one other tiny gripe - the auto blip in sports mode - in the Spyder you have : Sport (no auto blip) and Sports + (with auto blip - but same set up as Sport) I find it really odd that the GT4 didn't follow this set up as others will want to H&T in full fat mode (I would too, but I'm just not very good at it)
So in conclusion : Porsche are really rather good at making cars - hats off to them
Edited by RSVP911 on Tuesday 12th December 22:48
GT3cs said:
Nice write up . I've also had both in the past . Got to agree if i had to buy another I'd probably go Spyder, although very little in it . Maybe rose tinted glasses from an epic NC500 trip that I think the GT4 would have struggled with some of the roads , and wouldn't match the great roof off runs with fantastic noise in stunning Scottish scenery .
Actually in a 987 Spyder now offering nearly the same experience for half the price . Going to be a struggle to sell for incoming 991.2 GT3 .
Thanks both - don't think I'll give up my day job ! Actually in a 987 Spyder now offering nearly the same experience for half the price . Going to be a struggle to sell for incoming 991.2 GT3 .
Scottish trip sounds epic
Re the 987 Spyder - if you can hold onto it it I think prices are going nowhere (but upwards) but if not , they will keep coming up for sale - jump back into one later .
How would you compare the 981 to the 987 ?
Twinfan said:
Nice write up!
I agree with you about the engine noise in the cabin - the GT4 I drove at PEC was the same. I think it's just mechanical "stuff" which is more apparent due to the lesser sound deadening. Not sure there's much you can do about it, it's just part of the character of the car.
Re. the auto blip I think that's all the 'Sport' button does unlike on the non-GT cars. The mapping etc is the same I think, although it may affect cooling? There have been some comments on this so it may be worth a Google and checking here on PH and on Rennlist.
One more thought on the engine - very similar to the Spyders : location , sound deadening and technically - but the Spyder doesn't have the "bad" noise characteristic - it's very odd I'd love to know what's causing it ?? I agree with you about the engine noise in the cabin - the GT4 I drove at PEC was the same. I think it's just mechanical "stuff" which is more apparent due to the lesser sound deadening. Not sure there's much you can do about it, it's just part of the character of the car.
Re. the auto blip I think that's all the 'Sport' button does unlike on the non-GT cars. The mapping etc is the same I think, although it may affect cooling? There have been some comments on this so it may be worth a Google and checking here on PH and on Rennlist.
Taffy66 said:
As you well know i owned a GT4 for 18 mths and i loved it to bits...In comparison to any GT3 what it offers ime is the advantage of a mid-engine coupled with approx 100kg less to lug around which translates to an out of the box innate rightness which no 991 can hope to replicate unless its fitted with RAS.
Bear in mind that you have a sublime optioned version where you were very fortunate to acquire without having to pay a premium over list which is your good fortune and good luck to you.
Regarding noise i drove mine with the windows down most of the time tbo as i felt too distanced from the visceral sensations with them up however i still do that with my new GTS so maybe its just my personal preference and not a reflection on the car itself. Its a surefire future classic for sure and comfort yourself in the knowledge that you have bought a beauty at no silly premium...
Thanks Taffy - I went for an early morning blast with the windows down and the SE on - yep that helps and in truth,I think I will get used to the engine whirr. Bear in mind that you have a sublime optioned version where you were very fortunate to acquire without having to pay a premium over list which is your good fortune and good luck to you.
Regarding noise i drove mine with the windows down most of the time tbo as i felt too distanced from the visceral sensations with them up however i still do that with my new GTS so maybe its just my personal preference and not a reflection on the car itself. Its a surefire future classic for sure and comfort yourself in the knowledge that you have bought a beauty at no silly premium...
Edited by Taffy66 on Sunday 13th August 00:14
I think I was very lucky with the deal but it wasn't quite as good as you describe - but a bargain never the less - either way lets try to break with the norm and endeavour to create a PH first, by keeping this thread a VFZ (values free zone)
Keep well
T25UFO said:
Good write up and I agree with everything you say. I also have a real issue with the 'wind whistle' noise. Sometimes it sounds like a turbo spooling up! I guess there is nothing you can do to eliminate this?
That is a much better description - completely agree that is exactly what it sounds like - I'm going to try to embrace it - It's a tough one though as the Spyder really does sound perfect. Further thoughts on the car - yep it's a very good car - I'm bonding. I can't stop looking at it - I think I may have done it a mis service in my earlier post. It's a very pretty thing - looks tiny compared to it's siblings (I know in reality it isn't) The roofline looks so much lower than the GT3 - it's not - maybe it's the shorter length. Either way, it looks like a toy to me, but in a good way ; I just want to pick it up and put it in my pocket !
After another blast : The PCCB's really are excellent and I'm sure are a significant contribution to the felling of agility - I wish I'd put them on there Spyder now - never mind
After another blast : The PCCB's really are excellent and I'm sure are a significant contribution to the felling of agility - I wish I'd put them on there Spyder now - never mind
daro911 said:
Excellent review and definitely not the usual GT4 trashes the Spyder some folk like to report 
Unlike most I have "only" driven convertibles since passing my test many decades ago now so a tin top no matter how much better will never work for me but great to read the plus & minus of both 3.8L mid engine future classics from someone who has owned both
Enjoy your stunning looking GT4 and I'm now off out to enjoy my topless version
Ah, my favourite Voodoo blue Spyder ! No I have concluded that they are both excellent cars - very lucky to be able to have both for what I hope will be a considerable amount of time. I guess the true test will be if one has to go, which one will it be : watch this space ................Unlike most I have "only" driven convertibles since passing my test many decades ago now so a tin top no matter how much better will never work for me but great to read the plus & minus of both 3.8L mid engine future classics from someone who has owned both
Enjoy your stunning looking GT4 and I'm now off out to enjoy my topless version
Porsche911R said:
I bought the GT4 because it has adjustable sus and is newer than a 997 GT3.
I think the GT4 holds its own vs a older GT3 no issue, so it's every bit GT car imo.
Sound, don't try a new GT3 you will hate the in cabin sound on that then.
Exhaust sound imo is more honest on the GT4 vs the Spyder forced sound, but many people love this new forced sound all cars now have it seems , so personal, I think the GT4 is one of the best sounding cars on the road ATM. Some love the cgts sound more but I hate this sort of noise.
The 981 Spyder is a great car and cannot be put up vs a GT4 imo they are too different and I would never see myself buying a 981 Spyder unless it was a project car and I put £20k into it, as oem it don't drive how I would want.
I think the 987.2 Spyder has both cars licked for feel and fun at slower speeds, but that's common sense, it is more pure a car so will be more fun slower and has feel the other two can only dream off.
The GT4 need tweaking, it's an ok car upto 80% , I noticed that at pec 2 years ago, but many owners will only drive oem cars at 80% so they don't get to see the downsides much hence e fav forum reviews.
This is where the GT4 kills the 981 Spyder, you have fully adjustable sus to dial in the car above 80% this would cost £10k plus to do in the Spyder and make it hard to sell.
Yes you might have to buy rear toe links at £300 to do it but that's not a big spend.
I think the 981 would suit more people than the GT4 , but if you want to push on the GT4 wins by a county mile over the 981 Spyder. The brakes are massive, and you can dial in a focused geo and make the car GT3 like but better as its mid engine like the RSR :-) also he tech is night and day better on the GT4 for NOT cutting in, PTV on the 981 Spyder is a pitter and PSM off is NOT off, the GT4 tc and eps are amazing the Spiders very lacking and a real down side, it feels standard boxster to me.
Again sport only is auto blip, so if you want to heal and toe don't press it, the car will open the extra rad in none sport mode if it gets hot.
I have a choice of cars and could buy anything within reason, the GT4 goes very well with a 987.2 Spyder in my fleet, but I can see if you wanted a bit of both why a 981 Spyder would suit a bigger % of buyers for that one special car, if you have a load of cars it don't really fit in that well.
If you drove my GT4 and my Spyder back to back with your cars > 80% it would make sense.
If I were super rich I would add a 981 Spyder to own all four, but I could not swap out what I own for one, unless I downsized the fleet and just kept the 981 and modded it lots.
All great cars all have issues, and all owners like what they like, no bad cars.
Some interesting stuff above - thanks for the post. Taking a few points in turn; firstly your point on sound : I think the GT4 holds its own vs a older GT3 no issue, so it's every bit GT car imo.
Sound, don't try a new GT3 you will hate the in cabin sound on that then.
Exhaust sound imo is more honest on the GT4 vs the Spyder forced sound, but many people love this new forced sound all cars now have it seems , so personal, I think the GT4 is one of the best sounding cars on the road ATM. Some love the cgts sound more but I hate this sort of noise.
The 981 Spyder is a great car and cannot be put up vs a GT4 imo they are too different and I would never see myself buying a 981 Spyder unless it was a project car and I put £20k into it, as oem it don't drive how I would want.
I think the 987.2 Spyder has both cars licked for feel and fun at slower speeds, but that's common sense, it is more pure a car so will be more fun slower and has feel the other two can only dream off.
The GT4 need tweaking, it's an ok car upto 80% , I noticed that at pec 2 years ago, but many owners will only drive oem cars at 80% so they don't get to see the downsides much hence e fav forum reviews.
This is where the GT4 kills the 981 Spyder, you have fully adjustable sus to dial in the car above 80% this would cost £10k plus to do in the Spyder and make it hard to sell.
Yes you might have to buy rear toe links at £300 to do it but that's not a big spend.
I think the 981 would suit more people than the GT4 , but if you want to push on the GT4 wins by a county mile over the 981 Spyder. The brakes are massive, and you can dial in a focused geo and make the car GT3 like but better as its mid engine like the RSR :-) also he tech is night and day better on the GT4 for NOT cutting in, PTV on the 981 Spyder is a pitter and PSM off is NOT off, the GT4 tc and eps are amazing the Spiders very lacking and a real down side, it feels standard boxster to me.
Again sport only is auto blip, so if you want to heal and toe don't press it, the car will open the extra rad in none sport mode if it gets hot.
I have a choice of cars and could buy anything within reason, the GT4 goes very well with a 987.2 Spyder in my fleet, but I can see if you wanted a bit of both why a 981 Spyder would suit a bigger % of buyers for that one special car, if you have a load of cars it don't really fit in that well.
If you drove my GT4 and my Spyder back to back with your cars > 80% it would make sense.
If I were super rich I would add a 981 Spyder to own all four, but I could not swap out what I own for one, unless I downsized the fleet and just kept the 981 and modded it lots.
All great cars all have issues, and all owners like what they like, no bad cars.
"Sound, don't try a new GT3 you will hate the in cabin sound on that then."
Not sure I'd agree with this but I haven't driven a 991.2 GT3 yet (not sure you have either ?) But other points of reference : I found the sound in my 991.1 GT3 too quite and added a SWBP - this fixed it. My 991.1RS sounds great and didn't need modding. I like to hear the roar of an engine - the GT4 has two sounds - the engine roar - I love that then the mechanical spooling sound - I don't like that - but as mentioned previously - I'll get used to its.
Re the 981 Spyder - I never drive with the SE on as I agree it can sound synthetic at times - truth is without the SE the sound is fantastic - best sounding car I ever had except for my 997.2RS - this has a sound all of its own - it's the sweetest sounding thing - you get a sort of ram air induction noise at high revs - it's genuinely spine tingling - I love that engine - in fact I love the whole car.)
"The 981 Spyder is a great car and cannot be put up vs a GT4 imo they are too different" :
Firstly, please can you clarify - have you actually driven a 981 Spyder - I only ask as when discussing on previous threads you were asked this a few times but never gave a definitive answer ?
On a track maybe - but I have to say the 981 Spyder did me proud at Bedford recently - I was very impressed (got black flagged for noise a lot though - naughty car!) But as mentioned in the post, I will use both as road cars and as such my comments were based on this alone - you may well be right about the merits on track with alterations broadening the gap - but that's not what I was comparing - I think there's some value comparing the two out of the box on public roads. Truth is the limiting factor in both cars by some margin is not their set up. but me - by a country mile - when I stop being the weakest link I'll think about modding.This is why your points on the electronics is a mute point for me - I like the aids - they make me feel like I'm an ok driver and help to keep me in one piece if I make a mistake - again one day I'll have enough time to hone my art and spend lots of time on the track until then they are a positive. I think we are at different stages in our journey - I agree with a lot of what you say but it's not where I'm at at the moment.
Thanks for clearing up the auto blip thing and info re the centre rad - very helpful.
"if you have a load of cars it don't really fit in that well."
Urm.. fits in very nicely and I have a few - Air-cooled to Modern.
Keep well
Edited by RSVP911 on Sunday 13th August 13:16
GT4P said:
Thanks RSVP for a good honest write up not the usual comparison trash like another post! Personally with the gt4 and 981 spyder it all comes down to choice of a soft or tin top (same same but different)i was offered both but wanted a coupe! I agree with some of what MrD is saying with regards to the 987 Spyder though which would be my choice if I wanted a convertible but that is not to knock the 981 version although the 987 roof is way better especially with the "sunshade"
Plus as for the PEC yellow car it's a preproduction model so not as refined as factory built cars hence its roughness that's why for my PEC day I made sure I chose the black car.
Anyway enjoy your car
Cheers Plus as for the PEC yellow car it's a preproduction model so not as refined as factory built cars hence its roughness that's why for my PEC day I made sure I chose the black car.
Anyway enjoy your car
Re the 981 roof - I love the roof - I've become a roof removal and raising Ninja warrior - I currently hold the official world speed record (lots of practice) - up and down in a matter of a few (ish) seconds .
Never tried the 987 roof , but I saw a video of it once - it lasted for about three hours and involved 20 men, 2 cranes, a trebuchet and a dog - they managed it in the end.
I hereby challenge you to a roof duel .
If however you were simply commenting on styling and the ability to fit without the sunshade then I shall calm down and slowly walk away ........
Porsche911R said:
RSVP911 said:
Some interesting stuff above - thanks for the post. Taking a few points in turn; firstly your point on sound :
"Sound, don't try a new GT3 you will hate the in cabin sound on that then."
Not sure I'd agree with this but I haven't driven a 991.2 GT3 yet (not sure you have either ?) But other points of reference : I found the sound in my 991.1 GT3 too quite and added a SWBP - this fixed it. My 991.1RS sounds great and didn't need modding. I like to hear the roar of an engine - the GT4 has two sounds - the engine roar - I love that then the mechanical spooling sound - I don't like that - but as mentioned previously - I'll get used to its.
Re the 981 Spyder - I never drive with the SE on as I agree it can sound synthetic at times - truth is without the SE the sound is fantastic - best sounding car I ever had except for my 997.2RS - this has a sound all of its own - it's the sweetest sounding thing - you get a sort of ram air induction noise at high revs - it's genuinely spine tingling - I love that engine - in fact I love the whole car.)
"The 981 Spyder is a great car and cannot be put up vs a GT4 imo they are too different" :
Firstly, please can you clarify - have you actually driven a 981 Spyder - I only ask as when discussing on previous threads you were asked this a few times but never gave a definitive answer ?
On a track maybe - but I have to say the 981 Spyder did me proud at Bedford recently - I was very impressed (got black flagged for noise a lot though - naughty car!) But as mentioned in the post, I will use both as road cars and as such my comments were based on this alone - you may well be right about the merits on track with alterations broadening the gap - but that's not what I was comparing - I think there's some value comparing the two out of the box on public roads. Truth is the limiting factor in both cars by some margin is not their set up. but me - by a country mile - when I stop being the weakest link I'll think about modding.This is why your points on the electronics is a mute point for me - I like the aids - they make me feel like I'm an ok driver and help to keep me in one piece if I make a mistake - again one day I'll have enough time to hone my art and spend lots of time on the track until then they are a positive. I think we are at different stages in our journey - I agree with a lot of what you say but it's not where I'm at at the moment.
Thanks for clearing up the auto blip thing and info re the centre rad - very helpful.
"if you have a load of cars it don't really fit in that well."
Urm.. fits in very nicely and I have a few - Air-cooled to Modern.
Keep well
mechanical spooling sound was what I was thinking about regarding the new 991.2 GT3 cabin as that seems to be even more than the GT4 noises."Sound, don't try a new GT3 you will hate the in cabin sound on that then."
Not sure I'd agree with this but I haven't driven a 991.2 GT3 yet (not sure you have either ?) But other points of reference : I found the sound in my 991.1 GT3 too quite and added a SWBP - this fixed it. My 991.1RS sounds great and didn't need modding. I like to hear the roar of an engine - the GT4 has two sounds - the engine roar - I love that then the mechanical spooling sound - I don't like that - but as mentioned previously - I'll get used to its.
Re the 981 Spyder - I never drive with the SE on as I agree it can sound synthetic at times - truth is without the SE the sound is fantastic - best sounding car I ever had except for my 997.2RS - this has a sound all of its own - it's the sweetest sounding thing - you get a sort of ram air induction noise at high revs - it's genuinely spine tingling - I love that engine - in fact I love the whole car.)
"The 981 Spyder is a great car and cannot be put up vs a GT4 imo they are too different" :
Firstly, please can you clarify - have you actually driven a 981 Spyder - I only ask as when discussing on previous threads you were asked this a few times but never gave a definitive answer ?
On a track maybe - but I have to say the 981 Spyder did me proud at Bedford recently - I was very impressed (got black flagged for noise a lot though - naughty car!) But as mentioned in the post, I will use both as road cars and as such my comments were based on this alone - you may well be right about the merits on track with alterations broadening the gap - but that's not what I was comparing - I think there's some value comparing the two out of the box on public roads. Truth is the limiting factor in both cars by some margin is not their set up. but me - by a country mile - when I stop being the weakest link I'll think about modding.This is why your points on the electronics is a mute point for me - I like the aids - they make me feel like I'm an ok driver and help to keep me in one piece if I make a mistake - again one day I'll have enough time to hone my art and spend lots of time on the track until then they are a positive. I think we are at different stages in our journey - I agree with a lot of what you say but it's not where I'm at at the moment.
Thanks for clearing up the auto blip thing and info re the centre rad - very helpful.
"if you have a load of cars it don't really fit in that well."
Urm.. fits in very nicely and I have a few - Air-cooled to Modern.
Keep well
I have put back my PEC GT3 day and waiting for a manual GT3 to drive, so yes not driven the brand new manual GT3 yet, but reviews state more mechanical cabin noises.
I have driven the 981 Spyder and been in one on track, for me it's frustrating, but many cars I have had are frustrating esp nanny modes or modes to make a driver be able to go faster than they could other wise.., it's cheating :-) and PTV is cheating imo and the 981 leans on that ten fold, makes slow drivers faster . I am not the fastest driver, but I feeI I can pedal a car ok on track to a good level and have a bit of skill tucked away there some where.
Now any one who can drive ok can do an ok lap time in a modern car I feel.
It's a shame the Spyder missed out on the GT4 TC/EPS system. but then imo the 981 Spyder is not a track car and no one should be buying it as one I guess for serious track use, ok for a play now and again but too limiting for me to enjoy..
As I stated it fits in between the GT4 and my 987.2 Spyder so for me no point in owning one, I feel my 987.2 is more fun on the road at slower speeds and the GT4 is night and day better on track when you start to pedal on above 80% and want to dial in some real camber.
But if you wanted that 1 car which the other half could drive and euro tour etc then I can see why the 981 Spyder would win over many people.
I also cannot think the PCCB will offer any unsprung mass advantage you would notice, they are 420mm with massive calipers and big tyres, over the Spyder 330mm, 4 pots and small tyres, I would say the size of the PCCB even out the weight on the Spyder small parts. I think Porsche just made the EPS a load better on the GT4, it's def the best Porsche EPS car I have driven to date, and I can only hope the 991.2 GT3 has moved that on again and having the updated GT3 front end with helper springs etc it's act a nicer drive on the road than a Spyder imo, the GT4 should NOT ride that good, but it does, it's some form of magic.
As I said no bad cars, every one likes what they like, The 981 Spyder does not excite on a personal level (that does not make it a bad car, it's just not a car for me) , it's not outstanding enough at one single thing . but can see why people would love it and rather have it over either a GT4 or a 987.2 Spyder, it's a more rounded car for all purpose use.
Good luck with you GT3 allocation
Fokker said:
Cheers RSVP, I've always wondered how they'd compare on the road. I drove a spyder back to back with a GT4 at the PEC and the spyder I guess l felt more of a road car. More like a CGTS I suppose in terms of ride but with more shove.
The ride was smoother, slightly less dialled in for track work but a beautiful thing. I'd have mine in GT silver too!
The ride was smoother, slightly less dialled in for track work but a beautiful thing. I'd have mine in GT silver too!
av185 said:
Sorry R, just found this thread!
Firstly, some are dismissing the 981 Spyder as not being as good as a GT4 because it is not a track car. This clearly misses the point as the 981 Spyder is not and was never intended to be a track car! In some ways, the deficiencies (if we can call them such), of the GT4 for its intended purposes are greater. The main one being the lack of the GT engine which could be seen as a distinct disadvantage on track.
So lets talk about the cars from a spirited road driving perspective. And leave the GT3 as the proper track car. (Although I rate it as a proper road car too btw).
In reality, even for fast road use, there is little it in between the GT4 and 981 Spyder. One could argue it is virtually impossible to get anywhere near the limits offered by the GT4s GT3 front suspension and brakes on a public road. Yes, the cup tyres offer some further advantage, especially over the controversial Pirelli tyres of the Spyder, but in a road going situation this is minimal under most circumstances for us lesser driving gods.
Usability.? Spyder greater ground clearance than GT4. Better for most road trips I find.
Sound? I would agree that the Spyder sounds better with pse off. On it is a touch synthetic but off it does sound better than the GT4.
Enjoyment and sense of occasion? Probably both in equal measures. But possibly the Spyder wins with the roof down.
Rarity and 'good attention'? Spyder wins hands down.
Which one to keep? Spyder definitely. And at the risk of mentioning prices, Spyders are now above GT4s as expected.
Both great cars, and agree they are totally different, as Porsche clearly intended. And to compare both cars for the same use would be like comparing the 991 GT3 with 911 R. Different cars, different ethos entirely.
Finally, you mention the 'hetrodyning' noises from the GT4 engine and transmission. This is most notable around 50 in top gear on a smooth road surface on a slightly trailining throttle I find. Although annoying, apparantly it is perfectly normal for the GT4.
Welcome to the GT4 experience.....your car looks fantastic btw!
Good morning AV - hope all is well ?Firstly, some are dismissing the 981 Spyder as not being as good as a GT4 because it is not a track car. This clearly misses the point as the 981 Spyder is not and was never intended to be a track car! In some ways, the deficiencies (if we can call them such), of the GT4 for its intended purposes are greater. The main one being the lack of the GT engine which could be seen as a distinct disadvantage on track.
So lets talk about the cars from a spirited road driving perspective. And leave the GT3 as the proper track car. (Although I rate it as a proper road car too btw).
In reality, even for fast road use, there is little it in between the GT4 and 981 Spyder. One could argue it is virtually impossible to get anywhere near the limits offered by the GT4s GT3 front suspension and brakes on a public road. Yes, the cup tyres offer some further advantage, especially over the controversial Pirelli tyres of the Spyder, but in a road going situation this is minimal under most circumstances for us lesser driving gods.
Usability.? Spyder greater ground clearance than GT4. Better for most road trips I find.
Sound? I would agree that the Spyder sounds better with pse off. On it is a touch synthetic but off it does sound better than the GT4.
Enjoyment and sense of occasion? Probably both in equal measures. But possibly the Spyder wins with the roof down.
Rarity and 'good attention'? Spyder wins hands down.
Which one to keep? Spyder definitely. And at the risk of mentioning prices, Spyders are now above GT4s as expected.
Both great cars, and agree they are totally different, as Porsche clearly intended. And to compare both cars for the same use would be like comparing the 991 GT3 with 911 R. Different cars, different ethos entirely.
Finally, you mention the 'hetrodyning' noises from the GT4 engine and transmission. This is most notable around 50 in top gear on a smooth road surface on a slightly trailining throttle I find. Although annoying, apparantly it is perfectly normal for the GT4.
Welcome to the GT4 experience.....your car looks fantastic btw!
Edited by av185 on Tuesday 15th August 07:47
Edited by av185 on Tuesday 15th August 07:51
Great post, very well put - my OP did try and make it clear that I was comparing for the purpose of my intended end use only; which is spirited road use; as most know I am not and will probably never be, a track warrior.
I also "know" deep down that, for me, the Spyder is the most special for two reasons :
1. Versatility : got to love a ragtop
2. The positive noise of the Spyder vs. the "negative" noise of the GT4 (btw I've never heard of heterodyning - I thought it meant a man and a women popping to Nando's - however, a quick search on google and a physics lesson put me right - learn something new every day - Cheers)
I find it frustrating as I'm tending to notice the engine for the wrong reasons and it's a reminder that a "compromised" engine is in the GT4, whereas the engine feels "honest and right" in the Spyder and really helps to make the car. I can't believe there hasn't been more chatter about this - however it's probably not a "thing" if you are using the GT4 in isolation - it's more noticeable when comparing it to the Spyder / RS .
Also It's only a minir gripe - I'll get used to it and it's the only negative I've found on a brilliant car and in truth, as mentioned, it only really bothers me as I have another point of reference.
Either way, what I already know is simple and that is, they are both great cars and "better" can only be defined by the required end use of the owner. It's no more complex than that .Anyone owning either should be very happy indeed - being able to enjoy both is real a bonus & a massive stroke of luck
BTW : Today is DECAL DAY - I plan to improve or ruin both cars (delete as per your own point of view)
Pictures to follow ........
:AndrewD said:
RSVP911 said:
A taster
Be careful those stickers don't peel off, parking that poor car there in a place with no walls and the wind howling past off the North Sea. So a few piccies of the decals : I know they are Marmite - but I have a penchant for a sticker - the sticker the better - thanks once more to Rick at Highgate House for supplying and Tim for fitting
GT4 P O R S C H E Motorsport Wing Decal :
981 Spyder : Roof Up :
981 Spyder : Roof Down :
Kissing :
GT4 P O R S C H E Motorsport Wing Decal :
981 Spyder : Roof Up :
981 Spyder : Roof Down :
Kissing :
Edited by RSVP911 on Tuesday 15th August 22:37
AndrewD said:
RSVP911 said:
So a few piccies of the decals : I know they are Marmite - but I have a penchant for a sticker - the sticker the better - thanks once more to Rick at Highgate House for supplying and Tim for fitting
GT4 P O R S C H E Motorsport Wing Decal :
981 Spyder : Roof Up :
981 Spyder : Roof Down :
Kissing :
The end of the stripe sticker ahead of the wheel on the Spyder doesn't line up with the stripe between the wheels Richard. GT4 P O R S C H E Motorsport Wing Decal :
981 Spyder : Roof Up :
981 Spyder : Roof Down :
Kissing :
Edited by RSVP911 on Tuesday 15th August 22:37
Edited by RSVP911 on Wednesday 16th August 18:22
Slippydiff said:
Whoooa, back up tiger ! ! Now correct me if I'm wrong, but you appear to be saying these aren't genuine, factory supplied "original" Porsche "stickers" ??? And that they're some aftermarket bits you've found on the interweb ?
You do realise the implications these will have on your warranty don't you R ? ? ? If you'd let me have your chassis number, I'll contact Reading to ensure it's added to their warranty blacklist post haste. Can't have you flaunting their rules and regulations in the name of "style" or being "individual" can we ?
As for Andrews observations regarding the "stickers" on your wife's car. I'd suggest a public flogging for the "fitter" concerned, and death by firing squad for the management team. Normally I'd say it's shoddy workmanship, but I think the use of the word workmanship is giving credit where it's clearly not due, so we'll stick with just plain old shoddy
Firstly I think you've used this image to ridicule me in a previous post - a good PH'r never does this - originality and freshness are the order of the day - please try harder.
Re the decals - I am very happy with the source - it's as close at you can get to OEM if Porsche don't do the colour that you want - the supplier does all the work for lots and lots of OPC's - including all the work for Reading. However, I realise I've not only invalidated my warranty , but also devalued the car by at least 50 % ! Happy to off load it to anyone on here for 50p (for legal clarity : this is a joke !)
Re the fitter - he's really brilliant and in truth, I think any issue may have been down to me meddling with final positioning - but honestly in real life they look absolutely fine - its the photo that makes them look odd - honest guv.
None of this matters though, as you know it will never be driven- other than in and out of the garage of course for a polish
Gassing Station | Porsche General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff