Corvette C8 or R8 V10 ?
Discussion
I've been saving up for a good few years with the intention of buying my first 'supercar' - which should come to reality next year or the year after.
My criteria is quite strict but I've narrowed it down to the following options - between either a Gen1 V10 R8 manual or a brand new Corvette C8 automatic.
I will have a budget of around £45k-50k - which I think will be near enough the base entry point of the new C8 , but which also can gain a decent V10 R8.
Of the above options, does either one stand out as the "no brainer" choice?
Criteria was originally a list of these must haves :
Manual gearbox
Rear wheel drive (or significantly rear biassed drive if 4wd)
Limited slip diff (mechanical rather than electronic)
Reasonably reliable - it won't be used as an everyday car, more a weekend toy and short trips over to mainland Europe.
Min bhp of 500 (or thereabouts)
- Now the R8 ticks those boxes, but the C8 doesn't offer the manual box (at the moment), but with the car being brand new I was planning to let this slide.
- The R8 seems to be approaching the bottom of its depreciation curve, but will have mileage on it which will no doubt lead to some maintenance costs.
- The C8 may or may not have depreciation, I guess this will depend on the UK purchase rate of these cars and the rarity of them come a number of years later.
- One other negative of the C8 is that I think I saw a review video showing that it had fake news engine sound delivered to the cabin via the speakers. (Something that would irritate me to the nth degree - but something that may have a work around to stop it and deliver natural engine sound to the cabin)
Anyway, over to you guys for comments.
My criteria is quite strict but I've narrowed it down to the following options - between either a Gen1 V10 R8 manual or a brand new Corvette C8 automatic.
I will have a budget of around £45k-50k - which I think will be near enough the base entry point of the new C8 , but which also can gain a decent V10 R8.
Of the above options, does either one stand out as the "no brainer" choice?
Criteria was originally a list of these must haves :
Manual gearbox
Rear wheel drive (or significantly rear biassed drive if 4wd)
Limited slip diff (mechanical rather than electronic)
Reasonably reliable - it won't be used as an everyday car, more a weekend toy and short trips over to mainland Europe.
Min bhp of 500 (or thereabouts)
- Now the R8 ticks those boxes, but the C8 doesn't offer the manual box (at the moment), but with the car being brand new I was planning to let this slide.
- The R8 seems to be approaching the bottom of its depreciation curve, but will have mileage on it which will no doubt lead to some maintenance costs.
- The C8 may or may not have depreciation, I guess this will depend on the UK purchase rate of these cars and the rarity of them come a number of years later.
- One other negative of the C8 is that I think I saw a review video showing that it had fake news engine sound delivered to the cabin via the speakers. (Something that would irritate me to the nth degree - but something that may have a work around to stop it and deliver natural engine sound to the cabin)
Anyway, over to you guys for comments.
Gary Woodland said:
The C8 will be ~£80k so that should make your mind up for you.
https://www.theweek.co.uk/supercar/100896/chevrole...Seems to state £46,800 for base spec, going up to £55,800 for the 3LT spec.
AC123 said:
A number of Gallardos and Ferrari 360s will be in your budget next year
Yeah I did have a 'very brief' look at the prospect, but I want something that is much more affordable to run. I don't wish to own a 'garage queen' whereby I fear adding mileage to it and fear every squeak or sound whilst driving.
Pioneer said:
AC123 said:
A number of Gallardos and Ferrari 360s will be in your budget next year
This. Running costs aren't that far off running a V10 Audi. What would you rather have in the garage! Plus depreciation is likely to be less. I don't think I would feel comfortable picking the bottom priced examples just because I could buy them, I would rather be buying on condition and I think I would get better value on the R8 by comparison.
On top of that I think mileage is less of an issue on the R8's value. Although having a number of common parts between the R8 and the Gallardo, I think that it being an Audi just gives more peace of mind when it comes to ownership issues.
Finally, the additional price tag of the Lambo and Ferrari badge/brand - I think once again that better value for money is found in the R8.
All purely in my own opinion of course !
blueg33 said:
Of the 2 i the Op the R8 every time - but its not s supercar.
For me, if not being used as a daily, I woul dlook at something like a Ferrari 360, slower but more character, and more likely t be a classic (note th F 1 box is isn't my favourite gearbox)
Thanks. For me, if not being used as a daily, I woul dlook at something like a Ferrari 360, slower but more character, and more likely t be a classic (note th F 1 box is isn't my favourite gearbox)
I take everyone's opinion on board.
But for me the V10 R8 is a supercar
It seems to tick my criteria for being one anyway.
You mention the F360 - a friend of mine used to own one and I drove it a couple of times, but I just didn't get the 'buzz' from it that I thought I was expecting from a Ferrari. I guess because it was the F1 gearbox and probably would have been a much better experience if it had a clutch pedal.
Last year I showed interest in the R8 and took both a V8 manual and a V10 manual out for a test drive. The R8 felt much more refined than what I remember the F360 to be, and the interior is much better for longer journeys and for taking the missus out on day trips etc. The V10 sound though, this is something to behold !
Appreciate the replies guys - by replying I am hoping to also confirm in my mind that I am looking to buy the right car - and for the money.
Thanks for the replies everyone.
That Viper does look amazing.
I've been for a passenger lap around the Nurburgring in the red coloured Viper (with the white stripes, if you know which one I mean) and was mightily impressed by its capability. Obviously it was all set up for track with roll cage and race suspension etc., but for some reason I was expecting it to be a handful for the driver, but instead it seemed to cope with the bumpy nature of the Nring quite well. It was a very "raw" feel and the driver mentioned that it was a car that you had to be "on top of" even when it wasn't near the limit. Which is a positive in my mind because driver involvement is something I am looking for, rather than having computers taking away all the fun.
That Viper does look amazing.
I've been for a passenger lap around the Nurburgring in the red coloured Viper (with the white stripes, if you know which one I mean) and was mightily impressed by its capability. Obviously it was all set up for track with roll cage and race suspension etc., but for some reason I was expecting it to be a handful for the driver, but instead it seemed to cope with the bumpy nature of the Nring quite well. It was a very "raw" feel and the driver mentioned that it was a car that you had to be "on top of" even when it wasn't near the limit. Which is a positive in my mind because driver involvement is something I am looking for, rather than having computers taking away all the fun.
I think this next question from me is more for a finance thread, but say if you comfortably had the money in the bank, is it generally 'better', 'safer', more financially sound...to buy a £50k car outright, or to finance it over a few years?
I know for a NEW car purchase whereby depreciation over the first few years is severe, the answer would always be to lease the car, then hand it back.
But for 2nd hand cars which have seen the bulk of depreciation, is there an obvious winner over buying the car outright in one transaction, or to buy the car by form of certain percentage deposit and the rest being a loan/finance term repayment?
I know for a NEW car purchase whereby depreciation over the first few years is severe, the answer would always be to lease the car, then hand it back.
But for 2nd hand cars which have seen the bulk of depreciation, is there an obvious winner over buying the car outright in one transaction, or to buy the car by form of certain percentage deposit and the rest being a loan/finance term repayment?
Trev450 said:
For me its all about ROI. If the return I'm getting on my investments is greater than the cost of borrowing the funds, then clearly the loan route is the obvious choice. If the money borrowed exceeds the ROI you're getting on your own funds and you can afford to spend it, then that has to be the viable option.
ROI involves a crystal ball to see the future Was hoping there may be a magic formula, or a "tipping point" whereby one route is seen as the default '"no brainer" option.
May sound like a strange question, but I've never bought a car on any type of finance, always bought with cash or bank transfer, the full amount.
But this has always been on 2nd hand car values below £25k.
Spending £50k is kind of making me feel a bit itchy, having no 1st hand experience of the finance option in which to make a direct comparison in terms of risk (and sanity of course)
That is a strong point.
But there are so many different angles you can look at it.
If for example a labour government got to power and their mission to wage war on the motorist takes full effect, they have proposals to remove 30% of cars from the road. Depending on how they'd go about this it could have huge impacts on car ownership choices and the simple affordability of car ownership in the first place. The market would likely crash as older cars could be banned from public roads. (We are seeing already with left/green leaning councils that they are banning cars from town centres and even proposals to ban them from tourist hotspots etc. - the progression of this is to ban vehicles on more and more stretches of roads or what they would likely deem 'environmentally sensitive' areas).
On a brighter note Corbyn will never take power, and if interest rates stay minimal, this means leasing will continue to be strong which forces up new car prices and tugs along the 2nd hand price market with it.
One question about the future of an Audi R8 V10 manual - everything considered, would the sheer number of production models be that they will struggle to retain value, or I am worrying too much?
(I plan to keep hold of the car for a good few years. I'm in my late 30's now, so hoping to keep hold of it for at least 10 years - or until the C8 is something I just can't ignore)
But there are so many different angles you can look at it.
If for example a labour government got to power and their mission to wage war on the motorist takes full effect, they have proposals to remove 30% of cars from the road. Depending on how they'd go about this it could have huge impacts on car ownership choices and the simple affordability of car ownership in the first place. The market would likely crash as older cars could be banned from public roads. (We are seeing already with left/green leaning councils that they are banning cars from town centres and even proposals to ban them from tourist hotspots etc. - the progression of this is to ban vehicles on more and more stretches of roads or what they would likely deem 'environmentally sensitive' areas).
On a brighter note Corbyn will never take power, and if interest rates stay minimal, this means leasing will continue to be strong which forces up new car prices and tugs along the 2nd hand price market with it.
One question about the future of an Audi R8 V10 manual - everything considered, would the sheer number of production models be that they will struggle to retain value, or I am worrying too much?
(I plan to keep hold of the car for a good few years. I'm in my late 30's now, so hoping to keep hold of it for at least 10 years - or until the C8 is something I just can't ignore)
sonicbloo said:
ZeroGroundZero said:
........... so hoping to keep hold of it for at least 10 years - or until the C8 is something I just can't ignore)
but in 10 years the C8 will have been superceded by the C9, and then C10 (no doubt electric powered) which will make the C8 just an old out -dated Corvette Depreciation is something that I am concious of but not something that will put me off buying - if I am satisfied that the car will not further lose 50% or more of its value of course!
I've always come from the mind set that I would never buy a car with the intention of just making money on it (I've no intention of become just a dealer or a flipper) - as some replies eluded to, this would mean I'd be scared of using it for fear of putting on mileage and wearing out components that would devalue the car.
I'll never buy a battery powered contraption either !
Good reply, thanks Dave.
Question to all - you may tell I'm still in a bit of indecision on how best to spend my £50k on something that comes as close to the criteria listed earlier, but as the C8 will seemingly be well out of reach (unless a free-trade deal can be struck with the USA in the next year), could I ask opinions on a comparison between the V10 R8 and a 997 Turbo ?
997 Turbo offering what looks like more practicality for storage of luggage, which would allow me to travel around Europe on driving holidays, but the 911 shape being something 'bland' and an engine noise uninspiring in comparison to the R8 V10.
Is there an obvious choice between these two other than personal subjective opinion on the shape and sound?
Question to all - you may tell I'm still in a bit of indecision on how best to spend my £50k on something that comes as close to the criteria listed earlier, but as the C8 will seemingly be well out of reach (unless a free-trade deal can be struck with the USA in the next year), could I ask opinions on a comparison between the V10 R8 and a 997 Turbo ?
997 Turbo offering what looks like more practicality for storage of luggage, which would allow me to travel around Europe on driving holidays, but the 911 shape being something 'bland' and an engine noise uninspiring in comparison to the R8 V10.
Is there an obvious choice between these two other than personal subjective opinion on the shape and sound?
Trev450 said:
You may find this thread from R8talk.com helpful. In this instance the OP is asking opinions between the V10 R8 and a Turbo S, but you should get the gist. https://www.r8talk.com/threads/2014-r8-v10-vs-911-...
Excellent. Thanks for that.Still checking the market for options. Still in a bit of a quandry.
To R8 or not to R8
My position is that I come from a number of 'old school' Japanese performance cars. I've owned R34 Skyline, EVO-6 and EVO-X, and recently sold my 450bhp Supra.
The Supra was the best car I've had so far, being slightly tuned, it performed as a reliable sports GT that could also handle the Nurburgring with relative ease.
Also used to go on summer road trips around the Alps in it. It was practical enough for storing luggage to last us for 2 weeks travel, powerful enough to be fun on track, 0-60 in 4.5sec, RWD for playfulness, manual gearbox for driver-car connection and all packed up in a sleek GT shape that turned heads where ever it went.
With prices having shot up over the past few years I decided to sell it on for what was a 'crazy' amount of money (£37k - as it was a rare UK 6-speed twin turbo with only 80k miles on the clock - that is not far off the original list price when brand new out of the factory! - I bought it 2nd hand for only £16k !, so quite a 'profit' in some respects).
I've since been looking to "step up" from the Supra, and struggled to find anything that would do it without having to go up to the >£100K price bracket which is well over my budget.
I would have loved to have gone for the AM V8 4.7, but I know a couple of people who have them already and the ownership costs are just too high, and they say its not a car that is happy on track, with it being underpowered and fearful of the engine/drive train being a bit too weak for such intense use.
So I'm looking at the V10 R8 as the option that would possibly get closest to what I'm after. Although the BMW M4 has now placed its head above the parapet. The M4 offering the RWD and the practicality to go off on road trips, but the V10 R8 offering a much more special experience, albeit only for weekend trips.
One question about the R8's 4WD system, do I understand it correctly to be a 80%-20% rear-front bias in normal drive. With mechanical LSDs (front and rear) to prevent power sapping away at an unloaded wheel? And then if an entire axel loses traction, the system can send a maximum of 35% to the front? (for the Gen 1 R8) Meaning that it will always have a RWD 'feel' to the set up?
(Be nice if that was the case, but hoping some of you guys know the score on this)
To R8 or not to R8
My position is that I come from a number of 'old school' Japanese performance cars. I've owned R34 Skyline, EVO-6 and EVO-X, and recently sold my 450bhp Supra.
The Supra was the best car I've had so far, being slightly tuned, it performed as a reliable sports GT that could also handle the Nurburgring with relative ease.
Also used to go on summer road trips around the Alps in it. It was practical enough for storing luggage to last us for 2 weeks travel, powerful enough to be fun on track, 0-60 in 4.5sec, RWD for playfulness, manual gearbox for driver-car connection and all packed up in a sleek GT shape that turned heads where ever it went.
With prices having shot up over the past few years I decided to sell it on for what was a 'crazy' amount of money (£37k - as it was a rare UK 6-speed twin turbo with only 80k miles on the clock - that is not far off the original list price when brand new out of the factory! - I bought it 2nd hand for only £16k !, so quite a 'profit' in some respects).
I've since been looking to "step up" from the Supra, and struggled to find anything that would do it without having to go up to the >£100K price bracket which is well over my budget.
I would have loved to have gone for the AM V8 4.7, but I know a couple of people who have them already and the ownership costs are just too high, and they say its not a car that is happy on track, with it being underpowered and fearful of the engine/drive train being a bit too weak for such intense use.
So I'm looking at the V10 R8 as the option that would possibly get closest to what I'm after. Although the BMW M4 has now placed its head above the parapet. The M4 offering the RWD and the practicality to go off on road trips, but the V10 R8 offering a much more special experience, albeit only for weekend trips.
One question about the R8's 4WD system, do I understand it correctly to be a 80%-20% rear-front bias in normal drive. With mechanical LSDs (front and rear) to prevent power sapping away at an unloaded wheel? And then if an entire axel loses traction, the system can send a maximum of 35% to the front? (for the Gen 1 R8) Meaning that it will always have a RWD 'feel' to the set up?
(Be nice if that was the case, but hoping some of you guys know the score on this)
PompeyReece said:
Trev450 said:
Sorry Reece but ZeroGroundZero is spot on with his understanding.
The car does have a RWD feel to it but with stock suspension geo it will understeer when pushed. If this is unaceptable, dialing in a more track-focused set up will certainly help. Alternatively, RWD conversion kits are available for under a £1K.
Ta for the clarification TrevThe car does have a RWD feel to it but with stock suspension geo it will understeer when pushed. If this is unaceptable, dialing in a more track-focused set up will certainly help. Alternatively, RWD conversion kits are available for under a £1K.
I think its a case of when somebody gains a "half-truth" they spread it and it sort of catches on as a faux-fact which conflicts with another half-truth and so on.
Anyway, I've been trying to gather some definitive information and I contacted no less than four separate Audi dealerships in and around my area and they all replied back with a different answer, well two of them actually replied back to say they would look in to it and get back to me - which they didn't of course!
One relied with partial information stating that the R8 has LSD on it - but going no further to explain the details.
The other replied back stating it has an 85% rear and 15% front bias, but again not going any further with the details.
I looked in to the set up a while back and found an assortment of figures flying around the internet and saw a few that mentioned the 80-rear / 20-front split for power delivery.
I now see a number of sites stating this is actually 85-rear and 15-front in normal driving. (For both the V8 and the V10). Not to mention if there is any difference between the Gen 1 and Gen 2 etc. And still unsure if the R8's system will throw more than 15% to the front when drifting for example.
As for the LSD's, I can no longer find definitive information if there is an LSD on the front axle or the rear axle or whether it just has a centre diff. I thought I had read a while back that there was definitely a rear LSD at least. (And that it was a mechanical type rather than an electronic type coupled with the traction control).
Be great to have definitive information on the above from those in the know.
Slight forum name change but its still me!
Thanks all for the replies.
Will be waiting patiently until summer time before I actively go out to test drive and select from what ever the market has to offer at an affordable price.
Would it be standard practice these days, on a 10 year old Gen 1 R8, along with the typical new car purchase check to be checking for the following ?
- any front end frame cracks (walk away if refused to do so, or indeed if there is any cracking)
- mag ride shocks (if leaking then not the end of the world as they can be sent off to poland? for a refurb at much cheaper price than replacement from Audi)
- water pump check
- air con check
Thanks all for the replies.
Will be waiting patiently until summer time before I actively go out to test drive and select from what ever the market has to offer at an affordable price.
Would it be standard practice these days, on a 10 year old Gen 1 R8, along with the typical new car purchase check to be checking for the following ?
- any front end frame cracks (walk away if refused to do so, or indeed if there is any cracking)
- mag ride shocks (if leaking then not the end of the world as they can be sent off to poland? for a refurb at much cheaper price than replacement from Audi)
- water pump check
- air con check
C7 Corvette is a very good shout.
Only one of them on Autotrader at around the £50k mark with manual gearbox when looking today, its a yellow example with additional bodykit, which actually makes the car look nicely balanced and aggressive.
I'll have to keep my eye on the game to see if any other examples pop up over the next few months so that I have decent comparisons that can be made.
Comparing to a V10 R8 makes an interesting proposition. The C7 will win on practicality, allowing me to use the car a couple of weeks euro tour driving holidays, with it being able to seemingly fit in enough luggage. Over double the space that the R8 offers.
In terms of C7 reliability and maintenance, what is this like generally? Do they have a history of any common failure parts?
Only one of them on Autotrader at around the £50k mark with manual gearbox when looking today, its a yellow example with additional bodykit, which actually makes the car look nicely balanced and aggressive.
I'll have to keep my eye on the game to see if any other examples pop up over the next few months so that I have decent comparisons that can be made.
Comparing to a V10 R8 makes an interesting proposition. The C7 will win on practicality, allowing me to use the car a couple of weeks euro tour driving holidays, with it being able to seemingly fit in enough luggage. Over double the space that the R8 offers.
In terms of C7 reliability and maintenance, what is this like generally? Do they have a history of any common failure parts?
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